Impact balance can have on a great offense.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    Could also be titled "Impact a good O.C can have on a great offense"

    1st in scoring

    1st in passing yards

    3rd in rushing yards

    1st in total plays

    1st in 1st downs, FIFTY TWO more then the 2nd most which is G.B Packers

    1st in rushing 1st downs, 14 more then 2nd place Reskins(RGIII)

    2nd in 3rd down conversion despite having the most 3rd down plays in league.

     


    This offense can compile 500 rushing yards in 2 games or it can spread you out and throw for 300 and a few tds.

    VERSATILITY IS THE KEY.

     

    Oh btw the defense allows the fewest yards after contact in the league and is 1st in forced fumbles and 7th in INT's.

     

    Great 1st half of the year by this team!

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    This years pass/run ratio is about 1.2/1 vs last years 1.4/1; about 2 more runs rather than passes a game.

    That's all it took for you to be happy with the "balance"?

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    Babe you have zero clue what balance is. BTW if you only want to look at ratio's, what were the ratio's in the loses?

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    Being 9th in yards a carry this year rather than last year's 21st is a help. Everybody loves a more effective running game. Now if we could just do that consistently.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    This years pass/run ratio is about 1.2/1 vs last years 1.4/1; about 2 more runs rather than passes a game.

    That's all it took for you to be happy with the "balance"?




    I think you missed the part about we are 3rd in rushing and 1st in rushing 1st downs, and 1st in 3rd down conversions(meaning defense's are having a tough time keying in on 1 half of the offense), oh and 1st in total plays....might be the most total plays in half of a season in NFL history. I'd be interested to know.

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    Babe you have zero clue what balance is. BTW if you only want to look at ratio's, what were the ratio's in the loses?

    Aren't you one of the complainers about personal attacks? Hypocrite much?


    Explain to us what balance is then. It sucks when those pesky facts smash your spin to smithereens, ain't it?

    Try this. Look at the effectiveness of the running in losses to get a drift why they might be running less in that instance. Have to tell you the same old football kindergarten facts over and over and over but they still don't sink in.

    Go to the blackboard and write this 1000 times. "When the run isn't working, they do it less".

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Being 9th in yards a carry this year rather than last year's 21st is a help. Everybody loves a more effective running game. Now if we could just do that consistently.




    Yes but also having non formuliac play calling has helped a ton too. Balance isn't just about how many carries a team has it's also how they use it on all downs, distances, and quarters in the game. Back with OB a D could count on a 65% chance that they'd run it on first down, a 75% chance they run with less then 5 on 2nd down otherwise it was practicully always a pass, and on 3rd down unless it was within 2 yrds they always passed and within 2 yrds almost always ran.


    Additionally OB didn't give the RB's consistent reps instead he'd run them early and if they weren't getting what you consider affective yards he wouldn't use them until almost the 4th. It's almost impossible for an OL and RB to get yards late in the game if they aren't getting consistent reps throughout the game to begin with.

    That's the biggest difference between last year and this year. Even the difference between games this year too. McDaniels will give consistent reps on all three down, regardless of yardage, and throughtout the entire game even if it's not completely affective at that moment. That keeps the O balanced and unpredictable and it's clearly visible on the opposing D which is really helping Brady and the receivers get open too. Did you see how badly the Rams bit on those play actions? Of the 3 loses 2 you can directly point to the fact that they didn't consistently give reps and gave up running when they thought it wasn't affective and that killed them when they tried to kill the clock late in the game. They just couldn't get it going. Heck even a 3.3ypc average will help close out a game but not if the running game is cold when you try to do it

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    This years pass/run ratio is about 1.2/1 vs last years 1.4/1; about 2 more runs rather than passes a game.

    That's all it took for you to be happy with the "balance"?




    I think you missed the part about we are 3rd in rushing and 1st in rushing 1st downs, and 1st in 3rd down conversions(meaning defense's are having a tough time keying in on 1 half of the offense), oh and 1st in total plays....might be the most total plays in half of a season in NFL history. I'd be interested to know.

