Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from JMUFranco. Show JMUFranco's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    fantastic analysis...nice to see some one on the board can articulate their thoughts in a non offensive manner...

    where we differ is that you ask "what else can we ask them to do?"

    All I would ask them is..."did you do proper due dilligence before resigning AH to his contract?", and "if you did, did your investigation turn up any red flags with regards to whom the player is hanging out with socially, and where he is hanging out?"

    It is my opinion that BB nor Kraft, nor anyone else affiliated with the PAts has faced the media because these questions would be asked...



    Fair question, and one I'd like to hear answered, yet realize we likely never will know. To be honest, I haven't really decided what I feel what be an appropriate level of background probing. And to be honest, if they do an extensive probe on one player, shouldn't they theoretically be doing that for all players they sign? Or at least to contracts of a certain length/amount? And what parameters specifically would be grounds for dismissal or leaving the bargaining table for a contract or extension? How much money would hiring someone for that purpose cost, and what would be the net payoff?

    I think those are fair questions for us to wonder and for them to actively pursue.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    In response to russgriswold's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    [QUOTE]

    Every person who talks about race isn't a racist.  It has been and continues to be a major issue in American society.  

     



         Yeah...this country is so racist that it elected an African-American president.

     

         Spare me.




    Tex, cmon man, surely you are smarter than this. I mean do you really think the gvmnt Se-lecting a half black, half white man means there is no more racism?  Do you realize the president has always been a puppet? I have seen this post has already got off topic and this is why people leave that stuff out. Sports can be agreed upon or not, but its usually just sports. Dont bring in other topics that bring feelings into it. The statement you just made,....I dont even know where to start. Lets just say I have a different opinion of you now and some others so lets keep the threads on topic. Some of the people here need to more research on this country they live in. I'll leave it at that. Things they dont teach you in school.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from NEOHPatsFan. Show NEOHPatsFan's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    Found this article today that had some info I was unaware of.  It looks as though people have covered for this kid most of his life.


    Tim Tebow tried to break up Aaron Hernandez violent bar fight in 2007

    By Iliana Limón Romero | Orlando Sentinel
    .12:40 pm, July 2, 2013

    Tim Tebow tried to stop Aaron Hernandez from getting into a violent bar fight in 2007 while both were football players at the University of Florida, according to Gainesville police records.

    Hernandez, then a 17-year-old freshman, punched a bouncer in the head causing a broken ear drum on April 28, 2007, according to the police report.

    When a police officer could not find Hernandez at the scene of the altercation around 1 a.m., the report states he interviewed Tebow about it.

    The report stated the following:

    A waitress at The Swamp bar allegedly brought Hernandez two "alcoholic drinks," which he consumed but refused to pay for. That's when Hernandez got into a fight with a bouncer at the bar.

    Hernandez told police [bouncer Michael] Taphorn got in his face and began yelling at him. As Taphorn turned to walk away, Hernandez punched him in the side of the head.

    Taphorn declined medical treatment but the next day doctors discovered his right ear drum had burst and the injury would take four to six weeks to heal.

    When the officer could not find Hernandez immediately following the incident, he interviewed Tebow and Shaun Young.

    “Tebow stated that he witnessed the dispute,” the officer wrote. “… Tebow stated that he went over to try to help resolve the conflict.”

    Tebow went on to say he urged Hernandez to leave peacefully and tried to make arrangements to pay the bill.

    Two hours later, another officer found Hernandez and spoke with him about the incident. Tebow was present during the interview.

    The officer wrote Hernandez did not appear to be intoxicated and was, “very polite and professional.”

    Hernandez told the officer both he and Tebow had already called then-UF football coach Urban Meyer and informed him about the incident.

    A day later, the investigating officer told Hernandez’s attorney, Huntley Johnson, he would not be pursuing charges in connection with alcohol served to minors at the restaurant, but he wrote, “it would be noted in the report so the coaches could handle it internally.”

    Gainesville police recommended Hernandez be charged with a felony, but it is unclear how the case was resolved because all of Hernandez’s other juvenile records are sealed. However, Hernandez still end up punching the bouncer.

    Tebow developed a close bond with Hernandez early in his career with the Gators, hosting Hernandez during his official visit before signing to play for the Gators.

    Hernandez, now 23, has been charged with first-degree murder of semi-pro football player Odin Lloyd. Michael Fee, Hernandez’s attorney, entered a not guilty plea on his client’s behalf.

