Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pancakespwn. Show Pancakespwn's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    Ed Hochuli will be either fired or quit in the next 2 years.

    Seriously he is one of the worst refs in the league right now and we got stuck with the bum in a primetime game.

    Theres a photo of Goodell talking with the refs after the game.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from antibody. Show antibody's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    Hochuli is the poster boy for why the NFL needs to employ full time professional officials.  Proof that the league values image over substance.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    Why would a referee who resides in the State of Wisconson be allowed to referee a Green Bay Packers game in the first place? Leave it to the NFL to try and break the Patriots roll as they are dominating opponents who are supposed to be their equals! BB and his team are starting to walk away from the league again,and the NFL is all about parity. It was very disappointing to watch Hockuli and his band of Merrimen take from the rich and give to the poor,his hometown Green Bay Packers!!!!! Call me a whiner or any other name you like, but I'm calling a cheater a cheater and Ed Hockuli is just that a cheater!
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jazzpelli. Show jazzpelli's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]It is a very troubling precedent to allow officials to watch replays and then have a conference after a play on which no flag was thrown. But I wouldn't expect to hear any more about this. Take your cue from the broadcast . . . After the play, Collinsworth was praising McCourty for understanding what is an acceptable hit and what is not . . . then, after the conference and the retro-active flag, Collinsworth alomst fell on as his @ss backpedaling: "On second look, there is helmet-to-helmet contact. He didn't launch, but . . .  blah, blah, blah . . .   excuse, excuse . . . " The league will stand behind this nonsense 100%, if it even gets brought up at all . . .    which I doubt.
    Posted by p-mike[/QUOTE]
    Collinsworth is a complete idiot.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : Hochuli is SOOOOO bad that he continues to get plumb post season officiating gigs, which are awarded after grading each game by the league. I'll buy that, and throw in that swamp land in the Sonora desert, the snow capped mountain in Kansas, and that certain bridge in NYC that has been bought/sold millions of times over the years.  The NFL is no different than any other professional league. Refs all have different ways of doing their jobs. Do you think batters in MLB don't know what a certain home plate umpire's strike zone is BEFORE the game starts (I beklieve it's called "scouting"). How about hockey refs that allow the teams to "play", while others button things down? NBA refs? If you want to find issues, THAT'S where you need to develop your conspiricy theories, especially seeing the imprisonment of the yahoo who admitted to throwing games. If teh Pats draw Hochuli int eh pst season,a nd they probably will meet uo with him, they need to learn from last night's game. "Play stupid, be stupid, lose stupid."
    Posted by AZPAT[/QUOTE] Don't you mean if they run into him in a game the mantra will be :I'll cheat you,I'll cheat you,I'll cheat you everytime?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BrWyMi. Show BrWyMi's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    McCourty led with his shoulder; he didn't go head first.  I thought that's what players were supposed to do??

    Roger in the stands explains some of those horrendous (and very one sided) calls.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from jcour382. Show jcour382's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]Check out the "First downs from penalties" stat... http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=301219017 Team Stat Comparison   GB NE 1st Downs 26 14 Passing 1st downs 13 9 Rushing 1st downs 9 5 1st downs from Penalties 4 0
    Posted by NY-PATS-FAN4[/QUOTE]

    3 of those from penalties continued drives that would have been over...
    and the packers scored on each of them...
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from soups. Show soups's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    There was holding non-call last night in the third (or fourth) where the Pats' D (think it was Banta-Cain) literally got held UNDER his jersey.  Watch the highlight:  The defender is turning the corner from the right side and the O lineman's hand slides up his jersey to his shoulderpad. 

    On another, similar play, it was either Banta-Cain or Guyton that got grabbed, held, and spun 180 degrees in front of the official. 

