Draft Killers - BB and DBs

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    Oh boy - another thread by the same poster about what an abysmal judge BB is of DB prospects.  I do hope this one goes on for 28 pages as well.  It really elevates the quality of discourse in this forum.  A word of caution however: you may run the risk of damaging that drum when that's the only one you beat, post after post after post.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

    Also, you saying RESPONSE: Stop it! Who played QB for those teams? Who coached those teams? is pretty much making my point. Those things are far more important than CB, or DB overall. (So are DL and LB.) You can make it to the SB and win it with a great QB and a lousy defensive backfield, but try it the other way around.

     



    Not sure how I proved your point. No one is saying that a good CB is more important than a good QB. But CB Darrelle Revis nearly led the Jets to a SB, despite having Mark Sanchez as his QB. 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from CubanPete. Show CubanPete's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    Oh boy - another thread by the same poster about what an abysmal judge BB is of DB prospects.  I do hope this one goes on for 28 pages as well.  It really elevates the quality of discourse in this forum.  A word of caution however: you may run the risk of damaging that drum when that's the only one you beat, post after post after post.




    Are you saying I'm wrong? Are you defending 1/13 on DBs in the first 3 rounds?

    That "drum" gets stronger for every repeat whiff.

    BTW, I couldn't find any topics you've inititated on this forum. Only thing I see from you are butthurt replies whenever anyone questions BB.

     

     

     

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to CubanPete's comment:



    Are you saying I'm wrong? Are you defending 1/13 on DBs in the first 3 rounds?



    You are wrong because 2 of the guys you are saying are busts haven't even played a down yet.

    You are wrong because 1 of the guys you are saying is a bust is in his 2nd season.

    You are wrong because Ellis Hobbs and Eugene Wilson were not stars, but good players.

    Of course 3/10 isn't nearly as dramatic as 1/13.  And of course guys like Samuel and possibly Dennard represent hits in the later rounds.

    In addition you need to consider how hard it has been for the entire league to find DBs.  Consider that 235 DBs have been drafted in the first 3 rounds since BB has been GM.  99 of them have never started a full season.  Only 36 have made a pro bowl.  So while I don't think anyone is going to argue that BB has been at the top of his game when it comes to drafting DBs he isn't as completely incompetent as you would have us believe either imo.

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from tanbass. Show tanbass's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to CubanPete's comment:

     Only thing I see from you are butthurt replies whenever anyone questions BB.



    Actually, ATJ is about the most level headed, respectful poster on this forum, so your post is way off base.

    As far as the DBs that BB has drafted over the years...I think it certainly hasn't been his strength, and plenty of room for improvement. However, perhaps they need to fix the more important problem of no pass rush.

    You can put 4 pro-bowl DBs in the game, and they will only to be able to cover for so long. How many sub-par QBs have torched our secondary in the last several years? Too many is the answer. Bottom line is that if I had all day to stand back there and survey the field, I could torch them too. Get some pressure on the QB, and our DBs will look a whole lot better very quickly.

     
  6. This post has been removed.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    Oh boy - another thread by the same poster about what an abysmal judge BB is of DB prospects.  I do hope this one goes on for 28 pages as well.  It really elevates the quality of discourse in this forum.



    This is actually a true statement.

     

    I for one am astonished at how many now chime in with agreement about BB's drafting screwups compared to a couple of years ago. The kool-aide guzzlers who deny the obvious have become the minority.

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to tanbass' comment:

    In response to CubanPete's comment:

     

     Only thing I see from you are butthurt replies whenever anyone questions BB.

     




    As far as the DBs that BB has drafted over the years...I think it certainly hasn't been his strength, and plenty of room for improvement.



    This sounds like a typical defense we hear from kool-aide guzzlers about one of BB's dreadful draft picks just before he cuts them as the rookie contract expires while the realists have been saying the guy sucked for two years. LMAO

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to tanbass' comment:

    In response to CubanPete's comment:

     

     Only thing I see from you are butthurt replies whenever anyone questions BB.

     



    Actually, ATJ is about the most level headed, respectful poster on this forum, so your post is way off base.

     



    ATJ is clearly a nice guy, but also is just as clearly a kool-aide guzzler.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to CubanPete's comment:



    Are you saying I'm wrong? Are you defending 1/13 on DBs in the first 3 rounds?

     

     



    You are wrong because Ellis Hobbs and Eugene Wilson were not stars, but good players.

     



    You are wrong, because neither of those guys were "good" players. They were without a doubt mediocre players.

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:


    You are wrong, because neither of those guys were "good" players. They were without a doubt mediocre players.



    Coming from the guy who thinks virtually the entire team other than Brady and like one or two other guys is mediocre this isn't a particularly meaningful assessment.  It seems to me any players that aren't great get classifed as mediocre at best by you.  There is some in between imo.

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to CubanPete's comment:

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    Oh boy - another thread by the same poster about what an abysmal judge BB is of DB prospects.  I do hope this one goes on for 28 pages as well.  It really elevates the quality of discourse in this forum.  A word of caution however: you may run the risk of damaging that drum when that's the only one you beat, post after post after post.



    Are you saying I'm wrong? Are you defending 1/13 on DBs in the first 3 rounds?

    That "drum" gets stronger for every repeat whiff.

    BTW, I couldn't find any topics you've inititated on this forum. Only thing I see from you are butthurt replies whenever anyone questions BB. 



