Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from RiceintheHall. Show RiceintheHall's posts

    Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    My two cents....the Pats O-line is bigger and stronger than the 2009 team.  additions of Waters, Solder, and Volmer(if healthy) are much stronger that the 2009 line. I thought the 09 team was soft upfront.    

    I think the Pats Defense is really bad, they can put an aweful lot of beef on the defensive line against the run.  The run defense might be a little better this time around.   Thought? 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brad34. Show Brad34's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    2 virtually uncoverable tight ends as well. If you are talking about the playoff game against Ravens also Welker will be there as he got hurt the week before that game against Ravens in 09. Also Brady was only just feeling his way back after the major knee injury in 09. Linebackers are better as well now with Spikes,Nickovich and Mayo all stand outs last week against Denver. Looking at Baltimore their defensive stars in Suggs,Lewis and Reed are all a couple of years older and slower and we have seen first hand what age can do to even the greatest defensive players in the playoffs Brucshi and Harrison.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rerun85. Show Rerun85's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Brads right. I don't need to add anything to that.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    would be easier to ask what is similar or the same.

    Completely different teams.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brad34. Show Brad34's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Also looking at the Ravens Herman Munster Flaco hasn't developed at all either. He still can't win a game when it is all on him.
    I hope BB is showing that opening touch touchdown run of Rice's in the 09 game to Vince Wilfork over and over and over again this week.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from mgraham. Show mgraham's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    In Response to Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?:
    My two cents....the Pats O-line is bigger and stronger than the 2009 team.  additions of Waters, Solder, and Volmer(if healthy) are much stronger that the 2009 line. I thought the 09 team was soft upfront.     I think the Pats Defense is really bad, they can put an aweful lot of beef on the defensive line against the run.  The run defense might be a little better this time around.   Thought? 
    Posted by RiceintheHall


    i agree and I think Vollmer is key here. If he is healthy then Solder can come in as a TE or Hback w/ Hernandez as the RB? ( was that a surprise last week?) and we have a 3-headed monster .  What do they do now w/ those 5 recievers..  Solder TE  , Gronk slot or WR, Hernandez  RB, TE , WR? Welker slot opposite side  and oooh maybe Owcho to spread the field???

    intersting???
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SANPAT. Show SANPAT's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    No selfish players and mentaly strong
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from NOISE. Show NOISE's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Welker will be playing this time around too!
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    In 09 there was a lot working against us in that game, but let's face it - we got blown out - wasn't even competitive. For starters Wilfork was coming off a pretty bad ankle injury and it showed. There was no Welker, but we did have Moss. The tight end of note that we had was Watson...no comparison to what we have now. Brady was playing with a pretty serious rib injury. You had some real duds on the defensive side...Banta Cain (who was probably one of their better players, that dope from Oakland, Thomas (who quit on the team) and Mayo also had a bad year coming back from a bad ankle injury. Ty Warren was playing hurt and I'm not sure he even played in that game...hip injury. Our running backs were Maroney, Faulk, an old Fred Taylor and Sammy Morris.

    This time around we'll have a healthy Welker, Brady, Wilfork and Mayo. Our offensive line looks better. Our tight end position is much better. I'd say the running back position is a wash - which is a shame because if a guy like Ridley or Vareen had some quality starts we could of been better. Defensively I'd say we have more potential now, but with all the injuries we had this year we are vulnerable against the pass to say the least. There are some young players that may make a difference this time around...Spikes, Chung, Anderson, Fletcher. And some decent veterans...Ellis and Warren.

