Good D -- BUT!!!!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from sheldong. Show sheldong's posts

    Good D -- BUT!!!!

    The defense played great today starting with second period.  However, if you spot a playoff caliber team 21 points, you aren't going to win the game.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]The defense played great today starting with second period.  However, if you spot a playoff caliber team 21 points, you aren't going to win the game.
    Posted by sheldong[/QUOTE]

    Agreed.

    But let me ask you this...do you really think a team in the playoffs goes for a 4th-and-1 fake punt, in their own territory, in the first quarter?

    Or goes for a 4th-and-5 from midfield, also in the 1st quarter?

    The point is that Buffalo had nothing to lose, so they took risks that a team in the playoffs wouldn't take that early in the game. To their credit, they converted the gambles...but that's much easier to do when you really don't give a crap whether you succeed or not; the Bills had no pressure to win, which became obvious once they got down two scores and mailed in the rest of the game.

    Had they had that pressure, they would have punted on their first two possessions, and the Pats would have been down, at most, 7-0.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnochRoot. Show EnochRoot's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    It doesn't matter how they got the 21 points, sheldong's point still stands that you can't do the same thing with a playoff calibre team. 
     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]It doesn't matter how they got the 21 points, sheldong's point still stands that you can't do the same thing with a playoff calibre team. 
    Posted by EnochRoot[/QUOTE]

    Which is why my post began with:

    "Agreed."
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    I know, I know but the Offense is going to need to help out early on also.  Cant be putting the D back on the field time and again with no points on the board. 

    Amazing the turn around of the team, both offense and defense.  49 unanswered points after being down 21-0.  I have to say that the team seems to have hearts of champions.  Never give up, never panic, make adjustments and keep plugging away, D making the Bills offense make mistakes and the Pats O going out and just blowing up the Bills defense. 

    No, they might not be able to come back like that against an elite team but I'm not going to panic if they get behind like that.  They never give up or get down on themselves to where they can't fight on and come back.  Maybe the most impressive element of this team that hasn't been there in the recent years.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from nyjoseph. Show nyjoseph's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    Not that I want to remember, but the Pats tried a fake punt against the Jets in the playoff last year when they were only down 7-3.  They were on their own side of the 50.

    And the Saints opened the 2nd half of the SB against the Colts with an onside kick. 

    The Bills truly had nothing to lose today, but this stuff is not confined to the regular season.
     
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    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    Bills have a better offense then any team in AFC playoffs
     
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    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    Peyton has some stones to make that call in the SB...awesome.  Good counterpoints by nyjoseph.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]Not that I want to remember, but the Pats tried a fake punt against the Jets in the playoff last year when they were only down 7-3.  They were on their own side of the 50. And the Saints opened the 2nd half of the SB against the Colts with an onside kick.  The Bills truly had nothing to lose today, but this stuff is not confined to the regular season.
    Posted by nyjoseph[/QUOTE]

    True, but the defense did their job on the first drive. The special teams failed to stop the fake punt.
     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!! : True, but the defense did their job on the first drive. The special teams failed to stop the fake punt.
    Posted by NY-PATS-FAN4[/QUOTE]

    Yeah, but after the fake punt, there will still 51 yards between the LOS and the goal line, which the defense relinquished in just three plays.  No excuses for Molden, either.  That was a legit PI call against him.  Yeah, he turned his head, but he fell into the receiver's legs before the ball got there. 

    Let's face it, there's no excuse for the D's abysmal performance in the first quarter. After that, though, they did much better, though they still gave up more passing yards than is ideal.  

    The D is scrappy and plays with heart, but it's not going to win any games for us. For the Pats to win, the O has to play well--which it fortunately does with fair consistency. 

     
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    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    Hey, look at the caliber of teams in the playoffs.  NOT anything really different than we just saw.  Stop kidding yourselves that the Steelers and Ravens are anything special.  I saw the Steelers and the Browns today, they looked nearly equal.  Yes, that D (and O) came out weak, but the Bills were going balls out and the Pats tightened it up and strangled them.  I'm cautiously optimistic.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!! : Yeah, but after the fake punt, there will still 51 yards between the LOS and the goal line, which the defense relinquished in just three plays.  No excuses for Molden, either.  That was a legit PI call against him.  Yeah, he turned his head, but he fell into the receiver's legs before the ball got there.  Let's face it, there's no excuse for the D's abysmal performance in the first quarter. After that, though, they did much better, though they still gave up more passing yards than is ideal.   The D is scrappy and plays with heart, but it's not going to win any games for us. For the Pats to win, the O has to play well--which it fortunately does with fair consistency. 
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]

    Well, that's a little like saying, "Yeah, but after the offense got the ball and fumbled it away..."


     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    I did not see any AFC offenses of the potential playoff teams the Pats will face that scare us.  Do any of you?  The Steelers could only muster 13 at Cleveland and Mendenhall may be out and Big Ben is still gimpy!  The Ravens got TWO long runs out of Rice and plenty of favorable calls to win @ Cincy!!  Texans lose at HOME to Tennessee!!  Denver - 3 points!!

    The Pats D has shown MOST times plenty of brilliance to shut down a team.  In the playoffs if they put together a 60 minute game, we may all be celebrating in February!
     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]I did not see any AFC offenses of the potential playoff teams the Pats will face that scare us.  Do any of you?  The Steelers could only muster 13 at Cleveland and Mendenhall may be out and Big Ben is still gimpy!  The Ravens got TWO long runs out of Rice and plenty of favorable calls to win @ Cincy!!  Texans lose at HOME to Tennessee!!  Denver - 3 points!! The Pats D has shown MOST times plenty of brilliance to shut down a team.  In the playoffs if they put together a 60 minute game, we may all be celebrating in February!
    Posted by agcsbill[/QUOTE]

    I agree . . . though you can't completely ignore them either. 

