Final tune up observations

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Final tune up observations

    I was not at the game, and making observations from watching the game on TV. I have not seen the game a second time yet


    -thought the OL did not distinguish itself and still numerous question marks especially with Mankins gone. Hard to say Devey or Kline played well and demanded starters snaps. Disappointed that no one really stepped up and prove they are a notch above any other player


    -I do think the OL is a work in progress and we will see numerous combinations, which I do not think a good thing. Connolly, Wendell, Kline on the interior has me thinking that the running game is in trouble, and Brady will be sacked and pressured about the same rate as last years too high number


    -I do like Stork, Halapio and Cannon quite a bit, but clearly Stork and Halapio are not ready. They might be games 4-8 however, meaning lots of movement


    -I don't see Barker sticking


    -Devey allows the pats to keep 8 OL given his flexibility, but he is not ready yet to play meaningful snaps


    -Stork seems the closest to being ready for regular snaps


    -Kline seems to be the same player he was last year, which I am disappointed he did not take another step forward. He is going to look real good at times, but have some serious beak downs too often. Needs more consistency, and did not show it yesterday


    -a Jimmy G did not play well. He had some nice throws, but made some bad reads and bad decisions. The OL did him no favors


    -I thought Dobson looked 100% healthy. 


    -from what I have see in practice, I still think this roster has 3 QB's


    -White continues to underwhelm me


    -Same with beauharnis


    -from what I saw this summer, I am still convinced Smith would have helped this team more than Buchanon and Bequette. I have been back and forth all summer on how this DL would look, but I think it is; Vince, Siliga, Easley, Jones, Nink, Jones, Vellano, Worthy. Maybe one more sneaks in. I really liked what Siliga showed this summer, too bad we could not see what he could do in game action. We have to hope Siliga and Easley are the read deal, or this DL is again in poor shape. BB has to manage Vince and CJones snap count for them to play at peak level. No more playing them every down. Ditto Nink.


    -hard to judge any of the RB's running behind that OL play last night. Too bad. I was interested in seeing if Gray would show. 


    -everything I have heard leads me to believe Gronk is still a few weeks away. 


    -I am still thinking Hooman might be a roster casualty


    -tough break for Morris who was PS bound, but all in all a pretty healthy summer for the Pats


    -the Jints look like a 6 win team. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

     


     A more sober assessment than some, but fair.  I'm optimistic about the team, but I do think your concerns are valid. 



    • O line is the biggest question mark.  Let's face it--at the end of last season, we all thought Connolly and Wendell both needed to be upgraded.  With Mankins gone, all three interior spots need an upgrade.  There are lots of bodies competing, but I don't see three who are better than Connolly and Wendell at this point in the season.  

    • The starting front seven is very good, but the depth is still uncertain.  If they stay healthy, they'll be excellent.  Injuries could hurt.

    • The secondary is great.  Yes, there's a hole at the second safety spot, but I think that's going to be a non-issue because of excellent corner play.  With five DBs, we'll be fine, given that some of our corners are good tacklers who can defend against the run. 

    • All of a sudden, I think the receivers (at all positions) are pretty good.  We've got two very good small slots (Amendola and Edelman); three nice bigger/outside guys (Dobson, LaFell, Thompkins), and two good receiving TEs (Gronk and--based on last night's production at least--Wright). Plus Tyms is in the background if someone gets hurt.  And Vereen and Develin should give us decent production from the backs too. 

    • The run game is suddenly a concern.  Losing Mankins hurts the blocking and I have been less than impressed with the running we've seen from White.  Ridley is still fumbling and none of the other guys really looks great.  This looks like a team that will live and die by the pass once again.  I'm okay with that, though honestly I was hoping for more from the run this year. Right now I'm not seeing that. 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    There was one thing that really really stood out to me, and that was White. Talk about a major disappointment - everything I read about the guy gave him rave reviews - I've seen nothing. In fact he may be the worst runner I've seen on this team in years (as far as running the ball). He had one play where it was a pitch to the right and he had one guy to beat...he couldn't even do that...he couldn't put a move on him...he couldn't power over him...he couldn't out speed him...nothing. I've never seen such a huge nothing running the ball. Everything is missing in his running game...size...strength...vision...moves. I really thought this kid was going to be a major surprise, I was dead wrong.

