Is it play calling or lack of execution??

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]Great questions, and I have no answers. It frustrating that we see the problem well but can't do anything about it. Some mechanism in the offense isn't working.  Moss pretty much goes deep every play (for real or as a decoy), so I don't blame OB for Brady hucking it deep to Moss too much. I blame Brady for that. Maybe it's up to the OC to call plays where Brady disregards Moss and passes to the open guy? I'd love to see Tate and Edelman in the open field with the ball more... In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? :
    Posted by Rockdog1293000[/QUOTE]



    Rockdog, I know we've talked this out, but I'll ask you the same question I asked MVP. What open guys did you see? Tell me the minute marks and  I'll happily agree with you. It didn't happen man. A few fans are screaming to hit the open receiver in the 2nd half but I have honestly watched it 10 times trying to figure things out and my conclusion is.... The Jets/Ryan kicked the @#$% out of us in the 2nd half. We couldn't figure out they were not really bringing the blitz they sold. They dropped back all day and flooded the field. The counter is to run the ball but apparently we didn't want to try and do that for more then 1 play in a row. WE WERE LEADING. WHY KEEP PASSING? Bill Belichick is not calling offensive plays.  He is on the sideline literally being the defensive coordinator. He is teaching the young D. He is rarely involved in the offense.

    To all fans who blame Brady for this loss(which I find outrageous) Brees has Sean Peyton right in his ear all the time. Peyton has Tom Moore(maybe the best in the league) Brady has a guy that used to coach in college. No relationship. His coaches have been taken from him. His receivers not named Moss,Welker are all 1st year guys. Who is really to blame?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rockdog1293000. Show Rockdog1293000's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    I'll give you at least three throws. Hernandez burned whoever was covering him on the strip sack, Brady underthrew Gronk, and Brady's first int to Moss was terrible. You make the right play on those throws then maybe the outcome of the game is different. Maybe the Jets upped their D in the second half, but Brady didn't. Maybe three throws are all that's available. I would argue that in 2006 he made these throws (see the divisional matchup against the Chargers) while he didn't last year and so far, this year.

    I think it's delusional to blame an OC for such a common theme of bad second half play.




    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : Rockdog, I know we've talked this out, but I'll ask you the same question I asked MVP. What open guys did you see? Tell me the minute marks and  I'll happily agree with you. It didn't happen man. A few fans are screaming to hit the open receiver in the 2nd half but I have honestly watched it 10 times trying to figure things out and my conclusion is.... The Jets/Ryan kicked the @#$% out of us in the 2nd half. We couldn't figure out they were not really bringing the blitz they sold. They dropped back all day and flooded the field. The counter is to run the ball but apparently we didn't want to try and do that for more then 1 play in a row. WE WERE LEADING. WHY KEEP PASSING? Bill Belichick is not calling offensive plays.  He is on the sideline literally being the defensive coordinator. He is teaching the young D. He is rarely involved in the offense. To all fans who blame Brady for this loss(which I find outrageous) Brees has Sean Peyton right in his ear all the time. Peyton has Tom Moore(maybe the best in the league) Brady has a guy that used to coach in college. No relationship. His coaches have been taken from him. His receivers not named Moss,Welker are all 1st year guys. Who is really to blame?
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]All week long I have seen many posts complaining about OC OBrian and the second half issues the Patriots' offense seem to have lately.  So, I ask, is this bad play calling or simply a lack of execution?  Posted by agcsbill[/QUOTE]

    both. no need for me to get into a long analysis, but it is very obvious, the OC is calling crappy stuff, and TB and gang aren't executing the crappy stuff
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    Or the OC is calling crappy stuff and TB and the gang are executing that crappy stuff to perfection. The problem is that it is crappy stuff to begin with. So, when they execute it, the result is crappy.