    • Cincy's receivers are pretty good--they may cause some problems for our secondary, but overall Cincy doesn't look too tough
    • Rice is explosive, but the rest of Baltimore's offense is pretty pedestrian
    • When healthy, the Steelers offense can control the ball for long stretches . . . but their health is a real concern now and we usually play them well anyway (despite the debacle earlier this season)
    • Houston looks like it's in deep trouble in their passing game, and though their RB is very good, I'm not sure it's enough 
    • Denver is an awful offense
     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from sheldong. Show sheldong's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Good D -- BUT!!!! : And just what "playoff caliber team" is in your closet that is going to be up on the Pats 21-0 at the Razor? Good grief.  You people are working and have time to think up this crap?
    Posted by Patsfansince1966[/QUOTE]

    Any team with a good defense.  That means Pittsbugh, Baltimore or even Denver.  Spot any one of them 21 points and our odds of winning drop to about 10-1.  If we should get to the super bowl, we would have a hard time against San Francisco.  We would also have a hard time playing catch up against explosive offenses like Green Bay or New Orleans if we spotted them 21 points. 

    '66, I've been a Pats fan since '67, but I am also a realist and not a guy with blinders on like certain other people here.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from sheldong. Show sheldong's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]I did not see any AFC offenses of the potential playoff teams the Pats will face that scare us.  Do any of you?  The Steelers could only muster 13 at Cleveland and Mendenhall may be out and Big Ben is still gimpy!  The Ravens got TWO long runs out of Rice and plenty of favorable calls to win @ Cincy!!  Texans lose at HOME to Tennessee!!  Denver - 3 points!! The Pats D has shown MOST times plenty of brilliance to shut down a team.  In the playoffs if they put together a 60 minute game, we may all be celebrating in February!
    Posted by agcsbill[/QUOTE]

    We need THREE 60-minute games.
     
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    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!! : Prolate still can't avoid lying and say the receiver came BACK for the ball, initiating contact with Molden. That's at worst, no call on an underthrown ball. [/QUOTE]

    Sorry, but no.  I saw that play and Molden also extended his hands pushing the receiver.  To me, at least, it was a clear interference call. 

    What was an utterly ridiculous call was the one on McCourtey for "defenseless receiver".  Hell, that ball had already been tipped before Mccourtey made contact.  Had the receiver caught the ball, what was he supposed to do?  Wait for him to start running?
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!! : Any team with a good defense.  That means Pittsbugh, Baltimore or even Denver.  Spot any one of them 21 points and our odds of winning drop to about 10-1.  If we should get to the super bowl, we would have a hard time against San Francisco.  We would also have a hard time playing catch up against explosive offenses like Green Bay or New Orleans if we spotted them 21 points.  '66, I've been a Pats fan since '67, but I am also a realist and not a guy with blinders on like certain other people here.
    Posted by sheldong[/QUOTE]
    sheldong...  you missed the point..   the Steelers, Ravens and the Broncos do not necessarily have the offenses to go up 21 - 0 without some sort of help.  The Bills only got to 21 - 0 by going for it on 4th down twice and a PI call.  PI call aside, the 4th down plays would not have happened if Buffalo has something to play for.  As for your opinion about how the Pats would fare against SF, how can you really say that?  Who have they played that can challenge their defense like the Pats? I am glad they still need to play these games and not rely on fan opinions.
     
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    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]Exactly. How many teams fake a punt and then get a bagjob call at the 3 yard line on underthrown ducks? I mean, it's a concern, because clearly the officiating is very onesided and has been all year. But, you can't get uptight over it before games. The base components are in place for the Pats. It will come down to execution over 4 qtrs. I will say the STs have improved a lot. The kick off covererage has been generally outstanding, as well as Mesko's punts. They'll need that.  We need an efficient start to a game on both sides of the ball. I agree with both Sheldong and NYPats's points.  Do you think NE will play better than last year's divisional round? I do. I don't know how they can't.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKingII[/QUOTE]

    Pats have been getting torched for either one long TD pass or one long interference call EVERY game. Need to eliminate those, not sure how you can practice not committing penalties. Also, they have had very poor offensive starts the past few games. Takes Brady a series (or three) to get them rolling if he has to sit through the other teams opening 6-7 minute drive. Maybe not defer til the second half and give the offense a chance to get a quick lead to put pressure on the other offense??


     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from sheldong. Show sheldong's posts

    Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!

    In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Good D -- BUT!!!! : sheldong...  you missed the point..   the Steelers, Ravens and the Broncos do not necessarily have the offenses to go up 21 - 0 without some sort of help.  The Bills only got to 21 - 0 by going for it on 4th down twice and a PI call.  PI call aside, the 4th down plays would not have happened if Buffalo has something to play for.  As for your opinion about how the Pats would fare against SF, how can you really say that?  Who have they played that can challenge their defense like the Pats? I am glad they still need to play these games and not rely on fan opinions.
    Posted by agcsbill[/QUOTE]

    No, you miss the point.  Any team can put up 21 points.  Maybe it is a lucky pass.  Maybe it is a missed tackle.  Whatever.  The point I am making is that

    GIVEN that they scored to take a 21 point lead, it would be VERY hard to come back against a playoff caliber team.  Is it likely that any of the playoff contenders could do that?  No, but was it likely that Buffalo or Miami (OK, just 17) could do that?  Also no.  If our D plays like it did in the first quarter (and I don't care about crazy 4th down risks), then it is quite possible against any of the other five.  Well, maybe not Denver.
     

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