     




    I didn't miss that truechamp. They have been running the no huddle like crazy this year and the running has been more effective since Benny went bye bye, so of course they have run more plays. But the "balance" is only about 2 plays a game different.

     

    If you're happy with the balance that's great. Just seems all the complaining about it last year was ill founded if in the end it was about merely 2 plays a game.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    If we're looking at this solely based on attempts, the number of rushing attempts projects to surpass last year's by a long shot if we extrapolate it out over 16 games.  The yards per attempt is up too.  If we carry that projection forward, the Pats wil have rushed 115 more times than last year and will exceed last year's total by +/- 500 yards over the course of a season.  

    If we're using the eyeball test and look at when they're running, the running game is undoubtedly more productive.  The run is a much better weapon than it had been last year, maybe due to personnel, maybe due to a change in offensive philosophy.  The have run over teams, they have use the run to set up play action and they have run to close out games.  We didn't see that happen as much last year.  

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to CablesWyndBairn's comment:

    If we're looking at this solely based on attempts, the number of rushing attempts projects to surpass last year's by a long shot if we extrapolate it out over 16 games.  The yards per attempt is up too.  If we carry that projection forward, the Pats wil have rushed 115 more times than last year and will exceed last year's total by +/- 500 yards over the course of a season.  

    If we're using the eyeball test and look at when they're running, the running game is undoubtedly more productive.  The run is a much better weapon than it had been last year, maybe due to personnel, maybe due to a change in offensive philosophy.  The have run over teams, they have use the run to set up play action and they have run to close out games.  We didn't see that happen as much last year.  




    They are also on a pace to pass more than last year. More plays overall this year because they have used the no huddle more. But the balance is only about 2 plays a game different.

    The running has been more effective than last season so as BB has said, if it's working they will do it more.

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Being 9th in yards a carry this year rather than last year's 21st is a help. Everybody loves a more effective running game. Now if we could just do that consistently.




    Yes but also having non formuliac play calling has helped a ton too. Balance isn't just about how many carries a team has it's also how they use it on all downs, distances, and quarters in the game. Back with OB a D could count on a 65% chance that they'd run it on first down, a 75% chance they run with less then 5 on 2nd down otherwise it was practicully always a pass, and on 3rd down unless it was within 2 yrds they always passed and within 2 yrds almost always ran.


    Additionally OB didn't give the RB's consistent reps instead he'd run them early and if they weren't getting what you consider affective yards he wouldn't use them until almost the 4th. It's almost impossible for an OL and RB to get yards late in the game if they aren't getting consistent reps throughout the game to begin with.

    That's the biggest difference between last year and this year. Even the difference between games this year too. McDaniels will give consistent reps on all three down, regardless of yardage, and throughtout the entire game even if it's not completely affective at that moment. That keeps the O balanced and unpredictable and it's clearly visible on the opposing D which is really helping Brady and the receivers get open too. Did you see how badly the Rams bit on those play actions? Of the 3 loses 2 you can directly point to the fact that they didn't consistently give reps and gave up running when they thought it wasn't affective and that killed them when they tried to kill the clock late in the game. They just couldn't get it going. Heck even a 3.3ypc average will help close out a game but not if the running game is cold when you try to do it




    So your complaint last year was in fact not about how much they ran the ball vs passing it; it was about the play calling series to series?

    That's not what I recall people complaining about last year. I recall them moaning that we weren't running enough in general. Perhaps some here could verify that in case my recollection is failing me.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    Brady is on pace for 640 pass att's(largely due to the Seattle game where McD went Bill Obrien on us and almost got Brady killed by throwing it a CAREER high in a rain and wind storm against a great front 7 WITH A LEAD???)

    640 pass att's(doubtful to maintain pace) is 29 more then last year

    We are on pace for 552 rushing att's(realistic) which is 114 more then last year.

    Balance.

    Save your breath.

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to CablesWyndBairn's comment:

    If we're looking at this solely based on attempts, the number of rushing attempts projects to surpass last year's by a long shot if we extrapolate it out over 16 games.  The yards per attempt is up too.  If we carry that projection forward, the Pats wil have rushed 115 more times than last year and will exceed last year's total by +/- 500 yards over the course of a season.  