    Now he may end up being a third down back, but it's clear he can't carry the ball.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from cyncalpatfan. Show cyncalpatfan's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    Regarding last night's performance, it was pretty much what I expected (actually, a little more when I think about Dobson and Wright's performances) and I was satisfied.  Regarding the preseason, as a whole, I'm more than satisfied.  To me, the most important observations are that the team suffered no major injuries and that our previously injured players, from last year, have been making steady progress.  So far, so good.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to mthurl's comment:


    There was one thing that really really stood out to me, and that was White. Talk about a major disappointment - everything I read about the guy gave him rave reviews - I've seen nothing. In fact he may be the worst runner I've seen on this team in years (as far as running the ball). He had one play where it was a pitch to the right and he had one guy to beat...he couldn't even do that...he couldn't put a move on him...he couldn't power over him...he couldn't out speed him...nothing. I've never seen such a huge nothing running the ball. Everything is missing in his running game...size...strength...vision...moves. I really thought this kid was going to be a major surprise, I was dead wrong.


    Now he may end up being a third down back, but it's clear he can't carry the ball.




    it looks early but he looks to me to be someone id cut (and a bust) to me.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

     

     A more sober assessment than some, but fair.  I'm optimistic about the team, but I do think your concerns are valid. 



      • O line is the biggest question mark.  Let's face it--at the end of last season, we all thought Connolly and Wendell both needed to be upgraded.  With Mankins gone, all three interior spots need an upgrade.  There are lots of bodies competing, but I don't see three who are better than Connolly and Wendell at this point in the season.  

     

      • The starting front seven is very good, but the depth is still uncertain.  If they stay healthy, they'll be excellent.  Injuries could hurt.

     

      • The secondary is great.  Yes, there's a hole at the second safety spot, but I think that's going to be a non-issue because of excellent corner play.  With five DBs, we'll be fine, given that some of our corners are good tacklers who can defend against the run. 

     

      • All of a sudden, I think the receivers (at all positions) are pretty good.  We've got two very good small slots (Amendola and Edelman); three nice bigger/outside guys (Dobson, LaFell, Thompkins), and two good receiving TEs (Gronk and--based on last night's production at least--Wright). Plus Tyms is in the background if someone gets hurt.  And Vereen and Develin should give us decent production from the backs too. 

     

      • The run game is suddenly a concern.  Losing Mankins hurts the blocking and I have been less than impressed with the running we've seen from White.  Ridley is still fumbling and none of the other guys really looks great.  This looks like a team that will live and die by the pass once again.  I'm okay with that, though honestly I was hoping for more from the run this year. Right now I'm not seeing that. 




    Pro, not somber. Just an honest onservation from someone (me) who is not an expert

    I obviously agree with everything you said

    this is still a 9-12 win team that takes the division. 

    I may have a different take if Easley and Sil had been on the field all summer

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.



    yes i guess some dont care for the truth. others maybe dont have the "eyes to see".

    not sure about the money angle. think bb truly feels this way in his team management philosophy outside of $. kraft, no idea if he values money over sbs. but perennial playoffs will indeed keep fans coming.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

     

    There was one thing that really really stood out to me, and that was White. Talk about a major disappointment - everything I read about the guy gave him rave reviews - I've seen nothing. In fact he may be the worst runner I've seen on this team in years (as far as running the ball). He had one play where it was a pitch to the right and he had one guy to beat...he couldn't even do that...he couldn't put a move on him...he couldn't power over him...he couldn't out speed him...nothing. I've never seen such a huge nothing running the ball. Everything is missing in his running game...size...strength...vision...moves. I really thought this kid was going to be a major surprise, I was dead wrong.

     

    Now he may end up being a third down back, but it's clear he can't carry the ball.

     

     



    it looks early but he looks to me to be someone id cut (and a bust) to me.

     




    It is early, but I'm going to go out on a limb here...this kid can't carry the ball. I've watched him in 4 preseason games now and honestly I can't remember one single run where I thought...ok, now that was good. I've never done that with any back we've ever had in camp over the last ten years - I always saw at least one good run...something...anything...out of just about all of them. I've seen nothing with White.

