In support of "Stand Your Ground"

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    In support of "Stand Your Ground"

    I admit, I was not much in favor of the Florida law of "Stand Your Ground"...

    But then I read some 400+ boston.com posts on the George Zimmerman thread...

    And I find myself newly enlightened...

    "Justice was carried out," I learned today...

    That poor George Zimmerman...

    Victim of the race-baiting liberal media...

    Received the verdict that was well deserved...

    At first, I was saddened to hear the news...

    I thought the senseless killing of an unarmed boy...

    Should not go unpunished in a land of laws...

    But, alas, that was just the bleeding-heart side of me...

    The side that must have---though I can't remember---been listening to Sharpton/Jackson...

    But I learned today that I was sooooo wrong...

    That the evidence did not support a conviction...

    And that race was not a factor in the case...

    My heart was overjoyed to learn this, on this thoughtful Boston.com thread...

    From all the scholarly, eloquent statements therein...

    So much so that now I have completely changed my mind...

    I now understand the sensibility of "Stand Your Ground"...

    And accept that it must be a good and fair law...

    And, well, since it is the law of Florida...

    I hope Floridians will gather and obey the law...

    I pray that those who weep over the loss of a young boy...

    Well---those with the legal permit to carry firearms...

    Will diligently, peacefully pursue Mr. Zimmerman...

    Not to intentionally harm him, mind you...

    But simply because he seems "suspicious"...

    Well, that is---to the few who might be foolish enough to believe...

    That shooting an unarmed boy seems more suspicious than buying skittles...

    I hope that this group of concerned watchmen...

    Will ignore police warnings to stay where they are...

    As---of course---any innocent, law-abiding watchman would do...

    And gather about Mr. Zimmerman in the dark of eve...

    To confront him regarding his obvious "suspiciousness"...

    And if Mr. Zimmerman so much as raises a hand...

    To strike fear into the watchmen in any way...

    I pray that the group surrounding him will be good citizens...

    And obey the law...

    And Stand Their Ground...

    So that the wise posters on Boston.com...

    Can collectively exalt, saying, "Justice was served"...

     

    So, now, I weep no more---well, except for one...

    Yes, my heart does hurt for one, Aaron Hernandez...

    For if only he had led Odin Lloyd to Florida---rather than North Attleboro...

    And simply waited for the condemned to land a punch out of fear...

    Mr. Hernandez would be declared innocent of all charges...

    And---hallelujah---justice would have been served.

     

     

     

     

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from fatsam72. Show fatsam72's posts

    Re: In support of

    well, well done.  

    and the last stanza brings it home. superb.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MrCricket. Show MrCricket's posts

    Re: In support of

    Cool

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: In support of

    My compliments on a very thoughtful and thought-provoking post that makes your point.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from fourjays30. Show fourjays30's posts

    Re: In support of


    Love it! Hern's defense team is asking for a change of venue right now to Sanford FL.Cool

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: In support of

     

     Quick, give this man a concealed weapon permit!

     

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: In support of

    In response to fourjays30's comment:


    Love it! Hern's defense team is asking for a change of venue right now to Sanford FL.Cool




    Actually, he would only need to go to New Hampshire.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from gr82bme. Show gr82bme's posts

    Re: In support of

    Wow, mindless moonbats still foaming at the keyboard - great stuff indeed.  Keep up the good work, maybe Eric Holder will follow through on federal "civil rights" charges.  Yup, that's the ticket - instead of honoring a court's decision to acquit, we'll keep digging at something to put this guy away.  Here's a though - the Department of Justice is just that - justice - it's not the Department of Social Justice or the Department of doing anything under the law to appease a bunch of folks that don't like a law - all for the glory of more liberal votes.  Yup, that's some system you want eh?  Be careful what you ask for - you just may get it.