    If we're using the eyeball test and look at when they're running, the running game is undoubtedly more productive.  The run is a much better weapon than it had been last year, maybe due to personnel, maybe due to a change in offensive philosophy.  The have run over teams, they have use the run to set up play action and they have run to close out games.  We didn't see that happen as much last year.  




     

    Agreed.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Being 9th in yards a carry this year rather than last year's 21st is a help. Everybody loves a more effective running game. Now if we could just do that consistently.




    Yes but also having non formuliac play calling has helped a ton too. Balance isn't just about how many carries a team has it's also how they use it on all downs, distances, and quarters in the game. Back with OB a D could count on a 65% chance that they'd run it on first down, a 75% chance they run with less then 5 on 2nd down otherwise it was practicully always a pass, and on 3rd down unless it was within 2 yrds they always passed and within 2 yrds almost always ran.


    Additionally OB didn't give the RB's consistent reps instead he'd run them early and if they weren't getting what you consider affective yards he wouldn't use them until almost the 4th. It's almost impossible for an OL and RB to get yards late in the game if they aren't getting consistent reps throughout the game to begin with.

    That's the biggest difference between last year and this year. Even the difference between games this year too. McDaniels will give consistent reps on all three down, regardless of yardage, and throughtout the entire game even if it's not completely affective at that moment. That keeps the O balanced and unpredictable and it's clearly visible on the opposing D which is really helping Brady and the receivers get open too. Did you see how badly the Rams bit on those play actions? Of the 3 loses 2 you can directly point to the fact that they didn't consistently give reps and gave up running when they thought it wasn't affective and that killed them when they tried to kill the clock late in the game. They just couldn't get it going. Heck even a 3.3ypc average will help close out a game but not if the running game is cold when you try to do it




    So your complaint last year was in fact not about how much they ran the ball vs passes it; it was about the play calling series to series?

    That's not what I recall people complaining about last year. I recall them moaning that we weren't running enough in general. Perhaps some here could verify that in case my recollection is failing me.




    When we passed it well over a 60%+ range then yes my complant was that they didn't commit to the run making us a one sided offense. When they actually did run it though I also complained that they weren't running it properly in the right situations. People were complaining all the time that they were too predictable.

    Balance isn't just about amount of runs it's how many times you run, in what situations, and when during the game. Running 15 times a row in the 1st then 30 passes then 15 runs in a row to end it is 50/50 but is in no way balanced. Running it every 1st down and half the time on second but passing it the rest of the time isn't balanced it. It's the entire running game which includes how, how much, and when. When you have a balanced O that doesn't mean a perfect 50/50 split but that doesn't mean a complete loop sided ratio either. Usually if you are between 40-60% on either passing or running then that's typically a good zone then it boils down to when you use each, how you use each, and whether you commit to both to keep D's from T'ing off on one or the other. Sometimes that means you need to take a hit when one isn't completely up to speed but you just can't abandon it because that hurts the other half of the O worse then if you are grinding for 3ypc


    That's balance not a simple ratio

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    Brady is on pace for 640 pass att's(largely due to the Seattle game where McD went Bill Obrien on us and almost got Brady killed by throwing it a CAREER high in a rain and wind storm against a great front 7 WITH A LEAD???)

    640 pass att's(doubtful to maintain pace) is 29 more then last year

    We are on pace for 552 rushing att's(realistic) which is 114 more then last year.

    Balance.

    Save your breath.

     




    Ratio still boils down to about 2 plays a game difference.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Being 9th in yards a carry this year rather than last year's 21st is a help. Everybody loves a more effective running game. Now if we could just do that consistently.




    Yes but also having non formuliac play calling has helped a ton too. Balance isn't just about how many carries a team has it's also how they use it on all downs, distances, and quarters in the game. Back with OB a D could count on a 65% chance that they'd run it on first down, a 75% chance they run with less then 5 on 2nd down otherwise it was practicully always a pass, and on 3rd down unless it was within 2 yrds they always passed and within 2 yrds almost always ran.


