Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from agill1970. Show agill1970's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    BB is always going to love his vets and be smitten with certain players.  But I think he is going to be a whole lot more picky in signing them just because he has been burnt more times than not at this point. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to agill1970's comment:

    BB is always going to love his vets and be smitten with certain players.  But I think he is going to be a whole lot more picky in signing them just because he has been burnt more times than not at this point. 



    I agree.  The street goes both ways.  Even though many of his signings were based on a degree of low risk, high reward - if it fails more often than not - ultimately, the failure affects any progress the team is trying to make in areas of weakness - and hurts the team in the end.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    Let me get this straight:

    Tommy Kelly and Adrian Wilson were on the first possible flights to FOxborough in the spring and Carter was on a red eye from California where he had told the public it "was either retirement or playing for BB only".

    I can see why Anonymis has me on ignore. He doesn't like to be shown to be a moron by far more intelligent people.

     



    I think no other team in football was offering Wilson a contract.

    in hind sight, regardless of the injury, Kelly IMO left money on the table to join the Pats. I believe teams would have paid more than he signed for here

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeadowlandMike. Show MeadowlandMike's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    Let me get this straight:

    Tommy Kelly and Adrian Wilson were on the first possible flights to FOxborough in the spring and Carter was on a red eye from California where he had told the public it "was either retirement or playing for BB only".

    I can see why Anonymis has me on ignore. He doesn't like to be shown to be a moron by far more intelligent people.

     



    I think no other team in football was offering Wilson a contract.

    in hind sight, regardless of the injury, Kelly IMO left money on the table to join the Pats. I believe teams would have paid more than he signed for here



    The best safety on the market and nobody wanted him?  You are insane!  He had most of the NFL clammoring for him and then came to Bill and took a paycut to be a part of something special.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to MeadowlandMike's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    Let me get this straight:

    Tommy Kelly and Adrian Wilson were on the first possible flights to FOxborough in the spring and Carter was on a red eye from California where he had told the public it "was either retirement or playing for BB only".

    I can see why Anonymis has me on ignore. He doesn't like to be shown to be a moron by far more intelligent people.

     



    I think no other team in football was offering Wilson a contract.

    in hind sight, regardless of the injury, Kelly IMO left money on the table to join the Pats. I believe teams would have paid more than he signed for here



    The best safety on the market and nobody wanted him?  You are insane!  He had most of the NFL clammoring for him and then came to Bill and took a paycut to be a part of something special.



    What most every team is seeing in Ed Reed today (except the Jets) , every team saw in AWilson last year (except BB)

    fool me once, shame on You. Fool me twice, shame on me

    Bb won't get fooled again! (Townsend/Daltrey)

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    Let me get this straight:

    Tommy Kelly and Adrian Wilson were on the first possible flights to FOxborough in the spring and Carter was on a red eye from California where he had told the public it "was either retirement or playing for BB only".

    I can see why Anonymis has me on ignore. He doesn't like to be shown to be a moron by far more intelligent people.

     



    I think no other team in football was offering Wilson a contract.

    in hind sight, regardless of the injury, Kelly IMO left money on the table to join the Pats. I believe teams would have paid more than he signed for here



    You just said no one else was offering Reed a contract.  That's not the focus of this thread.

    The focus of this thread is "do vets still want to play for BB?"

    Answer: YES

     



    Too many vets have come here and then quickly were shown the door, rightfully so. For every Carter, there are 5 busts. If I am a vet, knowing BB, I would look elsewhere.

    that is not a knock on BB. He usually makes the correct decision with cutting vets. The decision up for debate, is why bring them here in the first place?  

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    It's not that I think older free agents don't want to come here, it's that we have signed the wrong one's...Ocho Cinco, Fred Taylor, Torry Holt, Haynesworth, Shaun Ellis, Joseph Addai, Stallworth, Gaffney, Schiancoe, Galloway, Shawn Springs, Robert Gallery, Adrain Wilson, Gregory, Kelly, Fells, Fenene...none of these guys helped us because of age, declining play, or injury.

