Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsGnome. Show PatsGnome's posts

    Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    With the injuries that have occurred to both Hernandez and Gronkowski over the last two seasons, especially to Gronkowski.  I believe these two tight-ends will not finish their current contracts.

    Do you believe Belichick signed Ballard because of how beat up our tight-ends our getting the last two years?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to PatsGnome's comment:

     

    With the injuries that have occurred to both Hernandez and Gronkowski over the last two seasons, especially to Gronkowski.  I believe these two tight-ends will not finish their current contracts.

    Do you believe Belichick signed Ballard because of how beat up our tight-ends our getting the last two years?

     



    nope. he got burned last super bowl. wasnt gonna happen again. my read.

     

    further i suggested we needed to do it (buildin redundancy at te in our offense that runs on teh premise of 2 eliet tes) long before gronks injury last year

     
  3. This post has been removed.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from wonderdrums. Show wonderdrums's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to RockScully's comment:

    In response to PatsGnome's comment:

     

    With the injuries that have occurred to both Hernandez and Gronkowski over the last two seasons, especially to Gronkowski.  I believe these two tight-ends will not finish their current contracts.

    Do you believe Belichick signed Ballard because of how beat up our tight-ends our getting the last two years?

     




    I think it has more to do with how much they target that position which ups the odds that there will be injuries, not that Gronk or Hernandez are "soft".

     

     



    I'm with you on that one Rock. Gronk wasnt called soft when he was running everybody over last season. The way these guys hit each other it's only a matter of time before an injury strikes. There is one exception on the team who seems to somehow always get up. I don't want to say his name and jinx him, but I will say his first and last name start with the same letter.........that wascally wabbit. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from sporter81. Show sporter81's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to RockScully's comment:

    In response to PatsGnome's comment:

     

    With the injuries that have occurred to both Hernandez and Gronkowski over the last two seasons, especially to Gronkowski.  I believe these two tight-ends will not finish their current contracts.

    Do you believe Belichick signed Ballard because of how beat up our tight-ends our getting the last two years?

    Good point, the TE is an intregal part of the offense, more so than just about any other team that I can think of.  Next year when everyone is healthy they could put gronk, ballard, and hernandez all out there at the same time. i'd think that would cause some problems for the opposition. if demps can play and stay healthy they will once again have a pretty sick offense. 




    I think it has more to do with how much they target that position which ups the odds that there will be injuries, not that Gronk or Hernandez are "soft".

     

     




     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    The timing of Gronk's injuries have been unlucky to say the least.  Hernandez got hurt but he was there for the playoffs.

    The last two years showed that the Pats really need a good backup TE.  If the past two years show us anything the guy will have plenty of playing time. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from NoMorePensionLooting. Show NoMorePensionLooting's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    Didn't sign him, he signed him off the waiver wire. Ballard only has next season under contract to the Pats.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

    Didn't sign him, he signed him off the waiver wire. Ballard only has next season under contract to the Pats.



    you think he wants to stay or go to the giants?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    What kind of question is that?  Of course BB knew, he knows everything.  He knows your questioning him, and he doesn't like it.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    Ballard will play one season for the Pats and then will be gone to the highest bidder.  He probably has no intention of returning to the Giants unless they pay up. 

    The tight end position in New England is by no means soft.  Hoom and Daniel Fells are pretty capable subs at this point.  Hernandez isn't injured right now.

    Gronk came to the Patriots from college with bad back issues.  That's one reason that he dropped into the second round.  I've never heard of forearms staying permanently injured.  Gronk's knees, shoulders, foot speed and brain, the biggest worry spots, seem to be all in good shape at this time. 

    Every position on the field is temporary in some sense.

     
  11. This post has been removed.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    THis team really has two positions, not one, for TE. SO you need a second player at each of those positions. Consider RB. There is no way you have only one. And in fact no way you have only 2! Same with the two types of TE positions. You need some degree of quality behind each one of those spots. Quality enough because you can almost guarantee that at one time or another during the season a guy will miss time. And if it happens in the playoffs (and someone will miss time in the playoffs) then it is even more critical.

