Impact of Brandon Tate

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Impact of Brandon Tate

    Saw this comment on ESPNBoston and thought I'd share it here from an article on Brandon Tate.

    After returning 18 kicks for 601 yards (33.4 yards per return) and two touchdowns over the first four weeks of the 2010 season, Tate returned 28 kicks for 564 yards (20.1 yards per return) in 12 games after.

    To add some context to Tate's return stats..... 
     
    After the first four weeks, teams began kicking away from Tate - which is how those 15 other players got their touches on kickoffs. Three more kickoffs to these "up" men went OB ( more profit from teams kicking away from the threat Tate represented). 
     
    Ten of Tate's 28 returns in the last 12 games came against MIN and DET. They were the only two teams to kick freely to Tate, both had very good return coverage units last season and they kept Tate under 19 yds/KR. As for the rest: 
    CLE: kicked to Tate once for 32 yds and then kicked short four times 
    PIT: kicked to Tate twice for a 31.5yd avg 
    IND: kicked to Tate 3x for a 29yd avg (and then kicked short twice) 
    NYJ: kicked to Tate twice for a 29yd avg 
    GBY: kicked to Tate once for 27 yds, then kicked short 3x, yielding Connolly's history-making return 
    BUF: kicked to Tate once for 23yds, then kicked short 
    MIA: kicked to Tate once for 22 yds, then kicked one OB in an attempt to kick short 
    BAL and SD kicked to Tate 3x between them and kept him relatively in check (23yd avg), but each also kicked one OB on attempts to kick short. 
     
    Bottom line is that, after Tate established himself as a serious return threat in the first four games, 10 of the remaining 12 opponents gave Brady an average starting field position out beyond the 30 yd line rather than kick to Tate.



    I understand why Tate was cut, he had shown no talent at WR and the kickoff rules changed.  Tate is the NCAA's all time leader in Kickoff, punt return average.  In 2009 the Pats used a variety of returners who were not very good.  The Pats did not even make the stat sheet in yards per return which only goes out to the top 33.  Their best returner was Moroney with 279 yards, Tate had 1,057 yards in 2010.  The Patriots returned 56 kicks last year, I think you could safely say that Tate's impact led to an increase in field position by about 10 yards per kickoff over the year before.  Kickoff returns account for about 15% of a teams yards meaning they have a greater impact than any WR.  I think the new rule will negatively impact the Patriots as much as any team.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    If Tate could play WR half as well as he could return kicks, he would still be a Patriot.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from EASON11. Show EASON11's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    not a big loss.........as you said so yourself when the kick off rule changed he became expendable......plus we need that spot for more depth elsewhere.......
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from kansaspatriot. Show kansaspatriot's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    Tate is not a victim of the new kickoff rule. He is a victim of not giving 110% on the field.

    Slater came in the other night, caught a pass, and turned it into a 64 yeard play. That's all BB had to see.

    Effort is what counts
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from kirk54. Show kirk54's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    Tate was a very good return man early last year no doubt.  However; for some reason he lost his nerve.  He started dancing in the hole and running east/west rather  than taking it upfield. Once that happens to a return man they are done, and he is not a good enough recever to make the team as one.  
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from DCSoxFan13. Show DCSoxFan13's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    In Response to Impact of Brandon Tate:
    [QUOTE]Saw this comment on ESPNBoston and thought I'd share it here from an article on Brandon Tate. After returning 18 kicks for 601 yards (33.4 yards per return) and two touchdowns over the first four weeks of the 2010 season, Tate returned 28 kicks for 564 yards (20.1 yards per return) in 12 games after. To add some context to Tate's return stats.....    After the first four weeks, teams began kicking away from Tate - which is how those 15 other players got their touches on kickoffs. Three more kickoffs to these "up" men went OB ( more profit from teams kicking away from the threat Tate represented).    Ten of Tate's 28 returns in the last 12 games came against MIN and DET. They were the only two teams to kick freely to Tate, both had very good return coverage units last season and they kept Tate under 19 yds/KR. As for the rest:  CLE: kicked to Tate once for 32 yds and then kicked short four times  PIT: kicked to Tate twice for a 31.5yd avg  IND: kicked to Tate 3x for a 29yd avg (and then kicked short twice)  NYJ: kicked to Tate twice for a 29yd avg  GBY: kicked to Tate once for 27 yds, then kicked short 3x, yielding Connolly's history-making return  BUF: kicked to Tate once for 23yds, then kicked short  MIA: kicked to Tate once for 22 yds, then kicked one OB in an attempt to kick short  BAL and SD kicked to Tate 3x between them and kept him relatively in check (23yd avg), but each also kicked one OB on attempts to kick short.    Bottom line is that, after Tate established himself as a serious return threat in the first four games, 10 of the remaining 12 opponents gave Brady an average starting field position out beyond the 30 yd line rather than kick to Tate. I understand why Tate was cut, he had shown no talent at WR and the kickoff rules changed.  Tate is the NCAA's all time leader in Kickoff, punt return average.  In 2009 the Pats used a variety of returners who were not very good.  The Pats did not even make the stat sheet in yards per return which only goes out to the top 33.  Their best returner was Moroney with 279 yards, Tate had 1,057 yards in 2010.  The Patriots returned 56 kicks last year, I think you could safely say that Tate's impact led to an increase in field position by about 10 yards per kickoff over the year before.  Kickoff returns account for about 15% of a teams yards meaning they have a greater impact than any WR.  I think the new rule will negatively impact the Patriots as much as any team.
    Posted by shenanigan[/QUOTE]