    From what I've heard there was one running play attempted through the second half. One. That is bad play calling and that I lay at the feet of the OC. If he called running plays and Brady threw the ball instead, I lay that at the feet of the OC. It is his responsibility to see that the plays he calls get executed and if his QB is deciding he knows better, then he better reign him in or find a better game plan. One other thing, lack of execution on the offensive side of the ball is the OC's fault. It is his responsibilty to ensure the game plan is within the ability of his guys to execute and to ensure they do. Weis wouldn't put up with it, McD wouldn't either.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : Rockdog, I know we've talked this out, but I'll ask you the same question I asked MVP. What open guys did you see? Tell me the minute marks and  I'll happily agree with you. It didn't happen man. A few fans are screaming to hit the open receiver in the 2nd half but I have honestly watched it 10 times trying to figure things out and my conclusion is.... The Jets/Ryan kicked the @#$% out of us in the 2nd half. We couldn't figure out they were not really bringing the blitz they sold. They dropped back all day and flooded the field. The counter is to run the ball but apparently we didn't want to try and do that for more then 1 play in a row. WE WERE LEADING. WHY KEEP PASSING? Bill Belichick is not calling offensive plays.  He is on the sideline literally being the defensive coordinator. He is teaching the young D. He is rarely involved in the offense. To all fans who blame Brady for this loss(which I find outrageous) Brees has Sean Peyton right in his ear all the time. Peyton has Tom Moore(maybe the best in the league) Brady has a guy that used to coach in college. No relationship. His coaches have been taken from him. His receivers not named Moss,Welker are all 1st year guys. Who is really to blame?
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    So, are you saying it is the OC's fault, the young WR/TE's fault or both? If TB and BB are not to blame, who is here? 

    I guess we could just say the Jets played exceptionally well and there was nothing we could do no matter what to beat them. If This is it I would be OK with. IF we were outplayed, playing against better quality talent, I understand that. If it is simple as saying we didn't adjust which it sounds from what you said is one of the key points (example; not running the ball enough in the 2nd half after the Jets faked the blitz and dropped people back), then I have to think the blame goes 3 ways;
    1. OC for not adjusting, calling the run more
    2. TB for not recognizing what the Jets were doing and adjusting the offense
    3. The Young TE/WR"s not adjusting their routes to find soft spots or get separation..this will come in time however.


     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    Pats Liifer the answer is yes to all 3 choices. I do blame all 3 aspects, but I would certainly blame Brady the least. MVP and Rockdog have given us 3 examples in the 2nd half of what they feel is Brady not executing. Without blindly defending Brady I will say the 1st example is terrible, Hernadez open on the strip sack. PLEASE. Watch it again. under 2 seconds Brady is hit from behind on a THREE MAN RUSH THREE MAN RUSH. That means 8 guys were covering 4. AH was not wide open at all. the pass to Gronk was under thrown and I think Brady didn't step into that throw he lofted it of both feet next to each other. I have said it in other threads, I think his only bad throw of the game and the line did get pushed back in front of him. The throw to Moss was single coverage when the other 3 options were blanketed. It was the best throw available. I do know that the wr is not supposed to let the cb get in front of him. It is an age old scenario. Moss was beat by Cromar but it was still the right play.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    So, seems a lot of you are pretty much into the lack of execution corner.  So, why is this happening so often in the second half?  This is a complete mystery to all of us!  Also, it is not like the Pats D is necessarily getting blown out in the second half and the team simply lost a shoot out.  Turns out the team never bothered to bring a gun to the gunfight in the second half.  For something like this to be a carry over from the 2009 season means, IMHO, there is a disconnect between the coaches and the players to get on the same page and perform!  This should have never carried over from last year.  Remember how Brady talks about the lack of focus by the team in the second half of many games last year and the lack of "finishing the game"?  Let's hope they turn it around and become the second half monsters, like the team was in 2007, and finish the opponent off.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]I'll give you at least three throws. Hernandez burned whoever was covering him on the strip sack, Brady underthrew Gronk, and Brady's first int to Moss was terrible. You make the right play on those throws then maybe the outcome of the game is different. Maybe the Jets upped their D in the second half, but Brady didn't. Maybe three throws are all that's available. I would argue that in 2006 he made these throws (see the divisional matchup against the Chargers) while he didn't last year and so far, this year. I think it's delusional to blame an OC for such a common theme of bad second half play. In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? :
    Posted by Rockdog1293000[/QUOTE]

    Rock,  What would you say is "the right throw" on the INT to Moss? He was single covered and Cromar was in front of him. I guess you could say throw the ball out of bounds, but I would rather take a chance at the guy who has over 45 tds in the past 3 seasons.  How can you possibly use the strip sack as an example of Brady losing the game for us? He was hit in the back in less then 2 seconds???

