First Thoughts on the Roster

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    First Thoughts on the Roster

    I'm sure this roster will change a bit over the next few days, but here are my initial impressions:

    Defense

    LBs

    Best group of LBs we've had in years.  This is very exciting group, in my opinion.  

    DL

    Starters are nice, but a very thin group.  There aren't enough big bodies to go traditional two-gap 3-4, but I wonder if BB has something interesting up his sleeve.  

    DBs

    I think we're okay here with the starting group of McCourty, Gregory, Talib, and Dennard.  Arrington is a good nickel.  We'll see how all the young guys work out for depth, but I'm not too worried yet about this group. Let's face it, this combo worked pretty well toward the end of last season. 

    Offense

    OL

    Pretty much as expected.  Middle of line may be improved if Cannon can step up.

    TEs

    I was saying for a while we'd only go with three.  Didn't think it would be this three, but I think the two TE set is going to be used less this year.  

    FB

    Think we may use a FB in place of a second TE on more sets--though look for two-back sets with two tailbacks (Vereen and Ridley/Blount/Bolden for instance)

    RB

    Deep group . . . wonder if all will stick for the whole season.  Does suggest more two-back sets than we've used in the past, either with FB or two tailbacks

    WR

    Nicer balanced group than in the past, though lots of youth.  I think three and four receiver sets are back

    Specialists

    Fine with this group . . . 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    At least as far as depth is concerned on the DL I hope he has something up his sleeve as you have suggested.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tydog. Show Tydog's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    the pats made 12 player transactions from this day last year to opening day. Expect the same this year. The roster is at 51 right now.

    "I swear it upon Zues the most exceptional runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler"  Socrates

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    At least as far as depth is concerned on the DL I hope he has something up his sleeve as you have suggested.



    I assume he's planning to bring in some big bodies . . . but I wonder if he's got some ideas to change the scheme.  Is he going to try to go with more of a speed than power approach? There are an awful lot of LBs and edge players and very few big guys.  

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from krismk. Show krismk's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster


    Prolate,

    I like your analysis, but I'm not so thrilled with the big lug LBs...they have to cover WR slants, RB curls and the TE patterns.  Spikes, Mayo and Hightower like to slam the line, and are lost puppies against the current NFL passing O's. 

    Today, if you can't cover, you can't play.

    The Pat's D is about giving huge yardage and stacking it up in the red zone, where it becomes man coverage...short DBs and slow LBs.  Thank you to the teams that run in the red zone!

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to krismk's comment:

     


    Prolate,

    I like your analysis, but I'm not so thrilled with the big lug LBs...they have to cover WR slants, RB curls and the TE patterns.  Spikes, Mayo and Hightower like to slam the line, and are lost puppies against the current NFL passing O's. 

    Today, if you can't cover, you can't play.

    The Pat's D is about giving huge yardage and stacking it up in the red zone, where it becomes man coverage...short DBs and slow LBs.  Thank you to the teams that run in the red zone!

     



    I agree pass coverage among the LBs was a problem last year, but I think you're going to see Collins taking a lot of Spike's snaps and I think that's going to help.  I also expect improvement from Hightower, and Mayo is at least okay in coverage, especially in the middle of the field.  

    I think it's going to be interesting to see how BB schemes with this group of players.  It's a light DL, but with some big LBs.  Maybe the size at LB allows him to use more athletic edge players who can drop into coverage more.  We'll see.  

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatFanInBA2. Show PatFanInBA2's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    We have 2 more open slots.. whom would you pick from the waivers / FA ?

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to PatFanInBA2's comment:

    We have 2 more open slots.. whom would you pick from the waivers / FA ?

     



    Not sure who's available (haven't looked), but clearly they're thin at DT.  I could see them bringing in two or three even (and cutting someone else).  Other positions I could see them looking at (roughly in order of priority) are safety, corner, TE, and interior OL.  

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    I think we're experienced to not so good at db McCourty ok talib check, Dennard who knows when, Arrington not a big fan, slot ok but just ok, anyone else at safety. DL thin inside.  O tackle we have 2. Vollmer's back could act up anytime, as in the past. TE that's fluid right now.  Bunch of RB's, I like that a lot. Wr's. limited experience.  Ok at guard. ST will be the key. I again predict Washington will be special for us. Our fP last year stunk on kick offs. It was better if it went out the end zone it seemed.  

     

     

    Now you got the easy part done telling me about it.

    Does that handshaped bruise on your back hurt?

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from quinzpatsfan. Show quinzpatsfan's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I'm sure this roster will change a bit over the next few days, but here are my initial impressions:

    Defense

    LBs

    Best group of LBs we've had in years.  This is very exciting group, in my opinion.  

    DL

    Starters are nice, but a very thin group.  There aren't enough big bodies to go traditional two-gap 3-4, but I wonder if BB has something interesting up his sleeve.  

    DBs

    I think we're okay here with the starting group of McCourty, Gregory, Talib, and Dennard.  Arrington is a good nickel.  We'll see how all the young guys work out for depth, but I'm not too worried yet about this group. Let's face it, this combo worked pretty well toward the end of last season. 

