DE's Moore and Werner

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Army2LT. Show Army2LT's posts

    DE's Moore and Werner

    Does anyone think the Pats will draft either one?  Both were seen as top 5 picks as soon as the season ended.  Thier stocks have fallen probably more that anyone's for whatever reason.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjdbrasil. Show jjdbrasil's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.



    cunnigham shine?

    shine out of foxboro.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjdbrasil. Show jjdbrasil's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

     

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.

     



    cunnigham shine?

     

    shine out of foxboro.




    Bred, he was actually showing more than the other years until his suspension. He is no savior.  However, I agree he will be gone after this year, if they sign Abraham he might not make the team.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

     

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

     

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.

     



    cunnigham shine?

     

    shine out of foxboro.

     




    Bred, he was actually showing more than the other years until his suspension. He is no savior.  However, I agree he will be gone after this year, if they sign Abraham he might not make the team.

     



    im hoping for those 2 things.

    losing his adderol made him from accepabel to unacceptable :)

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.



    I could see them staying away from a DT because of the two guys you mentioned - especially Kelly as he has shown he can play in this league. BUT - I would not be surprised to see BB look that way anyway, even in round 1 if we dont trade out of it. There are a few DTs that if they fall to us might be worth grabbing....  At the end of the day I would hope we have either locked up enough real talent at either DE or DT to last us a few years when taken alongside who we already have.

     

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.



    You sound so sure that the DL will be better with the two DTs added. One is untested in the NFL and the other is an older guy who hasn't played well in the last season or so. 

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjdbrasil. Show jjdbrasil's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to seattlepat70's comment:

    In response to jjdbrasil's comment:

     

    It depends where NE has them on their board. If they are rated higher than 29 on NEs board and they drop to 29, would be hard to not pull the trigger.

    I would draft a DE/OLB next year, extend Nink, sign Abraham, and concentrate on the middle corp of the defense this year. IMO, WR, coverage LB and CB are the main needs in the draft. If we trade back and get an extra pikc then DE comes in to play. Also, pick up some risk/reward guys  in the 7th, like Dennard last year.

    We have Kelly and Armstead as new DTs with them DL should be better.  If we cover and disrupt better, our pass rush will be fine.  Have to have faith that out of Francis, Bequette and Cunningham someone will shine.  If you don't like The pash rush like other opinions on the board, draft a pash rusher at 29.  Either way is fine, DE by draft or DE by FA, it all comes down to economics.

     



    You sound so sure that the DL will be better with the two DTs added. One is untested in the NFL and the other is an older guy who hasn't played well in the last season or so. 

     




    Hey Seattle, not really, I said "should be".  If NE goes DL with DE or DT, that is because the player is at the value or higher NE wants.  If your are reading different sources out there, GMs are not even sure who will go in the top 10 or 15 picks.  I have been following drafts for while and this one is playing out a bit different.  It has much more depth which leads to good selections in the middle rounds and more selections for UDFAs.  We will sign 15-17 this year compared to 7 last year.

    I would look at it this way, would Moore or Werner replace Nink?  At DT, would S.Williams, J. Williams, J Jenkins, K. Short be the starter next to Wilfork?  I think yes, they could replace Love or Deaderick. So the people advocating at DT are correct in that NE good upgrade at a starting position. I think that is teh key a firts round selection should be a starter.  A selection in first round for CB, LB will probably not start.  WR would hopefully start right away, but they would have to pick up the offense. NE could urprise us and take one.

    I think the core of the defense is where they should concentrate.  They just don't have enough picks. If they can move back, and get more great.  I would go DT, CB, WR, DE, Coverage LB, SS. Who knows we may get the LB and SS as UDFAs.

    The other part of this is economics.  Who will be extended? Who do we resign? Who will be let go this year and next?  There is only so much you can do in one year.  Just my opinion.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    Everyone seems to think there's people lining up to help us trade out of the first round.  Yeah if we get a deal like we did last year with GB. I think there's 3 teams with multiple first round picks. They can offer a better price then we can. I say we have to use the pick. I hope we go DE. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    I want Damontre Moore, he can play with his hands on the floor and up in the air. 