    You think it is delusional to blame the OC/ young defense but somehow you have come to the conclusion that is is Tom Bradys fault?
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]All week long I have seen many posts complaining about OC OBrian and the second half issues the Patriots' offense seem to have lately.  So, I ask, is this bad play calling or simply a lack of execution?  Let's discuss.. First off, no one here complained about the first half of the Jets game, right? Nor the Bengals game.  But, the second half?  All this week complaints about bad play calling.  So, let me thrown in a what if - If the plays that were called in the second half were executed properly and worked, would we still be complaining?  I think not.  
    Posted by agcsbill[/QUOTE]

    Great question. I think you would get criticism from those a bit more knowledgable in how the game is played. I don't want to speak for TexasPat, but I think he would caution folks to be wary that the play calling could be suspect. 

    No fan is happy when the team does poorly (as the second half this last week) and starts to second guess the play calling. But most won't notice bad play calling or would notice it and dismiss it if the players executed.

    Now, I haven't seen this question yet. Did the Jets out execute the Pats in the second half or did the Pats just flat out sVck?

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]The fact that you know so much about this game just so you can defend Brady no matter what is a little off putting lol Brady didnt execute, he knows it which is why he said as much after the game last week so why are you having so much trouble admitting it? The play calling could have been better but Brady didnt execute and its a fact
    Posted by MVPkilla4life[/QUOTE]

     I don't defend Brady no matter what. If it was a lack of execution Brady would not have torched the best D in the league for 180 and 2 tds in the 1st half. I guess maybe Brady forgot how to execute after he has been doing it for 10 years. I guess our offense being one of the youngest in the league and coaching staff missing any guys with coordinator experience has nothing to do with it. Brady must have just forgot how to throw to "open receivers" in the second half?
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    I would have to disagree with you on this post. Yes everything was fine in the first half thats because of the call being called. That was due to the team using all of there weapons on offense. But in the 2nd half they were focusing more on getting the ball to R. Moss all the time. Why???? A. Hernandez was killing Jets coverage on him. No one was able to stay with Hernandez. They could have done they same thing with Gronkowski. The ball was being spread around to the open reciever. But if you would watch the second half they were trying to get the ball to Moss to many times and trying to running the ball more often. I thought that they should have tried the same thing that they were doing the first half. Spread the ball. Find the open man. Most inportant tthing is to move those chains and control that time. Patriots should and would have won this game if they would have stayed in the same game plan that they had in the first half.

     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]RockDog you are a smart guy you should be able to figure this out lol I think that over all its a coaching issue, but in the jets game I think it was an execution issue but like i said over all I think BB needs to get himself a real OC like he had in Weis and McDanials.
    Posted by MVPkilla4life[/QUOTE]


    that's right!!! whether planning, play calling or execution, it all goes back to the coach.  you wonder why execution is a coaching issue? well, it has to do with the the consistency of it. that means there is some kink in what it is they are doing that is causing them to not execute. it's the coaches' job to figure out how they overcome it. if brady is all of a sudden having butterflies in the 2H, then the oc needs to know that and call plays that won't be affected by it.

    ultimately i think they need to overhaul their philisophy. as a response to one of my posts someone told me that (this is on the d side), the pats funnel the other team's player into zones. given how consistent the d has been in the second half, maybe it's the pats defenders who are getting funneled. there could be an analogy on the o side.



     
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rockdog1293000. Show Rockdog1293000's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    All I know is that Brady has the ability to change plays if the play call is wrong. How many times did brady audible? You said you've watched the game several times, so you probably know the number. 5, 10, maybe 15 times? The point is that even a bad play call by OB could be changed if Brady sees fit. It's Brady's responsibility to get the team in the best play call, and he's obviously experienced enough to do this. 