    BB teams put a lot of stock in depth of talent. Having Gronk and Hern is great. But it doesnt lessen the need for talent behind them.

    Ballard was an easy way of doing that for next year. I am not convinced that Fells will make the team next year. I suspect he is not living up to all that they had hoped. But perhaps he will redeem himself during the playoffs - or during preseason.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to jri37's comment:

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

     

    Ballard will play one season for the Pats and then will be gone to the highest bidder.  He probably has no intention of returning to the Giants unless they pay up. 

    The tight end position in New England is by no means soft.  Hoom and Daniel Fells are pretty capable subs at this point.  Hernandez isn't injured right now.

    Gronk came to the Patriots from college with bad back issues.  That's one reason that he dropped into the second round.  I've never heard of forearms staying permanently injured.  Gronk's knees, shoulders, foot speed and brain, the biggest worry spots, seem to be all in good shape at this time. 

    Every position on the field is temporary in some sense.

     




     

    Ballard brings a better skill set than Fells. He is a better route runner, catcher of the ball and a better blocker. It will come down to money and fit behind Gronk and Hern.



    I think a healthy Ballard and Huma's ability to play all 4 special teams means no spot for Fells. Disappointed in Fells ability to get on the field this year, especially with the injuries at the position. Unfortunately this means more dead money from this disaster of a free agency year...

    Wopuld not surprise me to see 4 TE's: Gronk, Hern, Ballard, Huma. 5 RB's: Ridley, Vereeen, Woody, Bolden, Demps. Need some young legs at WR: Wes, Lloyd, Edelman, Slater, Free Agent/Draft Choice

    Looking at free agents with $$ in mind with the hopeful signing of Wes, I like Donnie Avery as a down field WR with speed....I also like David Nelson...even though coming off of injury.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    With Gronk and Hern signed to long-term deals, I think BB knows he needs quality depth at their position because obviously the offense is going to be designed to utlize two TEs on a large percentage of plays.  Hence the parade of TEs he's had in camp and during the season (Fells, Shiancoe, Hoomanawanui, and--for next year--Ballard).  

    I think it will be interesting to see what they do with WRs next year.  I think they were hoping to shore up that position with one more true outside WR to complement Lloyd and the slots (Welker and Edelman).  Hence having Branch, Gaffney, and Stallworth (plus some lesser known guys) in camp.  All of those guys were cut (though Branch and Stallworth both came back for periods).  Salas was brought in for a short time (he is more a slot, but with some outside potential), but really there's never been a solid second outside receiver on the team.  I think that is the one weakness the team has in offensive skill positions now and if they could bring that guy in next year they could have the most complete and awesome range of offensive talent we've ever seen.  Think of it:  Vereen and Ridley, Gronk, Ballard, and Hern, Welker (if we keep him), Lloyd, and another big, fast X-type receiver.  Wow!  Beat you running, beat you with quickness short, beat you with size, and beat you with speed deep and on the perimeter . . .

     

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    yeah, if the Pats had that type of player that would take a defender out of the play deep, it really would open up a lot underneath. many thought Lloyd was that player, but obviously he is not. Avery is.

    Not sure the Colts let him get away, but I like him on this WR group

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    yeah, if the Pats had that type of player that would take a defender out of the play deep, it really would open up a lot underneath. many thought Lloyd was that player, but obviously he is not. Avery is.

    Not sure the Colts let him get away, but I like him on this WR group




    Yeah, I think Avery would be a fit.  Jennings too, but probably too expensive.  Wouldn't mind seeing us take a good young one in the draft either.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    I look at it as BB saw a team those a young, under contract TE with a lot of promise on waivers trying to sneak him through because of injury and said, it's like someone giving away a free late 1st early 2nd round draft pick. I'll gobble it up and make room for him.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    - Although Tom Brady hasn’t called upon Michael Hoomanawanui or Daniel Fells much in the passing game, on their limited targets they have averaged 21.8 and 21.3 yards per catch, respectively. That is the second- and third-best marks in the league for those playing at least 25% of their team’s snaps.