     

    Margus Hunt = Jake Bequette...

     

    He'd be a terrible pick, IMHO. Inconsistent, bad tackler and plays too high are the words that get mentioned whenever I read about him. 

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from maine12. Show maine12's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.



    I've been saying this the entire time. Werner is in my opinion the best player in the draft. When I watch him I see him doing more than what JJ Watt was doing for Wisconsin.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from tenace4life. Show tenace4life's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    Werner will not be there at #29  . . .  and the Pats do not have the picks to trade up.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    I think people often misinterpret players 'falling' and other players becoming 'hot commodities.' I think the pre-draft process is full of certain players getting 'hot' because of a combine number or apparent high interest from numerous clubs, or some highlight that was missed previously. The result is that players that were once ranked in the top 10 suddenly become late 1st or second round  proscpects.

    Not saying that players don't fall based on closer evaluation or negative surprises at the combine. I just think that a lot of the perceived drops are not due to anything specific to the player but rather to the other prospects. Werner certainly seems that type of player.

    The other issue of course is 'media frenzy' which is often not what the the actual professionals (team) evaluators are thinking. And the teams do a heck of a lot of misdirection to help the media look as silly as possible

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to maine12's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.

     



    I've been saying this the entire time. Werner is in my opinion the best player in the draft. When I watch him I see him doing more than what JJ Watt was doing for Wisconsin.

     




    You think so? I think he can be solid, but I don't think he is anywhere near the best player in the draft. I think Ansah will be a better player...I've been pretty much blown away with his stength, toughness, explosiveness and pass rush potential. Werner does look like a player to me though and it wouldn't surprise me if some team took him in the top 15 - I don't care if he didn't do well in workouts...he has game speed and he can bend around that corner. A lot of guys can't do that (see Jermaine Cunningham)...faster, more eplosive, but he can't do it unless it's in a striaight line. I think that's one resone why they had him rushing from the inside this year...he can't get around the edge.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Army2LT. Show Army2LT's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    The more I think about it, I believe that the Pats will go DT with thier first pick.  The number one guy that we absolutely cannot play without on defense is Wilfork.  One of the most frightening things is watching him limp off the field.  

    I think that area is pretty deep this year.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to Philskiw1's comment:

     

    Everyone seems to think there's people lining up to help us trade out of the first round.  Yeah if we get a deal like we did last year with GB. I think there's 3 teams with multiple first round picks. They can offer a better price then we can. I say we have to use the pick. I hope we go DE. 

     



    i hope we make the pick at 29 and a de

    with the exception if we go okafor, then id hope to trade back a few spots and get him

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to 49Patriots' comment:

    I want Damontre Moore, he can play with his hands on the floor and up in the air. 

     

    Margus Hunt = Jake Bequette...

     

    He'd be a terrible pick, IMHO. Inconsistent, bad tackler and plays too high are the words that get mentioned whenever I read about him. 

     

     



    all true, though bequette comparison is a guess. no one knwos what he will be.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to maine12's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.

     



    I've been saying this the entire time. Werner is in my opinion the best player in the draft. When I watch him I see him doing more than what JJ Watt was doing for Wisconsin.

     



    he was my first pick for the pats in the draft season very early on and a pipe dream, now several reputable mockers have him dropping to late rd 1. id be ecstatic if we pounce on him or carradine and a big wr or 2 from rd 2 on.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to maine12's comment:

     

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.

     



    I've been saying this the entire time. Werner is in my opinion the best player in the draft. When I watch him I see him doing more than what JJ Watt was doing for Wisconsin.