    Brady deserves some of the blame pie here. It's not unpatriotic to question the QB or the coach.

    And no, I wouldn't throw up a jump ball to Moss against Cromartie. It didn't work in the AFC championship game in the 07-08 playoffs, and it didn't work last sunday. I'd rather him throw the ball to someone else in that situation.

    Hopefully the team plays well in two weeks. That'll be another test.


    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : Rock,  What would you say is "the right throw" on the INT to Moss? He was single covered and Cromar was in front of him. I guess you could say throw the ball out of bounds, but I would rather take a chance at the guy who has over 45 tds in the past 3 seasons.  How can you possibly use the strip sack as an example of Brady losing the game for us? He was hit in the back in less then 2 seconds??? You think it is delusional to blame the OC/ young defense but somehow you have come to the conclusion that is is Tom Bradys fault?
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    is it my imagination or is there an emerging trend of teams going into games with different 1st half and second half strategies. i am not talking about nwe's aggressive first half and conservative second. i am talking aggressive both halves but in very different ways. two games that come to mind are new orleans during the sb and jets last week.
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    I didn't see poor execution. Unless Welker, Edelman, and the 2 new TE's all of a sudden forgot how to play. Like last year, it seems like in the 2nd half, when they get a lead, they go into their bend don't break mode on defense and on offense. Now, it may be Brady's fault if he was ignoring the other receivers to feed Moss.  Moss was covererd and the 2 interceptions were passes to him that should never have been thrown.
    It may also be coaching adjustments and the other teams are doing better.  Look at last year.  The Jets game was no different.  The Pats were shut out in the 2nd half.  Either the Jets adjusted well and the Pats did not, or Brady was focused on Moss.
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]I was kidding people lol i dont really care god what kind of D bag do you think I am? lol I guess the title of my thread would lead some to think it was just another dumb dumb crying about the game but i guess i thought i have been posting here long enough for at least the regs to know i am not that guy at all. My thread might have had a bad title but inside basically I just said that people want to blame the D and the coaching but its a cop out, it was clear to me that Brady was at fault. The plays that were called were not great but they were good enough to win and had we won no one would have anything to say about the play calling the problem was Brady didnt execute.
    Posted by MVPkilla4life[/QUOTE]

    Brady certainly had a hand in it. Here's a question though. What explains our general inability to score in the second half (considering it's been going since last year)? If it was because the other team did a better job of making second half adjustments - then I'd say it was a coaching problem.

    Plus, Moss missed a TD early in the first Q, Ghost missed a couple of field goals, WRs (including Gronk) did miss several catchable passes in the second half, Brady wasn't called for stupid penalties.

    When things go wrong like the Jets game - it's usually more than one factor that goes wrong. In this case, there were many reasons why the Patriots lost.
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    The problem is that we don't have game film, so it's really hard to make educated judgments.  I just went over to NFL.com and watched the Cromartie interception a few times (along with the annoying Geico ad).  It's only one play so it doesn't tell us anything close to the full story, but here are a few guesses about what may have been happening based on my analysis of just this one play.