    Pats hurt themselves, too, but some of those calls were just ridiculous.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]During tonight's Saints-Vikings game in New Orleans,  Reggie Bush took a handoff and was met near the line of scrimmage by Vikings linebacker Chad Greenway. Greenway grabbed Bush's facemask and pulled, jerking Bush's head toward him, and then knocked the ball out of Bush's arm. The Vikings jumped on the ball, but that shouldn't have mattered. The Vikings would be called for facemasking, the Saints would accept the penalty, and they'd have the ball, first-and-10. Right? Wrong. The officials missed the facemasking. How they missed it I have no idea: This was a blatant facemask, the kind of clip you'd show to someone who didn't know anything about football if you wanted to explain what facemasking was. There is absolutely no excuse for the officials not calling it. But they didn't call it, and the fact that the crew that missed the call is led by referee  Ed Hochuli  is going to be another black mark on Hochuli's record. Heading into this season, Hochuli was probably the most highly respected referee in the NFL. But between  his horrendous call on Jay Cutler's Week 2 fumble  and tonight's blown call by Hochuli's crew, that reputation is gone.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]

    Time for you to quote the person you're stealing this documentary from. If it's yours (highly unlikely), then it's only your opinion. How do I know you stole this?  The Vikes didn't play the Saints or ANYONE yesterday/last night (see your first line). I seem to recall they are playign tonight.

    Nothing says "tool" like not plagerising someone else's words. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from raptor64d. Show raptor64d's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    After that terrible call I was screaming so loud my wife closed the sliding doors so I would not offend the neighbors LOL. Oh yea, I live in Tucson AZ right now.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]Another week two, another blown call at the end of a game for Ed Hochuli. This year's, however, was far less significant than the  game-changer that embroiled the NFL's most well-known referee  in controversy last season. With 12 seconds left today in the Packers-Bengals game, Green Bay wide receiver  Donald Driver (notes)  caught a deep pass from  Aaron Rodgers (notes)  deep in Bengals territory. The Packers rushed to the line to get off a final play and seemed to snap the ball in time. But a flag was thrown and whistles blew the play dead with zeroes showing on the clock. The officials congregated before Hochuli made his announcement: "The game was over before the ball was snapped. There was also a false start on the last play. If the ball had been snapped, there was a false start on the last play which would require a 10-second run-off. So, in either case, the game was over." Hochuli got the second part right. There was a definite false start on the Packers (players must be set for at least one second and few of the players on the line were set at all) and the run-off associated with the penalty would have ended the game. But he and the other officials were wrong about Green Bay getting the snap off in time. As the picture above plainly shows, Rodgers had taken a three-step drop as time still showed on the clock. The ball was actually snapped with two seconds left in the game. With the false start penalty, it's irrelevant. Just like Hochuli said, the game was over either way. But it's interesting that he covered his bases this time just in case. Maybe last year's incident has caused Big Guns to become a little gun shy.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]

    LMFAO!

    Ultimately the right call was that the penalty ended the game, but you have an issue with the way the call was made. Who journalistic genius did you plagerize this masterpiece from?

    Did you know that there is NO PENALTY FLAGS THROWN when game time reaches "0.00"? They usually are thrown when there's, like, a "Penalty" called. In this case, the illegal procedure. It's on the offense, the play stops, and the 10 second run off takes place. When the clock reaches "0.00", the play continues and then the determination is made as to time running out. Or, if the clock strikes midnight before the ball is snapped, the whistles blow and the officials run towards the middle of the field to tell the players that the time is up. NO FLAGS ARE THROWN.

