Is This Really True?, I need Proof

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    I have been calling for it all year and unless I missed it, I dont think we have called a screen pass the whole year and I cant remember if that has been the case before.

    I do remember one TE screen to Gronk earlier.

    I mean this used to be a staple of our offense and even guys like P.Pass could have success doing it.

    We have Danny and Faulk who I know can do it, so whats the problem?

    I also have not seen many bubble screens which are the passes at the line of scrimmage to Wes to substitute the run game.  I am very happy that Wes has expanded his game this year and runs corner routes, posts, and all that, but his bread and butter was the short screen passes.

    These 2 things have been strangely absent from our arsenal and we just happen to be struggling on offense as of late with teams figuring out our 2 dimensional offense (wes and gronk)

    I dont know who needs a slap upside the head, but to go a whole half season without a screen pass is ridiculous and its why Brady has struggled trying to do everything. I think the lack of screen game has Brady back there like a sitting duck and hence him trying to juke guys 15 yards in the backfield(brady never throws balls away)

    That and our lack of production on special teams makes Brady have to drive 80 yards using a 60/40 pass/run ratio and teams have caught on. Its too predictable and Brady is just making it look do-able because he is Brady, but we need to help out our QB

    Can anyone please tell if we have run a screen and I just missed it, or is this true....
     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from CaptainZdeno33. Show CaptainZdeno33's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    There was one to Welker in the Jets game.

    I've noticed them try it a few times, it hasn't been all that successful but I believe the one in the Jets game got a decent gain.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from seawolfxs. Show seawolfxs's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof


    Is the lack of screen plays due to our
    not having a WR who flashes down the field?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Ok, I remember that one to Wes, was that the over throw?

    I am talking about traditional Rb , blockers out in front screen.

    I still remember the snow bowl game against the Raiders. I wanna say we came out the half and ran 3 of them in a row all for 1st downs . One thing about Charlie, if he found something that worked, he would stick with it.
     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from tompenny. Show tompenny's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    They don't run normal screens like say Sproles gets on the Saints. Why I don't know. Especially when you have a TE that can block like gronk. They have run a few bubbles. They don't seem to have the RB block and release into passes much. I have no clue why. You see a game like the Giants and you wonder how on earthy your not running any screens. They also can't run many WR screens because they are playing press man alot now. Obviously that works if the DB is playing off the receiver. Can't risk the DB breaking on the ball and it's automatic pick 6.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from CaptainZdeno33. Show CaptainZdeno33's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof:
    I still remember the snow bowl game against the Raiders. I wanna say we came out the half and ran 3 of them in a row all for 1st downs . One thing about Charlie, if he found something that worked, he would stick with it.
    Posted by JayShizzle45


    JR Redmond FTW
     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof:
    There was one to Welker in the Jets game. I've noticed them try it a few times, it hasn't been all that successful but I believe the one in the Jets game got a decent gain.
    Posted by CaptainZdeno33
    perhaps the INT on a screen in the jet game made them gun shy esp after bB put his shoe up BILLY O'S ARSSE!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    They run them during the commercial break, only paying customers get to see the unstoppable screen pass. Also during the commercial break Taylor Price catches 50 yard bombs with one hand.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from deluxbury. Show deluxbury's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Not sure if it's zero but I've taken notice how it's been absent from our game plan strategy.

    That's okay...  Now opposing defenses won't be ready for it when we do actually execute one!  I'm sure BB is waiting to be opportunistic with it. 

    In the past I think we've relied to much on screens.  Assuming we add it into our game plans towards playoffs, I see this as a positive. 
     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Is the lack of screen plays due to our not having a WR who flashes down the field?
    Posted by seawolfxs[/QUOTE]



    I wish I could let them off the hook so easy...

    Its not that hard. Every team does it, and some more than others, but to not have any is puzzling to me.