    I think we win this time out...24-17

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    In Response to Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?:
    In 09 there was a lot working against us in that game, but let's face it - we got blown out - wasn't even competitive. For starters Wilfork was coming off a pretty bad ankle injury and it showed. There was no Welker, but we did have Moss. The tight end of note that we had was Watson...no comparison to what we have now. Brady was playing with a pretty serious rib injury. You had some real duds on the defensive side...Banta Cain (who was probably one of their better players, that dope from Oakland, Thomas (who quit on the team) and Mayo also had a bad year coming back from a bad ankle injury. Ty Warren was playing hurt and I'm not sure he even played in that game...hip injury. ...
    Posted by mthurl


    i don't remember the injuries on the d side but tha explains a lot of what i remember from that game. it was a little painful to watch. there was that shock right at the very beginning.

    i don't know if it was teh ankle injury, but i remember telling myself that vw was gassed halfway through the game, because the d kept coming back on the field and they would stay on the field for long periods.

    today, with love in there, i don't think the bal OL can overpower the pats DL. i actually think now that the pats DL can overpower the bal OL. and they can sustain that with their rotation of big boys. this time around, i expect the bal OL to run out of gas so that by early second half, we'll see the pats d penetrate the OL a lot.




     
  11. This post has been removed.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brad34. Show Brad34's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    In Response to Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?:
    No AD or Moss or Burgess to be cancers this year. Has anyone else noted that they haven't lost since Fat Albert was cut?
    Posted by Patsfansince1966


    And Tampa Bay didn't win one game since Fat Albert rode into town there. Coach got fired as well.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Where to begin... 2009 in blue and 2011 in red. 


    Quarterback - Brady was rusty all year, he had been knocked down, beat down and humbled all year. He wasn't his usually accurate self all year and his mobility in the pocket was not what it had been in '07 and earlier on in his career. C 

    2011, Tom Brady is playing lights out football. After the Steelers game, a pass rush stop effecting Brady and he started making his own pocket if the OL failed him. A-

    Running Back - Lawrence Maroney was our feature back. Twinkle toes and soft, couldn't run the ball or catch the ball. F

    Benny, Woody and Stevan are all much better backs than Laura Maroney. Woody and Stevan bring the flash while Benny brings the hammer. Polite will also come in handy if they decide to go with a power run. B

    Offensive Line - I believe Matt Light wasn't healthy and Kaczur stunk. Neal wasn't that good either in pass protection. C 

    In 2011, our guards are the strengths of this OL. Waters and Mankins are tough, Mankins stinks in pass protection, but they're tough. Baltimore's DL won't push them around. Light has lost a step, but I think he could still take it to Suggs. If Vollmer is healthy, that's a plus. That can only boost our running game because it means Solder comes in with Polite and we smash the ball down the Ravens' throats. B

    Wide Receivers - In 2009, Bill O'Brien's worst years as our OC, our offense was simply Moss up top and Welker underneath. The Pats had no secondary WR and when they lost Welker in Houston, they just had Moss. Moss did his usual disappearance in the post-season and they were left with Edelman as the only WR. C-

    Branch gives Brady another security blanket and a healthy Welker means Webb is going to get challenged. If they ever get Ocho going he adds another fold to the team. With McDaniels creating the gameplans I hope they implement him in this game. This could be his last chance to get a SB ring, I hope he comes to play. Edelman could come in handy as well as he always comes up big against the Ravens/Jets. B- 

    Tight Ends - Watson and Baker, that's all I'll say. F

    Gronk and the Rainmaker are beasts! They're the strengths of this team. This is, without a doubt, the biggest upgrade between these two teams. A+


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Defensive Line - Wilfork and Warren were bangged up by the time we got to playoffs, the Pats had a major weakness at the RDE since the traded Seymour and Jarvis Green is only a pass-rush. They Ravens lined up and ran it down his throat. C

    I call 'em the great wall of beef. You better believe that BB is going to go with Ellis, Wilfork and Love again. Good luck running on those guys, Anderson is a better pash rush than we had in '09. B-

    Linebackers Mayo wasn't right because he had a sprained MCL and wasn't right, Guyton was terrible and soft. Adoofus Thomas and Derrick Burgess didn't even try, TBC did the majority of the work on defense. D-


    In 2011, Spikes, Mayo and Nink the Dink are servicable and tough. They might not be the best, but they'll give you 100% on every down. C+

    Corner Back - Bodden was solid and Springs was okay, Butler was okay in the slot as well. C

    Arrington is okay, Molden is okay, Moore is okay and hits like a safety. McCourty is the weak link, gets turned around to easily, doesn't play the ball, can't manD

    Safety - Sanders sucks and Meriweather was too dumb to do anything. McGowan was solid, but he got benched and Chung was a rookie who made no impact. D+

    Chung is solid and McCourty could be as well in the backfield. It's an improvement soley because Chung is a better safety than both Meriweather and Sanders. C
     
  15. This post has been removed.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from carawaydj. Show carawaydj's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Holy Cow 49Patriots!  I knew we were a better team this year but your breakdown really hammers home just how better we are.

