1. You have chosen to ignore posts from boston006. Show boston006's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:12 AM EDT

    OK, Here is my Take on the Krafts.  The Krafts are a Class Act and I am very Glad to have them Owning the NE Patriots.  They spend wisely and sometime they over spend.  CHEAP???  No WAY....  Again, the Kraft's are a Class ACT...
     

  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from NickC1188. Show NickC1188's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:21 AM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    This isn't baseball, people! The NFL has a cap, the Patriots were only 22 mill over the cap in the offseason, they still managed to get Bodden, Springs, McGowan, Taylor, and Baker. 
    Posted by 49Patriots


    Huh?
     

  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 3:16 AM EDT

    " I was really angry with the Pats not making any moves before the trading deadline and getting rid of Seymour. "

    Funniest post of the week so far.  I was really angry when my Mom sold my scooter at the tag sale in 4th grade. Eventually I got over it and finally realized she understood financial planning better than I did.
     

  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 3:31 AM EDT

    To ALL:

    I agree  with this Thread Topic, and it is NOT some question that should be in some form "out of bounds, as some posters would have Us believe" 

    MY TAKE:  First Now, I had a Link on my Computer for some time, which I can't seem to find...I believe it was a Sporting News article entitled "Top Overpaid and Underpaid Teams."  It was fom '07 or '8, and It DID show How New England was consistantly one of the bottom teams in Total Cap Spending...and this was true for some time. 

    Look, I agree with frugality, and To Those that say, We spend very much near the top, We indeed Do.  HOWever, In terms of, and to those that counter with the "The Salary Cap IS FIXED, WhatTH Do You want BB or Kraft to do?"  BB does "handle the grocery money" as one Poster stated, and as I know it too, So no matter, I don't think one can "pin" this on Bob Kraft (who has given N.E. so much, and is a marked change from the seemingly "bankrupt" Sullivan-Era)...

    BUT THESE things SAID, I have to ask, "HOW many times DO teams get in trouble for spending OVER-The-CAP in a given Season?"  I, personally, Know of ZERO times.  For years past, 5, 6, 7 years ago, I kept hearing that Washington Redskins were gonna be "in trouble" one day...one day, one day?  They may stink, But IMO THIS is because Their Coaches stink (and the Owner puts his head in the field of play, rather than allowing Coaches freer reign ala, BB/Kraft), They still get good FA players to this day... 

    Teams ALWAYS seem to "make it work" the next year, or the year after, etc., ....ALWAYS as far as I know.  SO IMO "Deficit Spending" (Reagonomics) works great in the NFL, and When someone states, "Wellll, They'll get scr#wed sooner or later."  TEAMS NEVER DO.  The Overall NFL Team Salary Cap goes up, OR they just backload a Player's Contract with wicked $$$, The Team gets a GREAT Player, and they cut him in his last year or so, OR again, "Next Year they 'make it work'" (and NOW there's a Collective Bargaining Agreement to behold, "NEXT YEAR", so these Teams that might have shot themselves in the proverbial foot will probably get 1 more "Get-Outta-Jail Free" card! 

    ANYway, MY Point is, Yes Pat's almost always Spend "near the cap." BUT IMHO, I wish they did more "overspending" BECAUSE There's seemingly ALWAYS an "out" for these NFL-Clubs that land Great Impact-Players and NEVER have to deal with the consequences of the overly-rich contracts they gave them.  I wish at least, The Pats Brass would just "beef up" their offers, Beacuse many, many players WILL take a Pay-Cut to play here, but there's a point where even a "pay cut" is simply too stringent, poor, and even obscene...  

    If I could liken it to anything, it would be that:  The New England Patriots are tightly oiled, moderate-large business selling a material product that ALL businesses are jealous of not having, BUT...It's just, sometimes, I wish The New England Patriots were run like a "RICH Business," a Fortune 500 Company that actually has a sledge-fund, AND isn't afraid to use it, (sure, It may go bankrupt and collapse in on itself 1 day, But, It's YET to happen in The NFL so WHY NOT "beef up" spending and worry about next year NEXT Year...  Just My Take...   
     

  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from payingfan. Show payingfan's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 7:25 AM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    I support the Krafts 100% and argued this point a month or so ago, but the truth is they haven't spent fully to the cap in a while. This year they're somthing like $5 mil under. Reiss wrote something about this at the beginning of the season.
    Posted by seattlemaslow


    $5 mil would certainly be enough to sign a quality third WR, I must say I'm truly disappointed.
     