    Also, can we cease with the "just a little unarmed boy walking through the neighborhood" drivel.  The characture you all so desparately want to believe is as false as all get-out and you know it.  At least make your debate reasonable - you don't like the law and you want Z in jail.  But to cloud your debate with the old "this kid was on the a-team of the choir boys" baloney is just that - baloney.

     
  9. This post has been removed.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from csylvia79. Show csylvia79's posts

    Re: In support of


    There is a differance between hitting someone than going to the ground with them and ground and pounding them...

     

    Once he hit GZ and he went down he could have just stayed standing and not strattling him to give him a complete beat down.

     

    I think the world of MMA make people think that this is not a life threating situation but it is...

     

    At that point his life is in danger and it is above and beyond defending yourself.

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: In support of

    In response to NY-PATS-FAN4's comment:

    I admit, I was not much in favor of the Florida law of "Stand Your Ground"...

    But then I read some 400+ boston.com posts on the George Zimmerman thread...

    And I find myself newly enlightened...

    "Justice was carried out," I learned today...

    That poor George Zimmerman...

    Victim of the race-baiting liberal media...

    Received the verdict that was well deserved...

    At first, I was saddened to hear the news...

    I thought the senseless killing of an unarmed boy...

    Should not go unpunished in a land of laws...

    But, alas, that was just the bleeding-heart side of me...

    The side that must have---though I can't remember---been listening to Sharpton/Jackson...

    But I learned today that I was sooooo wrong...

    That the evidence did not support a conviction...

    And that race was not a factor in the case...

    My heart was overjoyed to learn this, on this thoughtful Boston.com thread...

    From all the scholarly, eloquent statements therein...

    So much so that now I have completely changed my mind...

    I now understand the sensibility of "Stand Your Ground"...

    And accept that it must be a good and fair law...

    And, well, since it is the law of Florida...

    I hope Floridians will gather and obey the law...

    I pray that those who weep over the loss of a young boy...

    Well---those with the legal permit to carry firearms...

    Will diligently, peacefully pursue Mr. Zimmerman...

    Not to intentionally harm him, mind you...

    But simply because he seems "suspicious"...

    Well, that is---to the few who might be foolish enough to believe...

    That shooting an unarmed boy seems more suspicious than buying skittles...

    I hope that this group of concerned watchmen...

    Will ignore police warnings to stay where they are...

    As---of course---any innocent, law-abiding watchman would do...

    And gather about Mr. Zimmerman in the dark of eve...

    To confront him regarding his obvious "suspiciousness"...

    And if Mr. Zimmerman so much as raises a hand...

    To strike fear into the watchmen in any way...

    I pray that the group surrounding him will be good citizens...

    And obey the law...

    And Stand Their Ground...

    So that the wise posters on Boston.com...

    Can collectively exalt, saying, "Justice was served"...

     

    So, now, I weep no more---well, except for one...

    Yes, my heart does hurt for one, Aaron Hernandez...

    For if only he had led Odin Lloyd to Florida---rather than North Attleboro...

    And simply waited for the condemned to land a punch out of fear...

    Mr. Hernandez would be declared innocent of all charges...

    And---hallelujah---justice would have been served.

     

     

     

     

     

    Spoken like a true troll! You were born with a serious brain disorder or did you develope it as you alledgedly developed into adolesence? It's ok we understand your confusion and when mommy lets you out of the basement you to shall be free, maybe you should practice the Stand your ground law on yourself,you know get a feel for it before you try it out on your parents.


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: In support of

    Not to bring facts into the discussion, but stand-your-ground was not a defense used in this case. In fact, it really had nothing to do with this case, except that the media used it to further sensationalize. 

    The only way Zimmerman might have needed that defense is if he had an opportunity to run away from Martin but chose not to, but that was never the defense's position.

    Also, SYG been used as a defense by African Americans in Florida to a much greater degree than whites (black defendants accounted for about one-third of the SYG cases and they are about half that in terms of population in FL).