    Stop using your WWE mentality on this issue. Fact is you don't like Hochuli, and who cares? You have no say in his game assignments or his ability to work games. Stop being like a Raid-uh fan STILL whining about the Tuck Rule! The Pats get the benefit of some calls, in which case the OTHER teams whine incessently, or they get the calls made against them (wanna take up teh cause of the Ravens in 2009, or did the refs get that game "right"?), in which case some Pats fans whine about conspiracies. Guess what.... IT HAPPENS! You show me a player, besides Kareem Abble Dabble Jababble (Lakers) who strongly feels they NEVER committed a foul in their entire career, and I'll show you 10 more who feel they are fouled on every play, even while sitting on the bench.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]Why would a referee who resides in the State of Wisconson be allowed to referee a Green Bay Packers game in the first place? Leave it to the NFL to try and break the Patriots roll as they are dominating opponents who are supposed to be their equals! BB and his team are starting to walk away from the league again,and the NFL is all about parity. It was very disappointing to watch Hockuli and his band of Merrimen take from the rich and give to the poor,his hometown Green Bay Packers!!!!! Call me a whiner or any other name you like, but I'm calling a cheater a cheater and Ed Hockuli is just that a cheater!
    Posted by sportsbozo1[/QUOTE]

    Spoken like a true clown!

    Did I say how much clowns bore me?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : Don't you mean if they run into him in a game the mantra will be :I'll cheat you,I'll cheat you,I'll cheat you everytime?
    Posted by sportsbozo1[/QUOTE]

    Spoken like a JEST! troll, or any low-life whiny conspirator.
    Back to your car with 25 of your favorite buddies. Yoiu get to ride shotgun this time.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : 3 of those from penalties continued drives that would have been over... and the packers scored on each of them...
    Posted by jcour382[/QUOTE]

    Here's a stat to wrap your overworked brain cell around:

    The Packers and Pats have just about identical stats re: penalties (in general). The Pats committed 7 last night, the Pack 2. Several Pats penalties (5) were of the "big" variety: unneseccary roughness, PI on Sanders (which NO ONE seems to dispute), Crumpler's hold when Pats were on the 50 (again, no one bichin' 'bout that one), a face mask and illegal use of hands. Hmmmmm... seems like a  lack of discipline by the Pats to me, especially with them knowing WHO the game officials were going to be. But let's just excuse it away and blame it on the refs. After all, today's society clearly mandates that NO ONE is accountable for their own actions. it's always someone else's fault. Especially when it comes to the Pats.

    Keep your hands down under the shoulders, and there's little opprtunity to catch a flag for illegals use of hands OR face mask. WHAT A CONCEPT! It's a known fact to every NFL plyer that the league is closely looking at unnecessary roughness and blows to the head. (Did I mention the Pats knew would the game officials would be?) So, instead of taking this action out of play, they played right into it. BRILLIANT! Yet, if they lost it would ONLY be because of the officials, right?  

    You take "homer" whining to a new level.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : Time for you to quote the person you're stealing this documentary from. If it's yours (highly unlikely), then it's only your opinion. How do I know you stole this?  The Vikes didn't play the Saints or ANYONE yesterday/last night (see your first line). I seem to recall they are playign tonight. Nothing says "tool" like not plagerising someone else's words. 
    Posted by AZPAT[/QUOTE]

    Hey pal, take it easy. I merely looked around for other Hochuli bonehead plays and these are what I came up with. I'm not claiming these are my words or observations. Would you like me to Bluebook it for you in the future? And these quotes are from years past.

    God almighty, is Hochuli your boyfriend or something?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    AZ:

    Are you developmentally delayed? If so, I am sorry. You just spent a lot of time responding to years old posts that I just reposted to show that the complaints about Hochuli are not germane to New England alone. 

    Seems like I struck a nerve.

    Bottom line, the guy is on the wrong end of a lot of blown calls over the past few years.

    Now, I expect four pages of your anger.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    YEah, I find it odd AZ Pat has exploded like this over some pathetic calls, especially referencing the Jumbotron.  Not sure what he is so upset about, when it's clear GB got some great calls and NE got nothing.

    I am pretty sure that ins't legal for officials to do that. Once the play has eclipsed, you can't drop a flag.

    I'd be sort of surprised if he wasn't reprimanded for that, to be honest.