    Now he may be a 50 catch guy, but he is not going to be able to run the ball...not at his size/strength. I was totally wrong about this kid.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from cyncalpatfan. Show cyncalpatfan's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

     

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.



    yes i guess some dont care for the truth. others maybe dont have the "eyes to see".

    not sure about the money angle. think bb truly feels this way in his team management philosophy outside of $. kraft, no idea if he values money over sbs. but perennial playoffs will indeed keep fans coming.



So over the past thirteen years, the team has been in 5 Super Bowls, winning three of them.  In the two losses, by the way, they were winning going into the last couple of minutes.  On top of that, they have been in a few more championship games.  You're trying to suggest that this is indicative of an owner and GM who do not put a priority on winning?  What more could any other fan base expect to see from their team? 

I don't know about you, but it just makes me thankful for what we've got, cuz it won't be here forever.

 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from user_4160947. Show user_4160947's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    After last night, no real surprises.  White does not look like anything at all.  No moves, no power, and, while he can catch, that job goes to Vereen (or Finch in a pinch).

    JG still looked good against the #1s.  Some iffy plays but good at most of 'em.

    Boyce is terrible.  Not even PS material now.

    I have 2 surprise cuts:  Mallet for obvious reasons.  Walk-year, slow decision making, slow-footed, and he's been outplayed (or equalled at least) by a rook who costs much less.  Other surprise cut is Slater.  I think he's lived a charmed life up till now.  Sure, he's an ace STer, and BB values that, but c'mon!   BB just traded another captain, the heart and soul of the OLine, and TBs binky.  Slater is a one-trick pony.  Didn't I see him carelessly step out of bounds as the gunner in Game 3?  That's a no-no.  He contributes on 4 or 5 plays a game.  I see one of Ebner, T Wilson, Chung, Harmon, or perhaps Worthy as cuts if Slater stays.  BB will do what is best for the team and keep these guys if at all possible.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to cyncalpatfan's comment:

     

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.



    yes i guess some dont care for the truth. others maybe dont have the "eyes to see".

    not sure about the money angle. think bb truly feels this way in his team management philosophy outside of $. kraft, no idea if he values money over sbs. but perennial playoffs will indeed keep fans coming.



    So over the past thirteen years, the team has been in 5 Super Bowls, winning three of them.  In the two losses, by the way, they were winning going into the last couple of minutes.  On top of that, they have been in a few more championship games.  You're trying to suggest that this is indicative of an owner and GM who do not put a priority on winning?  What more could any other fan base expect to see from their team? 

    I don't know about you, but it just makes me thankful for what we've got, cuz it won't be here forever.



  • I do not agree with the money comment. Listening to Jonathan speak the other day, he had no clue IMO Mankins was being dealt. 1000% in BB's hands. BB owns the keys to this multi billion dollar entity.

    the team spend money, no doubt, but at BB's discretion.

    I also don't agree with the philosophy that the team has been in 5 SB's the past 13 years, so it is ok if the past couple of seasons they have had injuries and holes that have kept them out of even more. Those 5 appearances have zero to do with this year. The team ended last year needing DL and interior OL help, and TE depth. I don't think it negative, trollish or anti BB to discuss after this preseason if those areas of need have been addressed properly or not

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    We saw the Gunts first team vs our 2nd, 3rd and 4th stringers so while I wouldn't say our OLine played amazing they were going against Jonathan Hankins and some solid DT's.  The best combination along the interior that I saw was a little later in the game and it was easy to spot; 67, 68 and 69 put together some good plays and got some push in the middle.  James White did not follow his blocks or do much of anything with it.  Conversely Barker, Devey, Stork and Fleming were pretty mediocre to bad.  


    Kline looked pretty good, especially in the screen and run game but got smoked by a pass rusher late when the game was on the line.  Halapio is the most impressive in the run game, he gets a surge and usually ends up double teamed or into the defensive backfield, Cave provided some good center play but has to work on his long snapping in shotgun, he was throwing some balls at Gyros ankles.  I think if we had seen more Gray and less White the running game would have looked better, especially early in the game.  Most important for the hand wringers regarding Mankins departure is know that Cannon, Wendell and Connolly weren't playing, those are the guys who will man the middle until these kids are ready.


