Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]What happened to compassion? It's every man for himself nowadays. How much money is enough for the owners and players? The NFL is a billion dollar business who can and should do more to help their retired players. If they can afford to donate millions of dollars to political candidates link then they can afford to help their own.
    Posted by digger0862[/QUOTE]

         Compassion is a wonderful thing. But, where should it end? Should society be held responsible every time an adult makes a bad decision...or a financial decision that doesn't turn out right?

         I agree that the NFL should (and have, of late) done more about the health care issues of retired players. But, isn't that the call of the NFLPA, as much, if not more, than of the owners? Both sides must agree in order to allocate funds. Why is the blame being placed solely on the league?

         Should the NFL be blamed every time a player squanders the money he earned playing ball? Where does personal responsibility for bad decisions come in?

         Do you believe that the public should bail out every company or individual who fails financially?  Where does it end??
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    When I say NFL, I include the players. All I'm saying is, the NFL, players included, have the resources to help. So they should.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? : Maybe the principal here should be "mutual responsibility."  A lot of folks are arguing the players should have known they were playing a violent game that might leave them damaged.  Well the same goes for the owners: they should have known they were running a violent game that might leave their workers damaged.  In that case, both parties have some responsibility for ensuring that the "damaged' players are taken care of once their playing days are over. With today's high salaries and better benefits maybe there is that mutual responsibility (at least for the high-paid stars).  But in the old days and even today for players who aren't stars and play only for a short time, the compensation and benefits maybe aren't sufficient to make up for the damage incurred.  The league is a very rich and successful one, so maybe it should provide more to the players who helped create that success at a significant cost to their future well being.  That's what the courts are for. . . they'll allow both parties to make their cases and then will come up with some kind of decision.  That decision may not be perfect, but sometimes the legal process is the best and only way we have to come up with some kind of reasonably just resolution.    
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]

         Apples and oranges. Taking care of the health needs of retired players is a completely different issue than the one being litigated. The concussion suits  blame the NFL for failing to warn of the dangers of concussions, and mis-diagnosing them.  

         Here's an article on one of the most recent suits filed on the concussion controversy. It gives a basic desciption of the issues involved: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/football-insider/post/art-monk-is-lead-plaintiff-in-another-concussion-lawsuit-against-the-nfl/2012/05/10/gIQASGtOGU_blog.html
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    Players pay union dues right?  If so what does it cover?  Does anybody know?
     
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    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]Players pay union dues right?  If so what does it cover?  Does anybody know?
    Posted by Rocky[/QUOTE]

         Again...seeing that players have a good post-retirement health care plan is not the focus of this discussion. We're dealing here with the concussion lawsuits issue. 

         But, if you're interested in knowing about what benefits the retired players have, here they are: https://www.nflplayercare.com/Default.aspx
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? :      Again...seeing that players have a good post-retirement health care plan is not the focus of this discussion. We're dealing here with the concussion lawsuits issue.       But, if you're interested in knowing about what benefits the retired players have, here they are: https://www.nflplayercare.com/Default.aspx
    Posted by TexasPat[/QUOTE]

    That's a lot of benefits and much more than us common folks would receive for disability or retirement.
    The one that stuck out was the $9000. a month for the death benefit for family.  I wonder if that was void due to the suicide.
    Also common folks don't get a lifetime cash benefit for disability.  They get one lump sum payment depending on the severity of the disability.
    I got a 28k payment for a 38% whole body disability (both shoulders w/ depression).  Whoopee!
    The concussion thing, IDK.  What prevented them (the players) from researching them at the time.  I know when I hurt my shoulders, I became an expert on the subject.  LOL
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? :      Apples and oranges. Taking care of the health needs of retired players is a completely different issue than the one being litigated. The concussion suits  blame the NFL for failing to warn of the dangers of concussions, and mis-diagnosing them.        Here's an article on one of the most recent suits filed on the concussion controversy. It gives a basic desciption of the issues involved: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/football-insider/post/art-monk-is-lead-plaintiff-in-another-concussion-lawsuit-against-the-nfl/2012/05/10/gIQASGtOGU_blog.html
    Posted by TexasPat[/QUOTE]

    It also claims that players were pressured to return to games when injured and told to ignore the impact of their injuries because they weren't that serious.  I think it's quite conceivable that teams and coaches wanted to get players back on the field and put pressure on them to ignore injuries that many players may have felt were serious.  If that's the case then why shouldn't the teams now bear some of the costs of the lasting consequences of those injuries?  In the end, the courts will decide, which is the way the American system works. 

