Does resigning Welker make sense?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    If its up to me (the Pats fan) i say sign him to three year deal (maybe with a club option). If I am Welker's agent I fully realize that this could very well be the last time to cash in on big deal (four years at $9-10m per year) so I test the FA market. For example, Welker could be an awesome slot guy for Calvin Johnson and Matt Stafford. If I am contender I look at a Welker FA signing as enhancing the chances at a SB.

     

    Big thing is how many players are still on their rookie contracts and what goes on and comes off the books next year. I don;t know the answer to this so I`ll read and listen to whoever wants to write about it. My point being Spikes draft class could still be on rookie contracts and why pay more. Just begin discussing or negotiating with players you want to keep around.

     

    When someone mentioned the Pat were paying the offensive players (Brady et al) far more than the defensive players it was obvious that the offense was clearly better than the defense; if not than ask yourself how many teams would covet brady or Gronk more than Kyle Love. To me BB wanted to lock up Wilfork and Mayo because a) the are easily the best players on average D b) they are about the only defensive Pats players other teams would covet on the FA market.

    Do you extend Ridley right now? Or do you wait for his final rookie contract year to negotiate  a new deal.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from 15315k. Show 15315k's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to 15315k's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    I trust BB will do right with the players he has had the opportunity to have on his team. His record of assessing players he has actually coached is remarkable. The draft, not so much, though he has had his hits.



    Hey there jints, about time to change to UD6 ain't it?

    Tool!l




    Hi Rusty. Get a life.



    Don't worry bout me jintsfan .  

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ccnsd. Show ccnsd's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to JohnHannahrulz's comment:

    If its up to me (the Pats fan) i say sign him to three year deal (maybe with a club option). If I am Welker's agent I fully realize that this could very well be the last time to cash in on big deal (four years at $9-10m per year) so I test the FA market. For example, Welker could be an awesome slot guy for Calvin Johnson and Matt Stafford. If I am contender I look at a Welker FA signing as enhancing the chances at a SB.

     

    Big thing is how many players are still on their rookie contracts and what goes on and comes off the books next year. I don;t know the answer to this so I`ll read and listen to whoever wants to write about it. My point being Spikes draft class could still be on rookie contracts and why pay more. Just begin discussing or negotiating with players you want to keep around.

     

    When someone mentioned the Pat were paying the offensive players (Brady et al) far more than the defensive players it was obvious that the offense was clearly better than the defense; if not than ask yourself how many teams would covet brady or Gronk more than Kyle Love. To me BB wanted to lock up Wilfork and Mayo because a) the are easily the best players on average D b) they are about the only defensive Pats players other teams would covet on the FA market.

    Do you extend Ridley right now? Or do you wait for his final rookie contract year to negotiate  a new deal.



    If Ridley runs for 1300+ yards this year then it's decision time. They wouldn't match the Curtis Martin offer in the late 90's (who knows what Belichek would have done back then) and while they did win the super bowl a few years later i always felt letting Martin go to an AFC east club was a killer.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from palookaski. Show palookaski's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    ^^^ Ok you guys please stop the bashing, let it go. Good thread here.

    Signing Wes is a great Idea but not at anywhere near $8 mil/per for a slot.  Those numbers are for extraordinary young deep threat wideouts, not between the hashes.

    Wes should think about going elsewhere and getting killed. Wes works in a system now that has two great TE and now a deep threat on the field who all demand tight coverage - this opens Wes up. Wes is prolly Bradys second read on each pass play because of this. Wes should know that any Team interested in him should have nearly the same pieces in place the Pats now have -or else his health will suffer.

    Wes is a first down machine with his overwhelming receptions at 10 yards or less, very few over 20 yards. Skills deteriorate swiftly after age 32 which is reason why another team may not have interest at Big $. Any other team should also know that Wes' talents would be diminished if they're not setup like the Pats system. If I remember correctly Wes did some great work after Moss and before Gronk and Hern arrived but he suffered some physical abuse during that time.

    I think Wes will go for a 2 Year 6-7 mil/per with an option for one more. Even That's aLotta $$$ for a slot that will get you progressively into FG range, rather than a game changer WR. Wes needs to be smart and realize that Bellichick knows what's going on. Staying with Brady is not bad idea either.

    But then again if your a Dan Snyder or Jerry Jones, who knows? The cap ... is another story.