    First, here's what happened on the play:
    • The Jets rushed five on this play, but it wasn't a true blitz because the fifth rusher held back until he was sure Faulk wasn't coming out of the backfield, then rushed late. Brady had plenty of time.
    • The Pats sent only three receivers--Moss and Welker from the right side and someone else (Hernandez or Tate maybe--couldn't see the number) from the left.  Gronk (left side) and Faulk (right side) stayed in to block.  Gronk had no one to pick up, however, since the rush came from the right.  Gronk did not release though--it seems to me that he would have been more useful if he had released toward the middle of the field, but I don't know his assignment.
    • The Jets had six in coverage--three guys went with the unidentified Patriot lined up on the left side (who seemed to be running a deep route); two covered Welker in the middle of the field; and Moss was single covered by Cromartie.
    • Brady seems to focus in on the right side of the field, looking for either Welker or Moss (I don't think he ever looks left).  Welker didn't get open (double coverage over the middle). When Brady winds up to throw to Moss, Moss is about even with Cromartie along the sideline. This seems like a good decision since you'd expect Moss to beat Cromartie downfield and it's only single coverage with no safety help.
    Here's what I draw from this play:
    • On this play at least, the Jets were not concerned with Moss or the deep ball.  They were much more focused on the short routes. It was the short routes that were killing them in the first half, so they were probably trying to take them away in the second half. 
    • The Jets lined up like they'd overload Brady's right side, but didn't blitz aggressively and the fifth rusher was clearly prepared to drop into short coverage if need be. 
    • Moss didn't execute well--he should have been able to beat Cromartie, though Cromartie does seem to use the sideline well to block Moss.
    • Brady made a reasonable decision and a good throw (if Moss was ahead, it would have been a touchdown)
    • Brady had good protection--blocking was good.
    • Gronk would have been the other option besides Moss on the play, but neither Brady or Gronk seemed to think he was an option (Gronk didn't release and Brady never looked toward him).  I assume he was there just to block.  However, had he released he may have been an open short option or may have pulled coverage in the middle away from Welker. 
    Overall, this seems to be more execution (Cromartie outplayed Moss) than play calling--but I wonder about the use of Gronk on the play.  Given that the Jets sent six into coverage, maybe the play should have been designed to allow Gronk to release. Six on four would have been better than six on three.  Plus Gronk could have given Brady a higher-percentage short option rather than a lower-percentage deep pass. 

    In general, the Pats appeared to use more deep passes in the second half (probably because the Jets were focusing more on taking away short options).  The Pats couldn't execute on the deep passes, however.  The learning may be you beat the Pats by taking away short passes and the run because their deep game isn't good enough.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Patriots1970. Show Patriots1970's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    I question taking Moss out of the line up on 2nd down in the 2nd half and then running the ball and leaving 3rd and long.

    That is coaching.

    For execution the line did not block well in the 2nd half to allow the running game to work. The Pats use the pass to set up the run and w Faulk now on IR who can take his place as a blocker, runner and receiver? Morris? Morris was blocking when Brady went down in 2008!

    it will be interesting to see the play calling on the offense this week and who Brady targets. He should have used Hernandez more in the 2nd half and did not.

    This week Edelman is near 100% so the question (outside of RB) will be who Brady trusts and targets-

    Defensively, the Pats ahve been doing well, but not executing enough. LT was the only spark for the Jets and that came during the sub packages when LT would run on the nickel and dime packages and get yards until he hit the 2nd/3rd levels- Otherwise the Pats have done well versus the run, but did not make the plays v the Jets tehy did v the Bengals.

    The Bills have the 3 ehaded monster to run the ball and should use Jackson to catch the ball out of the backfield. The Pats need to stop the run and force Fitzzy to throw.

    The Pats need to execute in all three phases of the game this week. The defense is still suspect and this is the weakest offensive team they will face all season. Good thing they play them twice!

     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : Brady certainly had a hand in it. Here's a question though. What explains our general inability to score in the second half (considering it's been going since last year)? If it was because the other team did a better job of making second half adjustments - then I'd say it was a coaching problem. Plus, Moss missed a TD early in the first Q, Ghost missed a couple of field goals, WRs (including Gronk) did miss several catchable passes in the second half, Brady wasn't called for stupid penalties. When things go wrong like the Jets game - it's usually more than one factor that goes wrong. In this case, there were many reasons why the Patriots lost.
    Posted by BubbaInHawaii[/QUOTE]

