Notice: All forums will be retired as of May 31st, 2016 and will not be archived. Thank you for your participation in this community, and we hope you continue to enjoy other content at

Lack of Pass Rush

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from bobomul. Show bobomul's posts

    Lack of Pass Rush

    For the 2nd year in a row, the Pats managed only 31 sacks.  This after downing the QB 44 and 47 times in the two previous seasons.  So many here were looking for the Pats to draft a speed OLB to get to the opposing passer.

    But is the OLB spot the problem? 

    The Pats LBs had 20 total sacks last year.  Their DL had only 7.  Here's a look at the last 4 years:

    YR      LB      DL      Total
    2009  20       7        31
    2008  10      16       31
    2007  27      18       47
    2006  21      21       44

    So I saying that last year it was the lack of sack production from the DL that was the larger culpret.  Missing Seymore obviosly hurt the defensive pressure. Both Warren and Green had down years.  Wright was the only bright spot on the line in terms of getting to the passer.

    Not sure if there's anyone out there that can help the line's passing pressure.  But they clearly need Warren to step up his production.  Maybe Pryor or Lewis can add some pressure.  Or the Pats can incorporate more 4-3 scheems to get better pressure from the line and add a speed DE. 
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from NickC1188. Show NickC1188's posts

    Re: Lack of Pass Rush

    I'd like to think that the cornerbacks' inability to make plays on the ball (they ran with or near receivers but never jumped or tried to bat the ball when it was thrown and often weren't looking for the ball when it came) also contributed to the Pats' inability to generate pressure.  QBs threw to receivers in tight spaces with impunity.

    Having said this, I tend to agree somewhat with your assessment.  

    Banta-Cain was effective at beating his man to the QB, although I worry about him anchoring against the run.

    Ninkovich was a decent anchor against the run, but a mediocre pass rusher who won battles through tenacity.  I don't think he'll ever record more than 5 sacks in a season because of his talent ceiling, as much as I like him.

    Burgess was an unmitigated disaster.  At least one of his sacks came when Matt Moore of the Carolina Panthers broke a clean pocket where every one of his linemen had their guy blocked to roll out to the right and into Burgess' arms, where he celebrated the occasion like the QB didn't just hand him the sack and the stat on a silver platter.  He's too small to bull rush, anchor against the run, and extend against big offensive tackles, and he's too slow to speed rush.  EVERY time he tried a spin move he ended up on his a*s*s.

    Especially because the defensive linemen play two-gap where they have to make reads before heading upfield as pass rushers and also because in the 3-4 all three d-linemen end up in a crowd in the interior where it's much harder to generate pressure, I think it's important that the OLB's get the edge and move the QB off of his spot.

    I think the most important element to the pass rush is finding a suitable right end for running downs and finding a MLB who can complement Jerod Mayo and stuff the hole so Mayo can flow to the play without getting stuck in a crowd (Guyton got pushed around at times, which couldn't have helped Mayo do his job).

    By stuffing the run on rushing downs, they can force teams into long yardage situations, substitute all of their best pass rushers into the game (Mike Wright and Myron Pryor on d-line), and cut them loose (no need for d-linemen to worry about 2-gap)
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Lack of Pass Rush

    In BB's scheme most of the pass rush comes from the OLBs and we didn't (and maybe still don't) have the talent at OLB to generate a strong rush.  BB's version of the 3-4 puts a lot of pressure on OLBs not just to rush the passer but also to make reads and drop into coverage on passing plays.  I actually wonder if the scheme may demand too much of the OLBs.  Exceptionally smart and highly skilled players like Vrabel and Colvin may be able to handle all the responsibilities, but I wonder if most other players--even if physically talented--just can't handle the mental demands of the position as BB wants it played.  My biggest concern is that guys who could be good pass rushers (and this includes Burgess and Thomas as well as others) end up hesitating too much at the snap as they try to make a read and figure out what the "right" thing to do is on the play.  When Romeo Crennel was here, defensive players used to say that he made BB's complex schemes simpler for them to understand.  I wonder if without someone like Crennel to simplify the defense, players are getting a bit confused about their responsibilities and that may be causing just a few nanoseconds of hesitation at the snap.  In a game as fast as NFL football, just the slightest hesitation can destroy a pass rush.  This is all speculation, of course, but watching players like Burgess and Thomas who were good pass rushers before they came here fall apart makes me wonder about the scheme.  Maybe BB needs to ask his players to think a little less and just charge forward like wild men a little more? 
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from siestafiesta. Show siestafiesta's posts

    Re: Lack of Pass Rush

    Good point.  I think the loss of Seymour is the biggest factor and Jarvis Green's numbers have also fallen off the map over the past 3 yrs.  Seymour was the rare 3-4 lineman that could really get after the QB. 
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bobomul. Show bobomul's posts

    Re: Lack of Pass Rush

    Obviously the BB defensive scheme does require pressure from the OLBs, but the DEs need to generate some sort of pass rush also.  The Pats used to be able to count on 10-12 combined sacks from Warren and Green + what Seymore could add.  Last year Warren and Green combined for just 2 total sacks.  That simply will not cut it for the defense to be effective.

    Seymore's gone and Green's also now gone.  Warren needs to stay healthy and productive in the pass rush.  I think Wright can again get around 5 sacks but that's probably his limit.  It they can find another DE to contribute some pressure, the Pats might be able to get 14-16 sacks from the DL for the year and get the overall sack total back up to around 40 for the team.
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Lack of Pass Rush

    Everybody seems to point to the D-Line or LB's but I think you can't leave the DB's out of that equation. I mean, I don't know how many times I saw the DB's turn tail and run from the line of scrimmage when the ball was snapped but it was a lot. I don't know how many times I saw the DLs or the LBs closing on the QB when the QB got rid of the ball a half second before he got hit. That maybe why BB went after a DB that is supposedly good at press coverage. He may make the opposing QB hold onto the ball that extra half second or two that lets the big guys get there. Where would you find the stat that tells you how long the opposing QB had the ball before he threw it?