In response to mthurl's comment:
In response to TrueChamp's comment:
In response to mthurl's comment:
In response to BostonTrollSpanker's comment:
FYI you just contradicted yourself:
"First of all, that term is mostly a media creation, if not a COMPLETE media creation".
"Kraft, however, I do believe has embraced the term in the past."
Exactly. Kraft has pushed this concept quite a bit. That's why the media didn't create it. The media delivered the story.
Recall the Pats running out as a team in the first Super Bowl. That was not a media creation. That was the Pats saying we do things differently here - we're about the team.
I do think it's fair to say Belichick never bought into or propogated that stuff. But Belichick has qualities that both reinforced and added to this in different ways that make it pretty complicated.
Win at all costs - that's not a media creation either. That's Spygate. That's Belichick having the hubris to ignore a specific letter of warning from the league. And underesimating the animosity of the Jets.
That became part of it. Not all the Pats fault because many teams had similar programs. But it added to the perception.
But for Belichick it was always about guys who loved football players - smart football players. Not really about character - though we took less chances on "character" issues pre Corey Dillon. That wasn't about anything but value, getting value any way you can.
Of course the problem is that smart football players means problems as you have to ignore guys who are pure athletes if they can't grasp your system.
Point is that "Patriots Way" is a lot of stuff mixed together.
But Kraft and Belichick always had different ways of thinking about it and going about it.
My hope is that they are still on the same page. I'm sure there are some interesting conversations that will happen.
I couldn't agree more. This "Patriot Way" thing I believe has been endorsed by the Krafts and rightfully so, if I owned a team I'd like to think I had some part in it's success and having a business model (the patriot way) would allow me to feel like I had done something. That's why I think this latest turn of events has to be devastating to Kraft, because this hits his department the most.
I don't believe Belichick was ever into this "Patriot Way" thing, I believe he just wants hard working, talented football players. I'm not saying he would turn the other cheak and sign a potential murderer, but I highly doubt he would hesitate to acquire questionable characters if they loved football and could play it at a high level.
I really hope Kraft and Belichick can see eye to eye going forward, because I'm sure Kraft is going to be asking Belichick some very difficult questions in the coming weeks. And honestly I don't hink Belichick will feel like he needs to answer to him (or anybody), he has worked hard and brought success to this team, he has made quite a name for himself in the NFL and he could go anywhere and name his price and title. If I'm Kraft I tread very lightly on Belichick with this one.
Hey this is football and we are no different than anyone else, which is why I always thought "The Patriot Way" was overblown. Look at the players the origanal poster listed...
(Seymour, Bobby Hamilton, Antowain Smith, Bryan Cox, Matt Light, David Patten, Ted Washington, Otis Smith...these kinds of guys.)
At least two of those guys are not the nicest guys you are going to meet...not guys you would think of when saying "The Patriot Way". Ted Washington is a homophobic guy that pinned the trainer against the team bus (he was gay) in San Fran and began to force himself onto him while player's families watched on, this was written about 10 years ago in ESPN the magazine. And everyone knows Bryan Cox was the bad boy of the NFL for years - I was at training camp the day they signed him...the team stunk...everyone was hurt, there wasn't much talent out there and the general consensus was that we were going to finish dead last in the division. There was only two things positive I saw that day, one was Richard Seymore (a rookie at the time) driving offensive lienmen into the ground like he was a sledge hammer and they were stakes (I had never seen anything like it). And the other thing was watching Scott Pioli walk out to Belichick fist pumping and all smiles - I wondered what the hell were they so happy about? On the ride home weei announced we had just signed Bryan Cox.
Ted Washington father of 5 who lives with his wife is gay and forced himself on a trainer in front of a bunch of families? Or the trainer was gay and forced himself on Ted Washington in front of families and Washington reacted by pinning him against the bus? In either case what is your point? The Patriots never had "class" guys? We never had "high character guys"? We all know that isn't true, so again what is your point?