    I'm not sure some person suffering from early dementia and unable to work or support himself as a consequence of injuries suffered on a job is "greedy" if he asks the employer to help cover the cost of his injuries.  The employer benefited from the employee's service, but in the long term, the employee without help from the employer is bearing most of the cost of the damage the service caused to the employee.  

    Your initial post used very judgmental language accusing the players of greed and wanting to destroy pro football.  Why not try living with brain damage for a while and then getting back to us on how you feel about this?  That is, if you can still write or communicate at all, which of course many of these brain damaged players can't . . . 




     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? : It also claims that players were pressured to return to games when injured and told to ignore the impact of their injuries because they weren't that serious.  I think it's quite conceivable that teams and coaches wanted to get players back on the field and put pressure on them to ignore injuries that many players may have felt were serious.  If that's the case then why shouldn't the teams now bear some of the costs of the lasting consequences of those injuries?  In the end, the courts will decide, which is the way the American system works.

    RESPONSE: Again...the concussion issue has nothing to do with retired players not getting properly compensated with a good retirement package. This issue centers on head injuries only, allegedly caused by multiple concussions.
         How were grown men so "pressured"? If you've played the game on either the high school or collegiate level, you know that no one "pressured" a kid to run back in and play. He couldn't wait to get back in. Besides, do you really believe that the coaches cared so little about their players that they would purposely run them back in...and expose them to serious injury? No one knew the potential long term effects of such head shots. Hopefully, juries will decide these suits with this in mind...and not be driven by a sense of sympathy, or compassion...as they were in the cigarette cases. 
         
    I'm not sure some person suffering from early dementia and unable to work or support himself as a consequence of injuries suffered on a job is "greedy" if he asks the employer to help cover the cost of his injuries.
     
    RESPONSE: Again, you're attempting to change the focus of this discussion. The issue is not whether the retired players have received a sufficient retirement package to care for their needs. This is a cash grab, no doubt being fueled by the trial lawyers...just as the suits against "Big Tobacco" were. The retired players aren't asking to have the NFL "help cover the cost of their injuries"...they are asking for millions, above and beyond that.

    The employer benefited from the employee's service, but in the long term, the employee without help from the employer is bearing most of the cost of the damage the service caused to the employee.
     
    RESPONSE: Again, you're trying to make this an issue dealing with the insufficiency of the retired players' benefit package. This is not. This is a bunch of players and their families suing due to alleged symptoms of multiple concussions. You have no idea who is paying what...but are simply sympathetic to the plight of the player. 
         As for receiving the benefit of employment, professional athletes have been well paid for years. Do you know any high round draft choices over the past 5-10 years who didn't become millionaires overnight?   


    Your initial post used very judgmental language accusing the players of greed and wanting to destroy pro football.
     
    RESPONSE: I reject this accusation. Go back and read the post. Call it "judgmental if you will...but I call it common sense. What happens to the game if these trial lawyers are successful with all these suits? And, as I stated above, the players involved aren't merely "trying to get assistance to cover they medical bills". They're seeking millions, above and beyond that.
         If anything, it is you who are being judgmental, in that you're taking the stance that it's the NFL's fault...and consistently trying to change the focus of this discussion from the concussion based lawsuits, to the retired players getting insufficient benefits to cover their needs. As stated above, that both naive, and untrue.
         Besides, isn't it the responsibility of the NFLPA to bargain for retirement benefits? If they made a bad bargain, why is it now solely incumbent upon the NFL to rectroactively modify the deal bargained for?


    Why not try living with brain damage for a while and then getting back to us on how you feel about this?  That is, if you can still write or communicate at all, which of course many of these brain damaged players can't . . .

