How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from csylvia79. Show csylvia79's posts

    How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    Before I start , I would really like this to be a constructive thread that stays on topic so I'll just say it... Yes Brady has to play better in the playoffs if the team wants to win a superbowl!  Now that it has been said can we get some ideas about players and ways to improve all parts of the team.

     

          One thing I've been thinking more and more about is one area of the team that may be over rated and in need improvment is the O-line. I know people are going to think I'm crasy but it seems that against the better d-line the Pats current crew gets man handled.

          How much is Brady's ability to get the ball out quickly masks this groups inability to open holes in tough yardage situations or maintain the pocket on 100% passing downs.  The teams that give them the most trouble are those who can get push up the middle.  Is this flaw fixable with a new center or guard? Is it playcalling? Such as the use of no huddle tiring out this crew in  the second half and late in games.  Are the running backs not patient enough to let holes or cut back lanes develop?  What do you guys think.  I know there are pleanty of areas that can use improvement.  I just wanted to see what you guys think can improve the O-line.

         

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    Jake Long.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    A year more experience for Wendell and Solder and perhaps an upgrade at right guard.  If Vollmer moves on then RT may be an issue.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    In response to csylvia79's comment:

     

    Before I start , I would really like this to be a constructive thread that stays on topic so I'll just say it... Yes Brady has to play better in the playoffs if the team wants to win a superbowl!  Now that it has been said can we get some ideas about players and ways to improve all parts of the team.

     

          One thing I've been thinking more and more about is one area of the team that may be over rated and in need improvment is the O-line. I know people are going to think I'm crasy but it seems that against the better d-line the Pats current crew gets man handled.

          How much is Brady's ability to get the ball out quickly masks this groups inability to open holes in tough yardage situations or maintain the pocket on 100% passing downs.  The teams that give them the most trouble are those who can get push up the middle.  Is this flaw fixable with a new center or guard? Is it playcalling? Such as the use of no huddle tiring out this crew in  the second half and late in games.  Are the running backs not patient enough to let holes or cut back lanes develop?  What do you guys think.  I know there are pleanty of areas that can use improvement.  I just wanted to see what you guys think can improve the O-line.

         

     



    been writing about this all last season.

     

    aint good enough to beat tough des. consider for example amount of time flacco acn sit back in comfort to brady's typical 3 secs. dito run game, very spotty getting beat by their  man.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    1. Stay healthy. Injuries to Mankins and Vollmer have hurt.

    2. Solder needs to keep developing. He's good, but hasn't yet fully developed to his potential.

    3. We need to either re-sign Vollmer or pick up another very good right tackle. Weakness at RT was a chronic problem for the Pats until Vollmer took over.  We don't want to slide backwards at that position.

    4. Upgrading center or right guard would be nice, but not sure we can do that this year given other needs.

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    I'm mostly going to echo everyone else

    T's - Another year for Solder and Cannon (Cannon played well in a sub role), resign Vollmer who's one of the best RT's in the game.

    G's - a healthy Mankins and resign Thomas who playing at a high level spelling Mankins and Connolly. Also try to find a replacement at RG if possible

    C - I really liked Wendell. He reminded me of Koppen after he took over Woody. A bit shaky at times but lots of promise. I think we could see a step up in his game with a year under his belt

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    King Dunlap. draft/sign a big Center to beat the inside passrush.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    In response to Godvernment's comment:

    1. Re-sign Vollmer

    2. Cut Dan Connolly

    3. Re-sign Donald Thomas




    why would you cut dan connolly?  why just not get someone to make him a great backup.  You can't deny that he filled in pretty well for mankins and koppen.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    In response to natesubs' comment:

    In response to Godvernment's comment:

     

    1. Re-sign Vollmer

    2. Cut Dan Connolly

    3. Re-sign Donald Thomas

    why would you cut dan connolly?  why just not get someone to make him a great backup.  You can't deny that he filled in pretty well for mankins and koppen.

     

    I think Thomas might actually be the answer - moved to RG - keep Connolly and let he and Wendell compete for the starting center/back-up interior line position.

    The other current possibility is with Cannon/Zusevics - Zusevics was pretty highly rated until he blew out a chest muscle at the combine. If he is good enough, make him the back-up RT and shift Cannon inside - if he isn't good enough at Tackle shift him inside and see what he can do?

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    they need more size at C. Wendell needs to be a back up swing man between C and G spots. Connolly is good on the move, sweeps, screen passes, but does not have the footwork to thrive in a game played in close in the trenches. Healthy Mankins, Solder and Vollmer are pro bowl or close to it.

    Might be interested in Connolly back at C, with Cannon starting at G. Wendell is the C G swingman, and Thomas is signing a big contract elsewhere.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TitleTown11. Show TitleTown11's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    1) Keep Dante Scarnecchia

    2) Resign Vollmer, Thomas

    3) Draft more depth 

     

    O-Line is a strength of this team. Although I'm sure Brady's quick release and receivers short routes may overrate them some, lets not forget about the improved running attack from last year. Not many offensive line groups are capable of leading top 5 passing and rushing attacks.