    Beauharnis is easily our 4th best linebacker, I don't understand the criticism, he leads THE ENTIRE NFL in preseason tackles and has looked very solid, the reason we cut Anderson.


    Morris hopefully isn't hurt bad, he walked off on his own two legs so let's hope not because he was also flying around.


    Gyro played well but has to work on his touch to smaller receivers, he overthrew them all.  Dobson was our best player out there, Boyce doesn't know the playbook which has been a talent killer, White is ONLY a third down back at best.


    Moore played well at DT late in the game but didn't seem quick enough at end to shake an offensive tackle, Buchanon got pressure when he played, Bequette for all his detractors played very well last night, the guy plays on every special teams unit, that is why he is on the roster and Will Smith isn't.  The secondary played well, Browner is a thumper, Dennard if healthy starts every game opposite Revis unless we play a huge WR and BB puts Browner in to match up with him, Harmon played McCourty's free safety role tonight which left Nate Ebner at SS and he was very solid, Tavon Wilson also made some strong plays.  Swanson a back end corner played very well for a series late, had good coverage than had a strip and recovered the fumble, he may end up on the practice squad.


    This is a very good team, playing the Gunts starters to a stand still at half and only losing by a field goal with a bunch of no namers on the field by the 4th quarter is good enough for me.

     
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    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to cyncalpatfan's comment:

     

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.



    yes i guess some dont care for the truth. others maybe dont have the "eyes to see".

    not sure about the money angle. think bb truly feels this way in his team management philosophy outside of $. kraft, no idea if he values money over sbs. but perennial playoffs will indeed keep fans coming.



    So over the past thirteen years, the team has been in 5 Super Bowls, winning three of them.  In the two losses, by the way, they were winning going into the last couple of minutes.  On top of that, they have been in a few more championship games.  You're trying to suggest that this is indicative of an owner and GM who do not put a priority on winning?  What more could any other fan base expect to see from their team? 

    I don't know about you, but it just makes me thankful for what we've got, cuz it won't be here forever.



  • Completely agree.... And the guys that say otherwise are not just unrealistic. They are spoiled. We have been in 2 SBs in the last 7 years and came very close to winning both. That is substantial. We have been in championship games. And if not for injuries could have won more. How do you get that close and with injuries (AND A MAGIC HELMET CATCH.. lets not forget that) and still hear this BS. I mean really. Get a life. 

    And now here we are with yet another top 4 team and maybe the best team at the start of the season and we have not just whiners but spoiled little children. You are not trolls. Just kids.

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from NYC. Show NYC's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

     

    Overall, this team is on the right path.

    In the cap era it is very complicated to keep the core of the team together especially as the talent of that core begins to decline or become too expensive. Decisions are made which are unfamiliar and unpopular (Branch, Samuels, Seymour and Mankins trades) and inexperienced guys come on board to compete with each other for positions which eventually becomes a team as the season progresses and unfolds. Each year's team is a work in progress both individually and collectively.

    It is the same this year. We have lost the stability of Mankins run blocking but we have new growth at QB, TE, DL (Easley hopefully) and DB. OL is in transition. I see this as the exciting part as new guys will compete, learn, grow on the OL. This will force adaptations on our offensive strategy. Till this line takes shape I see quick drops, short passes, wheel routes and if Wright is a gamer a return to our 2 TE offense. I will also look for our D to hold the fort as it did in the SB runs to eek out wins in close games. Exactly how far the team progresses as the season progresses is impossible for anyone to project but again I see that lack of certainty as the exciting part.

    Overall, we are in great shape for the future as we have necessary cap space to sign Revis/DMC etc. and we have personnel who can develop to fill roles. Are we guaranteed an SB? Absolutely not! But I am proud we are doing what we need to do to maintain the long term viability of the team while working to win today.

     

     

     
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    Re: Final tune up observations

    Regarding all the comments on White: not a single person said a thing about his pass blocking. If you watch the tape you will see he has always picked up the guy he needs to and done his job. That is a major part of his job. 