    RESPONSE: What does this whine of yours have to do with the issues? No one is arguing that head trauma issues are not severe. The trial lawyers are hoping to seat jurors with an emotional, knee jerk attitude, like yours. If they do, they may very well succeed with their suits. If that happens, it could destroy the NFL, and the game of football, as we know it. 
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?


    Hey Tex, why not go back to whining about Tavon Wilson.  It's just as annoying but not nearly so despicable.  

    You're the one saying this lawsuit is nothing but a cash grab.  Maybe it is, but why not let the courts decide?  That's what they're there for.  It's also quite possible that a lot of ex football players have serious brain damage as a result of their careers and their lives are ruined by it.  If that's the case, then I see nothing wrong (or greedy) about them trying to recover damages to the extent that their past employers are at least partially responsible for the players' injuries.  

    What the heck is your agenda here?  Why are you so anxious to try to label these players greedy?  Let them have their day in court and make their arguments.  They have that right.  Then we can see if their claims have any merit or not.  You haven't heard their full case yet.  So it's a bit premature to start convicting them of greed or anything else . . . 

    I just don't get all the anger you're showing toward these old players, many of whom clearly are suffering and never made a lot of money playing the game . . . what the heck is wrong with you?  Why are you so worked up about this? 




     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]     No question that Pro Football is a violent game. No question that there's a higher risk on debilitating injury in football than perhaps any other sport, save perhaps boxing. No question that playing NFL football just about guarantees that a players will pay a continuing price, long after retirement.      BUT...what NFL player is completely ignorant of the risks involved? To quote the mythical North Dallas QB, Seth Maxwell, in the movie, North Dallas 40, "we're all a bunch of whoorrres". In other words, they know that when they sign up to play pro ball, that they are in essence "selling" and sacrificing their bodies, to get paid big money to play the game.      For years, retired NFL players have, with some justification, whined about how the league has forgotten them, when it comes to retirement and pension benefits. Now, could they be extracting their revenge by participating in the avalanche of lawsuits over concussions, against the league? WR Roddy White of the Atlanta Falcons believed this to be the case...despite his lip service about how he loves the retired players, and naivety about how the NFL can afford to pay off on all these suits:   http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d828f9ef1/article/roddy-white-insists-former-players-killing-our-game?module=HP11_content_stream      The truth of the matter is that, should the trial lawyers get their way through the courts, and the retired players score big, more and more retired players will pile on. As a result, there's a good chance that the game of pro football, as we know it, will be severly altered, or be discontinued all together.         
    Posted by TexasPat3[/QUOTE]

    Greed? Are you serious? That is a pathetic thing to say. Players are generally not the most sophisticated people and teams and the league have been paying doctors (actual doctors who give actual advice to laymen who know they do not know much and are predisposed to fear losing their jobs if they are not on the field) to tell players that it is OK to get back on the field. THere should be some hefty law suits and the league and the doctors involved should lose big time.

    But that does not mean that things can be done to minimize future health issues (making the most protective helmets a requirement and including new sensor based means of measuring potential harmful effects on individual players - this technology exists NOW) and the players better informed and so health issues can be optimized.

    You on the other hand blame the players for the sins of the league, the teams, the doctors... and THEN you make a statement that essentially says that no matter how dangerous it is for players the fans should have the game the way they want it. Well, what if your season ticket came with a contract clause stating that if a player suffers a serious head injury or if it is found that he had a head injury in the game(s) you paid to see and there ended up some cumulative health problems you would be partially liable to pay a percentage of the health care costs? And a similar clause for gettting games on TV. I wonder if you would run the risk of watching.

    Bottom line is that while there are abuses of suing in this country there are PLENTY of legitimate claims out there. And one reason why there are so many legitimate claims is that too many people are willing to cut corners or lie or cheat or look the other way because THEY are greedy and in fact so greedy that no religious, moral or ethical values guide their lives - and many of these people are self righteous and feel gleeful in pointing the finger of blame at others, especially in the political spectrum. So bottom line is that the fault lies in too many people being so greedy taht they will let harm befall others so they can make a buck. And they complain about things like safe food and drinking water or regulations so that medicines, machines, etc are safe.