    More than sketchy and the worst officiated game I have seen this year for any team.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]AZ: Are you developmentally delayed? If so, I am sorry. You just spent a lot of time responding to years old posts that I just reposted to show that the complaints about Hochuli are not germane to New England alone.  Seems like I struck a nerve. Bottom line, the guy is on the wrong end of a lot of blown calls over the past few years. Now, I expect four pages of your anger.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]

    "years old posts that I just reposted"

    And I'm "developmentally elayed? LOL!

    Let it go before you get consumed over it! The Pats won, despite their lack of on field discipline! Bottom line is Ed's been in the NFL for over 2 years, a head ref for 19 of them. Somehow I'll believe in those credentials more so than any whine you can produce, no matter what the vintage year is. Sounds like the NFL doesn't buy into your whine either.  
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]YEah, I find it odd AZ Pat has exploded like this over some pathetic calls, especially referencing the Jumbotron.  Not sure what he is so upset about, when it's clear GB got some great calls and NE got nothing. I am pretty sure that ins't legal for officials to do that. Once the play has eclipsed, you can't drop a flag. I'd be sort of surprised if he wasn't reprimanded for that, to be honest. More than sketchy and the worst officiated game I have seen this year for any team.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]

    I don't mean to suggest that Hochuli has it out for the Pats - he's an equal opportunity moron. His time has passed.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnochRoot. Show EnochRoot's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]Keep in mind that the blown call in Denver cost the Chargers the game. The blown call in Detroit ended up costing the Lions the game. The blown calls last night almost cost the Patriots the game. Now, obviously teams need to overcome that, which the Pats did, but an official should not keep making calls to decide games. Maybe if he put the whistle away, this wouldn't happen to him so much.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]

    Some might actually feel that the Chargers not stopping the TD and two-point conversion is what really cost them the game. It was the exact same play on 4th down for the TD as it was 1 play later for the 2-point conversion. Sure, a bad call got them there, but the Chargers still had plenty of opportunity to prevent the loss. And didn't.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]YEah, I find it odd AZ Pat has exploded like this over some pathetic calls, especially referencing the Jumbotron.  Not sure what he is so upset about, when it's clear GB got some great calls and NE got nothing. I am pretty sure that ins't legal for officials to do that. Once the play has eclipsed, you can't drop a flag. I'd be sort of surprised if he wasn't reprimanded for that, to be honest. More than sketchy and the worst officiated game I have seen this year for any team.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]

    I see it's time to "coach up" here, so here goes.

    Fact is the Pats KNEW who the game officials were. They knew they were the highest laundry tossing crew in the league. Fact is they know (whether they can all comprehend it or not is an apparent issue) that the league is tightening up the unnecessary roughness stuff, yet here they are, playing with fire with the wrong crew on the field. McCourty's play was not the only play he could have made, while running right at the receiver HEAD ON. He tempted the fates and got burned. Wilfork DID grab the facemask, and while TBC and the linemen each had their hands in each other's grill, it was the SHOVE that he gave while the other player's head was already bent back that brought the flag. STUPID PLAYS ALL!  

    It doesn't matter what the players believe is right, or whether you and I agree with 100% of the calls, 100% of the time. The game officials are there for a reason, and they do a good job in a fast moving game. Technically, there is hold on every NFL play. Seeing you want it called against the other team, are you willing to step up and accept it when it's called on the Pats?  How about PI?

    The Pats put themselves in a position to be flagged for that stuff last night. BB even said as much by stating that "coaching" was an issue on that point, knowing who the refs were, yet they still didn't adjust. Common sense says you stay away from any possibility of having a ref interpret something they saw. If they'ere going to shoot at me, I'm damn sure NOT going to provide them ammo. But, here's the Pats last night giving the refs shells AND the shotgun, while wearing teh bullseyes on their shirts!