    Have a great night all ... Thanks to all who try to keep the forum going in a + direction.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    Before the year I'd say yes but right now I'm not sure. With the addition of the running game and running mostly 2 TE snaps, along with Fells proving to be a very capable blocker I'm starting to wonder if Welker is now the 3rd or even 4th option. It seems like Gronk and when health Hern might be option #1-2 with Lloyd being 3rd or 4th as Lloyd is always on the field and Welker is flexed out with Edelman and Branch in certain 2 TE sets.

    If that's the case then you could make a strong argument that $9mil is not worth spending on a #3/4 option when you have a strong running game. At that point the trade off becomes whether you put that money to enhance another weak spot on the team and if that extra money improves that weakness more then the drop off between Welker to Edelman as a #3/4 option.

    If money wasn't a factor then of course it makes sense but since both money and age are factors I'm going to have to go with no for right now



    eng,

    are you suggesting in your post we could sign him for 9 mil?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bradysgirlforreal. Show Bradysgirlforreal's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    It makes sense for 3 years at 5-6 million with Kraft giving him a 25 million $ signing bonus--c'mon Bob pony up for Bradys security blanket and a great Patriot--he's earned it and you have the money!! BTW he's also been the # 1 or 2 guy at receptions past 3 years and top 5 reciever in that period.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    Before the year I'd say yes but right now I'm not sure. With the addition of the running game and running mostly 2 TE snaps, along with Fells proving to be a very capable blocker I'm starting to wonder if Welker is now the 3rd or even 4th option. It seems like Gronk and when health Hern might be option #1-2 with Lloyd being 3rd or 4th as Lloyd is always on the field and Welker is flexed out with Edelman and Branch in certain 2 TE sets.

    If that's the case then you could make a strong argument that $9mil is not worth spending on a #3/4 option when you have a strong running game. At that point the trade off becomes whether you put that money to enhance another weak spot on the team and if that extra money improves that weakness more then the drop off between Welker to Edelman as a #3/4 option.

    If money wasn't a factor then of course it makes sense but since both money and age are factors I'm going to have to go with no for right now



    eng,

    are you suggesting in your post we could sign him for 9 mil?




    Well that's what the tag was so for the right number of years I think that would be around what you are looking at. But for $9mil for a single year not a chance more like $9mil average a year over a contract

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to Bradysgirlforreal's comment:

    It makes sense for 3 years at 5-6 million with Kraft giving him a 25 million $ signing bonus--c'mon Bob pony up for Bradys security blanket and a great Patriot--he's earned it and you have the money!! BTW he's also been the # 1 or 2 guy at receptions past 3 years and top 5 reciever in that period.



    The $25 mil signing bonus still counts against the cap

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to palookaski's comment:

    ^^^ Ok you guys please stop the bashing, let it go. Good thread here.

    Signing Wes is a great Idea but not at anywhere near $8 mil/per for a slot.  Those numbers are for extraordinary young deep threat wideouts, not between the hashes.

    Wes should think about going elsewhere and getting killed. Wes works in a system now that has two great TE and now a deep threat on the field who all demand tight coverage - this opens Wes up. Wes is prolly Bradys second read on each pass play because of this. Wes should know that any Team interested in him should have nearly the same pieces in place the Pats now have -or else his health will suffer.

    Wes is a first down machine with his overwhelming receptions at 10 yards or less, very few over 20 yards. Skills deteriorate swiftly after age 32 which is reason why another team may not have interest at Big $. Any other team should also know that Wes' talents would be diminished if they're not setup like the Pats system. If I remember correctly Wes did some great work after Moss and before Gronk and Hern arrived but he suffered some physical abuse during that time.

    I think Wes will go for a 2 Year 6-7 mil/per with an option for one more. Even That's aLotta $$$ for a slot that will get you progressively into FG range, rather than a game changer WR. Wes needs to be smart and realize that Bellichick knows what's going on. Staying with Brady is not bad idea either.

    But then again if your a Dan Snyder or Jerry Jones, who knows? The cap ... is another story.

    Have a great night all ... Thanks to all who try to keep the forum going in a + direction.



    Wes already turned that deal down before he was franchised

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to glenr's comment:

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    I'm a huge Welker fan and would love to see him on the team over the next couple of years but I don't see it happening.  He will be too expensive from a BB perspective.  Hate to see him go but don't see him staying.  The Gronk/Hernan investments make it pretty clear that is the direction the team is headed.




    Do you see him getting franchised again for 11 mil +  ?