    This is my argument. Each player and coaching gets the blame, but to those who "Pin" this on Brady I say you are ignoring several factors and taking the easy way out.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]The problem is that we don't have game film, so it's really hard to make educated judgments.  I just went over to NFL.com and watched the Cromartie interception a few times (along with the annoying Geico ad).  It's only one play so it doesn't tell us anything close to the full story, but here are a few guesses about what may have been happening based on my analysis of just this one play. First, here's what happened on the play: The Jets rushed five on this play, but it wasn't a true blitz because the fifth rusher held back until he was sure Faulk wasn't coming out of the backfield, then rushed late. Brady had plenty of time. The Pats sent only three receivers--Moss and Welker from the right side and someone else (Hernandez or Tate maybe--couldn't see the number) from the left.  Gronk (left side) and Faulk (right side) stayed in to block.  Gronk had no one to pick up, however, since the rush came from the right.  Gronk did not release though--it seems to me that he would have been more useful if he had released toward the middle of the field, but I don't know his assignment. The Jets had six in coverage--three guys went with the unidentified Patriot lined up on the left side (who seemed to be running a deep route); two covered Welker in the middle of the field; and Moss was single covered by Cromartie. Brady seems to focus in on the right side of the field, looking for either Welker or Moss (I don't think he ever looks left).  Welker didn't get open (double coverage over the middle). When Brady winds up to throw to Moss, Moss is about even with Cromartie along the sideline. This seems like a good decision since you'd expect Moss to beat Cromartie downfield and it's only single coverage with no safety help. Here's what I draw from this play: On this play at least, the Jets were not concerned with Moss or the deep ball.  They were much more focused on the short routes. It was the short routes that were killing them in the first half, so they were probably trying to take them away in the second half.  The Jets lined up like they'd overload Brady's right side, but didn't blitz aggressively and the fifth rusher was clearly prepared to drop into short coverage if need be.  Moss didn't execute well--he should have been able to beat Cromartie, though Cromartie does seem to use the sideline well to block Moss. Brady made a reasonable decision and a good throw (if Moss was ahead, it would have been a touchdown) Brady had good protection--blocking was good. Gronk would have been the other option besides Moss on the play, but neither Brady or Gronk seemed to think he was an option (Gronk didn't release and Brady never looked toward him).  I assume he was there just to block.  However, had he released he may have been an open short option or may have pulled coverage in the middle away from Welker.  Overall, this seems to be more execution (Cromartie outplayed Moss) than play calling--but I wonder about the use of Gronk on the play.  Given that the Jets sent six into coverage, maybe the play should have been designed to allow Gronk to release. Six on four would have been better than six on three.  Plus Gronk could have given Brady a higher-percentage short option rather than a lower-percentage deep pass.  In general, the Pats appeared to use more deep passes in the second half (probably because the Jets were focusing more on taking away short options).  The Pats couldn't execute on the deep passes, however.  The learning may be you beat the Pats by taking away short passes and the run because their deep game isn't good enough.
    Posted by prolate0spheroid[/QUOTE]

    GREAT POST.              
     This was happening the entire 2nd half. They doubled or flooded the zone for short routes and played Moss man with Cromar. We didn't take advantage of that as you say by sending Gronk/AH in the flat. Where was Edelman? Where was Tate. We did not call the correct plays to get other guys the ball. We sent out 3 receivers with 6 guys staying home to protect either a 3-4 or 5 man rush. It wasn't working. We need to adjust better.
     
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    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : GREAT POST.                This was happening the entire 2nd half. They doubled or flooded the zone for short routes and played Moss man with Cromar. We didn't take advantage of that as you say by sending Gronk/AH in the flat. Where was Edelman? Where was Tate. We did not call the correct plays to get other guys the ball. We sent out 3 receivers with 6 guys staying home to protect either a 3-4 or 5 man rush. It wasn't working. We need to adjust better.
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    It's funny that since Charlie Weis's departure we went from being the best team at making halftime adjustments, to simply being the worst 2nd half team in football... yet somehow coaching and play calling play are supposed to play no role in that?

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : GREAT POST.                This was happening the entire 2nd half. They doubled or flooded the zone for short routes and played Moss man with Cromar. We didn't take advantage of that as you say by sending Gronk/AH in the flat. Where was Edelman? Where was Tate. We did not call the correct plays to get other guys the ball. We sent out 3 receivers with 6 guys staying home to protect either a 3-4 or 5 man rush. It wasn't working. We need to adjust better.
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    Agree...good analysis on the original post.

    Ok, if the Jets changed their scheme in the 2nd half as the poster noted, then either the playcalling has to adjust accordingly, Brady needs to adjust at the line when he sees it, and/or Gronk needs to recognize there aren't enough rushers when compared to linemen and release. Gronks' error I attribute to being a rookie or not having the experience to improvise. Brady's error perhaps was not so much in targeting Moss (as he and Cromar were stride for stride), but instructing Gronk to release based on what he saw, or audible at the line. 

