I am not a lawyer

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonSportsFan111. Show BostonSportsFan111's posts

    I am not a lawyer

    Can someone please explain why that former player who is no longer with the team would not lose his entire salary and all bonus money under section 9 of the standard NFL Players CBA?

    http://images.nflplayers.com/mediaResources/files/PDFs/General/2011_Final_CBA.pdf

    Section 9. Forfeiture of Salary: Players and Clubs may not agree upon contract provi­sions that authorize the Club to obtain a forfeiture of any Salary from a player except to the extent and in the circumstances provided in this Section 9. For the avoidance of doubt, Paragraph 5 Salary already earned may never be forfeited, and other Salary already earned may never be forfeited except as expressly provided herein. The maximum per­mitted forfeitures described below do not in any way obligate any player or Club to agree to any forfeiture. 

    (a) Forfeitable Breach. Any player who (i) willfully fails to report, practice or play with the result that the player's ability to fully participate and contribute to the team is substantially undermined (for example, without limitation, holding out or leaving the squad absent a showing of extreme personal hardship); or (ii) is unavailable to the team due to conduct by him that results in his incarceration; or (iii) is unavailable to the team due to a nonfootball injury that resulted from a material breach of Paragraph 3 of his NFL Player Contract; or (iv) voluntarily retires (collectively, any "Forfeitable Breach") may be required to forfeit signing bonus, roster bonus, option bonus and/or reporting bonus, and no other Salary, for each League Year in which a Forfeitable Breach occurs (collectively, "Forfeitable Salary Allocations"), as set forth below

    (i) Training Camp. If a player commits a Forfeitable Breach resulting in his absence for six preseason days after the start of training camp, the player may be required to forfeit up to 15% of his Forfeitable Salary Allocations, and up to an addition­al 1% of his Forfeitable Salary Allocations for each additional preseason day missed after the six days, up to a maximum of 25% of his Forfeitable Salary Allocations. A player who misses five days or less of training camp may not be subject to forfeiture. 

    (ii) Continuing Violation. If a player commits a Forfeitable Breach resulting in his absence from training camp and such absence continues into the regular season, in addition to the maximum forfeiture permitted by Subsection (i) above, the player may be required to forfeit an additional 25% of the remaining Forfeitable Salary Allocations upon missing the first regular season game. If such absence continues beyond the fourth week of the regular season, the player may be required to forfeit up to his remaining Forfeitable Salary Allocations on a proportionate weekly basis (i.e., one­ seventeenth for each missed regular season week after the fourth week). 

    (iii) Regular Season. If the player is not subject to Subsection (ii) above, and commits a Forfeitable Breach for the first time that League Year during the regular sea­son, the player may be required to forfeit up to twenty-five percent (25%) of his Forfeitable Salary Allocations upon missing his first regular season game. If player's Forfeitable Breach continues beyond four (4) consecutive weeks, then player may be required to forfeit up to his remaining Forfeitable Salary Allocations on a proportionate weekly basis (i.e., one-seventeenth for each missed regular season week after the fourth week). 

    (iv) Postseason. For the period following the Club's last regular season game through the Club's last postseason game, a player who commits a Forfeitable Breach during such period may be required to forfeit up to 25% of his Forfeitable Salary Alloca­tions for that League Year, subject to Subsection (d) below.

    (v) Second Forfeitable Breach. If the player commits an initial Forfeitable Breach (including a Forfeitable Breach in training camp) and then commits a second Forfeitable Breach during the regular season or postseason in the same League Year, the player may be required to forfeit immediately the entirety of his remaining Forfeitable Salary Allocations for that League Year. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

     

     Read closely.  You'll see that the forfeitable amount is limited to bonuses (not salary) and there are also limits on the percentage of those bonuses that are forfeitable.  Hernandez is now cut, however, so he can't miss time.  If he were not cut, then he would be missing time and be eligible to forfeit salary. This is why the Pats were better off financially not cutting him.  

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer


    The pats did what was right, not what was financially best for the team.  And I agree with them.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    I think the problem with your interpretation is that his bonus was due before incarceration.  No matter how they try to twist it I think the pats are on the hook for the bonus and the cap hit.  

     

     

    Now you got the easy part done telling me about it.

    Does that handshaped bruise on your back hurt?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    In response to MordecaiBloodmoon's comment:


    The pats did what was right, not what was financially best for the team.  And I agree with them.



    I agree too . . . just trying to explain to Commie why they might have trouble recovering money at this point.  They cut Hernandez before he had a chance to miss time. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    In response to Philskiw1's comment:

    I think the problem with your interpretation is that his bonus was due before incarceration.  No matter how they try to twist it I think the pats are on the hook for the bonus and the cap hit.  

     

     

    Now you got the easy part done telling me about it.

    Does that handshaped bruise on your back hurt?



    I think that's the issue.  Once he was incarcerated and starting missing time because of it, he would be subject to the forfeiture rule.  But before he was incarcerated, he wasn't subject to that rule, and the Pats actually cut him prior to his incarcerating causing him to miss any time. 

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to Philskiw1's comment:

     

    I think the problem with your interpretation is that his bonus was due before incarceration.  No matter how they try to twist it I think the pats are on the hook for the bonus and the cap hit.  

     

     

    Now you got the easy part done telling me about it.

    Does that handshaped bruise on your back hurt?

     



    I think that's the issue.  Once he was incarcerated and starting missing time because of it, he would be subject to the forfeiture rule.  But before he was incarcerated, he wasn't subject to that rule, and the Pats actually cut him prior to his incarcerating causing him to miss any time. 

     

     



    Pay him. It was a bad bet. No one feels sorry for you at a casino. The true way to move on is pay him, lick your wounds with the cap hit and don't look back.  

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pats-bilbo. Show Pats-bilbo's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    If they have to pay it. Give the check to his daughter or put it in a fund for her. Don't give him the money.


    --- " I am a happy fan, a proud fan and I want us to win every game 28-0 but as long as we win, the team is united and has a sense of respect to the community and the game I will be a patriots fan and damn proud of it." ---- signed a pats fan from middle earth

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    In response to Pats-bilbo's comment:

    If they have to pay it. Give the check to his daughter or put it in a fund for her. Don't give him the money.


    --- " I am a happy fan, a proud fan and I want us to win every game 28-0 but as long as we win, the team is united and has a sense of respect to the community and the game I will be a patriots fan and damn proud of it." ---- signed a pats fan from middle earth



    Very good suggestion. I'm with you don't give him the money and if they are forced to drag it into litigation for as long as possible.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    In response to Pats-bilbo's comment:

     

    If they have to pay it. Give the check to his daughter or put it in a fund for her. Don't give him the money.


    --- " I am a happy fan, a proud fan and I want us to win every game 28-0 but as long as we win, the team is united and has a sense of respect to the community and the game I will be a patriots fan and damn proud of it." ---- signed a pats fan from middle earth

     



    Very good suggestion. I'm with you don't give him the money and if they are forced to drag it into litigation for as long as possible.

     



    I agree too with this.  (I've always liked the idea of not paying Hernandez, but then using the money to set up a fund for his daughter.)

    In the end, though, it's going to be decided by the terms of the contract and what is required or not required by law. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    You gotta love unions.  What next, paying high school dropouts $15 and hour to F up our orders at McDonalds. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: I am not a lawyer

    In response to tcal2-'s comment:

    You gotta love unions.  What next, paying high school dropouts $15 and hour to F up our orders at McDonalds. 



    Coming to a drive thru near you. 

     
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