    Hernandez also is being investigated in connection with a double homicide in Boston. The Boston Globe reported investigators suspect Lloyd may have been targeted because he had information about Hernandez’s connection to the double shooting in Boston.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    I'd like to add my concurrence in JMUFranco's post on the previous page.  Well said, clear and courteous.  Thank you, sir.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation


    All one has to do is know the authour of the article, Florio.  His negative writing on the Pats is common.  A lawyer by trade and his connections with the NFL I think he knows what he's talking about here.  I personally cannot recall Hernandez being connected with any gang relations when he was drafted.  It was all about his immaturity and marijauna use.  That is what dropped him in the draft.

    The new contract that he signed had to do with his performance on the field.  His nose was clean although there may have been life style questions, he was clean.  Who on the Pats staff or here for that matter would have ever have thought he was going to pop somebody?  Lot's of players like to carry that the bad boy image. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    In response to russgriswold's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    [QUOTE]

    Every person who talks about race isn't a racist.  It has been and continues to be a major issue in American society.  

     



         Yeah...this country is so racist that it elected an African-American president.

     

         Spare me.

     




     

    Tex, cmon man, surely you are smarter than this. I mean do you really think the gvmnt Se-lecting a half black, half white man means there is no more racism?  Do you realize the president has always been a puppet? I have seen this post has already got off topic and this is why people leave that stuff out. Sports can be agreed upon or not, but its usually just sports. Dont bring in other topics that bring feelings into it. The statement you just made,....I dont even know where to start. Lets just say I have a different opinion of you now and some others so lets keep the threads on topic. Some of the people here need to more research on this country they live in. I'll leave it at that. Things they dont teach you in school.

    [/QUOTE]

    RESPONSE: Regarding those things that "you don't learn in school"...it doesn't appear that you've learned them, my friend. Now...back on topic...please!

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxrockursox. Show soxrockursox's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation


    I think the Kraft and BB should make a public statement and over due by now,no iam not blaming them and I think they did the right thing on releasing him but they must have something too say here just saying.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    The proof that race is still a significant issue in the US is the overblown reaction so many white people have when a black person says race is still an issue. 

    Another proof is when a bunch of white people read race into an article that's not about race apparently just because the article was written by a black person.

     

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxrockursox. Show soxrockursox's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    well Iam 35 .I think his agent should make a comment to about this ,but the reason is with all them being so hush hush gives the thinking of others that they seen something or over looked something .

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    The proof that race is still a significant issue in the US is the overblown reaction so many white people have when a black person says race is still an issue. 

    Another proof is when a bunch of white people read race into an article that's not about race apparently just because the article was written by a black person.

     

     



    Yawn

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from tanbass. Show tanbass's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    I honestly don't understand why people keep saying the Pats need to address the media and make a statement. Isn't (IMMEDIATELY) getting rid of AH a good enough statement?

    Once again, I heard the biggest fraud is sports media, (Felger), saying the same thing, like the Pats owe us an explanation. I say BS!! They don't owe us or the media anything.

    They took a calculated risk, and got burned bigtime. What does anyone need to hear from them? Are people looking for an apology? This isn't the fault of anybody except AH. He fooled a LOT of people, and the situation just sucks. There is no need for a statement from the Pats.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TSWFAN. Show TSWFAN's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to tanbass' comment:

    I honestly don't understand why people keep saying the Pats need to address the media and make a statement. Isn't (IMMEDIATELY) getting rid of AH a good enough statement?

    Once again, I heard the biggest fraud is sports media, (Felger), saying the same thing, like the Pats owe us an explanation. I say BS!! They don't owe us or the media anything.

    They took a calculated risk, and got burned bigtime. What does anyone need to hear from them? Are people looking for an apology? This isn't the fault of anybody except AH. He fooled a LOT of people, and the situation just sucks. There is no need for a statement from the Pats.




    Agreed!! ... Apologies and the like are the opiates of the new media generation.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Salcon. Show Salcon's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    The victim's family should get a statement/apology from Hernandez's family because their son/brother took part in killing in killing their loved-one.

    The Pats should get an apology from them also for their son/brother (Hernandez) staining their organization.  An organizition that believed enough in him to draft him and then resign him for $40 mil and they got "shot" in the back for it.

    The Patriots don't owe anyone a statement or apology for a former employee who is a grown-up adult that made his own decisions for what he did.