    I agree he has not lit up anything with his running but he is more of a Kevin Faulk type. He will not show off a lot of power. He will not show off great speed. What he will do is make a cut and head upfield. He will use the blocking pretty well. He will pick up some decent yards when they use him the way they used Faulk. He will NOT be much of a feature back. He will NOT be a guy to run stretch plays with. He will catch the ball. He will pass block. He will give you some reasonable smart running. He will not be a player to center a running game around.

    Now you can argue that makes him not so valuable. But ask yourself whether Faulk was valuable. I think yes. And BB seems to also. Maybe I am wrong and White does not make the team but I think BB likes him at this stage for certain roles and dependability.

    Think complete package (blocking included). Think roles and value in those specific roles that BB might want. I expect WHite makes the team. Could be wrong.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from cyncalpatfan. Show cyncalpatfan's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to NYC's comment:

     

    Overall, this team is on the right path.

    In the cap era it is very complicated to keep the core of the team together especially as the talent of that core begins to decline or become too expensive. Decisions are made which are unfamiliar and unpopular (Branch, Samuels, Seymour and Mankins trades) and inexperienced guys come on board to compete with each other for positions which eventually becomes a team as the season progresses and unfolds. Each year's team is a work in progress both individually and collectively.

    It is the same this year. We have lost the stability of Mankins run blocking but we have new growth at QB, TE, DL (Easley hopefully) and DB. OL is in transition. I see this as the exciting part as new guys will compete, learn, grow on the OL. This will force adaptations on our offensive strategy. Till this line takes shape I see quick drops, short passes, wheel routes and if Wright is a gamer a return to our 2 TE offense. I will also look for our D to hold the fort as it did in the SB runs to eek out wins in close games. Exactly how far the team progresses as the season progresses is impossible for anyone to project but again I see that lack of certainty as the exciting part.

    Overall, we are in great shape for the future as we have necessary cap space to sign Revis/DMC etc. and we have personnel who can develop to fill roles. Are we guaranteed an SB? Absolutely not! But I am proud we are doing what we need to do to maintain the long term viability of the team while working to win today.

     

     




    Now that is a good post.  Well said.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    We saw the Gunts first team vs our 2nd, 3rd and 4th stringers so while I wouldn't say our OLine played amazing they were going against Jonathan Hankins and some solid DT's.  The best combination along the interior that I saw was a little later in the game and it was easy to spot; 67, 68 and 69 put together some good plays and got some push in the middle.  James White did not follow his blocks or do much of anything with it.  Conversely Barker, Devey, Stork and Fleming were pretty mediocre to bad.  

     

    Kline looked pretty good, especially in the screen and run game but got smoked by a pass rusher late when the game was on the line.  Halapio is the most impressive in the run game, he gets a surge and usually ends up double teamed or into the defensive backfield, Cave provided some good center play but has to work on his long snapping in shotgun, he was throwing some balls at Gyros ankles.  I think if we had seen more Gray and less White the running game would have looked better, especially early in the game.  Most important for the hand wringers regarding Mankins departure is know that Cannon, Wendell and Connolly weren't playing, those are the guys who will man the middle until these kids are ready.

     

    Beauharnis is easily our 4th best linebacker, I don't understand the criticism, he leads THE ENTIRE NFL in preseason tackles and has looked very solid, the reason we cut Anderson.

     

    Morris hopefully isn't hurt bad, he walked off on his own two legs so let's hope not because he was also flying around.

     

    Gyro played well but has to work on his touch to smaller receivers, he overthrew them all.  Dobson was our best player out there, Boyce doesn't know the playbook which has been a talent killer, White is ONLY a third down back at best.

     

    Moore played well at DT late in the game but didn't seem quick enough at end to shake an offensive tackle, Buchanon got pressure when he played, Bequette for all his detractors played very well last night, the guy plays on every special teams unit, that is why he is on the roster and Will Smith isn't.  The secondary played well, Browner is a thumper, Dennard if healthy starts every game opposite Revis unless we play a huge WR and BB puts Browner in to match up with him, Harmon played McCourty's free safety role tonight which left Nate Ebner at SS and he was very solid, Tavon Wilson also made some strong plays.  Swanson a back end corner played very well for a series late, had good coverage than had a strip and recovered the fumble, he may end up on the practice squad.