    There was a time that I believed almost any older player we brought in was the answer and going to help...the last five years has dramatically altered my opinion on that. Now I'm starting to think any older player we bring in is going to be a bust - even when Kelly was playing well I thought...he's old...he's going to go down...he shouldn't be playing that many minutes. Then he tears his knee up in a non contact injury. We need guys in their prime, unfortunately we spent the money on the wrong guys.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    It's not that I think older free agents don't want to come here, it's that we have signed the wrong one's...Ocho Cinco, Fred Taylor, Torry Holt, Haynesworth, Shaun Ellis, Joseph Addai, Stallworth, Gaffney, Schiancoe, Galloway, Shawn Springs, Robert Gallery, Adrain Wilson, Gregory, Kelly, Fells, Fenene...none of these guys helped us because of age, declining play, or injury.

    There was a time that I believed almost any older player we brought in was the answer and going to help...the last five years has dramatically altered my opinion on that. Now I'm starting to think any older player we bring in is going to be a bust - even when Kelly was playing well I thought...he's old...he's going to go down...he shouldn't be playing that many minutes. Then he tears his knee up in a non contact injury. We need guys in their prime, unfortunately we spent the money on the wrong guys.



    and who's responsible for all of those signings....lol

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    It's not that I think older free agents don't want to come here, it's that we have signed the wrong one's...Ocho Cinco, Fred Taylor, Torry Holt, Haynesworth, Shaun Ellis, Joseph Addai, Stallworth, Gaffney, Schiancoe, Galloway, Shawn Springs, Robert Gallery, Adrain Wilson, Gregory, Kelly, Fells, Fenene...none of these guys helped us because of age, declining play, or injury.

    There was a time that I believed almost any older player we brought in was the answer and going to help...the last five years has dramatically altered my opinion on that. Now I'm starting to think any older player we bring in is going to be a bust - even when Kelly was playing well I thought...he's old...he's going to go down...he shouldn't be playing that many minutes. Then he tears his knee up in a non contact injury. We need guys in their prime, unfortunately we spent the money on the wrong guys.



    Do you just keep a list of names to cut and paste by your keyboard, Cupcake? Torry Holt and Gallery retired. Neither were meant to be key cogs or prime  FA signings.  Addai quit and was beaten out by sueprior talents like RIdley, Vereen and BOlden.

    For every name that retired or didn't make the team/weren't good enough, I can name a chunk of names that were nice complemetary signings:

    Arrington, Connolly, Ninkovich, BJGE, Wendell, Crumpler, Gerard Warren, Carter, Anderson, Waters, Lloyd, etc.

    The fact is, BB does not spend wildly like you want him to on big name prime market players so they end up like Brandon Marshall in Chicago and Mike Wallace in Miami.  He doesn't do that because he doesn't need to, wants his leverage and does not want to end up being a .500 team.

    He develops a base and fills in the gaps with a mid/low lever budget in FA.  He's done this since 2000 and 2001. He's built 3 SB winners and 5 SB contending teams, total.  It's those 2 SBs that get you and your minions every time.  

    None of the FA moves, whether it be Adalius Thomas in 2007 or Shaun Ellis in 2011, ruined another chance to a Lombardi.

    It was Brady. It was poor play by Brady and his preferred offense.  It's happened twice.  He's ruined it for the team and fans almost all by his lonesome in that shotgun formation in numerous playoff games.  Gomer wants to be in the shotgun on Sunday. Why?  Because he doesn't want a boo-boo. Now the Chiefs know it and will tee off.  Super.  

    It's comical to many here, I am sure, that a troll like Anonymis can start a thread like this with a 7-2 team with all the injuries this team has had, that somehow you and your wet blanket moron, Low IQ idiot RKrap, can sit here and whine like little women, completely miserable, unable to enjoy the brilliance of our GM in cap era.

    And, you're a fraud with Kelly too.  Ted Washington broke is leg in 2002 and was here in 2003 a year later at age 35.  No one was saying squat about him going to get hurt.

    Leave it to you to blame the bad luck of an injury and to put it at the feet of BB.



    Listen...listen, we all know you have a vitamin D deficiency (lack of milk at birth), but do you really need to showcase that daily by proving your football stupidity?

    You're going to blame the fact that we haven't won a Super Bowl in ten years on Brady? Lmao! And then you're going to call our free agent signings brilliant when next year we are tight up against the cap, despite the fact that 30 of the last 34 guys we signed during free agency over the last four years didn't come close to working out?! For the love of god! We wasted four million on Schiancoe and Fells alone. We spent 8 million on a reject from the Jets (Ellis). And another 7 million on Ocho Cinco. Brady had nothing to do with any of this - in fact any other GM in the league would of been fired for as much.