    If I did the same at my place of work the only statement you'd get from my employer would be, "He no longer works for us.  Take it up with him or his family."

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to tanbass' comment:

    I honestly don't understand why people keep saying the Pats need to address the media and make a statement. Isn't (IMMEDIATELY) getting rid of AH a good enough statement?

    Once again, I heard the biggest fraud is sports media, (Felger), saying the same thing, like the Pats owe us an explanation. I say BS!! They don't owe us or the media anything.

    They took a calculated risk, and got burned bigtime. What does anyone need to hear from them? Are people looking for an apology? This isn't the fault of anybody except AH. He fooled a LOT of people, and the situation just sucks. There is no need for a statement from the Pats.



    I am in complete agreement.  My only problem with your post is that you included the F-word (Felger).  Probably the most nausea-inducing presence on any network anywhere.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    The proof that race is still a significant issue in the US is the overblown reaction so many white people have when a black person says race is still an issue. 

    Another proof is when a bunch of white people read race into an article that's not about race apparently just because the article was written by a black person.

     

     



    Yawn

     

     



    Exactly, You brought your ignorant comment in and when called out on it, "lets change topic"

    Or

    "Yawn" 

    Like I said, you have said enough for us to paint a picture of you. The fact you have gone silent sais it all....smh. YOu make an asinine comment and then back away from it?

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from JMUFranco. Show JMUFranco's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to Salcon's comment:

     

    The victim's family should get a statement/apology from Hernandez's family because their son/brother took part in killing in killing their loved-one.

    The Pats should get an apology from them also for their son/brother (Hernandez) staining their organization.  An organizition that believed enough in him to draft him and then resign him for $40 mil and they got "shot" in the back for it.

    The Patriots don't owe anyone a statement or apology for a former employee who is a grown-up adult that made his own decisions for what he did.

    If I did the same at my place of work the only statement you'd get from my employer would be, "He no longer works for us.  Take it up with him or his family."

     




    Completely agree with tanbass above.

    On this, there's no way that Hernandez's family would release a public (or even private) statement apologizing for Hernandez's involvement in Lloyd's death. He's being tried for murder with a presumption of innocence until proven guilty. Such an admission, whether public or private, would certainly be used in court as conclusive evidence of an admission of guilt. Even if his statement was completely devoid of any admission of guilt, you better believe any competent prosecutor would present that in court. Juries aren't exactly composed of judicial experts. Even with extensive jury instruction, a comletely neutral public statement would likely sway some jury members toward an admission of guilt and would work against any defense Hernandez's party tried to raise.

    EDIT: And the Pats did offer condolences to the family and friends: "A young man was murdered last week and we extend our sympathies to the family and friends who mourn his loss."

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Salcon. Show Salcon's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to JMUFranco's comment:

    In response to Salcon's comment:

     

    The victim's family should get a statement/apology from Hernandez's family because their son/brother took part in killing in killing their loved-one.

    The Pats should get an apology from them also for their son/brother (Hernandez) staining their organization.  An organizition that believed enough in him to draft him and then resign him for $40 mil and they got "shot" in the back for it.

    The Patriots don't owe anyone a statement or apology for a former employee who is a grown-up adult that made his own decisions for what he did.

    If I did the same at my place of work the only statement you'd get from my employer would be, "He no longer works for us.  Take it up with him or his family."

     




    Completely agree with tanbass above.

    On this, there's no way that Hernandez's family would release a public (or even private) statement apologizing for Hernandez's involvement in Lloyd's death. He's being tried for murder with a presumption of innocence until proven guilty. Such an admission, whether public or private, would certainly be used in court as conclusive evidence of an admission of guilt. Even if his statement was completely devoid of any admission of guilt, you better believe any competent prosecutor would present that in court. Juries aren't exactly composed of judicial experts. Even with extensive jury instruction, a comletely neutral public statement would likely sway some jury members toward an admission of guilt and would work against any defense Hernandez's party tried to raise.

    EDIT: And the Pats did offer condolences to the family and friends: "A young man was murdered last week and we extend our sympathies to the family and friends who mourn his loss."



    Yeah, I completely understand your post and I didn't really think it would be in Hernandez's families best interests to make a public statement of apology.

    I only said that because of the idiots crying for the Patriots to make some other kind of public statement like they're responsible for Hernandez's acts because they drafted him.