     

    This is a very good team, playing the Gunts starters to a stand still at half and only losing by a field goal with a bunch of no namers on the field by the 4th quarter is good enough for me.



    Woz, I think your observations are pretty spot on. After last year, how comfortable are you with Connolly and Wendell starting at the interior?

    I do think Connolly has looked good so far this year, and feel his play last year was a result of not having a healthy offseason due to surgery. that hurt him all year. it appears that the team will go 7 OL on game day, and Wendell IM is a question mark, and the drop off to #7 is pretty steep right now. I assume Cannon is #6, and I like him rotating in for Vollmer and Solder a few series here and there to keep everyone fresh

    In a nutshell, Wendell and Kline at C/G make me wonder how the run game will develop this year, and how much pressure will TB face up the middle

     
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    Re: Final tune up observations

    I do wonder about what shape the O line and D line will be in at playoff time. THe O line has a lot of youth. It is possible it will be better then than at first game. D line is not quite as good that way but if healthy and if Easly comes to play it could be very good. I hope they can spell Nink, Jones and Vinny plenty during the season.

    It is also interesting to consider Jones and NInk OLBs. that gives us 5 very good LBs all who can play the outside if need be and at least 3 who can play inside.

    That makes the bigger questions about Vinny and the rotation at NT as well as how Easley fits in in terms of maximizing his talents. ANd simlarly how well these other guys can play DE in a 3-4.

    On a different note: boy wasnt it a nice surprise to not only see Wright on the field after like 1.5 days on the team but out there starting AND making plays.... That impresses me. I do not expect a whole lot from him blocking but I do expect that by game 12 his blocking is brought up to snuff to make him of value (not in line TE type blocker of course). He does look like he could catch 70 passes if they wanted to target him that often. I dont think he gets anywhere near that though because there are too many other players to throw to and one is named Gronk and another JE. ANd Dobson looks like he is ready to contribute. ANd DA is no slouch. And KT and LaFell will make some plays. ANd Vereen is a big mismatch that will demand looks. 

     
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    Re: Final tune up observations

    Regarding JG - showed he is a real rookie the way he played. But he also showed why he was draft so high and in fact should have been drafted higher. I think he already looks to be as good on the field as any other QB in this division outside of TB. If not he is close to it. And he is not jsut a rookie but a rookie who has not even suited up for his first real game!

    Yes he made some bad plays. That is the growing pains you go through. He looked like he handled himself well.

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from cyncalpatfan. Show cyncalpatfan's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to cyncalpatfan's comment:

     

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.



    yes i guess some dont care for the truth. others maybe dont have the "eyes to see".

    not sure about the money angle. think bb truly feels this way in his team management philosophy outside of $. kraft, no idea if he values money over sbs. but perennial playoffs will indeed keep fans coming.



    So over the past thirteen years, the team has been in 5 Super Bowls, winning three of them.  In the two losses, by the way, they were winning going into the last couple of minutes.  On top of that, they have been in a few more championship games.  You're trying to suggest that this is indicative of an owner and GM who do not put a priority on winning?  What more could any other fan base expect to see from their team? 

    I don't know about you, but it just makes me thankful for what we've got, cuz it won't be here forever.



    I do not agree with the money comment. Listening to Jonathan speak the other day, he had no clue IMO Mankins was being dealt. 1000% in BB's hands. BB owns the keys to this multi billion dollar entity.

    the team spend money, no doubt, but at BB's discretion.

    I also don't agree with the philosophy that the team has been in 5 SB's the past 13 years, so it is ok if the past couple of seasons they have had injuries and holes that have kept them out of even more. Those 5 appearances have zero to do with this year. The team ended last year needing DL and interior OL help, and TE depth. I don't think it negative, trollish or anti BB to discuss after this preseason if those areas of need have been addressed properly or not