    You actually quote a movie! That is something! OK, how about this quote from Its a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World... (I am not singling out a particular group or making a "class" statement here; the point is about the general level of morality and ethics):

    "Everybody pays taxes!- Even businessmen, who rob and cheat and steal from people everyday, even they have to pay taxes!". Well, maybe they do and maybe they dont but too many people take that approach to life. 
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    Hi ALL!  Hey, sorry I'm late to the party so I'll need some fill-in's right here...  See, I live in the world of unfitting analogies & a despicable hypocrisy of debased ideals, malleable solely towards my right-wing values & pocketbook...  Q: Any chance some fellow sl#meb#ll agenda driven outspoken conservative can bring back up to speed here? 


    Also: If some of you guys can preach on a bit more regarding how the zillion dollar Players Union Association should've pushed for tougher injury-abating regulations in the league, Based off the fact about just how easy it was for the NFL Player workers to wrestle that 49% share from the Owners and League last offseason, That'd be great. 

    Thanx in advance for the laughs.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? :      How does this make the concussion issue analogous with asbestos?? Helmet manufacturers, as far as I know, are not being targeted...and football stadiums are asbestos free.       If anything, as another poster mentioned previously, it's analogous to the money grab against "Big Tobacco"...in which the cigarette companies were sued for not giving ample warnings.      Those case turned on sentiment. If these concussion cases are decided by juries in the same manner, the costs of these suits could seriously damage the NFL, and have a detrimental impact on the sport in general, at all levels.  
    Posted by TexasPat[/QUOTE]

    I am sorry but you are quite wrong on the basis for the suits. It had to do with willingly generating false information on the health hazards. It included paying doctors to state "independently" that there were no problems and at other times that at least no meaningful evidence. Putting out lies (you know Tex, "mis information") and using professionals willing to back them up... no Tex, there was more than mere sentiment. It has been based on ACTIONS taken by the persons and companies being sued which were very influential on how the public viewed their products.

    You might have an opinion on climate change. Some of the same tactics are being used to generate misinformation (I am not advocating as to what to do or not do about it). But if you doubt the science of that then you are essentially buying in to the same thing the players and smokers have when they were mislead. And if you do not think we are being mislead by "deniers" here is a very simple but to the point analogy:

    You have a fire in your house that almost kills your family and almost destroys your house. You bring in 100 fire cheifs and experts on fires in the home. 97 out of 100 of them tell you you have a serious wiring problem and if you dont do anything about it you will have another life threatening fire. 3 (three) out of 100 tell you that there is nothing you can do about it; fires are mostly just accidents. Would you ignore 97 of the 100 experts or would you feel a need to protect yourself, your wife and your children - not to mention your investment in your house.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    Tex, I will add that there is CLEARLY pressure on players to get back in the game. ANd that is historically true throughout the history of the league. To think otherwise seems to be intentionally naive about the realities of the business and the world.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    Here's one of Tex's greedy bastards tyring to destroy football . . . too bad he shot himself before he got his grimy little hands on all the money . . .  

    Ray Easterling, a former Atlanta Falcons safety who helped lead the team’s vaunted defense in the 1970s and later joined a high-profile lawsuit against the National Football League over its handling of concussion-related injuries, died on Thursday. He was 62.

    Associated Press

    Ray Easterling in 1975.

    The Richmond, Va., police captain Yvonne Crowder told FoxSports.com on Saturday that Easterling died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound at his home in Richmond. His wife, Mary Ann Easterling, said that after he left football, Easterling experienced depression, insomnia and then dementia that she attributed to years of bruising hits.

    Easterling played for the Falcons from 1972 to 1979 and was part of the team’s Grits Blitz defense in 1977 that set the N.F.L. record at the time for the fewest points allowed in a season, 129.

    He was part of a group of seven former players who sued the league in Philadelphia in August, contending that it had failed to properly treat players for concussions and for decades had tried to conceal any links between football and brain injuries. The N.F.L. has said that any allegation that it intentionally sought to mislead players is without merit.

    Ms. Easterly said she would continue to pursue the lawsuit and urge the league to establish a fund for players with traumatic brain injuries related to their playing days.