    Additionally OB didn't give the RB's consistent reps instead he'd run them early and if they weren't getting what you consider affective yards he wouldn't use them until almost the 4th. It's almost impossible for an OL and RB to get yards late in the game if they aren't getting consistent reps throughout the game to begin with.

    That's the biggest difference between last year and this year. Even the difference between games this year too. McDaniels will give consistent reps on all three down, regardless of yardage, and throughtout the entire game even if it's not completely affective at that moment. That keeps the O balanced and unpredictable and it's clearly visible on the opposing D which is really helping Brady and the receivers get open too. Did you see how badly the Rams bit on those play actions? Of the 3 loses 2 you can directly point to the fact that they didn't consistently give reps and gave up running when they thought it wasn't affective and that killed them when they tried to kill the clock late in the game. They just couldn't get it going. Heck even a 3.3ypc average will help close out a game but not if the running game is cold when you try to do it




    So your complaint last year was in fact not about how much they ran the ball vs passes it; it was about the play calling series to series?

    That's not what I recall people complaining about last year. I recall them moaning that we weren't running enough in general. Perhaps some here could verify that in case my recollection is failing me.




    When we passed it well over a 60%+ range then yes my complant was that they didn't commit to the run making us a one sided offense. When they actually did run it though I also complained that they weren't running it properly in the right situations. People were complaining all the time that they were too predictable.

    Balance isn't just about amount of runs it's how many times you run, in what situations, and when during the game. Running 15 times a row in the 1st then 30 passes then 15 runs in a row to end it is 50/50 but is in no way balanced. Running it every 1st down and half the time on second but passing it the rest of the time isn't balanced it. It's the entire running game which includes how, how much, and when. When you have a balanced O that doesn't mean a perfect 50/50 split but that doesn't mean a complete loop sided ratio either. Usually if you are between 40-60% on either passing or running then that's typically a good zone then it boils down to when you use each, how you use each, and whether you commit to both to keep D's from T'ing off on one or the other. Sometimes that means you need to take a hit when one isn't completely up to speed but you just can't abandon it because that hurts the other half of the O worse then if you are grinding for 3ypc


    That's balance not a simple ratio




    I'll leave the second guessing of BB's coaching up to you. It's just not something I do much.

    If you're happy with 2 plays a game difference in pass/run ratio then I'm just thankful something as insignificant as that could stop all the crying about it we endured last year.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    "they have run to close out games. "

    Ahh, but not as much as we would all like. The four minute offense, where running truly matters to burn clock, has not worked. I care more about that than balance - though of course wearing a d-line down over the course of a game is part of the key to that. 

    Still, I'm not happy with our "balance." It's situational running where we still need work. Clock killing runs when we need them most. 

    That said we're better than Dallas, did you see their pathetic 3 and 1 and 4 and 1 plays against the Giants?

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:


    I'll leave the second guessing of BB's coaching up to you. It's just not something I do much.

    If you're happy with 2 plays a game difference in pass/run ratio then I'm just thankful something as insignificant as that could stop all the crying about it we endured last year.



    And this is why I said you have zero clue because you think of it as simply a ratio and not as a whole. It's not a black and white issue were ratio is the end all be all. BTW, you question BB all the time. Least we forgot you thinking they under utelized Moss, or that they shouldn't have used BJGE as much, or how about when you question the defensive moves. Sorry Babe you can't have it both ways. You either have to realize questioning BB's moves isn't a bad thing (esp when BB changes his philosphy in a manner suggested by some on this board) or you can't question anything BB does. BTW, I don't think I'm smarter then BB nor do I think I'd be a better coach then BB but it's clear he's over taxed with all his hats at times and might miss some things that we as fans who only get to see the large picture and not the details see. Of course it's nice when both BB and Brady come out talking about them needing to get more balanced after a loss, but lets let that fact slide by and just spin away Babe saying that you trust in BB when BB clearly is making an effort to become more balanced

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    I'm fairly certain this has been brought up before, but...running=good...balance=good

    Ben Jarvus Green Ellis=not allowing us either last year:(

    This year different runners=different results

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:


    I'll leave the second guessing of BB's coaching up to you. It's just not something I do much.

