How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Take away Welker and Moss (because they are excellent).  How have the pats done with their free agent pick ups over the decade?  How much do you believe they have helped the pats?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from GrantW. Show GrantW's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Hmm this one is easy enough:

    Vrabel, Harrison, Colvin, Antowain Smith, Phifer, Andruzzi, Izzo, Hamilton, Patten.....All instrumental in SB wins.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rocky. Show Rocky's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Grant- You beat me to it!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Thanks.  I was curious.  And the names are significant.  Are all of these Belichick pick ups?

    And what are your thoughts on the FA's since your last superbowl. 

    I guess the point of my question is that Belichick's methods do not seem to be working as well as they did earlier in the decade.  It seems that a number of the player pick ups are very old (almost too late to contribute old).  Obviously this is not entirely the case, but there does seem to be a pattern.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brad34. Show Brad34's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    In Response to Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups:
    [QUOTE]Thanks.  I was curious.  And the names are significant.  Are all of these Belichick pick ups? And what are your thoughts on the FA's since your last superbowl.  I guess the point of my question is that Belichick's methods do not seem to be working as well as they did earlier in the decade.  It seems that a number of the player pick ups are very old (almost too late to contribute old).  Obviously this is not entirely the case, but there does seem to be a pattern.
    Posted by underdogg[/QUOTE]

    I would have to agree with that unfortunately. This year especially they have been rubbish. Burgess who is really replacing Vrabel and Seymour has been invisible,Taylor has broken down already and  Galloway is a complete joke. Bodden and Springs get a pass mark only because they are a slight upgrade on the absolute bargain basement rubbish secondary the Pats have had since Law and Harrison were paired together. Early days though I suppose there is time to turn it around but it isn't looking good.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    I think Bodden has done very well and is a keeper.  I didn't think that Springs would be doing as well as he's doing.  I thought he was pretty much washed up.  

    Welker and Moss were not FAs.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    My apologies, I did mean FA's and trades.  Belichick frequently uses picks as a part of his trade strategy. 

    It just seems that the personnel magic that was there early in the decade is not there any longer.  Its still good, its just not great. 

    On the other hand, the pats of the early decade were stacked with players.  there weren't a whole lot of adjustments made maybe a pick up here or there.  but in recent years, there seems to be more and more pick ups and less player development through the draft. 

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    I have to disagree.  What you see is the sad drafting that was done after Parcells left.  Zero.  The SBs had Law, Bruschi, McGiness and the like which were Parcell picks.  After Parcells left there was a five or six year gap in which the Pats had nothing to show for their drafts.  It was the worst.  When you have a big gap like that it takes a while to get things back on track.  This thing is still a work in progress.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from JBonesky. Show JBonesky's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Vince Wilfork, Ty Warren, Daniel Graham, Deion Branch, Jarvis Green, Asante Samuel, Tully Banta-Cain, Ben Watson, Matt Cassel, Gostkowski, Merriwether and Mayo oh and the majority of our offensive line.  Explain to me when it was that this whole "gap" in the draft thing went down.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from JBonesky. Show JBonesky's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    I might have forgotten Richard Seymour and Tom Brady.  Those guys were alright.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from gfkr2. Show gfkr2's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Maroney and Chad Jackson, both were Busts.   I wouldn't give a high grade to Ben Watson either.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from unclealfie. Show unclealfie's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    In Response to How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups:
    [QUOTE]Take away Welker and Moss (because they are excellent).  How have the pats done with their free agent pick ups over the decade?  How much do you believe they have helped the pats?
    Posted by underdogg[/QUOTE]

    I know underdogg is always inventing new ways to criticise the pats and puff up colts accomplishments but, here's a news bulletin, No-one hits a home run with FA pickups every time at bat.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tnutts. Show Tnutts's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Light, Mankins, Koppen, Neal, Kazur, Morris, Guyton, Pyror to name a few. Man I wish BB knew what he was doing drafting players.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from MVPKilla2009. Show MVPKilla2009's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Your question was how good have the pick up's in FA been over the last decade. That was a mistake, Underdogg did this in an attempt to make the Pats look bad which had he said the free agents since the last super bowl but saying over the last decade is a bad move because early in this decade NO ONE was better then the Pats at picking up free agents. Over the decade lets look at it this way, teh Pats won 3 super bowls and played in 4 so I would say their team building scheme seems to be working a h ell of a lot better then whatever FA plan you have going on in Indy. I dont feel like listing the countless great FA pick up's but clearly we have done a good job over the last decade.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Alf and Tas -

    I agree that no one is 100%.  Polian said 60% hits in the draft was very good.  And I am really not trying to bash here.  I was curious what the general thoughts about this were. 

    It just appears that over the past few years there have been more misses than hits.  As for Indy's FA plan, I think the Lions, Raiders, Rams all have better FA plans than the colts.  I won't get into details, but other than Vinateri, it has not been great.  They did pick up Stokely and that lasted a couple of years, and McFarland for 1 1/2 yrs, but otherwise, nada. 
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimKe. Show JimKe's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    In Response to Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups:
    [QUOTE]Hmm this one is easy enough: Vrabel, Harrison, Colvin, Antowain Smith, Phifer, Andruzzi, Izzo, Hamilton, Patten.....All instrumental in SB wins.
    Posted by GrantW[/QUOTE]
    Also, all ancient history.  Except for Moss and Welker, recent pickups not
    so hot.  Except for 2009 draft, recent drafts also suspect.  May be the
    reason for no more Superbowl trophies.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Last time I checked the Pats traded to get Welker and Moss; they were not FA pick-ups. FAs are the similar to the draft: some work out, some don't. If, for example, you expected AD to turn into Demarcus Ware or Peppers after the Pats acquired him, you were mistaken. AD has played well, but not surpassed expectations. As GrantW reveals there have been some very good free agent signings and you won't see every FA signing become the best signing ever..it's just not possible with a cap.....For me it is all about BB arquiring players whpofit the system and perform well.....it's unrealistic to think that will happen with every player FA or Draft.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from MVPKilla2009. Show MVPKilla2009's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    You stack up all BBs FA picks i am sure he has far more hits then misses.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    In Response to Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups:
    [QUOTE]I have to disagree.  What you see is the sad drafting that was done after Parcells left.  Zero.  The SBs had Law, Bruschi, McGiness and the like which were Parcell picks.  After Parcells left there was a five or six year gap in which the Pats had nothing to show for their drafts.  It was the worst.  When you have a big gap like that it takes a while to get things back on track.  This thing is still a work in progress.
    Posted by garytx[/QUOTE]

