could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    I keep hearing how Pats QB's have so much value because they learn at the feet of the HOF TB and in the head of master BB. where are these QB's over the past decade plus?


    Ok, I can see Cassel, and his fill in year with the Pats, and even his 1 good year in KC. But really, any one else? Hoyer and his 3 game career in Brownsville?


    Where are these QB's that have gone to the school of BB that are groomed for greatness? Where are these QB's that have sat next to TB in meetings and some of his wisdom has made them NFL QB's?


    The list is long of failed QB's drafted here that have been non NFL prospects, never mind players. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcherbrook. Show Fletcherbrook's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

     


    Good point.


    Tom Brady is great. Just because your a backup to one of the greatest clearly does not translate into an appreciable improvement.


    how many backups have flourished after backing up manning the last 15 years? Bree's? 


    Part of the explanation for this is that teams are obviously not drafting high for these back ups. (Usually) 


    BB has proven that reaching for ANY pick rarely works out. Regardless of the who the coach is, who they are learning from, what team drafted them...etc. talent is talent is talent.


    if you want filet mignon don't go to Burger King.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

    [/QUOTE]

    Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub (for a short while), Foles (maybe), CK...I am sure there are others

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from GO47. Show GO47's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

    [/QUOTE]

    Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub (for a short while), Foles (maybe), CK...I am sure there are others

    [/QUOTE]


    If you're going to include all of them you have include Brady because he was a backup QB when he first started. Both Brady and Rodgers were behind two pretty QBs when they first started. But both were very talented QBs coming out college and both gained a lot of knowledge from the QBs in front of them.

    But if you're going to judge what the former backups for Brady have done then compare what other backups have done behind Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub, and the Mannings. That's closer to comparing apples with apples.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Cyberknot. Show Cyberknot's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

    [/QUOTE]


     Brady

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Cyberknot. Show Cyberknot's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    Although his success was probably not due to studying under Drew.
     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    The great school of "BB and TB" is a farce that rusty made up to justify why Mallett has so much trade value. It's a school of ridiculousness. No coaching/tutoring is going to make a guy see things differently on the field than his own brain allows. And I think a large part of being a QB is what you see and how quickly you react to it CORRECTLY. I also think it's what you sense....what you anticipate, and how quickly you react to that.

    I do think coaching and learning from someone has some value, but the bottom line is that until they can put a microchip in some of these guys heads, they are going to have to think and process things on their own. Not everyone can do that, in fact not many can do that at the rate of speed it is required to be a good quarterback. Take a look around, there are only a handful of guys who can consistently play quarterback at a high level in the NFL - we are lucky to have one of them - it makes me laugh that there is one moron that runs around here all day proving that he doesn't understand that.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to Fletcherbrook's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

    Good point.

     

    Tom Brady is great. Just because your a backup to one of the greatest clearly does not translate into an appreciable improvement.

     

    how many backups have flourished after backing up manning the last 15 years? Bree's? 

     

    Part of the explanation for this is that teams are obviously not drafting high for these back ups. (Usually) 

     

    BB has proven that reaching for ANY pick rarely works out. Regardless of the who the coach is, who they are learning from, what team drafted them...etc. talent is talent is talent.

     

    if you want filet mignon don't go to Burger King.

    [/QUOTE]


    True.

    Really it's the player, let's face it, there aren't many people who are going to be good NFL quarterbacks...what's the failure rate? Has anyone ever figured that out? It's got to be pretty high. Now every single one of the quarterbacks drafted in the first two rounds came into the NFL with high expectations, most of them failed....didn't matter what type of coaching or tutoring they received...most just can't do it. How many QB's are usually drafted between round one and three every year? 8? 10? How many of them make it and are successful starters for8-10 years? 1? Maybe 2? The rest are shuffled in and out of the lineup...from one team to another...out of the league, back in the league...starter, then backup. It happens all the time.

    Look at Sanchez - drafted high, high expectations - yet you knew he wasn't any good. Didn't matter if he had a running game...had a defense...got a new contract. The guy just wasn't good enough. Now he's a backup, and I'm sure in his mind he'll be starting again. And maybe he will. Maybe he'll play well again and he'll get a nice little sit down interview with the latest cool former player on ESPN...maybe put up some good numbers in the "right offense", but sooner than later he will stink again and be most likely out of football (with somewhere around 40 million in the bank). There's a reason why teams that have the quarterback win, it's because it's by far the most important position in the NFL...and no one seems to be able to play it.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    Mallett sucks.  Horrific draft pick and waste of so many years.