    Now that is a very interesting question which, I believe, is why you posed it.  To be honest, I truly think that is situational.  By that I mean if, in the receiving corps, BB thinks he can replace Welker (Edeleman, Hern, both, whoever) then no.  On the other hand if he believes he needs Welker to win then yes I do. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    Of course he would prefer to stay here. Of course the Pats would like him to stay. Of course Welker will test the market. Of course Welker will get some strong offers.

    The questions are: Do the Pats get close enough to outside offers to retain him? I would expect it is less than a 50-50 possibility. Maybe 20 or 25% chance. I am not sure that the number of years will be an issue. He wanted 3 years. He has the current year so he might settle for 2 years in the next contract. Maybe. But a fear is that the Jets will make him a major offer. They do not have a single RELIABLE WR (including Holmes). He would be a huge help to what they are trying to do and give Sanchez a means of being more consistent than he truly is.

    Of course I hope Welker and the Pats come to an agreement that keeps him here.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from dapats1281. Show dapats1281's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to palookaski's comment:

    ^^^ Ok you guys please stop the bashing, let it go. Good thread here.

    Signing Wes is a great Idea but not at anywhere near $8 mil/per for a slot.  Those numbers are for extraordinary young deep threat wideouts, not between the hashes.

    Wes should think about going elsewhere and getting killed. Wes works in a system now that has two great TE and now a deep threat on the field who all demand tight coverage - this opens Wes up. Wes is prolly Bradys second read on each pass play because of this. Wes should know that any Team interested in him should have nearly the same pieces in place the Pats now have -or else his health will suffer.

    Wes is a first down machine with his overwhelming receptions at 10 yards or less, very few over 20 yards. Skills deteriorate swiftly after age 32 which is reason why another team may not have interest at Big $. Any other team should also know that Wes' talents would be diminished if they're not setup like the Pats system. If I remember correctly Wes did some great work after Moss and before Gronk and Hern arrived but he suffered some physical abuse during that time.

    I think Wes will go for a 2 Year 6-7 mil/per with an option for one more. Even That's aLotta $$$ for a slot that will get you progressively into FG range, rather than a game changer WR. Wes needs to be smart and realize that Bellichick knows what's going on. Staying with Brady is not bad idea either.

    But then again if your a Dan Snyder or Jerry Jones, who knows? The cap ... is another story.

    Have a great night all ... Thanks to all who try to keep the forum going in a + direction.



    Wes already turned that deal down before he was franchised



    Those numbers are not extrodinary for between the hashes? How many other receivers put those numbers as a slot receiver? Percy Harvin, Victor Cruz, Jimmy Graham, Aaron Hernandez, Vernon Davis, and Gronk   are the only players capable of putting up those numbers between the hashes that I've seen. If you're going with strictly WRs...then just Victor Cruz and Percy Harvin. 

     

    Don't knock value from Wes because he's a slot receiver, because there are basically no slot receivers who have the same production as Wes except Victor Cruz. 1500 yards are 1500 yards, whether you get them from the outside or inside the hashes.

     

    Wes thrived in 2009 when the only other option was Randy Moss. This was also when Moss started to slip too...Wes does not need 2 TEs and a deep threat to open up. Only thing working against Wes is his age, but there are always GMs who are willing to overpay

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from tanbass. Show tanbass's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

    2. Defense is full of holes and will need upgrades. I wouldn't mind seeing more money spent there for depth.




    This I don't agree with. Although are secondary seems to be a weak link right now, they are young, and could develop into some good players. I feel like the front 7 is pretty solid right now, minus maybe someone to compliment Jones on the other end. This to me does not equate to: "full of holes".

    I want to see more attention on beefing up the offensive line. I would love to see a 1st round pick on a OL stud (Center)??. . Maybe grab a 2nd or 3rd round Tackle or Guard, and then maybe bring in a couple FAs to see who can play.

    As far as Welker goes, I'd like to see him signed to a 2 year deal, with maybe some kind of stay healty option for year 3. He's a hell of a receiver for this team. How can you let 100 catches a year walk? I have a feeling they will lose him, and like anything else, it will come down to $$.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    I think Wes tests the market and finds 2/$16 is what is out there. He resigns with the Pats at those numbers

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    Before the year I'd say yes but right now I'm not sure. With the addition of the running game and running mostly 2 TE snaps, along with Fells proving to be a very capable blocker I'm starting to wonder if Welker is now the 3rd or even 4th option. It seems like Gronk and when health Hern might be option #1-2 with Lloyd being 3rd or 4th as Lloyd is always on the field and Welker is flexed out with Edelman and Branch in certain 2 TE sets.

