Mankins Totally Lost?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TroyBrown80. Show TroyBrown80's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Yeah, I'm not sure why he thinks being 3rd highest paid player at the position was that bad.  Oh, well, at least it's clear now what the team must do.  That's always better.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

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    Yeah, well the O Line looked OK last game. I don't know, ZB. I like Mankins' play, but he really burned the bridge with Kraft. 4 Years at 7M per is very good deal for a guard. Thing is, the best they'll get for him is 2nd rounder and he was a late first.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    It seems like Mankins has totally lost his mind.

    He could have been the third highest paid guard in the league according to the article.

    It makes little sense.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BSII. Show BSII's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    I like the Pats approach to the holdout, silence.  Not a word from anyone, its like Mankins fell off the planet.  Contrast that to Jesters and Revis.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tcal2. Show Tcal2's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    I guess guards arn't the brightest bulbs in the ceiling so I'll make it easy for him by spelling it out.  The Patriots have already moved on.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from tartarus12. Show tartarus12's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    You people have no idea what Mankins was offered. The only reports we have are those from management. I, for one, have no problem with Mankins holdout. He should get every penny he can out of the Pats. Afterall, the Krafts aren't exactly breaking the bank, with resigning Brady, now are they?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    The reports I've seen from both camps goes like this, Mankins says they insulted him with their non-offer. He didn't say they had made him a low-ball offer he said they made him no offer at all. A week later it gets out from someone that there really was an offer made. Mankins agent says well, ok, they really did make us an offer but it was so little it was insulting. A week later it gets out that the offer was top 5 in money for someone playing his position. Again no denial from Mankins agent. Now we find out that it would have given him top 3 money. His agent is nuts, they probably finally caved after that game last night but found the offer off the table. Hope the greedy b-tard ends up playing for the 1.something million of his RFA offer and they franchise him next year.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from kebbe. Show kebbe's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    There is no way on God's green earth that I don't franchise him next season(assuming there is a next season)if he sits out till the 10th game or beyond this season.Regardless of what we would end up getting for there is no way they should let him go without something in return even if it isn't an equitable return.He is a top three guard but not as good as evans and Hutchinson and perhaps even one or two more.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

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    In Response to Mankins Totally Lost?:
    [QUOTE]OK,so this likely means he is out for the season or trade-bait. I have to admit I would have never thought Mankins would be the type of player to get this way over such small contractual differences.   http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/
    Posted by zbellino[/QUOTE]

    -z.  I see work has let up a bit.

    It's kinda late for a trade and what would a team give for a guard that wants elite money?  It's not like a team says they are an elite guard away from going to the SB.  So I think this means he's out for the season and the Pats will probably play hardball all the way.  What surprises me is Mankins looses money taking this route.  I don't think he'll get that type of money out in the free market.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from carawaydj. Show carawaydj's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    In Response to Re: Mankins Totally Lost?:
    [QUOTE]There is no way on God's green earth that I don't franchise him next season(assuming there is a next season)if he sits out till the 10th game or beyond this season.Regardless of what we would end up getting for there is no way they should let him go without something in return even if it isn't an equitable return.He is a top three guard but not as good as evans and Hutchinson and perhaps even one or two more.
    Posted by kebbe[/QUOTE]

    Assuming they still have a franchise tag in the new CBA, the players union will almost certainly address the "tag and trade" aspect of it.  It violates the spirit and intent of the franchise tag.  I'm sure the NFLPA will fight it.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from CaptnFoxboro. Show CaptnFoxboro's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

        Management isn't going to give up their "Franchise tool " easily and considering there are only @ 20 players franchised each season , it's hard to see the 1600 rank & file NFL players making too big of an issue over it.

     By all accounts MANKINS is well liked by players and coaches and over-all has been a good clubhouse presence so it should be noted that if indeed his days as a Pat are over , more than just his on-field play will be lost .

     That said , I for one am tired of athletes thinking what they do actual "matters ". THEY GET PAYED HANDSOMELY TO PLAY A GAME
    (while reaping the life long benefits of being in that exclusive club of ex PRO BALLPLAYER )

      I ' d still love to have the fences mended but barring that ...

    I say EF him .

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from OlderbutWiser. Show OlderbutWiser's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    $7 million per year sounds damn good to me. Third highest paid in the NFL at the position sounds damn good to me. Five, six, or seven years on contract sounds damn good to me, as I don't have a job at the moment.
    What do these folks think they accomplish for a living? Most people won't make more than $3 million in their entire working life.
    Sports players need to walk a mile in reality shoes.