    Offense

    OL

    Pretty much as expected.  Middle of line may be improved if Cannon can step up.

    TEs

    I was saying for a while we'd only go with three.  Didn't think it would be this three, but I think the two TE set is going to be used less this year.  

    FB

    Think we may use a FB in place of a second TE on more sets--though look for two-back sets with two tailbacks (Vereen and Ridley/Blount/Bolden for instance)

    RB

    Deep group . . . wonder if all will stick for the whole season.  Does suggest more two-back sets than we've used in the past, either with FB or two tailbacks

    WR

    Nicer balanced group than in the past, though lots of youth.  I think three and four receiver sets are back

    Specialists

    Fine with this group . . . 




    Good post, fair assessment, My first thought is "this team is really young" alot of rookies made it this year, remember 2007 we had so many vets, seems like alot of 1-3 year players, I didn't research just thought it.

    I would love to see 2 RB sets, wish bone , I set, smash mouth away!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    We have to sign another DT, we can't live with Vellano as our third DT, the guy weighs 260 soaking wet and showed nothing in the preseason.  Seymour...?

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bungalow-Bill. Show Bungalow-Bill's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    We have to sign another DT, we can't live with Vellano as our third DT, the guy weighs 260 soaking wet and showed nothing in the preseason.  Seymour...?



    This. Like I said in the other thread I'd be thrilled with Seymour. Any idea who else is out there? I looked through every team's cuts from today and didn't recognize any names other than Ron Brace. Could BB possibly have a trade in the works? Bring Forston or Francis back? There's just no way he goes into the season with only VW, TK and Vellano.

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000233304/article/roster-cuts-for-all-32-nfl-teams

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    RBs:  Look who all made it!   BB didn't have to choose between Brandon Bolden and LeGarrette Blount.  Nor was Leon Washington the odd man out.  They all flashed promise.  BB didn't count their various fumbles against them, probably because BB himself ordered them to fumble the football.  I thought Washington's fumble on the first bounce of a punt was especially fake.  I myself once caught an NFL-height punt on the first bounce when it came way over the sideline. 

    RBs can get beat up really fast, so six isn't a bad idea. 

    If BB sees some basement bargains tomorrow, one of the six could get cut. 

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from magicalhobo. Show magicalhobo's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    This roster has some serious potential. The DBs and DL depth are a little concerning, but overall I am very optimistic about this roster. Thompkins looks like the real deal. When he isn't catching passes he is forcing pass interference calls.

    I'm not upset with any of the roster cuts. Yeah, A. Wilson getting IR'd is disappointing, but I think the guys we have will be fine. I wish Ebner played more at safety during the preseason (did he play?). From what I have heard in the past, it seems like he has a nose for the ball.

     

    Mesko was slightly shocking. Didn't expect him to actually get cut.

    __________________________________________________

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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    What is Casey Hampton doing nowadays..?

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    Markus Kuhn and Marvin Austin cut from the Giants should be looked at, I'm surprised Kuhn was cut, but he did suffer a torn knee his rookie year so maybe he's not the same player or the Giants just don't have time to wait for him, I think he is worth a look.

    Beyond Seymour maybe Corey Williams... there's truly a void in talent at DT, maybe we think we can live without.  

    Vellano isn't exactly bad, the guy was very durable in college and played in the opponents backfield leading his team in TFL's as well as six sacks. He is a legit 300 pounds, his combine agility drills we're very respectable, as was his bench, that he beat Fortson out was a surprise to me but by the 4th (3rd?) quarter of most of these preseason games I was pretty foggy.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    Couple of thoughts on this thread:

    Prolate:  I like your overall assessment;

    magical: I am in complete agreement

    Overall, my only real concern is depth on the D line but there are still 2 open slots. 

    With regard to this thread, it is refreshing to read an overall assessment that strikes me as both realistic and optimistic.  I'm not saying that criticism is inappropriate but it does get tiresome reading the same posters beating the same old negative drum thread in and thread out. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from GO47. Show GO47's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    Excellent post Prolate!

    Mike Reiss, from ESPN/Boston, was thinking the same way you guys have been thinking in this discussion in that he took a look at who was cut by other teams at the defensive line position. Here's his thoughts:

    3. Let’s play the armchair-general-manager game for the Patriots when it comes to their defensive-tackle need and see if we can hit the bull's-eye. Here were a few players at the position we could envision being of interest to the Patriots on the waiver wire:

    Marvin Austin (Giants) -- Second-round pick out of North Carolina in 2011, he hasn’t panned out, as his rookie season was wiped out by a torn pectoral muscle and he didn't break through last year. He is 6-foot-2 and 312 pounds. As ESPN Giants reporter Dan Graziano noted, the Giants are pretty deep at defensive tackle, so part of Austin’s release was a numbers game.

    Kheeston Randall (Dolphins) -- The 6-5, 309-pounder who played collegiately at Texas appeared in 12 games for Miami last season. He was a 2012 seventh-round pick and has some physical traits (e.g. long arms) that might have some appeal to New England.