    If that's the case then you could make a strong argument that $9mil is not worth spending on a #3/4 option when you have a strong running game. At that point the trade off becomes whether you put that money to enhance another weak spot on the team and if that extra money improves that weakness more then the drop off between Welker to Edelman as a #3/4 option.

    If money wasn't a factor then of course it makes sense but since both money and age are factors I'm going to have to go with no for right now



    eng,

    are you suggesting in your post we could sign him for 9 mil?




    Well that's what the tag was so for the right number of years I think that would be around what you are looking at. But for $9mil for a single year not a chance more like $9mil average a year over a contract



    are you aware that the tag is clsoe to 12 next year

    also my understanding is even 9 mil per year  would be ww yielding from what he and his agent wanted in offseason (multiple years 10+ mil)

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    I think Wes tests the market and finds 2/$16 is what is out there. He resigns with the Pats at those numbers

     



    that woudl not be bad. howvever not sure i agree somene wont offer big years and big per year$

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to palookaski's comment:

    ^^^ Ok you guys please stop the bashing, let it go. Good thread here.

    Signing Wes is a great Idea but not at anywhere near $8 mil/per for a slot.  Those numbers are for extraordinary young deep threat wideouts, not between the hashes.

    Wes should think about going elsewhere and getting killed. Wes works in a system now that has two great TE and now a deep threat on the field who all demand tight coverage - this opens Wes up. Wes is prolly Bradys second read on each pass play because of this. Wes should know that any Team interested in him should have nearly the same pieces in place the Pats now have -or else his health will suffer.

    Wes is a first down machine with his overwhelming receptions at 10 yards or less, very few over 20 yards. Skills deteriorate swiftly after age 32 which is reason why another team may not have interest at Big $. Any other team should also know that Wes' talents would be diminished if they're not setup like the Pats system. If I remember correctly Wes did some great work after Moss and before Gronk and Hern arrived but he suffered some physical abuse during that time.

    I think Wes will go for a 2 Year 6-7 mil/per with an option for one more. Even That's aLotta $$$ for a slot that will get you progressively into FG range, rather than a game changer WR. Wes needs to be smart and realize that Bellichick knows what's going on. Staying with Brady is not bad idea either.

    But then again if your a Dan Snyder or Jerry Jones, who knows? The cap ... is another story.

    Have a great night all ... Thanks to all who try to keep the forum going in a + direction.



    Wes already turned that deal down before he was franchised



    exactly. adn if his stats continue the way they are now....

    id liek to see a departure where he decides he wants to stay with brady, win sb's and maybe even shot at the hall here, vs big $ elsewhere. how many million doens one need to feel secure?

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from glenr. Show glenr's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    Home from a long day on the road....


    From what I remember the two sticking points were the third year and the percentage of the contract he wanted guaranteed. We all know the front office doesn't like front loaded guaranteed contracts.

     

    I had to stream the game and I just finished watching the NFL Network game replay that I recorded last night. Some people commented earlier on how much Welker gets hit. After watching the replay I'm surprised at how much he doesn't get hit. He knows when to duck especially on those first down + 1 yard catches when he knows he has the first and there's no use getting his head taken off for an extra 3 yards.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bradysgirlforreal. Show Bradysgirlforreal's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Bradysgirlforreal's comment:

    It makes sense for 3 years at 5-6 million with Kraft giving him a 25 million $ signing bonus--c'mon Bob pony up for Bradys security blanket and a great Patriot--he's earned it and you have the money!! BTW he's also been the # 1 or 2 guy at receptions past 3 years and top 5 reciever in that period.



    The $25 mil signing bonus still counts against the cap



    Are you sure about that I thought only guaranteed contracts did ?

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from glenr. Show glenr's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to palookaski's comment:

    ^^^ Ok you guys please stop the bashing, let it go. Good thread here.

    Signing Wes is a great Idea but not at anywhere near $8 mil/per for a slot.  Those numbers are for extraordinary young deep threat wideouts, not between the hashes.

    Wes should think about going elsewhere and getting killed. Wes works in a system now that has two great TE and now a deep threat on the field who all demand tight coverage - this opens Wes up. Wes is prolly Bradys second read on each pass play because of this. Wes should know that any Team interested in him should have nearly the same pieces in place the Pats now have -or else his health will suffer.