    But good poem, song, soliloquy, whatever it was.  

     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: In support of

    The jury instructions referred to "stand your ground"  because it's now part of the regular self-defense law in Florida (which DontQuestionBB quotes above), and therefore stand your ground did play a significant role in the jury's decision.

    What wasn't used is only the provision in the stand your ground law that allows for a pre trial immunity hearing.  I'm surprised at how few people in media and in general seem to understand this.

    Stand your ground was very much in play.  The defense simply passed on taking advantage of the pretrial immunity hearing.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: In support of

    In response to russgriswold's comment:

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

     

     

    The jury instructions referred to "stand your ground"  because it's now part of the regular self-defense law in Florida (which DontQuestionBB quotes above), and therefore stand your ground did play a significant role in the jury's decision.

    What wasn't used is only the provision in the stand your ground law that allows for a pre trial immunity hearing.  I'm surprised at how few people in media and in general seem to understand this.

    Stand your ground was very much in play.  The defense simply passed on taking advantage of the pretrial immunity hearing.

     

     



    I am still wondering why the judge was bullied and why the jury were all morons. Was the judge paid off only, or did the jury get in on it, too? They asked for manslaughter and then the defense balked about that, where they dictated it not be added as a charge.

     

     

    The defense lawyer (the bald one) was standing there stalling, hands on his hips, trying to show up the judge for about a week. Very poorly handled. Terrible judge. Very weak and that is somewhat concerning.

    As a citizen, why can't we get it right? I don't really care what the official charge is to hold someone accountable for killing someone. I just want justice within an effective system.

    Everything is bought and paid for if there is enough money and incentive behind it. Truth hurts sometimes, but that;s what our justice system has become.

    We have people in jail for possession of drugs and Zimmerman thinks what he did was right.

    Amazing.

     

     




    What on earth are you talking about?  You did not watch a bit of the trial.  They DID ADD MANSLAUGHTER.  More misinformation, stated as fact, by the resident loon.

     

    Seriously, you seem to have a problem with authority and right or wrong and good or bad and lies or truth.

    You have them backwards.  Done much time?   How about institutional?

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: In support of

    In response to russgriswold's comment:

    In response to pezz4pats' comment:

     

    In response to russgriswold's comment:

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

     

     

    The jury instructions referred to "stand your ground"  because it's now part of the regular self-defense law in Florida (which DontQuestionBB quotes above), and therefore stand your ground did play a significant role in the jury's decision.

    What wasn't used is only the provision in the stand your ground law that allows for a pre trial immunity hearing.  I'm surprised at how few people in media and in general seem to understand this.

    Stand your ground was very much in play.  The defense simply passed on taking advantage of the pretrial immunity hearing.

     

     



    I am still wondering why the judge was bullied and why the jury were all morons. Was the judge paid off only, or did the jury get in on it, too? They asked for manslaughter and then the defense balked about that, where they dictated it not be added as a charge.

     

     

    The defense lawyer (the bald one) was standing there stalling, hands on his hips, trying to show up the judge for about a week. Very poorly handled. Terrible judge. Very weak and that is somewhat concerning.

    As a citizen, why can't we get it right? I don't really care what the official charge is to hold someone accountable for killing someone. I just want justice within an effective system.

    Everything is bought and paid for if there is enough money and incentive behind it. Truth hurts sometimes, but that;s what our justice system has become.

    We have people in jail for possession of drugs and Zimmerman thinks what he did was right.

    Amazing.

     

     




    What on earth are you talking about?  You did not watch a bit of the trial.  They DID ADD MANSLAUGHTER.  More misinformation, stated as fact, by the resident loon.

     

    Seriously, you seem to have a problem with authority and right or wrong and good or bad and lies or truth.

    You have them backwards.  Done much time?   How about institutional?

     




    You're wrong, dummy. NAS, your fellow troll, advised this board, manslaughter was not allowed.

