If it's going to be a 4-3..........

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from mojobag101. Show mojobag101's posts

    If it's going to be a 4-3..........

     Just one man's Humble Opinion on the personel I'd like to see in a basic 4-3 alignment
    DE's   Ellis, Carter
    DT's   Wilfork, Haynesworth 
    OLB's Cunningham, Nincovich
    ILB    Mayo
    CB's   McCourty, Bodden
    S's     Chung, Sanders

    Not a big fan of Meriweather and would honestly love to see a Vet (Sharper) brought in to play next to the young safeties.
    Spikes seems to be the odd man out but will get plenty of looks in 3-4 sets and and I could see Mayo playing OLB with Spikes in the middle on  obvious run situations.
    Warren and Pryor rotating in the middle will keep everyone fresh.
    Moore and Anderson add speed when spelling the elder bookends.

    .............thoughts?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from KUL00. Show KUL00's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    Your analysis is spot on. 

    The Pats are now much more multi dimensional than previous years. I think the reason BB took over the reins last year ( when the previous DC was not resigned), was due to the fact the Defense had slowly demised over the last 10 years. The Bend, but don't break was basically to sit back & hope the other team does not make a big play. It has really killed the pats in the last few years when the offense did not put up 30+ points. This is not college football & even Brady will have off days. 

    The Pats are finally making the case of being aggressive on Defense to get after the Qback & boasting one of the better Secondary's in the league. No one knows what kind of looks they will be giving which is the point. For the 1st time in years, I am excited to see the Defense....
     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    You'll see the 3/4 to start the game (unless of course it's a crazy powerful running team) with Vince, Haynesworth and G Warren/Ellis/Brace or a combination of the three at end.

    On long third downs (passing downs) you'll probably see the 2/4/5 with Vince and Haynesworth/Wright in the middle and Ellis/Carter/Moore/Cunningham on the ends.

    If you asked me what a basic 4/3 consisting of our personnel would look like I'd say Wilfork, Haynesworth in the middle with Moore and maybe Ellis or Wright at end...

    With the depth we have along the front you can expect a lot of substitutions to keep people fresh.  

    Seriously... Can we stop obsessing over the 4/3 already?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    In Response to Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........:
    [QUOTE]Could be be riding in the WayBack Machine and seeing a reincarnation of the feared Bears 4-3 / 4-6  ??? Defensive Starters         LDE Dan Hampton * 28 6 15 6.5 sacks, 0 interceptions, 3 fumbles recovered Chicago Bears / 1st / 4th pick /  1979 LDE Mike Hartenstine 32 10 8 1.0 sacks, 0 interceptions, 1 fumble recovered Chicago Bears / 2nd / 31st pick /  1975 LDT Steve McMichael + 28 5 16 8.0 sacks, 0 interceptions, 1 fumble recovered New England Patriots / 3rd / 73rd pick /  1980 RDT William Perry 23 Rook 9 5.0 sacks, 0 interceptions, 2 fumbles recovered Chicago Bears / 1st / 22nd pick /  1985 RDT Dan Hampton * 28 6 15 6.5 sacks, 0 interceptions, 3 fumbles recovered Chicago Bears / 1st / 4th pick /  1979 RDE Richard Dent *+ 25 2 16 17.0 sacks, 2 interceptions, 2 fumbles recovered Chicago Bears / 8th / 203rd pick /  1983 LLB Otis Wilson * 28 5 16 10.5 sacks, 3 interceptions, 2 fumbles recovered Chicago Bears / 1st / 19th pick /  1980 MLB Mike Singletary *+ 27 4 16 3.0 sacks, 1 interception, 3 fumbles recovered Chicago Bears / 2nd / 38th pick /  1981 RLB Wilber Marshall 23 1 15 6.0 sacks, 4 interceptions, 1 fumble recovered Chicago Bears / 1st / 11th pick /  1984 LCB Mike Richardson 24 2 14 0.0 sacks, 4 interceptions, 1 fumble recovered Chicago Bears / 2nd / 33rd pick /  1983 RCB Leslie Frazier 26 4 16 0.0 sacks, 6 interceptions, 0 fumbles recovered   SS Dave Duerson * 25 2 15 2.0 sacks, 5 interceptions, 1 fumble recovered Chicago Bears / 3rd / 64th pick /  1983 FS Gary Fencik 31 9 16 0.0 sacks, 5 interceptions, 1 fumble recovered Miami Dolphins / 10th / 281st pick /  1976   Take a look at the mix of youth and experience.....
    Posted by leatherhelmet[/QUOTE]

    I made a reference to that as well. The Ravens rana similar (although slightly different) system in the early 2000's. Look at the sack numbers on those LBers. It was essentially running 43 setups with 34 assignments and techniques. I don't see anyone shifting to 46 in this day and age, the West Coast Offense and it's influence has killed that, but having the ability to put together "shock" packages like that will be interesting.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    Oh my gosh our new aggressive attitude attacking 4-3 is going to be the best thing ever unlike that horrible read-and-react defense that gave up so many big plays the past decade ... can't think of any big plays actually given up but I'm sure the read-and-react is to blame and is now a thing of the past.

    Tongue out
     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rerun85. Show Rerun85's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    It sounds to me like they're going to run a little bit of everything. 3-4 /4-3/ nickle/ dime. This defense should be a very versatile and somewhat Hybrib version of Patriots D in the past. I saw a stat on Nesn where they said the Pats had 21-22 possible D lineman on the roster right now adding up to over 5000 Lbs. Who Knows what they will do with these guys. We might not even see the final product until the season starts but one thing is for sure, it will be interesting and should be at least a little different than what we've seen in the past. Mangini claims that we will run a base 3-4 with 4-3 spacing on the line. My guess is that he is right. He claims that is what the jets and the Ravens and steelers do a lot of and the pats have the personel to pull that off now.