    I don't think I called anyone "negative", "trollish", or "anti-BB".  I was simply saying that I didn't agree with their assessment.  By the way, I agree with you that their 5 super bowl appearances have zero to do with this year, but that wasn't the point of the post that I was responding to.  The writer was referring to Kraft and BB's overall team philosophy and that was why I mentioned the team's history. 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from fl+adam,. Show fl+adam,'s posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    I haven't checked the numbers to be 100%, but I can just about guarantee that the pats have the leagues best record since BB took charge, and even more so when tb took over.  The pats are the best.  They are in position to be in the final 4 teams virtually every year, and can often overcome alot of injuries to key people due to the depth BB insists on.  He gets that depth by making the tough decisions like Mankins.  That decision makes next years team better, at the expense of this years team having a marginal amount less experience.  That is BB here guys.  We have a solid if not great chance to win the SB any year and every year.  We are alwqays right there.  The Giants caught lightening in a bottle twice, otherwise we have 2 more titles.  Would I prefer 1 SB, 1 playoff run, and 2 years of missing the playoffs every 4 years over what we have now.....HECK no!!!

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to cyncalpatfan's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to cyncalpatfan's comment:

     

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    perennial playoff approach vs super bowls.

    what would one of the better gms in the league have done if brady fell in their lap?

    good coach. maybe one of the best.

    mediocre gm (for max super bowls)

    great gm for perennial playoff team.

     




    And all this - although honest - will get you labelled as a "troll". Yet I think you said it well. I think the philosophy here is about one thing and one thing only...putting a competitive team on the field every year to put people in the seats. It's not about winning Super Bowls, it's about making money. If we win a Super Bowl that's great! But it's not the number one goal.



    yes i guess some dont care for the truth. others maybe dont have the "eyes to see".

    not sure about the money angle. think bb truly feels this way in his team management philosophy outside of $. kraft, no idea if he values money over sbs. but perennial playoffs will indeed keep fans coming.



    So over the past thirteen years, the team has been in 5 Super Bowls, winning three of them.  In the two losses, by the way, they were winning going into the last couple of minutes.  On top of that, they have been in a few more championship games.  You're trying to suggest that this is indicative of an owner and GM who do not put a priority on winning?  What more could any other fan base expect to see from their team? 

    I don't know about you, but it just makes me thankful for what we've got, cuz it won't be here forever.



    I do not agree with the money comment. Listening to Jonathan speak the other day, he had no clue IMO Mankins was being dealt. 1000% in BB's hands. BB owns the keys to this multi billion dollar entity.

    the team spend money, no doubt, but at BB's discretion.

    I also don't agree with the philosophy that the team has been in 5 SB's the past 13 years, so it is ok if the past couple of seasons they have had injuries and holes that have kept them out of even more. Those 5 appearances have zero to do with this year. The team ended last year needing DL and interior OL help, and TE depth. I don't think it negative, trollish or anti BB to discuss after this preseason if those areas of need have been addressed properly or not



    I don't think I called anyone "negative", "trollish", or "anti-BB".  I was simply saying that I didn't agree with their assessment.  By the way, I agree with you that their 5 super bowl appearances have zero to do with this year, but that wasn't the point of the post that I was responding to.  The writer was referring to Kraft and BB's overall team philosophy and that was why I mentioned the team's history. 



    the highlighted part was just a general comment, not directed at you

    it appears we agree on every other point

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Final tune up observations

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE

    Woz, I think your observations are pretty spot on. After last year, how comfortable are you with Connolly and Wendell starting at the interior?

    I do think Connolly has looked good so far this year, and feel his play last year was a result of not having a healthy offseason due to surgery. that hurt him all year. it appears that the team will go 7 OL on game day, and Wendell IM is a question mark, and the drop off to #7 is pretty steep right now. I assume Cannon is #6, and I like him rotating in for Vollmer and Solder a few series here and there to keep everyone fresh

    In a nutshell, Wendell and Kline at C/G make me wonder how the run game will develop this year, and how much pressure will TB face up the middle

    [/QUOTE]

    I think Cannon steps in at guard for Mankins with little to no drop off, Connolly and Wendell have proven good enough to win regular season games so I can't say I'm worried.  

    That being said I believe at some point during the season Halapio will slide into a guard spot and bring much needed size and strength there.  If Wendell struggles it is a comfort to know Kline and Cave (hopefully) will be sitting there.  Connolly is a better center than Wendell so there is some wiggle room there. Regardless what we think the learning curve is with the youngsters they are already pretty good, Wendell good at least...

     
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