    Goodbye, Mr. Mankins. Maybe Denver will pick you up? Has it already been discussed?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from dafoe. Show dafoe's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Maybe if he had shown up for the 07 Superbowl I would care. He's a guard- It would be stupid to give him huge money.

    And secondly, they spent all off season getting rid of guys with character issues. Why add another? Get rid of him for whatever you can get. He's is not,and never will be the difference between us winning a title or not. Guards are a dime a dozen.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Isn't Breer the tub who tried to expose the Pats' Rams videotaping on the eve of the Super Bowl?  Since when does he write for the globe?
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    OlderbutWiser 

    The phrase "Older but Wiser" is a corruption of a term William Wordsworth used to end his poem, "The Rhime of the Ancient Mariner," Which HAS been depicted INcorrectly throughout time: The ACTUAL phrase Wordsworth coined was/is "Older AND Wiser." 

    Big freakin' deal, right?  Well...actually it is.  Ya see William Wordsworth specifically used the terms "Older AND Wiser" together, on purpose.  By saying "Older BUT Wiser", It presupposes THAT:  O.k., You've gotten older, YET now- You've grown far wiser in the process.  See, there's a "weighing" of the 2 terms when you place the "but" between them...

    HOWever, IF you happen to say "Older AND Wiser," It sorta leaves an almost hollow, or empty feeling:  There is NO weighing of the terms using the "And" in between the two...It's like saying, "O.k., I HAVE Age & I HAVE Wisdom."  It leaves the reader (or listener) OF that addage, somewhat lacking when all's said and done...  AND guess what?  THIS is PRECISELY what Wordsworth wanted it to do.

    SEE, William Wordsworth's poem was about a Groom taking a boat ride en route to his Wedding.  The ship's Captain tells the bridegroom a long, tale about how the former ship-hands of the vessel they're on, STILL man their posts and do their duty as ghosts, WHICH they'll do through eternity. 

    NOW, the actual boring-#ss story that the Captain tells the Groom, Don't mean jack-cr#p...  What DOES matter, IS what the Groom's left with After HEARING the story...  The Groom Is a Older AND Wiser person.

    Wordsworth was Ultimately 100% ANTI-Morality in this particular case here.  Wordsworth was attempting to have and imbibe in his readers "A Suspension of their Disblief" so that the readers could "Imagine what could be" in the realm "Of the Ideal." 

    In otherwords, You, I and EVERYone through each of our Individual experiences, takes with us, An ENTIRE set baggage of judgements, presumptions, pretensions, etc., EACH & EVERY time we see, hear or jump into any new experince (including, reading Wordsworth's poem here for the first time)...  William Wordsworth, Ideally wanted each  ALL of Us To leave these things (presumptions & judgements from any & all past experiences)- BY the wayside...To "Suspend our Disbelief" on the journey he was taking us on...

    Words, Tales, Stories, Phrases- WHATever...ANY things that make us the wonderfully (hopefully) MORAL creatures we are, CAN- also In a sense, DEsensitize us, by bringing all their weight (presumptions, etc.), WHICH can and WILL, kill the air of the imaginative, & the realm of "what could be" rather than the "weight" of what we singularly believe, Actually Is.


    ~I, ahh- I just thought you should know this...    
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from viewer222. Show viewer222's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    To Logan Mankins<
    Fire your agent immediately!
    Pull a "Teddy Bruschi" and represent yourself.
    Your agent is not helping whether you think so or not.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Who knows the motivation for Mankins. Honestly, it seems like this goes beyond anything in a contract, he was pi s s ed as soon as they didn't step up immediately. Mankins is a rare type, very prideful and honest man, and it SEEMS he THINKS he was lied to and misled. To a person like Mankins, their is no bigger insult. I think his mind was made up to get out of town, period.

    That being said, NFL players I NEVER have a problem with holding out. They play the shortest number of years (compared to MLB/NBA/NHL) and are not given guaranteed contracts. Teams can decide to cut a player and pay no more money (just take a salary cap hit) so it's on the player to get, basically what they think they are worth, all up front. It's a bad system that leads to a LOT of bad blood. So, really, while I may not agree with Mankins, I CERTAINLY wish he was there as the Pats are better off with him, I can't be mad at the man. But he made his choice. All I can say is, I'm very disappointed it's gotten to this point.