    “Half the time the player puts themselves back in the game, and they don’t know what kind of impact it has,” she said. “Somehow this has got to be stopped.”

    Easterling was born on Sept. 3, 1949, and played football at the University of Richmond. He was drafted by the Falcons as a ninth-round pick in 1972 and played for four years as a starter. He was a leader of the secondary that established a team record in 1977 with 26 interceptions.

    After his playing days ended, he returned to Richmond, where he ran a financial services company and started a youth football camp. His wife and friends said that he started showing signs of brain damage about 20 years ago.

    “He just wasn’t thinking right,” said Greg Brezina, a former Falcons teammate. “You could tell that 20 years ago. He’d start talking to you about one topic, and then he’d end up in another topic and he wouldn’t know how he got there.”

     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    If anyone cares to read the actual complaint filed by the players (or at least those in the Easterling suit), you can read it here. 

     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    I heard that he was born with concussions, brain trauma, insomnia, depression, and dementia...  Yup- Very same guy told me that Easterling in fact, never actually even PLAYED Pro Football (photoshop forgery...clearly), and that this lawsuit was just a scam to send some down-and-out, just trying-to-make-ends-meet NFL Owner, straight to the poor-house...

    No shame- Stop Whinin' and Get A Job pal...
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? : The relations to Hockey which you ask and sorry but you are wrong, I will give you just one of the many case studies done on concussions in the NHL from the years 1986 to 2001. http://cjns.metapress.com/content/walpbljjt2858ypy/ Also Hockey was a poor mans sport, players were never paid well and did not complain about injuries to the media, they kept many things in house. John MacKenzie from the 1970's Boston Bruins and Ted Green had said openly that there heads were never clear during the season, their Bells were Always rung. as for Nascar I can't really say, but I will do some research. But, Nascar uses a head and neck restraint system along with head gear and a roll cage absorbtion system.. as for never getting concussions you are very wrong here is just 1 link for you to read that will show your analysis incorrect...and please note Nascar has never really tracked records of concussions, but they are under investigation for it now... . http://espn.go.com/racing/nascar/cup/story/_/id/7599100/nfl-concussion-fallout-raises-red-flags-nascar The information on car crash injuries and brain injuries at 6 mph, here is one of the many links, http://www.articlesbase.com/personal-injury-articles/facts-about-whiplash-injuries-2843636.html The reason I know these facts was due to being in 2 car realted injuries, these facts were brought out in court cases. I dont know where you find these documented facts by the experts over the last 40 years misleading, but they are the common standard used in research and if you look them up there are many books written using this detailed information and over 1000 weblinks. you will find on serious matters I dont talk off the tip of my hat, these are facts and declorations made by professionals, not me Oh, and to come by measure of unit of force and not speed which you said is incorrect as well.... Force equals mass times acceleration, yes Newtons 2nd Law, But to determine the actual injuries at different junctures, the Auto Industry research and medical researchers needed speed in MPH or km to estimate the damages done. Sorry, but again these are not my facts or findings, these are the professionals. If you have more questions its very easy to google them, espically where you are lacking the knowledge you are claiming about nascar. have a great day!!!
    Posted by Stommpper[/QUOTE]

    Sorry I asked a question,

    Just so you know, Teddy Green's injury was not due to a normal in game collision. Basically an opposing player two handed him in the head crushing his skull. I know, I watched that game. 

    Also, most discussions I've had with medical doctors about concussions and most of what I have read refer to the g's experienced in the collision not the speed the head was travelling at when it collided with something. I've also read in the New England Journal of Medicine that straight on collisions are not nearly as injurious as a colision that induces a twisting motion to the skull. So when you say a collision at six miles an hour causes a concussion, I don't know if you are quoting a source that was dumbing it down for us laymen or not. Hence my question.

    As far as NASCAR is concerned I only mentioned them because there are many documented cases of their drivers crashing at 200 mph without getting a concussion. And 200 mph is much faster that 6 mph. Now I didn't say they never get concussions because I am pretty sure they do, but not everyone that crashes does and that was my point. The Hahns (sp) device was introduced to reduce the occurance of neck injuries during a crash, I believe the explanation at the time was the helmets were great at protecting the head but they were so heavy that neck fractures were occuring at relatively low speeds.