    I'll add one more advantage this year, playmakers.  In 2009 you could not count on anyone to step up and make a critical play when it was needed the most.  This team reminds me of our SB teams.  If they get backed against a wall and really need someone to step up and make a play, someone often does.  This year whenever things aren't going right, I have that feeling (once again) that someone will make a key play.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    if they can keep the likes of welker, gronk, hernandez as wrs/te - the offense should continue to be a force in the next 3-5 years.

    Cannon and Solder shore up the OL for the future....

    Ridley and vareen may actually have a larger impact to the running game; if they continue to develop

    Defensively, the scrubs are doing pretty well.....but not sure if they are big playmakers in the playoffs..... ...........................yet.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from hoochiemgg. Show hoochiemgg's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    The 2009 Pats lost....The 2011 Pats will win....handily.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbear3915. Show mbear3915's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Great analysis guys ... for me the biggest differences are:

    1) Gronk and Hernandez ...  critical parts of our offense
    2) Wes will be playing
    3) Tom is in a zone (hard to quantify - but a big part of success)
    4) O-line is playing well as a unit
    5) The Defense seems to be showing up when it counts
    6) Team chemistry is so positive this year

    Helping is that:

    7) Key Ravens (Reed, Lewis) are two years older
    8) Their Offense is erratic

    My worry:   I'm afraid of Bernard Pollard - any chance we send our new fullback out early to plow over him a few times?


     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    The Ravens' fans still think this is the same Pats team as 2009 as they constantly use that game as a measure of how the Ravens will do Sunday.  They are in for a BIG shock!
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    In Response to Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?:
    My two cents....the Pats O-line is bigger and stronger than the 2009 team.  additions of Waters, Solder, and Volmer(if healthy) are much stronger that the 2009 line. I thought the 09 team was soft upfront.     I think the Pats Defense is really bad, they can put an aweful lot of beef on the defensive line against the run.  The run defense might be a little better this time around.   Thought? 
    Posted by RiceintheHall


    When you talk about bigger and stronger on the O line why did you not mention Canon? He is playing a good amount.

    You also don't mention Gronk or Hernandez. While their addition to the passing game has been HUGE so has their blocking, especially Gronk. So yet another bigger stronger part of the blocking unit.

    You also do not mention Spikes or Nink. While Spikes has missed some time to injury his game against Denver showed an uptick in physical play inside. A huge improvement over guys like Guyton. Nink has just kept on developing. While not a "stud" (that is to say he does not make the other team game plan for him) he can be a very effective, dangerous player. Also, while Carter went down Anderson has added pass rush.

    Next year I suspect you will include Vereen but he has to prove himself and he is obviously a non factor this year. Hoping Ridley stops fumbling or he wont see the field ever again in this uniform. Ashame as he is showing real upgrade there.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    Great breakdown by 49!

    What I don't hear people talk about much is the fact that Brady was coming off one of the worst injuries a QB can have. This injury historically takes QB's 2 years to come back from(and be effective) look at Carson Palmer. He still took a one dimensional offense with very limited personnel to the playoffs.

    The biggest difference to me is Tom Brady being healthy followed by an obvious influx of talent on the offense.

    Brady has proven year after year he can win with anybody, but given good offensive talent he is close to unstoppable.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from No-Mercy-Defence. Show No-Mercy-Defence's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    game is won 45-7 with ravens only touchdown coming from a fumble by ridley with 1 minute left to go in the 4th qtr.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from bobomul. Show bobomul's posts

    Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?