  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_439198. Show user_439198's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 8:58 AM EDT

    In Response to Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    As a long time Patriots fan, I would be interested to get the opinions of other Pats fans.  I was really angry with the Pats not making any moves before the trading deadline and getting rid of Seymour.  Is Kraft trying to go cheap since he already has Patriots fans money.  Seems to me he's trying to cut cost and give us fans a fast food version of the Pats this season. Thoughts?
    Posted by payingfan


    If kraft wants to go cheap he would have gone tampa bay , bills routs and have a payroll of around 40 million. Are you saying kraft is trying to come down on to 40 million and get rid of his player. Is this an inside info.
     

  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsordie. Show patsordie's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 10:09 AM EDT

    In Response to Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    As a long time Patriots fan, I would be interested to get the opinions of other Pats fans.  I was really angry with the Pats not making any moves before the trading deadline and getting rid of Seymour.  Is Kraft trying to go cheap since he already has Patriots fans money.  Seems to me he's trying to cut cost and give us fans a fast food version of the Pats this season. Thoughts?
    Posted by payingfan


    How can anybody go cheap in the NFL. This is not MLB and the Sox (who by the way I think went cheap this year), we are talking about. Haven't you heard about the salary cap? If anything owners would love to spend more to get better players if not for the cap and Kraft is one of the richer owners in the league and generate revenue only next to Dallas I guess.
     

  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Patsfan24-7. Show Patsfan24-7's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 11:31 AM EDT

    In Response to Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    As a long time Patriots fan, I would be interested to get the opinions of other Pats fans.  I was really angry with the Pats not making any moves before the trading deadline and getting rid of Seymour.  Is Kraft trying to go cheap since he already has Patriots fans money.  Seems to me he's trying to cut cost and give us fans a fast food version of the Pats this season. Thoughts?
    Posted by payingfan



    wow stop crying lol Kraft is'nt spending money because he wants to know whats goin to happen with the Cap next season, hes playing it smart, we still have a very competitive team this year, regardless of what we lossed or didnt pay for. The pats are one of the best teams in the NFL and are built to compete at this level for the next 5-7 years at least.
     

  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from NickC1188. Show NickC1188's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 11:35 AM EDT

    Part of the reason why they are "cheap" is so that they don't overpay players.

    It's probable, but not guaranteed, that you get superior talent from more expensive deals.  It's less likely, given adequate research and talent evaluation, that said talented player will fit into your system.  Add intangibles like chemistry with teammates and acclimation to the new area and signing free agents is risky.

    Belichick might not have the best track record, but he takes calculated risks.

    The alternative is taking risks more frequently, which does not guarantee success.  The Red Sox pay two or three shortstops who no longer play for the team because they spend money more liberally.

    Instead, Belichick seems to create a value system at each position and refuse to exceed it.  He also seems to try to diversify his risks by signing a much higher number of cheaper, lower-risk free agents and trades.  This offseason is the perfect example.  Everybody focuses on Joey Galloway, Greg Lewis, and Alex Smith not working out, but seems to selectively forget that Springs played a big role in shutting down Owens, Bodden has been solid every game except Denver, Chris Baker has been a regular contributor, Fred Taylor was the number one back until he got hurt, and Brandon McGowan could be the strong safety of the future.

    If he had only signed 3 or 4 high priced free agents instead, some of them wouldn't have worked out and the team would be stuck against the cap with no space with which to resolve the problems.  If they'd have signed the same number of high priced free agents (which is impossible because of the cap), there would still be risk that the signees wouldn't work out, with the difference being that mistakes would be much more expensive.

    If you have the football coaching acumen, this lower risk strategy makes up for its apparent deficiency in spending by creating more opportunities for good signings through QUANTITY.
    *on an aside, this is the same reason that drafting in quantity in the upper middle rounds is better than picking in the top 5 - less risk, more opportunities.  Good players are hit or miss; great players are black swan events

    And if I were the owner spending money and I could win the same number of games by spending a lot of money and spending less on lower risk investments, I'd obviously pick the latter.

    To say that Kraft doesn't spend enough money is to say that the Patriots could have more success by spending more, which I think is entirely untrue.
     