    I'm tired of Pats fans bichin' and whinin' about stuff the Pats do to themselves, blaming the refs. We react to JESTS!, Colts, Bolts, Squeeler fans (et al) when they do this, yet it seems to be OK for Pats fans to do the same? Let's hope the Pats learn from this and BB drives the point home during this week's practices. They need to win or loose games on the field, not by putting themselves in a position where a guy in a zebra suit decides it.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    he needs to be fined and suspended for the playoffs. can't have this derelict pulling that crap. another call that was chnisy was the one on banta-cain for hands to the face, when meriweather made the INT 
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from AZPAT. Show AZPAT's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : Some might actually feel that the Chargers not stopping the TD and two-point conversion is what really cost them the game. It was the exact same play on 4th down for the TD as it was 1 play later for the 2-point conversion. Sure, a bad call got them there, but the Chargers still had plenty of opportunity to prevent the loss. And didn't.
    Posted by EnochRoot[/QUOTE]

    Now, now, now.... let's not allow a team's performance, or lack thereof, get in the way of a bad call, right? After all, the Bolts were "devastated" by the call and could not POSSIBLY make any reasonable effort to stop the 2 point conversion play.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from chrisakawoody. Show chrisakawoody's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : Now, now, now.... let's not allow a team's performance, or lack thereof, get in the way of a bad call, right? After all, the Bolts were "devastated" by the call and could not POSSIBLY make any reasonable effort to stop the 2 point conversion play.
    Posted by AZPAT[/QUOTE]

    I've been reading your posts and you are way off the mark in so many ways.

    Was there a bad call/non-call that favored the Pats last night?  Yeah, on Connolly's return there was a very late push in the back, about five yards from the finish of the play.  I think the official realized that it would have been a crime to negate a 71-yard return because there was a push in the back at 66 yards or so. 

    But that was the only (non) call to favor the Pats.  You could have used an abicuss last night to keep track of all of the missed calls for GB. I have never seen such blatant offensive holding ignored to such an extreme degree.  How many O-holding calls were called against GB?  None.

    You either don't know football or you have weak eyesight.  Re-watch the game, with slo-mo replay control, like I use, and you cannot miss the holds.  They are on just about every GB pass play in the game. Heck, GB guys were actually tackling Pats pass rushers...but no calls.  I used the reply slo-mo to teach my mom - who is learning the game - what offensive holding is and how to catch it.  She got so frustrated and stressed with the officiating last night that by the third QTR she had to leave the room once in a while to cool down, it was so frequent and biased.

    Last, you need to chill on the attitude.  You are a bit liberal with the Devil's Advocate approach and the high-n-mighty lecturing. Extend some respect and respect will be extended to you.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Davedsone. Show Davedsone's posts

    Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?

    In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Ed Hochuli Throws a Late Flag After Watching Jumbotron? : I've been reading your posts and you are way off the mark in so many ways. Was there a bad call/non-call that favored the Pats last night?  Yeah, on Connolly's return there was a very late push in the back, about five yards from the finish of the play.  I think the official realized that it would have been a crime to negate a 71-yard return because there was a push in the back at 66 yards or so.  But that was the only (non) call to favor the Pats.  You could have used an abicuss last night to keep track of all of the missed calls for GB. I have never seen such blatant offensive holding ignored to such an extreme degree.  How many O-holding calls were called against GB?  None. You either don't know football or you have weak eyesight.  Re-watch the game, with slo-mo replay control, like I use, and you cannot miss the holds.  They are on just about every GB pass play in the game. Heck, GB guys were actually tackling Pats pass rushers...but no calls.  I used the reply slo-mo to teach my mom - who is learning the game - what offensive holding is and how to catch it.  She got so frustrated and stressed with the officiating last night that by the third QTR she had to leave the room once in a while to cool down, it was so frequent and biased. Last, you need to chill on the attitude.  You are a bit liberal with the Devil's Advocate approach and the high-n-mighty lecturing. Extend some respect and respect will be extended to you.
    Posted by chrisakawoody[/QUOTE]

    Wow, have you sincerely become an arrogant jacka$s.  Or were you always that way, and I never noticed it?

     
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