    I read the article that you suggested that speaks to concussions happening at 6 mph. What it really was written about was whiplash and never mentions concussions. It was also an ambulance chaser's web site. I loved the "CALL A WHIPLASH ATTORNEY ASAP" message at the end.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]If it wasn't for the old football players this NFL would still be behind baseball as the favorite sport of all time. If you can remember back they started out with leather helmets. The finally evolved into a safer and more contact sport. All they want is a health insurance plan that will provide for them and their family. The billion dollar NFL can't or won't give it to them?
    Posted by bobo354[/QUOTE]

    What?? They don't get paid enough to purchase a top notch health plan? Give me a break...they know the possibilities are out there, they choose not to spend a dime for their own welfare.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? : What?? They don't get paid enough to purchase a top notch health plan? Give me a break...they know the possibilities are out there, they choose not to spend a dime for their own welfare.
    Posted by 3SB-rings[/QUOTE]

    Due to their jobs they were probably uninsurable by the insurance companies. So even if they knew the possibilities they were probably refused coverage.
     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? : Due to their jobs they were probably uninsurable by the insurance companies. So even if they knew the possibilities they were probably refused coverage.
    Posted by rtuinila[/QUOTE]

    Plus a lot of them don't make enough money to purchase policies that will cover them for their whole life when they are such high risks to cover and so young when they leave the game.  If they are even insurable, the cost could be astronomical.  Sure, the big stars might be able to afford it, but a typical pro football player quite likely doesn't earn enough during a relatively short playing career to pay for health and long-term care insurance that covers them for life. 



     
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    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football? : Sorry I asked a question, Just so you know, Teddy Green's injury was not due to a normal in game collision. Basically an opposing player two handed him in the head crushing his skull. I know, I watched that game.  Also, most discussions I've had with medical doctors about concussions and most of what I have read refer to the g's experienced in the collision not the speed the head was travelling at when it collided with something. I've also read in the New England Journal of Medicine that straight on collisions are not nearly as injurious as a colision that induces a twisting motion to the skull. So when you say a collision at six miles an hour causes a concussion, I don't know if you are quoting a source that was dumbing it down for us laymen or not. Hence my question. As far as NASCAR is concerned I only mentioned them because there are many documented cases of their drivers crashing at 200 mph without getting a concussion. And 200 mph is much faster that 6 mph. Now I didn't say they never get concussions because I am pretty sure they do, but not everyone that crashes does and that was my point. The Hahns (sp) device was introduced to reduce the occurance of neck injuries during a crash, I believe the explanation at the time was the helmets were great at protecting the head but they were so heavy that neck fractures were occuring at relatively low speeds. I read the article that you suggested that speaks to concussions happening at 6 mph. What it really was written about was whiplash and never mentions concussions. It was also an ambulance chaser's web site. I loved the "CALL A WHIPLASH ATTORNEY ASAP" message at the end.
    Posted by rtuinila[/QUOTE]

    See how people say what was never written. I NEVER mentioned Ted Greens steel plate or his injury. Please read what was written. I said, John MacKenzie and Teddy Green BOTH stated that their Bells were always rung during the season, you said concusions are new to Hockey, please stick to what you write.
    Also about the 6mph,  note your back tracking of , well MOST Nascar Drivers NEVER get concussions.(wow) Google it please, I dont have the time to waste trying to hand feed you real information, please continue to read 1 paragraph and make your own so called knowledge or continue to make it up as you go. Tell us, since Nascar is investigating the concussion issue, how you happen to have more knowledge about it than they do?.
    You're too funny, you pick quotes or paragraphs then pretend you know what your talking about. Try researching the entire event before you have to back track lol.
     Also before you start trying to quote Newton and his laws, have someone explain them to you so you at least have an understanding of them before you make yourself look foolish again.
    There are over 1000 ;links and 40 years of research history on the 6mph issue, again, go do some research and try reading before you pretend to knwo what the facts really are...
    Have a nice day!!!Yell
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    On another note:
    http://bleacherreport.com/tb/bgJGz?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=new-england-patriots
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Stommpper. Show Stommpper's posts