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    they need more size at C. Wendell needs to be a back up swing man between C and G spots. Connolly is good on the move, sweeps, screen passes, but does not have the footwork to thrive in a game played in close in the trenches. Healthy Mankins, Solder and Vollmer are pro bowl or close to it.

    Might be interested in Connolly back at C, with Cannon starting at G. Wendell is the C G swingman, and Thomas is signing a big contract elsewhere.



    Wendell is 6'2" 300lbs which is about average for most C's (height to weight ratio wise). How much bigger do you want? There are plenty of bigger C's out there that won't be able to function in the Pats zone blocking scheme because they don't have the speed or agility to function properly. Don't forget the Pats run a zone blocking scheme so the C needs to be quick and agile  

     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    I thought the line held up reasonably well last year - I think it helps when you have a quarterback that gets rid of the ball as quickly as ours too. It can't be understated just how much a quarterback can help his line, when you see a quarterback step up into the pocket to avoid a outside rusher it helps out your tackles...when you have a QB that can get rid of the football in a split second on a quick slant or screen...it helps your guards and center. A QB that can play action pass well will reduce a rush too. To me these are all the things that Brady does very very well - it's also the things that Bledsoe couldn't do to save his life and he made three offensive lines look putrid in the process (ours, Buffalo's and Dallas's). I wonder how a guy like Mallett would do behind our line? Because to me he looks/reminds me of Bledsoe a little bit.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    Wendell has transformed himself from a borderline C to maybe top 15-20 C's in the league. 

    An arguement can be made that they are in shotgun so often because they do not run the ball well.

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

     

    In response to rkarp's comment:

     

    they need more size at C. Wendell needs to be a back up swing man between C and G spots. Connolly is good on the move, sweeps, screen passes, but does not have the footwork to thrive in a game played in close in the trenches. Healthy Mankins, Solder and Vollmer are pro bowl or close to it.

    Might be interested in Connolly back at C, with Cannon starting at G. Wendell is the C G swingman, and Thomas is signing a big contract elsewhere.

     



    Wendell is 6'2" 300lbs which is about average for most C's (height to weight ratio wise). How much bigger do you want? There are plenty of bigger C's out there that won't be able to function in the Pats zone blocking scheme because they don't have the speed or agility to function properly. Don't forget the Pats run a zone blocking scheme so the C needs to be quick and agile  

     

     



    RKarp is wrong as usual.  Wendell has improved dramatically and is very consistent.   I give the coaches and Wendell himself a lot of credit. At best, I felt he was a backup or on the verge of being cut. 

     



    I wouldn't say that, I don't blame him for wanting a bigger C. All you see is larger C's going in the 1st but even the Pouncey brothers are smaller (both under 305 but 2-3" taller). But, in the end certain bodies fit certain schemes and zone blocking usually prefers smaller more athletic C's that can get out and swing around like Saturday (6'2 295) or Koppen (6'2" 300) or Wendell (6'2" 300)

     

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    1. Keep Vollmer or sign Jake Long (move solder to RT), Solder at RT lets us have a 6 man front at times, Solder in as eligible TE, and puts Cannon at RT (more reps for him) making for a scary goal line/short yardaage group. 

    2. Re-sign Donald Thomas to backup Mankins and be in the mix to start at RG

    3. Play Connolly or Wendell at C all year, let them fight it out, or restructure DC to backup cash and draft a G/C in round 2 (Barrett Jones or Travis Frederick), have 3 guys fighting to play C and 3 guys fighting to play RG

    4. If you are going to keep paying Connolly (at C) and not draft a C/G, then Restructure Mankins contract so you can sign Andy LeVitre of the Bills

    So you end up with one of Long/Vollmer and one of LeVitre/Frederick/Jones while saving cash by restructuring one of Mankins/Connolly's deals and keeping Thomas.

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    Bottom line, this team will not be a good running team with Brady under C or in shotgun with the current Oline. They will continue to put up prolific passing numbers and beat up on bad teams, falling flat against physical teams with superior DLine play. 

    To get over the hump, this team needs to run more effectively on 3rd down and in the red zone. This will not be accomplished without a more physical C. 

    To say the Pats had Koppen is not the correct answer, because the Pats had the same offense and running issues with him at C

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from NOISE. Show NOISE's posts

    Re: How does the Pats o-line get better next season?

    In response to TitleTown11's comment:

     

    1) Keep Dante Scarnecchia

    2) Resign Vollmer, Thomas

    3) Draft more depth 

     

    O-Line is a strength of this team. Although I'm sure Brady's quick release and receivers short routes may overrate them some, lets not forget about the improved running attack from last year. Not many offensive line groups are capable of leading top 5 passing and rushing attacks.

     



    #1.  Here, is right on!  Dante!  Best O line coach in league.  he coaches players up!  Only assistant that coaches guys up!   We miss this in other positions....

     

    #2. Resign vollmer , agree here.

     

    then run the ball more!  

     
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