    Mangini(Talking about Ellis)-

    \"That's where he played in Rex's system [with the Jets]. Rex runs a 3-4 but with 4-3 spacing," Mangini says. "That's what Baltimore does, what Pittsburgh does, it's 3-4 personnel but set up like a 4-3. That's another reason Shaun makes sense. He has a comfort level with that. He's a unique guy. You can do some creative stuff with him that you couldn't do with a lot of defensive ends."
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Quagmire3. Show Quagmire3's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    In Response to If it's going to be a 4-3..........:
    [QUOTE] Just one man's Humble Opinion on the personel I'd like to see in a basic 4-3 alignment DE's   Ellis, Carter DT's   Wilfork, Haynesworth  OLB's Cunningham, Nincovich ILB    Mayo CB's   McCourty, Bodden S's     Chung, Sanders Not a big fan of Meriweather and would honestly love to see a Vet (Sharper) brought in to play next to the young safeties. Spikes seems to be the odd man out but will get plenty of looks in 3-4 sets and and I could see Mayo playing OLB with Spikes in the middle on  obvious run situations. Warren and Pryor rotating in the middle will keep everyone fresh. Moore and Anderson add speed when spelling the elder bookends. .............thoughts?
    Posted by mojobag101[/QUOTE]

    I like it but I think you will see more of Spikes at MLB an Mayo at weakside limiting time for either Nink or Cunningham.
     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from patthepatriot666. Show patthepatriot666's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    Ive read mayo is to be OLB now. What will his responsibilities be as a 4-3 outside linebacker? Do you think he will excell?
    Is Spikes really going to be in the middle? I was of the understanding that speed was of the utmost importance for the 4-3 mlb
     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rerun85. Show Rerun85's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    In Response to Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: If it's going to be a 4-3.......... : Exactly. Just because it's more 4-3 than the standard 90% 3-4 of the last fewy years, doesn't mean the base changes over night. They can run a 2-4-5 with a big nickle or just Arrington as the nickel and basically disguise stunts and blitzes off of Remember the 2009 "stand up" game in Buffalo? BB was experimenting with the 2-4-5 there with far weaker personnel. So, imagine, being an O Line and seeing a 2-4-5, needing to double one or more of the Wilfork/Haynesworth duo, and then figuring out who is coming anf going as MLBs? And you add in some good cover speed with Guyton and Fletcher on the outside of that MLB 4 set, and your not exposing yourself to quick outs or check downs. Then, you can switch out Arrington and say Spikes, for example, and roll into a 4-3 by adding DE's Moore and Cunningham (for example) and kicking Guyton and Fletcher to 4-3 OLB. However, the less subbing the better. But, you get the idea here. QBs won't be able to isolate the MIC as well, predict who is blitzing if at all or be clear on what the formation is. If one formation matches up well, BB will probably use that until it looks like the opponents has it countered. Stuff like that. This, as opposed to, "here is out base 3-4 with a limited pass rush, inexeprience, not great D Line depth and rookies everywhere" in 2009 and 2010. Major difference and it makes BB/Patricia now far more dangerous during games.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]

    That's what I'm thinking- Confusion will be the order of the day for this Patriots defense and they now have enough quality personell to pull off almost anything they want at any given time.  The Possibilities are endless depending on the situation and BB has really got to be excited about this.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from pyegian. Show pyegian's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    Don't forget about Mike Wright, who was easily the Patriots' best pass rusher last year and according to some metrics, one of the best interior pass rushers in the game.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Macrawn. Show Macrawn's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    I know there has been argument as to what makes a team 4/3 or 3/4. BB plays both sets I realize that. 

    However it doesn't matter how many reps it's basically what do you put out there on the field on 1st down. That's your base D. Why? Because it needs to be solid against the pass and run. You can cheat on 2nd and 3rd down with other formations depending on what happens on 1st down. (Not including a Manning team where you pick a nickel back out there at all times). 

    This team is clearly going to have a 4/3 base. Thier new 4/3 is going to be the most flexible d they have because the guys on the field can rush, and they should be able to stop the run up the middle without any problems at all. It's the formation that gets the most talent on the field which is what BB has said he tries to do. 

    The 3/4 patriots D should have been able to rush but they have not. They have not even been able to set the edge and prevent outside runs. I think that hurts BB the most because the 3/4 should be able to contain the edges without a problem. 

    So in my opinion what you put out there on 1st down is your core d even if you put something different out there on downs 2 and 3. On 2nd and 10 you can play a little softer on the run and cheat toward the throw and still be okay with a 5 yard run. What got you there was what happened on 1st down. 
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from mojobag101. Show mojobag101's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    Spikes will HAVE to show the ability to play in SPACE otherwise he will lose snaps in the 4-3. He'll get plenty of snaps in 3-4 sets and I can also see him in the middle with Mayo at OLB in obvious run situations. We'll see plenty of Spikes, but individual stats AREN'T  a priority to BB.
    The 3-4 and other strange and wonderful alignments will all add up to an interesting and potentially dominant defense.It's been a while since anyone has called BB a defensive Guru, and I think he's taking it personally after last season!


     
     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from mojobag101. Show mojobag101's posts

    Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........

    In Response to Re: If it's going to be a 4-3..........:
    [QUOTE]Spikes will in no way be on the field in a 4-3, but he probably will in a 2-4-5.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]


    You can't see him there in OBVIOUS run situations? He's isn't Speedy Gonzalez, but he's not Tim Conway's Shuffling Old Man Character either.(old folks analogies..sry)
     
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