how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

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    how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    ?
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    better, still a work in progress.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    O-line -  better
    WR's - better
    TE's - slightly better (miss Alge as a 3rd TE)
    QB - same
    RB's - same (better if Faulk/Woodhead get healthy)
    punter - same
    kicker - better (Gosk hurt last year)

    D-line - better
    LB's - slightly worse (TBC/Cunn were ok 3-4 OLB's, Mayo hurt this year)
    CB's - even (better if McCourty just played 80% like '10)
    S's - worse

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmmyslinski. Show jmmyslinski's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    1) The secondary continues to have issues.  It seems there has been a shift in coverage, and McCourty is now on his own island.  I think it was too soon to make that change.  Arrington seems to be benefiting from the change, able to move on the ball for INT's.  Without a safety behind him, McCourty has shown his lack of experience, resulting in several big plays against him this year, and several TD's.  At times he seems indecisive.  There is no doubt about his ability, but a veteran CB would have been a nice move before the trade deadline.

    2) The pass rush is as good as the chances they take.  Without better edge rushers, the Patriots have not been able to get to the passer without blitzing on 3rd down.  I think this will happen a lot more after watching the end of the Dallas game.  Haynesworth and Wilfork will be a force as the year progresses, making it difficult for O-lines to hold pockets for QB's.

    3) Offensively, the Patriots have as dynamic group of players as there is in the NFL.  The offensive line has done well against some decent pass rushers this year, we'll have to see how they do against the Steelers multiple blitzes.   It should help that the Patriots have the ability to disguise their intentions with their tight end sets, which helped them a lot last year, after Moss was dismissed.  It is important that there is a constant effort ot establish the run, for Brady to be effective without a deep threat reciever.  If Taylor Price can find his way onto the field (bench 85) then maybe we can see some of the big play ability he showed in the preseason.

    4) Special Teams coverage and returns this year have been awful, given the fact that teams are shortkicking to our recievers, then carrying the ball out of the endzone when returning kickoffs, it is obvious this is a weak area.

    Overall... last year the Patriots were 14-2, then blew it against a Jets team that refused to blitz, but killed us in zone coverages, on our own field.  That won't happen this year.  I think this team is developing a tougher identity.  They won't be pushed around in the playoffs.  They seem to be getting on the same page.  It took some poor play calling by the Cowboys, to get to 5-1, but they fought hard to win that game.
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    It is still early, but it looks about the same.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from kevin13130. Show kevin13130's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    I would say the offense is better: better O-Line, better run game, better contributions from two TE, and an Ochocinco to distract coverage.

    Hard to tell about the defense. Better D-Line and better corners, but worse play from those corners and worse safeties.

    Overall, though, looks like a better team than it was week 8 last year.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Gulo. Show Gulo's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    honestly, worse on both parts.  but more flexible, so its much harder to match up against us this season
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    Physical and talent wise a little better (defense) . Mentally much better.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from murghkhor. Show murghkhor's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years:
    O-line -  better WR's - better TE's - slightly better (miss Alge as a 3rd TE) QB - same RB's - same (better if Faulk/Woodhead get healthy) punter - same kicker - better (Gosk hurt last year) D-line - better LB's - slightly worse (TBC/Cunn were ok 3-4 OLB's, Mayo hurt this year) CB's - even (better if McCourty just played 80% like '10) S's - worse
    Posted by rameakap

    I disagree.

    O-line -  even - lost Koppen and Neal (who was underrated) and gained Waters and Solder. 
    WR's - even - last year passing game was branch, welker and 2 TE. Same this year. 
    TE's - worse - miss Alge as a 3rd TE, Gronk2 isn't as good 
    QB - even 
    RB's - better - Ridley/Vereen are better than Aiken/Faulk. Woodhead is still around if we need him (probably won't after this year) 
    punter - even 
    kicker - better 
    D-line - even - Lost Wright/Pryor, Gained Haynesworth/Carter and switch to 4-3 is taking time to settle 
    LB's - even - Fletcher/Ninkovich are journeymen same as TBC was. Don't expect much. Spikes could elevate play, lets see. Mayo hurt but should be back 
    CB's - worse - DMC has regressed in new man coverage scheme. Bodden's play has regressed the most and is sloppy. Arrington is just-a-guy same as jonathon wilhite was last year. The new addition of Ras-I never materialized as he's injured. 
    S's - worse - Ihedigbo ? really. Brown? really. I don't care how undisciplined Merriweather was, or old Sanders was, they were not worse than these guys. We have the worst safeties in the NFL. Even McGowan was better than these jokers.

    Overall team - worse. Forget 14-2 and lets hope we win division.

     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    I think this team can run the ball more consistently, either because O'Brien realizes it's good for the O to establish its identity or because they have the personnel to do it. 