     

    lmao

    I love this. I love playing one troll against another so they can contradict one another.

    You can't align with a troll and then contradict one another. There is no possible way on this earth that Zimmertool is not in jail for manslaughter and the maximum.

     




    YOU ARE WRONG......AS USUAL!!!!

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from fourjays30. Show fourjays30's posts

    Re: In support of


    Actually the jury was instructed that they could convict on a lesser charge not sure which one though. Regardless it would not have mattered. Listening to the jurior who gave the interview it was apparent she had a preconceived bias towards GZ from the begining! 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: In support of

    If I were re-writing the Florida self-defense laws, I would write them in a way that would have made Zimmerman ciminally negligent in Martin's death and guilty of manslaughter, which is what I believe would have been a "just" result given what we know of Zimmerman's state of mind when he started to follow Martin (i.e., Zimmerman's faulty and, in my opinion, unreasonable assumption that Martin was up to no good, his desire to apprehend Martin, and his demonstrated--and in my opinion unreasonable--animus toward Martin as evidenced by calling Martin an assh*le) and how Zimmerman vigourously continued to pursue Martin even after Martin ran from him, therefore attempting to initiate a confrontation with someone who clearly was trying to avoid him.

    Under current Florida law, however, I think the jury would have to acquit him of manslaughter too.  The Florida law provides a very broad opportunity to claim self-defense and (at least if the judge made the right decision) doesn't allow juries to consider provocation as a reason to limit self-defense rights unless that provocation is a physical attack.  Personally, I think Zimmerman's actions were both provocative and threatening, but the Florida law seems to think otherwise. 

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TSWFAN. Show TSWFAN's posts

    Re: In support of

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    If I were re-writing the Florida self-defense laws, I would write them in a way that would have made Zimmerman ciminally negligent in Martin's death and guilty of manslaughter, which is what I believe would have been a "just" result given what we know of Zimmerman's state of mind when he started to follow Martin (i.e., Zimmerman's faulty and, in my opinion, unreasonable assumption that Martin was up to no good, his desire to apprehend Martin, and his demonstrated--and in my opinion unreasonable--animus toward Martin as evidenced by calling Martin an assh*le) and how Zimmerman vigourously continued to pursue Martin even after Martin ran from him, therefore attempting to initiate a confrontation with someone who clearly was trying to avoid him.

    Under current Florida law, however, I think the jury would have to acquit him of manslaughter too.  The Florida law provides a very broad opportunity to claim self-defense and (at least if the judge made the right decision) doesn't allow juries to consider provocation as a reason to limit self-defense rights unless that provocation is a physical attack.  Personally, I think Zimmerman's actions were both provocative and threatening, but the Florida law seems to think otherwise. 

     



    So you know what Z's state of mind was. The hubris of you do gooders is astounding. Maybe you would like to apply your talents to the stock market!

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from jjbag. Show jjbag's posts

    Re: In support of


    First off, I lived in florida when the Stand Your Ground law was enacted. A few facts you all do not seem to understand about the law and the way it is written. If your in a bar with your friend and you two have a heated exchange and your friend during this argument says i'm going to kill you . you bleep bleep (how many of you remember your younger days and having this type of argument) I in turn can march out to my vehicle and proceed to get my gun walk back into the bar and proceed to pump some shots into. Since you obvisouly threatened to do me harm I now have the right to end your life.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from fatsam72. Show fatsam72's posts

    Re: In support of

    Jjbag-that seems reasonable

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from bostatewarrior. Show bostatewarrior's posts

    Re: In support of

    Florida needs to do a better job at regulating neighborhood watch groups.  The various municipalities need to take training neighborhood volunteers more seriously. This was a tragedy that could have been avoided.

    I don't think George Zimmerman is a demon.  I also don't think Trevon Martin is without blame in his own death.

    Healthy discussion of this needless loss of life is productive.  Picking and choosing facts to support a position is not.

     
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