    We spent our money on the wrong guys...over and over and over again. We are not winning because of this, it's because of Brady.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to mthurl's comment:


    Listen...listen, we all know you have a vitamin D deficiency (lack of milk at birth), but do you really need to showcase that daily by proving your football stupidity?

    You're going to blame the fact that we haven't won a Super Bowl in ten years on Brady? Lmao! And then you're going to call our free agent signings brilliant when next year we are tight up against the cap, despite the fact that 30 of the last 34 guys we signed during free agency over the last four years didn't come close to working out?! For the love of god! We wasted four million on Schiancoe and Fells alone. We spent 8 million on a reject from the Jets (Ellis). And another 7 million on Ocho Cinco. Brady had nothing to do with any of this - in fact any other GM in the league would of been fired for as much.

    We spent our money on the wrong guys...over and over and over again. We are not winning because of this, it's because of Brady.

     



    Plus, I'm pretty sure that Arrington, Connolly BJGE, Wendell....weren't signed as free agents....lol

     

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    There are pretty good odds that you get cut before your multi-year deal is done in New England.  You may even get cut before your one year deal is done.



    Just out of curiosity what is the percentage of players being cut before their deal is done? How does it compare to other teams? Who are the players getting cut? Seems like a pretty broad statement without actual data.




    Feel free to do the work to disprove it.  I won't stop you.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

    Let me get this straight:

    Tommy Kelly and Adrian Wilson were on the first possible flights to FOxborough in the spring and Carter was on a red eye from California where he had told the public it "was either retirement or playing for BB only".

    I can see why Anonymis has me on ignore. He doesn't like to be shown to be a moron by far more intelligent people.

     



    I think no other team in football was offering Wilson a contract.

    in hind sight, regardless of the injury, Kelly IMO left money on the table to join the Pats. I believe teams would have paid more than he signed for here



    You just said no one else was offering Reed a contract.  That's not the focus of this thread.

    The focus of this thread is "do vets still want to play for BB?"

    Answer: YES

     



    Too many vets have come here and then quickly were shown the door, rightfully so. For every Carter, there are 5 busts. If I am a vet, knowing BB, I would look elsewhere.

    that is not a knock on BB. He usually makes the correct decision with cutting vets. The decision up for debate, is why bring them here in the first place?  



    They were shown the door, moron, because someone else was better for the TEAM.  Who cares who makes the team as long as the better player for the team was chosen?

    Your ratio is way off, too. For every veteran who isn't hungry anymore, there was 1 or 2 UDFAs who simply wanted it more and proved to be the better player.

    You two (Mt Hurl) are so stupid when it comes to this. The reason why BB didn't spend a lot in 2008, 2009 or 2010 was because of the lockout and who he had to pay in 2010 all at once (Brady, Mankins, Wilfork).

    So, that meant doing a lot of mid/low level signings to see what would work.  Every year BB brings in camp vets for comeptition and to see if they can help the team. This is EXPLAINED to the veteran before they sign. They all know the score.

    How many times have we heard vets say something to the effect of "I signed here because Bill was clear what he wanted and what he wanted from me"....?

    A dozen times in the last decade with these older players?  You and Mt HUrl act personally offended because Guard Joe Panos decided to retire in 2001 or Gallery in 2012.  Who cares?  If the position goes unfilled and sucks, then fine, but that is not what happens.

     




    http://overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Patriots&Year=2013

    Do you really mean that? All Pats' fans should care when free agents are brought in who cannot help the team because of eroding skills, pre - existing injuries, lack of fit in the Pats' system, etc.

    The Patriots have almost 9 million dollars of dead money on their 2013 cap allotted for Brandon Lloyd, J. Fanene, Ochocinco and Adrian Wilson.

    This prevents the team from improving its talent base in the off season or extending current players during the season (McCourty for example at this time).

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    There are pretty good odds that you get cut before your multi-year deal is done in New England.  You may even get cut before your one year deal is done.



    Just out of curiosity what is the percentage of players being cut before their deal is done? How does it compare to other teams? Who are the players getting cut? Seems like a pretty broad statement without actual data.




    Feel free to do the work to disprove it.  I won't stop you.