     

     




    You think so? I think he can be solid, but I don't think he is anywhere near the best player in the draft. I think Ansah will be a better player...I've been pretty much blown away with his stength, toughness, explosiveness and pass rush potential. Werner does look like a player to me though and it wouldn't surprise me if some team took him in the top 15 - I don't care if he didn't do well in workouts...he has game speed and he can bend around that corner. A lot of guys can't do that (see Jermaine Cunningham)...faster, more eplosive, but he can't do it unless it's in a striaight line. I think that's one resone why they had him rushing from the inside this year...he can't get around the edge.

     



    i agree ansahs upside is huuge. he is the 2nd plaryer i fell in lovce wiht till he moved from second roufd to top 5 rated.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    In response to maine12's comment:

     

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.

     



    I've been saying this the entire time. Werner is in my opinion the best player in the draft. When I watch him I see him doing more than what JJ Watt was doing for Wisconsin.

     

     




    You think so? I think he can be solid, but I don't think he is anywhere near the best player in the draft. I think Ansah will be a better player...I've been pretty much blown away with his stength, toughness, explosiveness and pass rush potential. Werner does look like a player to me though and it wouldn't surprise me if some team took him in the top 15 - I don't care if he didn't do well in workouts...he has game speed and he can bend around that corner. A lot of guys can't do that (see Jermaine Cunningham)...faster, more eplosive, but he can't do it unless it's in a striaight line. I think that's one resone why they had him rushing from the inside this year...he can't get around the edge.

     

     



    i agree ansahs upside is huuge. he is the 2nd plaryer i fell in lovce wiht till he moved from second roufd to top 5 rated.

     



    I'm not a big fan of Moore, but he does seem like a try hard type...plus he has great size. I just don't see him as a pass rusher - I think if you're going to be drafted as an end in the first round you should be a pass rusher. I can see Moore being a solid run defender, who gets you maybe 4 to 5 coverage sacks a year.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    What will it mean now the jests pick 2 x before we do.   

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Army2LT. Show Army2LT's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to Philskiw1's comment:

    What will it mean now the jests pick 2 x before we do.   



    I think it means that they will pick up Geno Smith if he's available. 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from maine12. Show maine12's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to maine12's comment:

     

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Everytime I watch highlights of Carradine, I see Werner making more plays and getting there quicker. He seems to be the focus of blockers too.

     



    I've been saying this the entire time. Werner is in my opinion the best player in the draft. When I watch him I see him doing more than what JJ Watt was doing for Wisconsin.

     

     




    You think so? I think he can be solid, but I don't think he is anywhere near the best player in the draft. I think Ansah will be a better player...I've been pretty much blown away with his stength, toughness, explosiveness and pass rush potential. Werner does look like a player to me though and it wouldn't surprise me if some team took him in the top 15 - I don't care if he didn't do well in workouts...he has game speed and he can bend around that corner. A lot of guys can't do that (see Jermaine Cunningham)...faster, more eplosive, but he can't do it unless it's in a striaight line. I think that's one resone why they had him rushing from the inside this year...he can't get around the edge.

     



    I really think so, I have watched a ton of film recently and to me this kid stands out the most. When ever I try to to watch tape on Carridine all I see is Werner all over the place. Hes a smart player with a relentless motor. I put almost no stock into combine numbers, some players just dont test well. It seems like every year GM's fall in love with potential, and try to draft stars, but I would much rather take a for sure solid player with New Englands picks. Very small chance Werner will fall to 29, but till the draft I'll keep my fingers crossed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Army2LT. Show Army2LT's posts

    Re: DE's Moore and Werner

    In response to maine12's comment:

    I

     

     



    I really think so, I have watched a ton of film recently and to me this kid stands out the most. When ever I try to to watch tape on Carridine all I see is Werner all over the place. Hes a smart player with a relentless motor. I put almost no stock into combine numbers, some players just dont test well. It seems like every year GM's fall in love with potential, and try to draft stars, but I would much rather take a for sure solid player with New Englands picks. Very small chance Werner will fall to 29, but till the draft I'll keep my fingers crossed.

     




    There seems to be alot of really good players in the 10-40 range.  Someone is going to fall to us, I am hoping its Werner or  Ogletree.

     
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