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/01/16/32-observations-conference-championships/

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to jri37's comment:

     

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

     

    Ballard will play one season for the Pats and then will be gone to the highest bidder.  He probably has no intention of returning to the Giants unless they pay up. 

    The tight end position in New England is by no means soft.  Hoom and Daniel Fells are pretty capable subs at this point.  Hernandez isn't injured right now.

    Gronk came to the Patriots from college with bad back issues.  That's one reason that he dropped into the second round.  I've never heard of forearms staying permanently injured.  Gronk's knees, shoulders, foot speed and brain, the biggest worry spots, seem to be all in good shape at this time. 

    Every position on the field is temporary in some sense.

     




     

    Ballard brings a better skill set than Fells. He is a better route runner, catcher of the ball and a better blocker. It will come down to money and fit behind Gronk and Hern.

     



    I think a healthy Ballard and Huma's ability to play all 4 special teams means no spot for Fells. Disappointed in Fells ability to get on the field this year, especially with the injuries at the position. Unfortunately this means more dead money from this disaster of a free agency year...

     

    Wopuld not surprise me to see 4 TE's: Gronk, Hern, Ballard, Huma. 5 RB's: Ridley, Vereeen, Woody, Bolden, Demps. Need some young legs at WR: Wes, Lloyd, Edelman, Slater, Free Agent/Draft Choice

    Looking at free agents with $$ in mind with the hopeful signing of Wes, I like Donnie Avery as a down field WR with speed....I also like David Nelson...even though coming off of injury.



    " think a healthy Ballard and Huma's ability to play all 4 special teams means no spot for Fells. Disappointed in Fells ability to get on the field this year, especially with the injuries at the position. Unfortunately this means more dead money from this disaster of a free agency year..."

    agree wih this

     

     

    Wopuld not surprise me to see 4 TE's: Gronk, Hern, Ballard, Huma. 5 RB's: Ridley, Vereeen, Woody, Bolden, Demps. Need some young legs at WR: Wes, Lloyd, Edelman, Slater, Free Agent/Draft Choice"

     

    agree with this

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to jri37's comment:

     

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

     

    Ballard will play one season for the Pats and then will be gone to the highest bidder.  He probably has no intention of returning to the Giants unless they pay up. 

    The tight end position in New England is by no means soft.  Hoom and Daniel Fells are pretty capable subs at this point.  Hernandez isn't injured right now.

    Gronk came to the Patriots from college with bad back issues.  That's one reason that he dropped into the second round.  I've never heard of forearms staying permanently injured.  Gronk's knees, shoulders, foot speed and brain, the biggest worry spots, seem to be all in good shape at this time. 

    Every position on the field is temporary in some sense.

     




     

    Ballard brings a better skill set than Fells. He is a better route runner, catcher of the ball and a better blocker. It will come down to money and fit behind Gronk and Hern.

     



    I think a healthy Ballard and Huma's ability to play all 4 special teams means no spot for Fells. Disappointed in Fells ability to get on the field this year, especially with the injuries at the position. Unfortunately this means more dead money from this disaster of a free agency year...

     

    Wopuld not surprise me to see 4 TE's: Gronk, Hern, Ballard, Huma. 5 RB's: Ridley, Vereeen, Woody, Bolden, Demps. Need some young legs at WR: Wes, Lloyd, Edelman, Slater, Free Agent/Draft Choice

    Looking at free agents with $$ in mind with the hopeful signing of Wes, I like Donnie Avery as a down field WR with speed....I also like David Nelson...even though coming off of injury.



    rkarp,

    i sign talib for 4 years option 5th, 2 guaranteed (behavior clause). this is the first time in years we have a chance to have a real defense, that the playiing man with talib allows, and dennard to a lesser extent. if we do this and get a pass rusher in the offseason, look out. whether we add teh safety too or not.