    You made the claim. I asked the question if you had data to support your claim... You do have data to back up your claim... No?

    Also to be fair what is the time frame being discussed? I am assuming the we are talking about the entire BB tenure as GM or are we cherry picking the time frame to support ones arguement?

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to m. a. pat's comment:

    Who cares?  If the position goes unfilled and sucks, then fine, but that is not what happens.

     




    http://overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Patriots&Year=2013

    Do you really mean that? All Pats' fans should care when free agents are brought in who cannot help the team because of eroding skills, pre - existing injuries, lack of fit in the Pats' system, etc.

    The Patriots have almost 9 million dollars of dead money on their 2013 cap allotted for Brandon Lloyd, J. Fanene, Ochocinco and Adrian Wilson.

    This prevents the team from improving its talent base in the off season or extending current players during the season (McCourty for example at this time).



    yer referring to someone who obviously knows nothing about football...and makes shyt up all the time.......will fall on deaf ears....lol

 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Uncle Rico. Show Uncle Rico's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

     

    The focus of this thread is "do vets still want to play for BB?"

    Answer: YES

     



    John Abraham says otherwise.

    You can't throw a blanket statement out there like that.  Some do want to play for Belichick, some couldn't care less.  End of story.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Uncle Rico's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

     

    The focus of this thread is "do vets still want to play for BB?"

    Answer: YES

     



    John Abraham says otherwise.

    You can't throw a blanket statement out there like that.  Some do want to play for Belichick, some couldn't care less.  End of story.



    Some where in the sky Richard Seymour is LHFAO

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    If the underlying premise is:

    Because Ed Reed did not sign with the Pats, BB and the Pats are no longer considered a desireable destination for vet FAs.

    Then my response to that premise is:

    No disrespect intended but I think the premise is flawed as a generalization from the particular.

    I think Reed wanted $$ and a role as a starter.  I don't either of those would have been in the offing in Foxboro. 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    If the underlying premise is:

    Because Ed Reed did not sign with the Pats, BB and the Pats are no longer considered a desireable destination for vet FAs.

    Then my response to that premise is:

    No disrespect intended but I think the premise is flawed as a generalization from the particular.

    I think Reed wanted $$ and a role as a starter.  I don't either of those would have been in the offing in Foxboro. 



    That was not my premise...my premise is that vets are realizing that regardless of wanting to play for the pats and BB, regardless of contract signed, if they do not come in and perform, they are gone, often times not even making it thru summer camp. 

    While this is a good thing for the team on the field, the dead money incurred, also hurts the team.

    it seems pretty clear after this off season and kicking the tires, that many vets are wishing up to this, and are not coming without a guarantee 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    rkarp, I was more referring to the OP's underlying premise.  I understood your point and, in general, don't disagree.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    Why are you following me around and hanging on my every word Mr Jealousy? 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    If the underlying premise is:

    Because Ed Reed did not sign with the Pats, BB and the Pats are no longer considered a desireable destination for vet FAs.

    Then my response to that premise is:

    No disrespect intended but I think the premise is flawed as a generalization from the particular.

    I think Reed wanted $$ and a role as a starter.  I don't either of those would have been in the offing in Foxboro. 



    ATJ - the op actually has less to do with any kind of cause-effect relationship between Ed Reed and the Patriots' ability to attract quality veterans.

    First of all, I start threads just to talk about things. Otherwise, a good part of what is posted in this forum is people trading personal insults.

    I would say that around 2001-2004 - the Patriots probably was a highly desirable team to  play for.  Two factors would have been winning 3 SBs and playing for BB. IMO, players gauge teams probably better than fans - so, maybe they see the Patriots as NOT being the best chance to win a SB (if they haven't already won one).  In addition, maybe they don't want to play for BB because he's not a "player's coach" or because their experience/style of play doesn't fit into BBs schemes.  Players certainly may know they have to produce to stay on the Patriot team - but I'm sure there are players who are desparate to play for anyone (because there are no other offers on the table) - and will play for BB/Patriots because of money - even if it's less than market value.

    Things change.  The fact is, the Patriots haven't won a SB since 2004.  The fact is, you have to be a pretty special player to actually succeed in BBs system; especially the skill positions.  The fact is, more free agents have failed than succeeded - and at time, has set back/delayed progress in areas of weakness. 