    To me, that's just ridiculous.  They made the right move.  I don't think they're obligated to do any more than that unless requested by law enforcement for info pertaining to him or the case.

    All the talk about hiring PI's to investigate possible draft choices is idiotic.

    They're football players not government empoyees being hired to work on top secret projects.

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to TripleOG's comment:



    Exactly, You brought your ignorant comment in and when called out on it, "lets change topic"

    Or

    "Yawn" 

    Like I said, you have said enough for us to paint a picture of you. The fact you have gone silent sais it all....smh. YOu make an asinine comment and then back away from it?



        And a  Triple "Yawn" for you, Triple OG. I'm not going to contribute to your attempts and those of others to hijack this thread, and turn it into a discussion over race. If you want to have that discussion, perhaps Rusty will oblige...or please take it to a political forum.  

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

         Jason Whitlock is at it again...blaming society for Hernandez, and some of the other disliked sports stars in the country:  http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/aaron-hernandez-blueprint-for-fixing-sports-culture-that-is-corrupt-jason-whitlock-070312

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    Well I guess nobody is responsible any more.  Blame it on a society or a culture and you're free.  There are all sort of walks of life in any occupation let alone sports.  Drugs, murders and theft all happen in corporate america.   You hear it about doctors and lawyers.   

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to garytx's comment:

    Well I guess nobody is responsible any more.  Blame it on a society or a culture and you're free.  There are all sort of walks of life in any occupation let alone sports.  Drugs, murders and theft all happen in corporate america.   You hear it about doctors and lawyers.   



         Yeah...there's always an excuse. Everybody is a victim, according to the media. It's amazing how our society has gotten away from the concept of personal responsibility. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to garytx's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Well I guess nobody is responsible any more.  Blame it on a society or a culture and you're free.  There are all sort of walks of life in any occupation let alone sports.  Drugs, murders and theft all happen in corporate america.   You hear it about doctors and lawyers.   

     



         Yeah...there's always an excuse. Everybody is a victim, according to the media. It's amazing how our society has gotten away from the concept of personal responsibility. 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Whitlock never says Hernandez isn't responsible for his crime.  All he is saying is that he believes the culture of sports needs to change and that, rather than relying solely on punishment after the fact, the league should be doing more to help change the culture of sports at the junior and college levels.  I'm not sure I agree with Whitlock, but you completely misread him if you think he's saying Hernandez is a "victim".  

    I assume you will take "personal responsibility" for misrepresenting what Whitlock said?

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from TSWFAN. Show TSWFAN's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

     

     

    In response to garytx's comment:

     

    Well I guess nobody is responsible any more.  Blame it on a society or a culture and you're free.  There are all sort of walks of life in any occupation let alone sports.  Drugs, murders and theft all happen in corporate america.   You hear it about doctors and lawyers.   

     

     

     



         Yeah...there's always an excuse. Everybody is a victim, according to the media. It's amazing how our society has gotten away from the concept of personal responsibility. 

     

     

     

     



    Whitlock never says Hernandez isn't responsible for his crime.  All he is saying is that he believes the culture of sports needs to change and that, rather than relying solely on punishment after the fact, the league should be doing more to help change the culture of sports at the junior and college levels.  I'm not sure I agree with Whitlock, but you completely misread him if you think he's saying Hernandez is a "victim".  

     

     

    I assume you will take "personal responsibility" for misrepresenting what Whitlock said?

     

    [/QUOTE]


     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    In response to Salcon's comment:

    The victim's family should get a statement/apology from Hernandez's family because their son/brother took part in killing in killing their loved-one.

    The Pats should get an apology from them also for their son/brother (Hernandez) staining their organization.  An organizition that believed enough in him to draft him and then resign him for $40 mil and they got "shot" in the back for it.

    The Patriots don't owe anyone a statement or apology for a former employee who is a grown-up adult that made his own decisions for what he did.

    If I did the same at my place of work the only statement you'd get from my employer would be, "He no longer works for us.  Take it up with him or his family."




    Great post!  The employee was fired.  The company is out of the picture.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Excellent Article on Pats' Role in the AH Situation

    I have a feeling this issue will get a lot more attention when Lloyd's family sues the deep pocketed Pats and the NFL, maybe even UF and the NCAA. You know it's coming. They ignored the warning signs and enabled Hernandez, blah, blah...

    It's a variation on the claims made against Penn State by Sandusky's victims.

     
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