    Actually my original post here in this thread was a bit snarky so I suppose I should expect a little push back.  Fair enough.  What I probably should have posted here was something along the lines of the following question:  Since you've already made this point in a thread that is now in the vicinity of 20 pages long and is still an active discussion, I'm not entirely sure why you wish to initiate a thread on what is essentially the same subject?  I get the point (and I suspect others do as well): you view Belichick as a pretty poor judge of the DB talent.  Got it. 

    With respect to your pot shot, you're correct, I don't initiate a good many threads on this board.  I do so, from time to time, when I see a point worth making or a source worth citing that others have not made or made reference to.  Not entirely sure what a butthurt reply is but I'll take your word for it that that is how you view my posts.  Not a matter of consequence from my perspective.  Moreover, I truly don't see a need to repeat points made by others.  pcmIV and tanbass pretty much sum it up on this thead with respect to the DB situation.  pcmIV in particular made some pretty compelling arguments that have yet to be refuted in your other thread on the matter.  Quite frankly, I don't believe that mere repetition equates to credibility. 

    With respect to my view of Bill Belichick, it's no secret that I think highly of him as a coach and a GM.  He's not exactly a media darling but I suspect that's not a big deal with Robert Kraft.  What I do try to do is view BB's body of work in context.  All in all, he's done a phenomenal job with the Pats. Not perfect, no one is.   Some, most particularly Babe, view this as almost exclusively due to the presence of Tom Brady.  Brady's great, no question.  I don't beieve, however, that even a great QB can win surrounded by mediocre talent.

    So, CubanPete, by all means post whatever you wish - I, for one, believe that you're entitled to your views.  Mine are different from yours and, with all due respect, I'll continue to offer them.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    RE: ATJ's post above, I'll just say the number of posts you have or the number of threads you start does not automatically equate to "good poster" or "contributor".  If that was the standard, then the Commie guy trying to push his Twitter alter ego would have everyone beat.  Don't break your arm patting yourselves on the back, some of you, because some of you clearly value your own opinions highly.  All I'll say to that is that sentiment may not be shared by the vast majority of posters who hate sorting through the jibber jabber.  

    I read all the boards here, and on all the boards there are a reasonable number of posters who like to have a civil debate with other posters.  I know who they are.  I read them.  I rarely reply, even if I really appreciate their points of view.  They offer an opinion based on some reasonable facts and expect a discourse. 

    Of course, then there are the sports preachers, spouting away from their cyber lectern, enlightening us all on a daily basis, or so they think.  Then there are the poseurs and the trolls...

    BTW, I don't pretend that I bring any profound sports knowledge to this board.  I'm a fan.  I like to hear what my fellow fans think.  Accuse me of speaking down my nose with this post, or ignore me altogehter.  But some of you really need to refrain with the ridiculously long posts, the putdowns, namecalling and childish behaviour.  I'd rather read a guy like ATJ's posts than 90% of the other trash that gets written in this place. 

     

     

     



     
  14. This post has been removed.

     
  15. This post has been removed.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from expertmike. Show expertmike's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    My dirty little secret is that I was psyched when they drafted him..thought he was a superb athlete..great value...was really going to be something. Boy was I wrong. Good to hear he is doing well (well its a little late now, but whatever).

    [/QUOTE]

    Deion Sanders was raving about him. Many were. It seemed after a solid 2009 rookie year, he regressed and lost confidence, never to recover.

    +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Could it be our South Dakota School of Mines DB Coach ruined him after one year.  But things are looking up for Butler now that he's escaped and had some time unlearn Patriots DB coaching.

    Who else was good their rookie year, then regressed?  McCourty. others?

     Dennard - good rookie year, we'll see about this year. 

     

     

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to russgriswold's comment:

    Since 2005:

    Eugene Wilson (2004 draft)

    Ellis Hobbs

    James Sanders

    Kyle Arrington

    Devin McCourty

    As far as BB selected DBs, I'd say those players have been mostly positive players. McCourty was All Pro as a rookie.

    Finally, Meriweather may have been uncoachable and immature, but let's not pretend he wasn't a steady starter on the team from 2008-2010. He, like Chung, just didn't get a second contract because they didn't progress here.

    Going from Harrison to Meriweather is clearly a downgrade.

    But, I repeat, not finding multiple All Pro DBs in the draft in the last 8 years (not 10 as Cuban Troll claims), is in no way why Brady has played so poorly or underperformed in the SB losses.

     



    Russ,

    not to nitpick but Arrington was drafted at all let alone by bb. He played with 2 teams prior to bb picking him up. Maybe when you said selected you meant chosen? 

    I will agree with Cuban Pete on this point. bb's drafting and acquisition of FA Db's hasn't been good, in fact, probably the worst position in terms of his track record.

    it makes me wonder if bb seeks any council from his staff on this, or who we have seen come in are his choices? I think Dennard and Talib are a positive step forward, but I think he over paid for Arrington as I believe Arrington is just a shade better than hobbs and Hobbs had no business playing on the outside like Arrington.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Draft Killers - BB and DBs

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

     

     


    You are wrong, because neither of those guys were "good" players. They were without a doubt mediocre players.

     



    Coming from the guy who thinks virtually the entire team other than Brady and like one or two other guys is mediocre this isn't a particularly meaningful assessment.  It seems to me any players that aren't great get classifed as mediocre at best by you.  There is some in between imo.

     

     




    The thing is I don't overrate players because they are on my team. Hobbs and Wilson were average, so that's what I call them.

     

    Other than Brady the team has about two or three standouts on each side of the ball, which is exactly the same thing that an average NFL team can claim.

     

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share