    Adam Replogle (Falcons) -- Undrafted rookie is 6-3 and 310 pounds, and started the final 47 games of his collegiate career at Indiana, where he was known for his work ethic and reliability. Patriots defensive-line coach Patrick Graham had worked him out before the draft.

    Torell Troup (Bills) -- He has battled injuries in the past but has some physical traits (6-3, 327) that could be appealing as a bigger-bodied backup to Vince Wilfork and Tommy Kelly. Bill Belichick got to know him well on his annual pre-draft scouting trip in 2010. Troup, who played at Central Florida, was picked by the Bills in the second round that year. He has some partially guaranteed money in his contract, so it might be smarter, if interested, for the Patriots to see if he clears waivers and then bring him in.

    As Wozzy mentioned Austin looks like a fit and I also like Randall.  

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    LBs

    Best group of LBs we've had in years.  This is very exciting group, in my opinion.  

     



    How so? Unless Collins turns out to be elite, or Spikes/Hightower show a lot more than what we have seen so far, looks like the same old, same old (nothing to get excited about).

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    DBs

    I think we're okay here with the starting group of McCourty, Gregory, Talib, and Dennard.  Arrington is a good nickel.  We'll see how all the young guys work out for depth, but I'm not too worried yet about this group. Let's face it, this combo worked pretty well toward the end of last season. 



    The unit improved with Talib added and McCourty moved. They became decent after that adjustment. The biggest question will be injuries, because without this grouping things get real ugly fast.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    We have to sign another DT, we can't live with Vellano as our third DT, the guy weighs 260 soaking wet and showed nothing in the preseason.  Seymour...?



    This is puzzling Wozzy, because I don't know how you can expect to put two big guys on the field as a "base" defense if you only have three on the roster (and one of those three is a developmental undrafted rookie). This (along, in retrospect, with the early cutting of both Deaderick and Love) makes me ask whether BB has some new scheme he's been developing that will surprise us all when it's rolled out.  Of course I have no idea what he's got up his sleeve, but I'm thinking he can't be planning to have both Kelly and Wilfork on the field on every defensive play.  You'd wear those two (older) guys out. 

    I would have guessed, maybe, that he'd be rotating those guys with a Cunningham or Francis type--but then he cut both those guys too.  We only have seven D linemen altogether, three tackles (Kelly, Wilfork, Vellano) and four DEs (Nink, Jones, Bequette, and Buchanon).  

    My only answer is, with the quality of LBs, he wants to keep four on the field a lot.  Hightower is heavier than any of the DEs, so maybe we're running more 3-4, with three guys on the D line and with Mayo/Hightower and Spikes lining up in the middle to give us size and power at the LB position (and Hightower/Mayo and Collins playing outside LB).  Or maybe Hightower is going to play on the line a lot--maybe as a tackle, not just an end.  Assuming Armstead comes back, I could see Hightower and Armstead playing a lot near the middle of the line, giving us biggish quick guys who maybe can penetrate reasonably well. 

    I'm not sure what the answer is but it's very interesting.  

     

     

     

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    RB

    Deep group . . . wonder if all will stick for the whole season.  Does suggest more two-back sets than we've used in the past, either with FB or two tailbacks

     



    Deep mediocrity. Until somebody shows they can step up when the other guy is expecting the run, this unit is an Achilles heel for the offense (O-line part of the problem in this).

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    Seymour...?



    NFW

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    LBs

    Best group of LBs we've had in years.  This is very exciting group, in my opinion.  

     

     



    How so? Unless Collins turns out to be elite, or Spikes/Hightower show a lot more than what we have seen so far, looks like the same old, same old (nothing to get excited about).

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I think Hightower looked like he improved this year.  Plus, I do think Collins, Fletcher (who was injured last year), and even Beauharnais give us more speed.  Given what's going on in the D line, I think BB is planning to use Hightower as a more versatile player this year.  And I think Collins and Fletcher are going to have bigger roles.

    It's still a lot of speculation, but this group is certainly no worse than last year and I see reasons for improvement in the continued development of Hightower and the new additions.  

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: First Thoughts on the Roster

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

     

     

     

    DBs

    I think we're okay here with the starting group of McCourty, Gregory, Talib, and Dennard.  Arrington is a good nickel.  We'll see how all the young guys work out for depth, but I'm not too worried yet about this group. Let's face it, this combo worked pretty well toward the end of last season. 

     

     



    The unit improved with Talib added and McCourty moved. They became decent after that adjustment. The biggest question will be injuries, because without this grouping things get real ugly fast.

     

     

     



    Yep . . . it's basically the same starting group we saw (briefly) last season.  That group, however, was far more effective than any other group we've seen in several years back there, and I assume it will continue to be.  Depth is a concern, but I actually have some optimism about both Harmon and Ryan from what we saw in preseason (they noticeably improved I thought through the games).  And Wilson still can cover TEs when we need that.  I agree depth remains an issue, but I'm not terribly concerned about this group if the starters are healthy.  

     

     

     
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