    In Response to Re: Differences between 2011 Pats and 2009 Pats?:
    Defensive Line  -  Wilfork and Warren were bangged up by the time we got to playoffs, the Pats had a major weakness at the RDE since the traded Seymour and Jarvis Green is only a pass-rush. They Ravens lined up and ran it down his throat.   C I call 'em the great wall of beef. You better believe that BB is going to go with Ellis, Wilfork and Love again. Good luck running on those guys, Anderson is a better pash rush than we had in '09.   B- Linebackers  -  Mayo wasn't right because he had a sprained MCL and wasn't right, Guyton was terrible and soft. Adoofus Thomas and Derrick Burgess didn't even try, TBC did the majority of the work on defense.   D- In 2011, Spikes, Mayo and Nink the Dink are servicable and tough. They might not be the best, but they'll give you 100% on every down.   C+ Corner Back  -  Bodden was solid and Springs was okay, Butler was okay in the slot as well.   C Arrington is okay, Molden is okay, Moore is okay and hits like a safety. McCourty is the weak link, gets turned around to easily, doesn't play the ball, can't man .  D Safety  -  Sanders sucks and Meriweather was too dumb to do anything. McGowan was solid, but he got benched and Chung was a rookie who made no impact.   D+ Chung is solid and McCourty could be as well in the backfield. It's an improvement soley because Chung is a better safety than both Meriweather and Sanders.   C
    Posted by 49Patriots


    I tend to agree with 49er on the offense as the Pats have much more options in the passing game vs Baltimore this time. NE in 2009 had only 2 recievers with more than 405 yards in Welker and Moss (who both had 1200+). Once Welker was taken out, this was a grossly imbalanced offense and not in the tradition of what NE likes to do in spreading the ball around. This year NE has 4 recievers available with over 700 yards comming into the Ravens game. Much more difficult to match up against than in 2009. I think the running game is basically a wash but I like Ridley's potential on Sunday than anyone NE had 2 years ago and Woodhead's alway a wildcard who can have nice pops.

    I have to say 49er is too generous on the defense though.  Mostly he has NE looking stronger accross the board on defense, with 1 small downgrade at CB.  Come on.... NE has given up about 90 more passing  yards game this year than 2 years ago and about 3.3 points/game on D.  It is not better than that season as a whole.  Bodden had an excellent year and the 2 safeties actually did play well that season.  Sanders was always steady and Merryweather had a much better year in 2009 than in 2010 (he actully stunk in 2010).  The saftey and CB play this year has generally been awful.  Getting Chung back is helpful but overall the secondary is very bad going into the Baltimore game this season.

    What's not been addressed is the Ravens this year vs 2009.  It's lazy and superficial analysis simply to conclude that 2 players on that team are older and thus the Ravens have taken a step back. They have improved in a couple of key areas: pass rush, secondary and WRs.

    T Sizzle had 4.5 sacks in 2009 but 12 this year.  Overall the Ravens have gone from 32 sacks to 46 as a team.  They really like Ladarius Webb at CB and Ngata is having an outstanding year at DE/DT.  Overall their defense has improved against the pass this year, mostly due to an improved pass rush.  NE's pass rush has also improved from 30 sacks to 40 but 10 of those came from the now injured A Carter.

    The area I worry about most (along with a bull rush up the middle into Brady from Ngata and the D line) is the Ravens WRs.  A Boltin and Tory Smith are the type of big, strong, fast WRs that have given NE's DBs fits all season. If they play back in a 2 deep zone, that gives too much room underneath for dump offs to the deadly Ray Rice to run in space.  This is a big improvement from the 2009 team that had aging Derick Mason and Mark Clayton.  NE will need to get some kind of pass rush on Flacco to protect it's secondary.  The one thing Flacco does well is through the deep ball for completions or (very often) interferenc penalties on the Defense.   The linebackers will have to make quick reads and tackle well to contain Ray Rice to prevent the 83 yard break away he did on the first play of the game in 2009 or more likely scampers off of short throws and screens this Sunday. 
     
  25. This post has been removed.

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share