Hey btw, didn't Bryan Cox come in here and conform to the team needs(patriot way or whatever title we want to give it) and win a Super Bowl? So the team didn't stink, Cox wasn't a bad boy, and was actually a key leader in the locker room for a championship roster. Isn't that the point of this game? Aqcuire players who "help the football team win" Hasn't Bill Belichick the GM been consistent on saying, and doing that for the duration of his career in N.E? I think we all know the answer is yes.
Hey thanks for proving my point. And it's good to see the "man of steal, defender of the koolaide" back. By the way, don't let Teddy Bear Washington know you're the man of steal, he might explain to you about that incident in San Fran up close over some fried clams.
Hey truechamp, this sound like a good date night for you?
The worst instance of harassment came at the hands of a player described as a "350-pound lineman ... a starter in this year's Super Bowl." While a member of the 49ers in the early ‘90s, this lineman would chase McLean around, "grab him from behind, push him against a locker and simulate rape. Get over here, b1tch. I know what you want. The lineman ... reprised his act whenever he could; even after he was traded to another team, he'd sneak up on McLean in the locker room or alongside the team bus."
"Kirk Reynolds, the 49ers' media relations director, witnessed one such scene. ‘There were coaches there, wives, sponsors, players, and we were all standing around waiting for the bus,' he recalls. ‘At first I thought the guy was joking. But it became clear it was something else. It was disturbing and bizarre.' McLean felt paralyzed. ‘I thought he'd get his jollies and stop,' he says. ‘But he never did. The guy is huge. What was I going to do?' "
(The player in question is Ted Washington, a former 49er who was a key member of the New England Patriots' Super Bowl-winning team. The Boston Globe was rebuffed in its attempts to contact Washington, but the player's agent, Angelo Wright, confirmed to the paper that the unidentified player was in fact Washington. Wright was upset that Washington was the only player easily identifiable. "Lindsy's just trying to sell some books," Wright told the Globe in a Feb. 15 story. "He's pointing Ted out so he can sell more books. It's an NFL locker room. It is what it is. It's the last bastion of male dominance. He probably was the target of harassment. He's trying to single out Ted Washington. Call everybody out. Charles Haley, Larry Roberts, Kevin Fagan. Don't single one guy out. There were a lot worse stories to tell about that team in the '80s than he cares to talk about. I'm not saying it was right or wrong, but in a locker room scene, what do you expect? Whatever. Everybody harassed him.")
One gets very angry reading the accounts of how Washington harassed McLean. Here we have a player, no longer with the team, abusing a member of the 49ers family and no one does anything about it. All these big, tough football players turned into a bunch of pansies when they could have stood for something important. Or else they condoned the intimidation because the target was gay. It's a sad commentary on how far we have to go in confronting homophobia in the locker room. Wright's attempt to defend his client is feeble, and for the record, McLean is not writing a book nor is he trying to profit from telling his story.
But there are some small victories in this story, times when McLean stood up for himself. "In 1997, a local TV station aired a Christmastime report on the Metropolitan Community Church," Bull writes. "McLean, as usual, was in the congregation. A player sauntered into the training room the next day, chirping about the ‘fag church,' clearly hoping to embarrass the head trainer. ‘I saw you on TV last night, McLean,' the guy said in a singsong voice. ‘I saw you!'
Well there you have it. Ted Washington represents the evil patriot way. I am shocked that guys in an NFL locker room harrass each other. This is one of the worst situations i have ever heard of. If Goodell was the commish back then Washington would have been stoned to death, ot at least knee capped. Probably should have been some red flags that he was this type of MONSTER, perhaps he picked on other kids in highschool too? Or handed out wedgies on a regular basis!
In any case BB should have known, just like the writing was on the wall Hernandez was a murderer. I mean he smoked pot for Gods sake. Excellent work here Mthurtl. You have opened up my eyes. This Bill Belichick guy is basically satans spawn, searching for the scum of the earth in order to pay them a bunch of cash and finance their assault on humanity.
Hey btw, whats worse? You calling me a koolaider for defending the team who's won more games and championships then any other for the 19 years Kraft has owned it, or that anybody even has to defend that team, or that GM, or that coach, or that owner, or whatever?