    I dont know if too much is being put on Bradys shoulders and why, but it seems they are putting him through some sort of obstacle course when he should be just skating through games with this personnel. Maybe they are testing him in regular season and will make it easier in the playoffs?!  I cant come up with anything logical


    2 things that help out a Qb, well there are lots of things, but two I am talking about are running game and screens. Right now teams are coming in looking for pass and to take Brady's head off and the coaches arent doing anything to back them off.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from chuchos. Show chuchos's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Brady is underthrowing a lot, and there have been many tips of the football.  Maybe they are trying to avoid the screens for that reason?
     
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  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from raptor64d. Show raptor64d's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    I think I have seen a few attempts at a true screen that were broken up. I cannot recall a succesful one.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Screens work best against blitzes, and also when the opposing corners are off the line a bit. It's tough to throw screens into the traffic when the CBs are making their jams ... they are already there to tackle the guy. 

    They ran a few against the Jests, none against the Gints. So that makes sense, because the Jests need to blitz to get pressure. 


     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    z, u right about the D-line. If a team can rush 4 like the giants and get pressure, the screens dont work as everyone is at the line.

    I guess the problem is teams are clamping down on us with press coverage and Brady is back there waiting for guys to uncover and gets sacked. 

    I think teams with the right personnel (the cheifs have Brandon Flowers) will continue to do that and we need to show we can beat it for teams to stop it.

    I go back to how the Colts used to kill us on that cheesy pick play w/Harrison and someone else in the slot.

    The never called a penalty on the Colts and we may not be as lucky but worth trying. Thats the only way I know to break out of it. Pick the man inside and the outside guy should be open, just have to time it right.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Evil2012. Show Evil2012's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof:
    Is the lack of screen plays due to our not having a WR who flashes down the field?
    Posted by seawolfxs


    Could be we don't have the OL people quick enough to get off of the line and move out laterally to block.

    Could also be that LBs and DEs have gotten so quick that they can get out to bust up a screen.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof:
    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof : Could be we don't have the OL people quick enough to get off of the line and move out laterally to block. Could also be that LBs and DEs have gotten so quick that they can get out to bust up a screen.
    Posted by Evil2012


    The first explanation is actually feasible since the Patriots OL is so dinged up.

    A way to test the second one would be to see a breakdown of screen usage across the league over the past few years and see if there is any kind of trend downwards.  No idea where to get that kind of data though.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Dessalines. Show Dessalines's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Yeah we used to run a lot of screens....  The defenses finally caught on and it became counter productive as we lost yardage when the defenses picked them up.  So the PATS went away from that and did other things.  It may make a come back, who knows?

     
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof:
    z, u right about the D-line. If a team can rush 4 like the giants and get pressure, the screens dont work as everyone is at the line. I guess the problem is teams are clamping down on us with press coverage and Brady is back there waiting for guys to uncover and gets sacked.  I think teams with the right personnel (the cheifs have Brandon Flowers) will continue to do that and we need to show we can beat it for teams to stop it. I go back to how the Colts used to kill us on that cheesy pick play w/Harrison and someone else in the slot. The never called a penalty on the Colts and we may not be as lucky but worth trying. Thats the only way I know to break out of it. Pick the man inside and the outside guy should be open, just have to time it right.
    Posted by JayShizzle45


    Good thread Jay!

    It's been a problem since Moss started to stink!

    NE's offense is great, but it would be even better if they could get someone who can actually beat the press. That will move the safety back out, and teams OR teams will be forced to play three safeties so they can have two back, because they will still need one to cover Gronkowski. It would take the corners off the line. It would, in short, back the whole defense up. 

    When everyone can crowd the line of scrimmage the opponent has a much, much easier time disguising rushers and defending the run at the same time. 

    Screens can help against teams that blitz, but NE has to be perfect at passing and run blocking against teams that can send just four, and play press, and have good enough corners to play cover-one and line a safety right over Gronk. Screens can only lower their 'aggression' ... it won't alter their all around formation, and the book is playing one safety shallower and crowd the line of scrimmage. 

    Imagine how effective this team would be if the RBs and Welker and Hernandez had room to make some plays?