  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from unclealfie. Show unclealfie's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 11:50 AM EDT

    This thread is hilarious.

    A bunch of yokels, half of whom probably can't balance their own checkbooks, sitting in judgment over the finances of a multi-millionaire managing a billion dollar sports franchise.
     

  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from carawaydj. Show carawaydj's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 12:10 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    Are BBRules and BillsHoody the same person? Because i find I frequently agree with myself... Maybe I should make a user name called Logic, Reason, or Sensibility and have it echo my thoughts. You can't argue with those lol
    Posted by NickC1188


    BillsHoody was not agreeing with BBRules, he was mocking him.  BBRules himself is probably mocking those who always slam posters for questioning anything the Pats do.  He just chose to mock in a most annoying manner.
     

  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 12:13 PM EDT

    In Response to Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    As a long time Patriots fan, I would be interested to get the opinions of other Pats fans.  I was really angry with the Pats not making any moves before the trading deadline and getting rid of Seymour.  Is Kraft trying to go cheap since he already has Patriots fans money.  Seems to me he's trying to cut cost and give us fans a fast food version of the Pats this season. Thoughts?
    Posted by payingfan


    The Pats are currently 5.16 under the cap....that isn't that much....not sure why the question unless you are an uneducated child or a troll trying to stir something up.

    I didn't know that the served Escargot at fast food restaurants.......
     

  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 12:17 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money? : $5 mil would certainly be enough to sign a quality third WR, I must say I'm truly disappointed.
    Posted by payingfan


    So you want the team to over spend on a 3rd WR that is not out there....

    You really need to stop posting and get a clue....
     

  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from provpats. Show provpats's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 12:19 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money? : $5 mil would certainly be enough to sign a quality third WR, I must say I'm truly disappointed.
    Posted by payingfan


    and what quality receiver is out there right now that would be classified as "quality"? You would need to probably trade for one and name me a team that had that available

    speaking of disappointments, your parents must be so proud
     

  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 12:47 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money? : $5 mil would certainly be enough to sign a quality third WR, I must say I'm truly disappointed.
    Posted by payingfan


    I'm more disappointed that you seem to be holding onto archaic notions that men who use TWEEZERS are somehow lesser men for it...
     

  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from boston2nj. Show boston2nj's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:06 PM EDT

    Kraft turned the Pats into a competitor, prior to that they were a joke. Kraft hired BB and everything went forward from that. Just becasue the Pats are not bringing in big name players does not mean they are not spending their cap space. They are, just on the right players. It has been the Patriot way not to just sign a player for the sake of signing them they have to fit.
    If you would like to have a team that spends every last penny on big name players or just throws money at extensions I suggest loading up your xBox or Playstation 3 with Madden and sign away. I will take Kraft over any other owner.
     

  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from payingfan. Show payingfan's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:20 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money? : I'm more disappointed that you seem to be holding onto archaic notions that men who use TWEEZERS are somehow lesser men for it...
    Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium


    Huh?  I don't get it?
     

  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from gmbill. Show gmbill's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:33 PM EDT

    In Response to Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    As a long time Patriots fan, I would be interested to get the opinions of other Pats fans.  I was really angry with the Pats not making any moves before the trading deadline and getting rid of Seymour.  Is Kraft trying to go cheap since he already has Patriots fans money.  Seems to me he's trying to cut cost and give us fans a fast food version of the Pats this season. Thoughts?
    Posted by payingfan


    You can not be from NE. I am from there, live in Miami and I can tell you that Kraft has taken a broken franchise and turned it into the DOMINATING force in the NFL. Everyone wants to be the Pats, how we play, how we scout, how we select and how win.

    On top of that he built a new stadium, new town,(Gillette Place) and a new look.

    NO ONE HAS BEEN BETTER FOR THEIR TEAM OR TOWN!