    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]Hi ALL!  Hey, sorry I'm late to the party so I'll need some fill-in's right here...  See, I live in the world of unfitting analogies & a despicable hypocrisy of debased ideals, malleable solely towards my right-wing values & pocketbook...  Q : Any chance some fellow sl#meb#ll agenda driven outspoken conservative can bring back up to speed here?  Also : If some of you guys can preach on a bit more regarding how the zillion dollar Players Union Association should've pushed for tougher injury-abating regulations in the league, Based off the fact about just how easy it was for the NFL Player workers to wrestle that 49% share from the Owners and League last offseason, That'd be great.  Thanx in advance for the laughs.
    Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium[/QUOTE]
    WEll LAzz, not to be condescending but from the way you speak on this matter, and call everyone else with the opposite opinion,

    I call you out and give you the open floor!
    Share with us please your expertise in your managing of your past business or businesses where you had employees that sued you, had injuries both real and non.
    Tell us your legal trouble with them, how your attorney's handled the problems and how you settled the matters at hand.
    Please relate to us the cost to you just in legal fee's without compensations paid out and or structured settlements.
    And also, did you employees have a union? Your employees contracts if union, were they 2 ,3 or 5 year voting conditions or just common place with compliant job descriptions, insurance vouture's with selection of carrier or standard with adjustable deducatables?
    Did you or do you offer stock options, 401k, reimbursement investment options, or straight shared dividends on company profit margins for advanced sale profits?

    Because you see, these are all things in small business that are magnified at the NFL level.
    These players and yes even in the 1980's are and were payed very well.

    Sorry Lazz but, with the way you people are thinking try this out?

    If any of you played football in your local high school or college and got hurt, say a broken bone, I want you to go to the head of that school and tell them you are going to sue them because the injury you sustaned has taken on new magnification and is ruining yoru life.
    After all they made money seloling tickets to these games and after all you deserve compensation, you helped make that school what it is today.

    So whats next, suits for broken fingers, hang nails and diaper rash?

    Once again the NFL is worth billions and the sleazeballs will use any tactic and attorney to milk money from the cash cow.

    Good luck Lazz with your buisnesses and I hope you have a great attorney that keeps people like this from taking your profits away from you.

    One thing though Lazz, if the NFLPA is such a great union rep of the players why are these issues never put forth with the affect of player strikes?

    I will answer it for you, its because the players salaries are so large and profit sharing so large,(unheard of anywhere else) that if they ever did strike, every other football player would line up and take less than half of what the NFL players receive.
    And that goes for the 1980's players as well.

    Sorry that people with other opinions have caused you to call us all slime and the such, but if you have better options then you need to be an attorney working for the players union and you will have my vote.Laughing

    your still my Idol on this program, even if Im just a low life sleezee guy!If you have a good answer to this problem for these guys, I would be the first in line to hear it
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Stommpper. Show Stommpper's posts

    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]Here's one of Tex's greedy bastards tyring to destroy football . . . too bad he shot himself before he got his grimy little hands on all the money . . .   Ray Easterling, a former Atlanta Falcons safety who helped lead the team’s vaunted defense in the 1970s and later joined a high-profile lawsuit against the National Football League over its handling of concussion-related injuries, died on Thursday. He was 62. Enlarge This Image Associated Press Ray Easterling in 1975. The Richmond, Va., police captain Yvonne Crowder  told FoxSports .com on Saturday that Easterling died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound at his home in Richmond. His wife, Mary Ann Easterling, said that after he left football, Easterling experienced depression, insomnia and then dementia that she attributed to years of bruising hits. Easterling played for the Falcons from 1972 to 1979 and was part of the team’s Grits Blitz defense in 1977 that set the N.F.L. record at the time for the fewest points allowed in a season, 129. He was part of a group of seven former players who sued the league in Philadelphia in August, contending that it had failed to properly treat players for concussions and for decades had tried to conceal any links between football and brain injuries. The N.F.L. has said that any allegation that it intentionally sought to mislead players is without merit. Ms. Easterly said she would continue to pursue the lawsuit and urge the league to establish a fund for players with traumatic brain injuries related to their playing days. “Half the time the player puts themselves back in the game, and they don’t know what kind of impact it has,” she said. “Somehow this has got to be stopped.” Easterling was born on Sept. 3, 1949, and played football at the University of Richmond. He was drafted by the Falcons as a ninth-round pick in 1972 and played for four years as a starter. He was a leader of the secondary that established a team record in 1977 with 26 interceptions. After his playing days ended, he returned to Richmond, where he ran a financial services company and started a youth football camp. His wife and friends said that he started showing signs of brain damage about 20 years ago. “He just wasn’t thinking right,” said Greg Brezina, a former Falcons teammate. “You could tell that 20 years ago. He’d start talking to you about one topic, and then he’d end up in another topic and he wouldn’t know how he got there.”
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]