     

    heres what i like to do sign byrd/goldson, one of the many pass rusher free agents, and maybe a speedy linebacker.

    in draft xavier rhodes, the big tough, fast cb, a big outside wr 6 2"+ 200+ (several in draft), and interior o line.

    chung can walk. arrington 1-2 mil or let walk. chung bye.

    edelman 3 yrs 7-8 mil welker 5 yeears 30 mil or tag, vollmer 4yrs - 24ish, woody 1-2 mil

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    With Gronk and Hern signed to long-term deals, I think BB knows he needs quality depth at their position because obviously the offense is going to be designed to utlize two TEs on a large percentage of plays.  Hence the parade of TEs he's had in camp and during the season (Fells, Shiancoe, Hoomanawanui, and--for next year--Ballard).  

    I think it will be interesting to see what they do with WRs next year.  I think they were hoping to shore up that position with one more true outside WR to complement Lloyd and the slots (Welker and Edelman).  Hence having Branch, Gaffney, and Stallworth (plus some lesser known guys) in camp.  All of those guys were cut (though Branch and Stallworth both came back for periods).  Salas was brought in for a short time (he is more a slot, but with some outside potential), but really there's never been a solid second outside receiver on the team.  I think that is the one weakness the team has in offensive skill positions now and if they could bring that guy in next year they could have the most complete and awesome range of offensive talent we've ever seen.  Think of it:  Vereen and Ridley, Gronk, Ballard, and Hern, Welker (if we keep him), Lloyd, and another big, fast X-type receiver.  Wow!  Beat you running, beat you with quickness short, beat you with size, and beat you with speed deep and on the perimeter . . .

     

     



    as i have it too!

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    I look at it as BB saw a team those a young, under contract TE with a lot of promise on waivers trying to sneak him through because of injury and said, it's like someone giving away a free late 1st early 2nd round draft pick. I'll gobble it up and make room for him.



    yuup

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to PatsGnome's comment:

     

    With the injuries that have occurred to both Hernandez and Gronkowski over the last two seasons, especially to Gronkowski.  I believe these two tight-ends will not finish their current contracts.

    Do you believe Belichick signed Ballard because of how beat up our tight-ends our getting the last two years?

     




    I think that's a stretch.

     

    Gronk's broken forearm was a fluke injury; can't account for those.

    The ankle injuries to Gronk (by Pollard) and Hernandez (by Edelman) were cases where another player's entire body weight fell rolled their ankles...any athlete would have suffered severe ankle injuries under the same scenarios.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from xXR3S1NXx. Show xXR3S1NXx's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

     

    In response to jri37's comment:

     

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

     

    Ballard will play one season for the Pats and then will be gone to the highest bidder.  He probably has no intention of returning to the Giants unless they pay up. 

    The tight end position in New England is by no means soft.  Hoom and Daniel Fells are pretty capable subs at this point.  Hernandez isn't injured right now.

    Gronk came to the Patriots from college with bad back issues.  That's one reason that he dropped into the second round.  I've never heard of forearms staying permanently injured.  Gronk's knees, shoulders, foot speed and brain, the biggest worry spots, seem to be all in good shape at this time. 

    Every position on the field is temporary in some sense.

     




     

    Ballard brings a better skill set than Fells. He is a better route runner, catcher of the ball and a better blocker. It will come down to money and fit behind Gronk and Hern.

     



    I think a healthy Ballard and Huma's ability to play all 4 special teams means no spot for Fells. Disappointed in Fells ability to get on the field this year, especially with the injuries at the position. Unfortunately this means more dead money from this disaster of a free agency year...

     

    Wopuld not surprise me to see 4 TE's: Gronk, Hern, Ballard, Huma. 5 RB's: Ridley, Vereeen, Woody, Bolden, Demps. Need some young legs at WR: Wes, Lloyd, Edelman, Slater, Free Agent/Draft Choice

    Looking at free agents with $$ in mind with the hopeful signing of Wes, I like Donnie Avery as a down field WR with speed....I also like David Nelson...even though coming off of injury.

     



    rkarp,

     

    i sign talib for 4 years option 5th, 2 guaranteed (behavior clause). this is the first time in years we have a chance to have a real defense, that the playiing man with talib allows, and dennard to a lesser extent. if we do this and get a pass rusher in the offseason, look out. whether we add teh safety too or not.