    Not sure which gap you are refering to is it the gap where BB and Pioli drafted

    Richard Seymour, Ty Warren, Vince Wilfork, Asante Samuel, Jarvus Green, Deon Branch, David Givens, Eugene Wilson, Ellis Hobbs, Logan Mankins, Dan Koppen, Russ Hochstien Daniel Grahambo and Ben Watson? Probably missing a few but they were all key contributors to Super Bowl Championships. 

    Is this the gap where we have not drafted well???????????????

    Great Post garytx!
    Great Thread underwear!
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    All this and we have a number of our players hitting free agency and 4 of the first 64 picks in 2010 draft...next off-season will be one of the interesting ever...
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MVPKilla2009. Show MVPKilla2009's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    You forgot about Matt Light, Matt Cassel,Brandon Merriweather, J. Mayo, Nick Kazcur,  and The Ghost (our kicker)

    Oh and we didnt draft Russ Hotchstien he was drafted by Tampa Bay and we signed him when they cut him.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from JustaFan5. Show JustaFan5's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    I guess that the original question was misleading because of the inclusion on Moss, who we traded for, and was not a FA. Welker was, and as stated it was a fantastic pick up. I think if you go into the draft you will find the big names pointed out by many of the posts, but there are some big misses, but which team in the NFL doesn't miss, the answer being none.

    As for free agents I think that you have to start by looking at this team, this year and then work backwards. Defensively this year they added Boddens, Springs, Cuircu, Banta-Cain, and #50 (however you spell his name). Three of those guys are starters, and I think that McGowan has been the teams most consistant defensive player to date. He took a position from a guy that the world thought was the next coming of the great safety, and he is a very good player. Witht that said what does that say about McGowan's ability? I think that Boddens is returning to form, and should not be judged on Sunday's performance, because he was just playing what was called. Springs has contributed, and played well at times, but is older. As for #50, Ninkovich, is a player and is starting to show signs of a Purdue pass rusher, like a Shawn Phillips in San Diego, Ray Edwards in Minnesota, or an Anthony Spencer in Dallas. I hope that he does take a spot at outside backer just to see what he can do. With Banta-Cain he seems to be getting back in stride, and making plays like he once could.

    When looking at free agents I think that is how you have to look at them, and I did not address the offense, with Galloway being a bust because he simply can't grasp the offense, but Baker is a player, and I think Taylor was going to contribute solid numbers at running back giving the team a much needed dimension. But I think with the free agents that they brought in this year I think that they were very successful, and that is without mentioning Aikens, Cuircu, McGowan, and Ninkovich's contributions on special teams.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from MVPKilla2009. Show MVPKilla2009's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Yea McGowen has been a find no doubt about it.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    Every team has hits and misses thru free agency, the draft and trades. The fact that the Pats have 3 Superbowls and win double digit games every season speaks for itself. The only other teams that have been close to them over the last decade are the Steelers and Colts but they don't have 3 rings. Nuff Said
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheFantasyBaron. Show TheFantasyBaron's posts

    Re: How about an honest assessment of the pats free agent pick ups

    The Pats can't predict the future. They look at last year's team and try to build where they think they need help through the draft. Watson was an excellent pick up at the time. BB figured they needed a big tough receiver to go up against the likes of Ty Law and other physical DBs. Meanwhile teams who couldn't compete with physical defensive play made sure the rules were changed to allow slight, finesse receivers to be allowed to catch the ball. All of a sudden Watson's value isn't as high; they should have just drafted a tall fast receiver with good hands since he wouldn't have to fight for the ball. Enter Chad Jackson. So then they wise up and get the fast slight receiver and the guy gets hurt.  Two years receving drafting gone. All because the rules were changed to allow less physical teams and wimpy receivers to get open. Forget about the last fifty years of football, change the rules now and allow offenses to get the advantage. Now that the finesse teams have their way flags are thrown on almost every play and the game has been reduced to simon says.  And I don't want to hear about the Brady Rule either. If receivers could be touched then defenses wouldn't concentrate on teeing off on the QB; there would be more honorable manly ways to win.

    Underdogg, I guess Colts ownership and management kind of ruined the game, changing the rules to benefit themselves and hurt the Pats who were undefeatable and just changed the way football is played overnight ignoring the last 50 years in order to become competitive.  The Colts were given a division to win in, the rule changes necessary to compete and the advantage of drafting players based on knowing the new two-hand touch style of offense/defense. Had the Pats known what Bill Polian knew five years ago they wouldn't have drafted anyone over 150 pounds in the secondary and changed their style of defense from physical to ultimate frisbee. I blame the Colts for Pats draft picks not working out. Heckk I blame the Colts for the wussification of the NFL overall. If you want to start a bi-partisan petition to get some manliness back in football I'm with you; until then lets not throw stones. Let's face it, minus rules changes the Colts are just another good team like the Jests remembering the good ole last SB in the 1960's.

     
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