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to GO47's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

    [/QUOTE]

    Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub (for a short while), Foles (maybe), CK...I am sure there are others

    [/QUOTE]


    If you're going to include all of them you have include Brady because he was a backup QB when he first started. Both Brady and Rodgers were behind two pretty QBs when they first started. But both were very talented QBs coming out college and both gained a lot of knowledge from the QBs in front of them.

    But if you're going to judge what the former backups for Brady have done then compare what other backups have done behind Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub, and the Mannings. That's closer to comparing apples with apples.

    [/QUOTE]

    I am not comparing, nor am I judging. There seems to be a fallacy out there that if a young QB is in that room with Bb and TB that the young QB is groomed to be an all pro. I simply have not seen the results from this theory

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    Historically BB and QB picks made in the 4th or higher rounds haven't been good. Hopefully Garp breaks that trend but Mallett, O'Connell, Davey weren't that good. BB has done much better developing QB's in later rounds for some odd reason: Brady, Cassel, Hoyer. But yeah in general the mythos that everyone wants a player trained by BB and TB is fan driven only. Just because a player is on the Pats and backs up Brady doesn't mean they are any good. And just because BB picked them and keeps them on the team doesn't mean they are any good either (how long did he keep Davey on the team?). BB isn't Midus, everything he touches doesn't turn into gold. Sometimes picks just don't work and just because BB keeps them around doesn't mean they were worth the spot they took up either just because they know the system.

    Trust me, I'm an engineer!

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to GO47's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

    [/QUOTE]

    Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub (for a short while), Foles (maybe), CK...I am sure there are others

    [/QUOTE]


    If you're going to include all of them you have include Brady because he was a backup QB when he first started. Both Brady and Rodgers were behind two pretty QBs when they first started. But both were very talented QBs coming out college and both gained a lot of knowledge from the QBs in front of them.

    But if you're going to judge what the former backups for Brady have done then compare what other backups have done behind Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub, and the Mannings. That's closer to comparing apples with apples.

    [/QUOTE]

    I am not comparing, nor am I judging. There seems to be a fallacy out there that if a young QB is in that room with Bb and TB that the young QB is groomed to be an all pro. I simply have not seen the results from this theory

    [/QUOTE]

    Who is saying this? It doesn't matter if you study under PM, TB, DB, AR or any other HOF QB. The bottom line is you either have the mental capacity, leadership skills, drive to be better and the physical attributes to play the most difficult position in all sports or you don't. Can you learn from those guys? Absolutely but you better have those other traits to go along with what you may have learned from them.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to GO47's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not sure I've seen a whole lot of 'great school of QB' discussion on the board but perhaps that's because i've not necessarily been looking for it.  Out of curiosity, is there much of a history around the league for backups becoming really successful starters?  I confess that I haven't looked.

    [/QUOTE]

    Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub (for a short while), Foles (maybe), CK...I am sure there are others

    [/QUOTE]


    If you're going to include all of them you have include Brady because he was a backup QB when he first started. Both Brady and Rodgers were behind two pretty QBs when they first started. But both were very talented QBs coming out college and both gained a lot of knowledge from the QBs in front of them.

    But if you're going to judge what the former backups for Brady have done then compare what other backups have done behind Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub, and the Mannings. That's closer to comparing apples with apples.

    [/QUOTE]

    I am not comparing, nor am I judging. There seems to be a fallacy out there that if a young QB is in that room with Bb and TB that the young QB is groomed to be an all pro. I simply have not seen the results from this theory

    [/QUOTE]

    Who is saying this? It doesn't matter if you study under PM, TB, DB, AR or any other HOF QB. The bottom line is you either have the mental capacity, leadership skills, drive to be better and the physical attributes to play the most difficult position in all sports or you don't. Can you learn from those guys? Absolutely but you better have those other traits to go along with what you may have learned from them.

    [/QUOTE]

    Many are saying this, including many in the media. It is not only Rusty the dope saying this

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from DoNotSleepOnThePats. Show DoNotSleepOnThePats's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    Never heard anyone speak of this theory.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjbag. Show jjbag's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    I'm of the mind set that a Great backup that can become a starter is rare.

    Rodgers, Brees, Romo, Schaub (for a short while), Foles (maybe

    Rodgers is an example (Brees not so much, he was drafted to become a #1) Romo (not going to say he is great, the dude still does some really stupid things that ends up costing his team, Schaub I'm still on the fence with him, was it the system in Houston, his O-line deteriorating or his true lack of "talent to go the distance".  Foles, well we shall see with him(still to early). Brady in my mind along with Rogers is an exception not the rule for backups.