     

    heres what i like to do sign byrd/goldson, one of the many pass rusher free agents, and maybe a speedy linebacker.

    in draft xavier rhodes, the big tough, fast cb, a big outside wr 6 2"+ 200+ (several in draft), and interior o line.

    chung can walk. arrington 1-2 mil or let walk. chung bye.

    edelman 3 yrs 7-8 mil welker 5 yeears 30 mil or tag, vollmer 4yrs - 24ish, woody 1-2 mil




    Id give Talib 3 years with an option for a 4th. 5 years is way to long for a DB, Id never give Edelman a Long term extension until he proves he can stay healthy, and 5 years is way too long for Welker. Id go 3 with and option for a 4th or the Tag like you stated.  The Rest though is Spot on. Id like to see the pats bring in a big Physical Safety to Pair with McCourty and take another flier on a troubled Talent in the later rounds Like they did with dennard.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Did BB know how soft the TE position was when he signed Jake Ballard?

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

     

    In response to rkarp's comment:

     

    In response to jri37's comment:

     

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

     

    Ballard will play one season for the Pats and then will be gone to the highest bidder.  He probably has no intention of returning to the Giants unless they pay up. 

    The tight end position in New England is by no means soft.  Hoom and Daniel Fells are pretty capable subs at this point.  Hernandez isn't injured right now.

    Gronk came to the Patriots from college with bad back issues.  That's one reason that he dropped into the second round.  I've never heard of forearms staying permanently injured.  Gronk's knees, shoulders, foot speed and brain, the biggest worry spots, seem to be all in good shape at this time. 

    Every position on the field is temporary in some sense.

     




     

    Ballard brings a better skill set than Fells. He is a better route runner, catcher of the ball and a better blocker. It will come down to money and fit behind Gronk and Hern.

     



    I think a healthy Ballard and Huma's ability to play all 4 special teams means no spot for Fells. Disappointed in Fells ability to get on the field this year, especially with the injuries at the position. Unfortunately this means more dead money from this disaster of a free agency year...

     

    Wopuld not surprise me to see 4 TE's: Gronk, Hern, Ballard, Huma. 5 RB's: Ridley, Vereeen, Woody, Bolden, Demps. Need some young legs at WR: Wes, Lloyd, Edelman, Slater, Free Agent/Draft Choice

    Looking at free agents with $$ in mind with the hopeful signing of Wes, I like Donnie Avery as a down field WR with speed....I also like David Nelson...even though coming off of injury.

     



    rkarp,

     

    i sign talib for 4 years option 5th, 2 guaranteed (behavior clause). this is the first time in years we have a chance to have a real defense, that the playiing man with talib allows, and dennard to a lesser extent. if we do this and get a pass rusher in the offseason, look out. whether we add teh safety too or not.

     

    heres what i like to do sign byrd/goldson, one of the many pass rusher free agents, and maybe a speedy linebacker.

    in draft xavier rhodes, the big tough, fast cb, a big outside wr 6 2"+ 200+ (several in draft), and interior o line.

    chung can walk. arrington 1-2 mil or let walk. chung bye.

    edelman 3 yrs 7-8 mil welker 5 yeears 30 mil or tag, vollmer 4yrs - 24ish, woody 1-2 mil

     




     

    Id give Talib 3 years with an option for a 4th. 5 years is way to long for a DB, Id never give Edelman a Long term extension until he proves he can stay healthy, and 5 years is way too long for Welker. Id go 3 with and option for a 4th or the Tag like you stated.  The Rest though is Spot on. Id like to see the pats bring in a big Physical Safety to Pair with McCourty and take another flier on a troubled Talent in the later rounds Like they did with dennard.



    xxr, here's teh thing to grasp. length of contract means nothing. only the $ guaranteed.

    the longer # of years is great to have in case teh player is still performing. in football, you always can be cut.

    but if they are playing well, toward teh end of that contract, if you are getting performanace, its going to be at a huge discount (and give the team a lot of stabilitiy).

    the 5 years for welk is incentive. longterm stability and h of fame possibility.

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share