    In addition, there are many other factors why free agents wouldn't want to play here - such as  money, geographical location, and a plethora of non-football related reasons.

    Anyway, disagree or agree, makes no matter - just something to discuss with having to resort to insults (and of course, I'm not talking about you).

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to anonymis' comment:

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    If the underlying premise is:

    Because Ed Reed did not sign with the Pats, BB and the Pats are no longer considered a desireable destination for vet FAs.

    Then my response to that premise is:

    No disrespect intended but I think the premise is flawed as a generalization from the particular.

    I think Reed wanted $$ and a role as a starter.  I don't either of those would have been in the offing in Foxboro. 



    ATJ - the op actually has less to do with any kind of cause-effect relationship between Ed Reed and the Patriots' ability to attract quality veterans.

    First of all, I start threads just to talk about things. Otherwise, a good part of what is posted in this forum is people trading personal insults.

    I would say that around 2001-2004 - the Patriots probably was a highly desirable team to  play for.  Two factors would have been winning 3 SBs and playing for BB. IMO, players gauge teams probably better than fans - so, maybe they see the Patriots as NOT being the best chance to win a SB (if they haven't already won one).  In addition, maybe they don't want to play for BB because he's not a "player's coach" or because their experience/style of play doesn't fit into BBs schemes.  Players certainly may know they have to produce to stay on the Patriot team - but I'm sure there are players who are desparate to play for anyone (because there are no other offers on the table) - and will play for BB/Patriots because of money - even if it's less than market value.

    Things change.  The fact is, the Patriots haven't won a SB since 2004.  The fact is, you have to be a pretty special player to actually succeed in BBs system; especially the skill positions.  The fact is, more free agents have failed than succeeded - and at time, has set back/delayed progress in areas of weakness. 

    In addition, there are many other factors why free agents wouldn't want to play here - such as  money, geographical location, and a plethora of non-football related reasons.

    Anyway, disagree or agree, makes no matter - just something to discuss with having to resort to insults (and of course, I'm not talking about you).



    Clearly I either misread or misunderstood your original post.  What you've outlined above, when applied to the Pats in recent years, has merit although I may disagree with certain elements of it.  I think BB attracts the kind of players he wishes to attract although it's not always possible to sign all those he wishes to.  Kelly is one example, Gregory is another.  Some may disagree with the signing but that's what being a fan is all about. 

    It's undeniable that the Pats haven't won a Lombardi since 2004 but they have reached the big game twice in the last five years.  Although coming close doesn't really amount for much they've been competitive in both of those games.

    And, yes, the incessant school yard bickering does cloud a true discussion of the topic at hand.

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    Clearly I either misread or misunderstood your original post.  What you've outlined above, when applied to the Pats in recent years, has merit although I may disagree with certain elements of it.  I think BB attracts the kind of players he wishes to attract although it's not always possible to sign all those he wishes to.  Kelly is one example, Gregory is another.  Some may disagree with the signing but that's what being a fan is all about. 

    It's undeniable that the Pats haven't won a Lombardi since 2004 but they have reached the big game twice in the last five years.  Although coming close doesn't really amount for much they've been competitive in both of those games.

    And, yes, the incessant school yard bickering does cloud a true discussion of the topic at hand.

     



    No, you didn't misread anything.  My original post was pretty vague - and discussions in this forum can lead anywhere Laughing

    Kelly's signing was good, I didn't care for Gregory (he doesn't stand out to me as being a playmaker - altho he does do his job okay). Wilson - who was supposed to have a signficant impact (like Haynesworth was supposed be an impact player) - was a fail.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    Not going to quote the above in the interests of posting economy (whatever the he11 that is).  I can see why you'd call Wilson a fail but I don't consider him that quite yet.  If he can't produce next year then, yes, he's a fail.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Have Patriots Lost Luster for Veterans?

    In response to Uncle Rico's comment:

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:

     

    The focus of this thread is "do vets still want to play for BB?"

    Answer: YES

     



    John Abraham says otherwise.

    You can't throw a blanket statement out there like that.  Some do want to play for Belichick, some couldn't care less.  End of story.



    John Abraham...forgot about that one...that guy has 6 sacks in 9 games this season. What did he get in Arizona for money? He would of looked good opposite Chandler, or rushing somewhere on third downs.

     
  • Sections
    Shortcuts

    Share