    Prolate I understand what yoru saying, and by no means is this a simple issue. Anyone taking their own life is obviously suffering things no one else can see.
    Who would ever have thought Junior Seau would take his own life.

    But to just lay blame on the NFl and say that handing out money will cure all this is not the answer.
    Mental illness either caused by a job realted injury or by food chemicals or by genes past on by family is still in a state of infancy.

    The problems most opposed and thinking the NFl should just hand out money sets a precedent. If they just blindly agree then they set themselves up for future law suits so on and so on with matters totally insane to ridiculous.

    The NFL will have to cave and pay some sort of settlement in good faith, but their attorney's will close the door and contracts restructured in the future that will most likely hurt players that have no financial knowledge, such as most of the players in the past.

    The one part I laugh at here is those so adamant about it with no business experience or knwoledge at all. Until you have been in those shoes you have no idea the legal ramifications and costs. If you own a business and are not 10 steps ahead of your employees you are finished. And that is a fact. Your very own structural base will be the first and strongest to either steal from you or sue you into bankruptcy.
    and All this while telling YOU how you should be running your buisness.
    Have a great day everyone
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?

    In Response to Re: Greed of Retired Players Threatening to Destroy Pro Football?:
    [QUOTE]Here's one of Tex's greedy bastards tyring to destroy football . . . too bad he shot himself before he got his grimy little hands on all the money . . .   Ray Easterling, a former Atlanta Falcons safety who helped lead the team’s vaunted defense in the 1970s and later joined a high-profile lawsuit against the National Football League over its handling of concussion-related injuries, died on Thursday. He was 62. Enlarge This Image Associated Press Ray Easterling in 1975. The Richmond, Va., police captain Yvonne Crowder  told FoxSports .com on Saturday that Easterling died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound at his home in Richmond. His wife, Mary Ann Easterling, said that after he left football, Easterling experienced depression, insomnia and then dementia that she attributed to years of bruising hits. Easterling played for the Falcons from 1972 to 1979 and was part of the team’s Grits Blitz defense in 1977 that set the N.F.L. record at the time for the fewest points allowed in a season, 129. He was part of a group of seven former players who sued the league in Philadelphia in August, contending that it had failed to properly treat players for concussions and for decades had tried to conceal any links between football and brain injuries. The N.F.L. has said that any allegation that it intentionally sought to mislead players is without merit. Ms. Easterly said she would continue to pursue the lawsuit and urge the league to establish a fund for players with traumatic brain injuries related to their playing days. “Half the time the player puts themselves back in the game, and they don’t know what kind of impact it has,” she said. “Somehow this has got to be stopped.” Easterling was born on Sept. 3, 1949, and played football at the University of Richmond. He was drafted by the Falcons as a ninth-round pick in 1972 and played for four years as a starter. He was a leader of the secondary that established a team record in 1977 with 26 interceptions. After his playing days ended, he returned to Richmond, where he ran a financial services company and started a youth football camp. His wife and friends said that he started showing signs of brain damage about 20 years ago. “He just wasn’t thinking right,” said Greg Brezina, a former Falcons teammate. “You could tell that 20 years ago. He’d start talking to you about one topic, and then he’d end up in another topic and he wouldn’t know how he got there.”
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]

         You are getting hysterical...LOL!!! No one is saying that head injuries aren't tragic, or serious. The only question is...should the NFL be held liable for it.

         Grow-up!
     

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