    In most cases your getting what you draft.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Quagmire3. Show Quagmire3's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I keep hearing how Pats QB's have so much value because they learn at the feet of the HOF TB and in the head of master BB. where are these QB's over the past decade plus?

    Ok, I can see Cassel, and his fill in year with the Pats, and even his 1 good year in KC. But really, any one else? Hoyer and his 3 game career in Brownsville?

    Where are these QB's that have gone to the school of BB that are groomed for greatness? Where are these QB's that have sat next to TB in meetings and some of his wisdom has made them NFL QB's?

    The list is long of failed QB's drafted here that have been non NFL prospects, never mind players. 

    [/QUOTE]

    OK here is my take on your passive aggressive shot at Bill Belichick. The Pats have had and groomed good back up QB's. Good enough that BB is comfortable with them on the team. The only time we had to see one in extended time (Cassell) the team went 11-5 and he did well. Please remember that Cassell did not look any better that preseason than Mallett has looked this preseason. The other part of your theory is that QB's that are groomed to be good/great are normally high draft picks, the Pats don't usually pick high in the draft and certainly don't draft a 1st round QB with TB12 on the roster.  Everyone mentions Aaron Rodgers, but don't forget he was a first round pick that lasted til the 20's but was projected to go much much higher. Pretty simple really.
    [object HTMLDivElement]

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    BB hit the lottery with Brady and good for us. Other than Brady all the backup have stunk. Does anyone honestly think Cassel was anything other than a product of the schedule????

    Then there's the BB slurper who thinks all the garbage on this team is worthy of a 1st in a trade.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from SnarkPatrol. Show SnarkPatrol's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to DoNotSleepOnThePats' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Never heard anyone speak of this theory.

    [/QUOTE]


    Maybe you were sleeping.

     
  20. This post has been removed.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from DoNotSleepOnThePats. Show DoNotSleepOnThePats's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to SnarkPatrol's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to DoNotSleepOnThePats' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Never heard anyone speak of this theory.

    [/QUOTE]


    Maybe you were sleeping.

    [/QUOTE]

    It's possible. Or I was drunk.

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from HelmetofLeather. Show HelmetofLeather's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    My QB's go to the same school as the rest of my players. The Academy of Either You've got it / get it, or you don't.....Then comes the part of getting drafted either into the right system or by a coach who recognizes your talents and caters to your strengths. The Pats ran a completely different offense under Bledsoe but once Brady took over, they shifted to a " game manager " style O, A moniker which even Brady couldn't' shake for his 1st few years. It really wasn't until 07 that the Madden numbers we've come to expect really came from this O, which showed great flexibility, not only in our GOAT , but in the coaching staff as well. So as far as QB's I would recruit to my school... Accuracy, Intelligence , Leader....we can teach the rest.


     


    Knuckleheads, regardless of talent , need not apply.....See :   Leaf, Ryan  


                                                                                             Callahan, Bo ( Draft Day )


     


    "Don't touch my Leatherhelmet!!"

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to DougIrwin's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Drunk?!  You have a drinking problem! You're a drunk loser!  Pezzy and TFB12 say so!

    lmao

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't think he said he is on here drinking all the time like you admitted you do...

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheRealBustchise. Show TheRealBustchise's posts

    Re: could some one enlighten me on this great school of QB theory?

    In response to DougIrwin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    My god is RKrap, dumb. He just listed proof of other QBs developed here going off and doing some good things elsewhere and here is asking why there is a reason why some may feel a BB/Brady developed QB who is still here, not cut and progressing, as a potential solution to another team's QB problem.

     

    LMAO

     

    The simple conclusion is no further than looking at Geno Smith taken in the high second rd.

     

    Any rational human would rather have Mallett as a prospect to groom than Geno Smith.  One played in a pro style offense in the SEC and has spent 3 years learning at the University of the New England Patriots by the greatest coach and quite possibly the best QB ever.

     

    The question posed is just so moronically dumb, I can't even continue.

     

    How ironic...The answer lies within the framework of RKrap's favorite team, the Jetsies.

     

    Case closed.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes, Queen Bean, second round pick QBs who start as rookies and win 8 games are very common.  Are you claiming BB, a defensive guy "developed Brady"?  Oh my.  Surely you have some sort of documentation about regarding this claim.  Did he also "develop" Mallet?  Still waiting on that top 10 pick for the ROI?  Bwahahhahahaha!

     
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