    Fixing that will take the emergence of Price, the improvement of Ocho, or a new player next season. In short, NE needs to develop a long passing game. Right now, they are the worst.

    Consider this! NE has ONE completion over 31 yards (through the air, RAC doesn't count) in 13 attempts. They aren't even trying to stretch the field, most likely because they don't have the players. 

    Coutning that one over 31, NE has just seven completions over 21 yards on the season! That is 7 out of 29 on patterns over 21 yards.  It's amazing enough that they only try a pass over 21 yards once or twice a game. Why the heck would the safeties line up any deeper than 15 yards? They don't have too!

    All said and done, I think this offense is certainly good enough to win a championship with. But if we are nitpicking and worried about getting people off the offense's scrote, then hitting (or at least trying) a few longer passes would probably back them up a touch, making it easier to run and to pass underneath. 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jam757. Show jam757's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    Ocho has been getting wide open lately. I say it's time to give him some more reps. He's been a good soldier throughout all of this. I wish he could be out there for the hurry up. And yes, we shoud throw more screens, obviously. When the O line sells them and let's the pass rush overcommit they can be deadly. Kevin Faulk, i love the guy, but he didn't look good last week. Maybe Woodhead is rounding in to form coming off injury. Let's get him involved some more!
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof

    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof:
    In Response to Re: Is This Really True?, I need Proof : Good thread Jay! It's been a problem since Moss started to stink! NE's offense is great, but it would be even better if they could get someone who can actually beat the press. That will move the safety back out, and teams OR teams will be forced to play three safeties so they can have two back, because they will still need one to cover Gronkowski. It would take the corners off the line. It would, in short, back the whole defense up.  When everyone can crowd the line of scrimmage the opponent has a much, much easier time disguising rushers and defending the run at the same time.  Screens can help against teams that blitz, but NE has to be perfect at passing and run blocking against teams that can send just four, and play press, and have good enough corners to play cover-one and line a safety right over Gronk. Screens can only lower their 'aggression' ... it won't alter their all around formation, and the book is playing one safety shallower and crowd the line of scrimmage.  Imagine how effective this team would be if the RBs and Welker and Hernandez had room to make some plays? Fixing that will take the emergence of Price, the improvement of Ocho, or a new player next season. In short, NE needs to develop a long passing game. Right now, they are the worst. Consider this! NE has ONE completion over 31 yards (through the air, RAC doesn't count) in 13 attempts. They aren't even trying to stretch the field, most likely because they don't have the players.  Coutning that one over 31, NE has just seven completions over 21 yards on the season! That is 7 out of 29 on patterns over 21 yards.  It's amazing enough that they only try a pass over 21 yards once or twice a game. Why the heck would the safeties line up any deeper than 15 yards? They don't have too! All said and done, I think this offense is certainly good enough to win a championship with. But if we are nitpicking and worried about getting people off the offense's scrote, then hitting (or at least trying) a few longer passes would probably back them up a touch, making it easier to run and to pass underneath. 
    Posted by zbellino




    *sigh*  Its been a long time since we threw that deep pass to Slater off the playaction. I've been calling for that and I knew it would have to be seldom used to be effective, but once in 8 games?!?


    Its def. something thats correctable with current personnel like you said. I know Price is faster than Ocho, but he has no reputation and until he makes a few plays downfield, noone will really follow him. This is where I think Chad can help and IS helping I might add. He isnt Moss, but can get down field and doesnt have to be 9 routes, He runs good skinny posts and 7 routes too.

    I remember watching one of the recent games over and I saw Chad(not the main target) running a post pattern and you could see the safety dropping down into that open area quickly, so its evidence that Chad still gets respect due to his name and teams are paying attention when he is in, which is why I am puzzled that he isnt on the field more for Branch even if he is a decoy. I know Branch is Bradys guy but he isnt scaring anyone or drawing attention these days.

    Ocho is the answer, IMO....maybe Price next year, but I'm done waiting on price for now.

    B.B. needs to find a way to get his boy involved. Its ok if you wanna stash him till playoff time, but not at the expense of losing games.
     
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