    Nice Pic
     

  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from gmbill. Show gmbill's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:50 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    To ALL : I agree  with this Thread Topic, and it is NOT some question that should be in some form " out of bounds, as some posters would have Us believe "  MY TAKE :  First Now, I had a Link on my Computer for some time, which I can't seem to find...I believe it was a Sporting News article entitled " Top Overpaid and Underpaid Teams ."  It was fom '07 or '8, and It DID show How New England was consistantly one of the bottom teams in Total Cap Spending...and this was true for some time.  Look, I agree with frugality, and To Those that say, We spend very much near the top, We indeed Do .  HOW ever, In terms of, and to those that counter with the " The Salary Cap IS FIXED, WhatTH Do You want BB or Kraft to do ?"  BB does " handle the grocery money " as one Poster stated, and as I know it too, So no matter, I don't think one can "pin" this on Bob Kraft (who has given N.E. so much, and is a marked change from the seemingly "bankrupt" Sullivan-Era)... BUT THESE things SAID , I have to ask, " HOW many times DO teams get in trouble for spending OVER-The-CAP in a given Season ?"  I, personally, Know of ZERO times.  For years past, 5, 6, 7 years ago, I kept hearing that Washington Redskins were gonna be "in trouble" one day...one day, one day?  They may stink, But IMO THIS is because Their Coaches stink (and the Owner puts his head in the field of play, rather than allowing Coaches freer reign ala, BB/Kraft), They still get good FA players to this day...  Teams ALWAYS seem to " make it work " the next year, or the year after, etc., ....ALWAYS as far as I know.  SO IMO "Deficit Spending" (Reagonomics) works great in the NFL, and When someone states, " Wellll, They'll get scr#wed sooner or later ."  TEAMS NEVER DO .  The Overall NFL Team Salary Cap goes up, OR they just backload a Player's Contract with wicked $$$, The Team gets a GREAT Player, and they cut him in his last year or so, OR again, " Next Year they 'make it work' " ( and NOW there's a Collective Bargaining Agreement to behold, "NEXT YEAR", so these Teams that might have shot themselves in the proverbial foot will probably get 1 more "Get-Outta-Jail Free" card!  ANYway, MY Point is, Yes Pat's almost always Spend "near the cap." BUT IMHO, I wish they did more "overspending" BECAUSE There's seemingly ALWAYS an "out" for these NFL-Clubs that land Great Impact-Players and NEVER have to deal with the consequences of the overly-rich contracts they gave them.  I wish at least, The Pats Brass would just "beef up" their offers, Beacuse many, many players WILL take a Pay-Cut to play here, but there's a point where even a "pay cut" is simply too stringent, poor, and even obscene...   If I could liken it to anything, it would be that:  The New England Patriots are tightly oiled, moderate-large business selling a material product that ALL businesses are jealous of not having, BUT...It's just, sometimes, I wish The New England Patriots were run like a " RICH Business ," a Fortune 500 Company that actually has a sledge-fund, AND isn't afraid to use it, (sure, It may go bankrupt and collapse in on itself 1 day, But, It's YET to happen in The NFL so WHY NOT "beef up" spending and worry about next year NEXT Year...  Just My Take...   
    Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium


    Sorry dozzed off there, you were saying............
     

  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 2:57 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money? : Sorry dozzed off there, you were saying............
    Posted by gmbill


    I'm not really sure...ya see, I dozed off re-reading it.
     

  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from BillsHoody. Show BillsHoody's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 3:06 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    Are BBRules and BillsHoody the same person? Because i find I frequently agree with myself... Maybe I should make a user name called Logic, Reason, or Sensibility and have it echo my thoughts. You can't argue with those lol
    Posted by NickC1188


    actually fool not the same person, in fact i dont agree with bbrules on anything....
     

  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 3:18 PM EDT

    The Patriots don't go out and spend huge for too many of the big name players.The reason for that can be summed up by the performance of A. Thomas. However they do pay their backups a little bit better and that has proven a good idea by the way our backup offensive and defensive lineman have performed over recent years. It may not seem like it but the Pats are very close to the cap every year. I could see complaining if they were like 10 million under and we were pathetic losers every year but that isn't the case.
     

  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 3:46 PM EDT

    I bet this kid want Reche' Caldwell, Givens and Troy Brown back.....Because only an idiot would not be happy with having Moss and Welker....and be complaining about a 3rd WR......LOL!
     

  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from gmbill. Show gmbill's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 4:04 PM EDT

    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?:
    In Response to Re: Is Kraft spending enough money? : I'm not really sure...ya see, I dozed off re-reading it.
    Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium



    Good humor
     

  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Evil2009. Show Evil2009's posts

    Re: Is Kraft spending enough money?

    posted at 10/23/2009 4:39 PM EDT

    Are those whining about the Krafts too young to remember when the Sullivans owned the team?
    You have no clue how lucky we are.