    I think the defense has had its growing pains, but there is enough youth, vets and depth for them to play better than they have.   

    I think this team is better than last year's team.  Maybe not at every position, but overall better.  I think they are a tougher team for sure, I like the edge that guys like Spikes, Chung and Carter are starting to bring to the D.  
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    Unless they win a playoff game they are the same as the last 3 teams as far as I'm concerned.
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years:
    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years : I disagree. O-line -  even - lost Koppen and Neal (who was underrated) and gained Waters and Solder.  WR's - even - last year passing game was branch, welker and 2 TE. Same this year.  TE's - worse - miss Alge as a 3rd TE, Gronk2 isn't as good  QB - even  RB's - better - Ridley/Vereen are better than Aiken/Faulk. Woodhead is still around if we need him (probably won't after this year)  punter - even  kicker - better  D-line - even - Lost Wright/Pryor, Gained Haynesworth/Carter and switch to 4-3 is taking time to settle  LB's - even - Fletcher/Ninkovich are journeymen same as TBC was. Don't expect much. Spikes could elevate play, lets see. Mayo hurt but should be back  CB's - worse - DMC has regressed in new man coverage scheme. Bodden's play has regressed the most and is sloppy. Arrington is just-a-guy same as jonathon wilhite was last year. The new addition of Ras-I never materialized as he's injured.  S's - worse - Ihedigbo ? really. Brown? really. I don't care how undisciplined Merriweather was, or old Sanders was, they were not worse than these guys. We have the worst safeties in the NFL. Even McGowan was better than these jokers. Overall team - worse. Forget 14-2 and lets hope we win division.
    Posted by murghkhor



    Interesting but flawed. Your running backs do not include the starter BJGE.  I assume that is due to your not seeing him as worth anything despite a thousand yard season last year and a 4.2 yards per carry average this year.


    Aiken was a wide out and was he even here last season?  The other backs last season were Morris and Taylor, both gone and not missed except possibly Morris' special teams play.

    I disagree with you about Fletcher, that guy is going to be good.  he has great instincts, which is why he's still here and TBC isn't.  IN fact TBC isn't playing anywhere.  You dismiss him because he went to Montana.

    I also disagree with you about Nink, the guy is a study in quiet efficiency playing the roles he is assigned to play, which is why they gave him the contract they gave him. 

    I see a strong bias on your part for players you consider better because they had some college pedigree coming into the league.  Many of the best players turn out to be guys who never went to big schools or were free agent walk ons after high school or weren't football players on college, like Stephen Neal who played Oline for us.  There are many others, like BJGE, whom I mentioned before.  I also note the anti-woodhead statement which must come from the same bias.  These people perform but you either dis them as in "Probably won't be here next year", or just leave them out entirely, as you did with Green Ellis.

     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Dessalines. Show Dessalines's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years:
    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years : You don't feel Ihedigbo has stabilized the back end? Chung raves about him and it's because of his intelligence.   I look at Safety like I look at the O Line. When it's quiet, that's a good sign. Since the Buffalo game, this secondary has greatly improved. I am not saying Ihedibgo is great, but with Brown being so raw, a little more experience has helped.  I don't see whiffed tackles  from Ihedigbo like we saw with Meriweather. Sanders was too pricey, so just get over that. As for Bodden? Regressed? Dinged up to start the year, sure, but how can a guy who had a knockout camp and missed all of last year "regress"? Who is the guy used strategically in the slot to shut down Bess, help with Keller and Witten, etc?  The midddle of the field is where our own Welker, Hernandez and Gronk SHRED teeams and you we allow basically nothing down the middle in the seams because of the work done by Chung and Bodden in that slot role, fromt a strategic point of view. Do you think it's a coincidence team's security blankets with slot WRs or All Pro TEs get shutdown in these games? The Pats D is very complex. Many players, some new, are still working out those kinsks, but you're blind as a bat if you don't like how the last 2 weeks played out on D. Haynesworth returned and played a bit more, which clearly has helped the 3rd down D, but this team's zone D is MILES ahead of 2008's. 2009s or 2010's. Miles ahead. BB was afraid to use zone in 2009 against good offenses. BB uses it now at a whim with great success. This didn't get better last year until late in the year. It was a huge reason why the 3rd down D last year was weak, same deal in 2009 or even 2008 for that matter with an aging D and an awful secondary. It's a huge deal this early in the season, especially with more players in the secondary able to play in each man (they aren't great here, but will be better with Bodden and Dowling back healthier) or the more lethal zone where BB is constantly lining people up in different spots, baiting QBs. I see more of a 2003 type defense here than I've seen since 2007.  The pass D was better in 2007, but we're also looking at a league where the offense was off to a historical start due to the lockout and ol' Rogie Goodell's obsession with selling his league overseas. You have to look at the whole picture. For the time in literally 5 years, BB has a load of quality youth, experience and versatility. The Bodden/Dowling issues have been around health, not quality.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing




    BTW, I agree with you about Ihedigbo.  In general, the guy has played solid if not inspired for us and solid is better than what we were getting previoulsy.
     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from FishTaco64. Show FishTaco64's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    The O-Line has to find a way to block those dominant D-Lines like the Lions or Giants. Those are the kind of teams they will see in the playoffs and there are very good chances that they will need to throw it often in those games.
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years:
    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years : I disagree. O-line -  even - lost Koppen and Neal (who was underrated) and gained Waters and Solder.  WR's - even - last year passing game was branch, welker and 2 TE. Same this year.  TE's - worse - miss Alge as a 3rd TE, Gronk2 isn't as good  QB - even  RB's - better - Ridley/Vereen are better than Aiken/Faulk. Woodhead is still around if we need him (probably won't after this year)  punter - even  kicker - better  D-line - even - Lost Wright/Pryor, Gained Haynesworth/Carter and switch to 4-3 is taking time to settle  LB's - even - Fletcher/Ninkovich are journeymen same as TBC was. Don't expect much. Spikes could elevate play, lets see. Mayo hurt but should be back  CB's - worse - DMC has regressed in new man coverage scheme. Bodden's play has regressed the most and is sloppy. Arrington is just-a-guy same as jonathon wilhite was last year. The new addition of Ras-I never materialized as he's injured.  S's - worse - Ihedigbo ? really. Brown? really. I don't care how undisciplined Merriweather was, or old Sanders was, they were not worse than these guys. We have the worst safeties in the NFL. Even McGowan was better than these jokers. Overall team - worse. Forget 14-2 and lets hope we win division.
    Posted by murghkhor


    Actually, looking at the remaining schedule, I think 14-2 is quite realistic, barring key injuries.
     
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    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    The Pats offense is more balanced than last year and the defense is improving from week to week. The O Line has been great and the D Line has a healthy rotation of run stuffers and gap controllers. The LB corps needs Mayo back, but Spikes and Fletcher have performed well in his abscence. If and when the secondary can start getting TOs (like last year) this defense will be close to reaching its potential. Alot of the yardage on pass D is basically due to garbage time . This a 14-2 team that has chemistry and could easily gel enough to go on a serious playoff run.
     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from PetesCall. Show PetesCall's posts

    Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years

    Thankls King...I feel better reading your analysis.


    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years:
    In Response to Re: how would you all compare this patriots team to last years : You don't feel Ihedigbo has stabilized the back end? Chung raves about him and it's because of his intelligence.   I look at Safety like I look at the O Line. When it's quiet, that's a good sign. Since the Buffalo game, this secondary has greatly improved. I am not saying Ihedibgo is great, but with Brown being so raw, a little more experience has helped.  I don't see whiffed tackles  from Ihedigbo like we saw with Meriweather. Sanders was too pricey, so just get over that. As for Bodden? Regressed? Dinged up to start the year, sure, but how can a guy who had a knockout camp and missed all of last year "regress"? Who is the guy used strategically in the slot to shut down Bess, help with Keller and Witten, etc?  The midddle of the field is where our own Welker, Hernandez and Gronk SHRED teeams and you we allow basically nothing down the middle in the seams because of the work done by Chung and Bodden in that slot role, fromt a strategic point of view. Do you think it's a coincidence team's security blankets with slot WRs or All Pro TEs get shutdown in these games? The Pats D is very complex. Many players, some new, are still working out those kinsks, but you're blind as a bat if you don't like how the last 2 weeks played out on D. Haynesworth returned and played a bit more, which clearly has helped the 3rd down D, but this team's zone D is MILES ahead of 2008's. 2009s or 2010's. Miles ahead. BB was afraid to use zone in 2009 against good offenses. BB uses it now at a whim with great success. This didn't get better last year until late in the year. It was a huge reason why the 3rd down D last year was weak, same deal in 2009 or even 2008 for that matter with an aging D and an awful secondary. It's a huge deal this early in the season, especially with more players in the secondary able to play in each man (they aren't great here, but will be better with Bodden and Dowling back healthier) or the more lethal zone where BB is constantly lining people up in different spots, baiting QBs. I see more of a 2003 type defense here than I've seen since 2007.  The pass D was better in 2007, but we're also looking at a league where the offense was off to a historical start due to the lockout and ol' Rogie Goodell's obsession with selling his league overseas. You have to look at the whole picture. For the time in literally 5 years, BB has a load of quality youth, experience and versatility. The Bodden/Dowling issues have been around health, not quality.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing

     
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