    I agree 100% that Tate did improve the Pats kick return game last year and the rule changes clearly hurt Tate.

    However, I did want to debunk a myth (I've seen versions of this posted a couple of times). Tate's career kick return average at North Carolina was a pedestrian 24.7 and his career punt return average was 10.6.  Neither figure is anywhere near the top of the career NCAA averages.  In fact, just looking at 2000-2011 NCAA stats, he would be 65th in KO return average and 81st in punt return average (behind guys like Asante Samuel and Wes Welker).  Even looking at total yards for that period he is 15th in KO return yards and 55th in punt return yards (Welker is #1 for that timeframe).  That said, he did return 6 kicks for TDs in four years at North Carolina, but his 3 KO return TDs still only ties him with a ton of guys for 13th and his 3 punt return touchdowns only tie him for 38th (along with Matt Slater at UCLA and many others) during the 2000-2011 timeframe.  So he was effective, but his career KO return/punt return #s are not elite. 

    If you look at NCAA records that include seasons before 2000 he doesn't even rate in any category.  My point is he was an effective kick returner in college and showed flashes early last year, but even if the rules changes hadn't taken effect I'm not sure he would have been an elite NFL kick returner over the long haul.  A good one yes, but an elite one, I don't think so.     
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsbandwagonsince76. Show patsbandwagonsince76's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    Could be a big impact, but since the Patriots won't be receiving many kickoffs this year I am not too worried.




     





     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

         Tate has to be a huge disappointment for BB...especially since he was taken in the 2009 draft, just one slot ahead of Steelers' game breaker, Mike Wallace. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Impact of Brandon Tate

    In Response to Re: Impact of Brandon Tate:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Impact of Brandon Tate : I agree 100% that Tate did improve the Pats kick return game last year and the rule changes clearly hurt Tate. However, I did want to debunk a myth (I've seen versions of this posted a couple of times). Tate's career kick return average at North Carolina was a pedestrian 24.7 and his career punt return average was 10.6.  Neither figure is anywhere near the top of the career NCAA averages.  In fact, just looking at 2000-2011 NCAA stats, he would be 65th in KO return average and 81st in punt return average (behind guys like Asante Samuel and Wes Welker).  Even looking at total yards for that period he is 15th in KO return yards and 55th in punt return yards (Welker is #1 for that timeframe).  That said, he did return 6 kicks for TDs in four years at North Carolina, but his 3 KO return TDs still only ties him with a ton of guys for 13th and his 3 punt return touchdowns only tie him for 38th (along with Matt Slater at UCLA and many others) during the 2000-2011 timeframe.  So he was effective, but his career KO return/punt return #s are not elite.  If you look at NCAA records that include seasons before 2000 he doesn't even rate in any category.  My point is he was an effective kick returner in college and showed flashes early last year, but even if the rules changes hadn't taken effect I'm not sure he would have been an elite NFL kick returner over the long haul.  A good one yes, but an elite one, I don't think so.     
    Posted by DCSoxFan13[/QUOTE]
    Sorry I wrote it wrong.  He is the all time leader in combined kick and punt return yards with 3,523 mainly as a KR.  Welker had 2,060 total mainly as a PR.  Tate was expected to and almost definitely would have shattered the 18 year old record of 2,944 KR yards had he not been injured and missed 8 games (he had only 11 returns as a SR, 39 as a JR).  He was ended up 263 yards short, with 14 less attempts than the current record holder.  So I don't think he was an average kick returner.  His scout reports out of college had him as an exceptional return man.  The fact that 5 teams decided 13 times to kick short rather than kick to him speaks to that.  Very few players in the NFL get that sort of respect.  Returns don't always show on the the stat sheet because a good returner won't get kicked to much like a good CB won't get thrown to.  For instance in 2006 when Devin Hester was considered the best return man in the NFL, he was 31st in KR yards, and 5th in average.  But people avoided kicking to him unless they had a great coverage team giving the Bears great position.
     

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