    Wes is a first down machine with his overwhelming receptions at 10 yards or less, very few over 20 yards. Skills deteriorate swiftly after age 32 which is reason why another team may not have interest at Big $. Any other team should also know that Wes' talents would be diminished if they're not setup like the Pats system. If I remember correctly Wes did some great work after Moss and before Gronk and Hern arrived but he suffered some physical abuse during that time.

    I think Wes will go for a 2 Year 6-7 mil/per with an option for one more. Even That's aLotta $$$ for a slot that will get you progressively into FG range, rather than a game changer WR. Wes needs to be smart and realize that Bellichick knows what's going on. Staying with Brady is not bad idea either.

    But then again if your a Dan Snyder or Jerry Jones, who knows? The cap ... is another story.

    Have a great night all ... Thanks to all who try to keep the forum going in a + direction.



    Wes already turned that deal down before he was franchised



    exactly. adn if his stats continue the way they are now....

    id liek to see a departure where he decides he wants to stay with brady, win sb's and maybe even shot at the hall here, vs big $ elsewhere. how many million doens one need to feel secure?




    Don't put it all on money equaling security. In the NFL the amount you can get a contract for has as much to do with ego as it does finances.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ccnsd. Show ccnsd's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to Bradysgirlforreal's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Bradysgirlforreal's comment:

    It makes sense for 3 years at 5-6 million with Kraft giving him a 25 million $ signing bonus--c'mon Bob pony up for Bradys security blanket and a great Patriot--he's earned it and you have the money!! BTW he's also been the # 1 or 2 guy at receptions past 3 years and top 5 reciever in that period.



    The $25 mil signing bonus still counts against the cap



    Are you sure about that I thought only guaranteed contracts did ?




    The signing bonus is guaranteed and are prorated over the life of the contract.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ccnsd. Show ccnsd's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to Bradysgirlforreal's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Bradysgirlforreal's comment:

    It makes sense for 3 years at 5-6 million with Kraft giving him a 25 million $ signing bonus--c'mon Bob pony up for Bradys security blanket and a great Patriot--he's earned it and you have the money!! BTW he's also been the # 1 or 2 guy at receptions past 3 years and top 5 reciever in that period.



    The $25 mil signing bonus still counts against the cap



    Are you sure about that I thought only guaranteed contracts did ?




    The signing bonus is guaranteed and are prorated over the life of the contract.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from trouts. Show trouts's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

     Resigning Welker is a no-brainer. 13 receptions last week and the only receiver to regularly get separation. We only have Brady for a few more years and you'd take away his go-to guy. The last time we balked on resigning an All-Pro palyer, Asante Samuels bailed for what now looks like little money and the Pats haven't had a decent cornerback since. Too many folks here think that letting Welker walk doesn't matter. It does. He's the best receiver the Patriots have ever had and you can make a case that he's the best receiver in the game today. Pay the guy like he's the best and get it done soon, because someone will surely step forward to do it if we wait too long.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from glenr. Show glenr's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    In response to trouts' comment:

     Resigning Welker is a no-brainer. 13 receptions last week and the only receiver to regularly get separation. We only have Brady for a few more years and you'd take away his go-to guy. The last time we balked on resigning an All-Pro palyer, Asante Samuels bailed for what now looks like little money and the Pats haven't had a decent cornerback since. Too many folks here think that letting Welker walk doesn't matter. It does. He's the best receiver the Patriots have ever had and you can make a case that he's the best receiver in the game today. Pay the guy like he's the best and get it done soon, because someone will surely step forward to do it if we wait too long.




    Lets be a little realistic. He had 13 because they had no one who could cover him. If we need 3 yards for a 1st down and Welker can go 4 and be uncovered Brady will go to him all day. If the opponent has someone who can cover him or they start doubling him Brady will go somewhere else.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: Does resigning Welker make sense?

    Pay the man. Injuries are part of the game and the pats receiving corps is only so deep. Gronk or Hern go down or you lose Lloyd for any amount of time and Welker's not there as a #1 or #2 option they will be sorry they let him walk. We've been hearing for the last number of years about how old the Yankees are and they keep winning. Welker is only 31 and not all player age the same. Pay the man and give him a three year deal. If he ages suddenly he'll be cut like anyone else and out of the salary cap. 

    Hetch

     

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share