    If you're happy with 2 plays a game difference in pass/run ratio then I'm just thankful something as insignificant as that could stop all the crying about it we endured last year.



    And this is why I said you have zero clue because you think of it as simply a ratio and not as a whole. It's not a black and white issue were ratio is the end all be all. BTW, you question BB all the time. Least we forgot you thinking they under utelized Moss, or that they shouldn't have used BJGE as much, or how about when you question the defensive moves. Sorry Babe you can't have it both ways. You either have to realize questioning BB's moves isn't a bad thing (esp when BB changes his philosphy in a manner suggested by some on this board) or you can't question anything BB does. BTW, I don't think I'm smarter then BB nor do I think I'd be a better coach then BB but it's clear he's over taxed with all his hats at times and might miss some things that we as fans who only get to see the large picture and not the details see. Of course it's nice when both BB and Brady come out talking about them needing to get more balanced after a loss, but lets let that fact slide by and just spin away Babe saying that you trust in BB when BB clearly is making an effort to become more balanced




    Wrong, wrong and wrong. Never said they underutilized Moss or that they should have used BJGE less or that the defensive moves are bad. Never.

    So, BB is too "busy" to understand the game as well as you? LMAO

     

    They have only been talking about offensive "balance" as the relative frequency of passing to running since the forward pass was invented. But you try to spin it as something else when cornered. Hilarious. Keep up the comedic relief.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    MT,

    BJGE = 1,700 yards 24 tds 4 ypc and zero fumbles in 2 seasons as the starter for N.E.

    Yet he is another reason why our pass heavy offensive philosophy was flawed. We had 2 un-drafted FA RB's as the starters for 2 seasons. This is what happens when the run game was an after thought.

    I remember we had a guy named Ridley on the roster last year, but he probably couldn't keep up with a pass heavy game plan, so he wasn't even used in the playoffs.

    Hence Benny only getting 22 carries for almost 100 yards in the afc championship and Superbowl. Seems like pretty effective running to me, but I'm sure you have a complicated scenario which paints a different picture altogether.

    You know very little, but slightly more then babe.

     

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    MT,

    BJGE = 1,700 yards 24 tds 4 ypc and zero fumbles in 2 seasons as the starter for N.E.

    Yet he is another reason why our pass heavy offensive philosophy was flawed. We had 2 un-drafted FA RB's as the starters for 2 seasons. This is what happens when the run game was an after thought.

    I remember we had a guy named Ridley on the roster last year, but he probably couldn't keep up with a pass heavy game plan, so he wasn't even used in the playoffs.

    Hence Benny only getting 22 carries for almost 100 yards in the afc championship and Superbowl. Seems like pretty effective running to me, but I'm sure you have a complicated scenario which paints a different picture altogether.

    You know very little, but slightly more then babe.

     

     

    Well I do know the difference between then and than.


    Hate to break it to you, but Benny's 4 a carry you mention is below average in the NFL.

     

    Why are you calling it a "pass heavy" game plan last year? It's a matter of 2 plays a game difference between last year and this.

     

    BB just spent a 2nd and 3rd round pick on the running game. Not enough for you?

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from anonymis. Show anonymis's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    Let's revisit when the Patriots beat a team with a top 5 defense.

    Tennessee = 32

    Buffalo = 27

    Denver - 6

    NYJ = 24

    St. Louis Rams - 23


    How the entire team plays against Houston and San Francisco will be telling.

     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Impact balance can have on a great offense.

    Funny how all the usual suspects were dead silent after last week's pedestrian offensive showing and now this week are blowing the balance/running/josh horn.

    Bottom line

    After eight games last year : 5-3

    After eight games this year: 5-3

    And many of those offensive statistics last year were similar to those this year. 

    As far as the running game goes, the talent is way better this year. Talent makes a difference, just like we were saying last year. 

     
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