    I got to think there is some chatter in the huddle where Brady says to Gronk.."Hey man, if you don't have anyone to block, release and give me an outlet, or draw coverage away from Wes...or something". 

    This is 1 play by the way. How many times in the 2nd half did the Jets not blitz or disguise the blitz and drop guys back? how many times in the 2nd half did the Jets drop 6 into coverage and how many receivers did we have on the field in these situations + what was the play called...this would be an interesting tidbit to find out. 

    I also think based on the above that it seems more like playcalling and adjustments than poor execution....I'm only talking Jets game...playcalling on OC, adjustments on OC and Brady at the line. 


     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution?? : Agree...good analysis on the original post. Ok, if the Jets changed their scheme in the 2nd half as the poster noted, then either the playcalling has to adjust accordingly, Brady needs to adjust at the line when he sees it, and/or Gronk needs to recognize there aren't enough rushers when compared to linemen and release. Gronks' error I attribute to being a rookie or not having the experience to improvise. Brady's error perhaps was not so much in targeting Moss (as he and Cromar were stride for stride), but instructing Gronk to release based on what he saw, or audible at the line.  I got to think there is some chatter in the huddle where Brady says to Gronk.."Hey man, if you don't have anyone to block, release and give me an outlet, or draw coverage away from Wes...or something".  This is 1 play by the way. How many times in the 2nd half did the Jets not blitz or disguise the blitz and drop guys back? how many times in the 2nd half did the Jets drop 6 into coverage and how many receivers did we have on the field in these situations + what was the play called...this would be an interesting tidbit to find out.  I also think based on the above that it seems more like playcalling and adjustments than poor execution....I'm only talking Jets game...playcalling on OC, adjustments on OC and Brady at the line. 
    Posted by PatsLifer[/QUOTE]

    I think you just summed the question up for this thread.  I re-watched the 2nd half(too many times) and the Jets NEVER brought more then 5 guys, usually 4 or 3. That is 6,7 or 8 guys dropping into coverage. Why did we not go to power run formation with Crumpler,Gronk and Hernandez as extra linemen (who could also chip block and release for a catch) and Fred Taylor jamming the ball down their throats? Why did we continually call for 3 receiver sets with 5 linemen a TE AND a RB to pick up a blitz that never came? We did it the majority of the 2nd half. Also why is it the few times we did run the ball we got stuffed at the line? I have to say the run plays that were called MUST not have fooled the Jets coaching staff.(we ran out of same formations) Either that or their D-line just suddenly dominated our line that played so well in the 1st half? I think the answers are obvious.  Brady didn't just all of a sudden have a bad half. The Jets coached and played a better half across the board.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from MatildaWanna. Show MatildaWanna's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    In Response to Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??:
    [QUOTE]The problem isn't that they're playing bad the second half, it's that they're playing too good the first half.  They had a lead at some point in every loss last year.  Hopefully they can get behind and stay behind the whole game, that should make some people here happy.
    Posted by shenanigan[/QUOTE]
    WOW!
    You Sir, are a genius! I have never thought of it in that way, and it makes sense!
    You see, I know the reason why the Patriots are losing in the second half, but no one would beleive me. The games are fixed! Pro Sports is fixed, just like Pro Wrestling, just like College Football, just like Don Kings boxing.
    They proved beyond a doubt Don King rigged ALL his boxing matches. But see, no one wants to beleive sports is rigged. If it wasnt, how would bookies in Las Vegas make money?
    Oh I know most of you are just too smart to ever beleive anything like Football would be fixed, or BaseBall, or dare I say even.....BasketBall?
    You just go on beleiveing there's no such thing and pumping that money into your favorite team, I will sit back, make bets, watch p2p games and count the money at the end of the week.
    Toot-a-lou!
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Is it play calling or lack of execution??

    Execution in my opinion is the thing that matters most. You can make people look like heroes if you execute it. Happens every year, a team with talent executes really well, the coordinator gets praised and moves on to bigger and better things and falls flat on his face. 
     
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