    Thanks, Logan, for playing your balls off for 5 years. Hope success finds you...preferably where NE doesn't run into you.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

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    In Response to Re: Mankins Totally Lost?:
    [QUOTE]Isn't Breer the tub who tried to expose the Pats' Rams videotaping on the eve of the Super Bowl?  Since when does he write for the globe?
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]

    No no...ughhh...

    Do I really have to type out his name? He still works for the Herald...

    Ok ok ... Pig-faced John Tomase.

    I'm gonna go p...or vomit, as p u k e is apparently not allowed.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Mankins seems to think he was promised something a few years ago and the Pats' didn't keep that promise.  None of us know what really happened (or the full details of whatever the Pats' did finally offer Mankins), so it's impossible to judge who's right or wrong here.  Maybe neither--sometimes misunderstandings just happen. One person thinks he's being promised something and the other doesn't think he's making any promises.  Both firmly believe what they believe--they just believe different things.  

    Personally, I like Mankins.  I think he was a helluva player and from everything I've read a decent guy in the locker room, liked by both coaches and players. He does seem to have a lot of pride--and maybe that same pride made him both a hard worker and one who isn't going to backdown when he believes (accurately or not) that something was promised to him that wasn't delivered. 

    The interesting thing about the Mankins situation isn't really who's right or who's wrong in the contract dispute, it's about the Patriots' approach.  The Pats are famous for not paying (in either money or draft picks) more than they think a player is worth. This discipline has allowed them (in the Kraft era) to build consistently strong teams.  But they are tough negotiators who like to lock up rookies for long terms.  If the player turns out to be a good one, by year five or six, they are great bargains for the Pats.  The Pats end up getting a year or two of playing time at a price less than the player is really worth.  This causes problems when contract negotiations come up, because the player feels he was underpaid for a few years and wants the new contract to make up for that underpayment. If the Pats feel the player isn't worth quite as much as the player thinks he's worth, the problem gets even worse, because the player wants more than the Pats' want to offer based on his current skills, plus the player wants a premium to make up for the past one or two years when the player believes he was underpaid. This problem happened with Branch, with Samuel, and now with Mankins.  (To the Pats' credit for the real top line players--Brady, Seymour, and Wilfork--they step up and pay the bucks--it's the second-line players where they have problems.)

    Generally, the Pats' approach has helped the Pats, because they get players at a bargain late in their contract periods and they don't overpay for new players.  But it has a big downside.  More than once, they've ended up with contract disputes that have left them with big holes in their rosters.  The Branch situation left them pathetically weak at wide receiver for a season.  The Samuel situation still hasn't fully worked itself out as the Pats have been weak at corner for several seasons.  And losing Mankins threatens to leave the O-Line very thin.  A key injury on the O-Line could put the Pats in a tough position this year--especially given the problems they've had with both pass protection and run blocking in recent years.  Mankins may not be worth exactly what he's asking, but do the Pats have any backup plan to fill the hole he leaves?  I'm not sure they do--and this, I think, is a failure.  In my opinion, they would have been much smarter to recognize Mankins as a guy they wanted to keep two years ago and have addressed his contract then.  At that point, they probably could have signed him to something much more reasonable--and kept him happy.  Instead, they let him play for bargain dollars and then didn't offer him what he thought he was worth and what he deserved when he entered free agency.  So now they have a problem--and a hole in their roster--they really don't need.  

    Now there is a counter argument to this.  If you renegotiate early, you don't get those "bargain years" at the end of the player's contract and you take a risk that the player won't really develop into the solid player you are hoping for.  But it seems to me that the Pats need to do a better job of selectively identifying a few three or four- year players who look like they could be long-term contributors to the team and start to give them some money to keep them happy and to avoid a big problem at the end of the contract. If they had negotiated with Mankins two years ago, they might still have him at a price well below whatever it is they're offering him now. As it is, they got him cheap for two years and now have a choice between paying him more than they think he's worth or making due with a much weaker offensive line. 


     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Being honest since I have not been keeping up on this story I have a few comments:
    My taking care of you will be different from your view of "I'm taking care of you". Unless agreed to previously.
    I read the article and my first and last thought was "W T F is Mankins and his agent thinking?" Top 5 in OL pay and in this economy he won't be getting too many people standing behind him even if the NFL is chockful of money.
    Then he has to look at the alternatives play this year for far less and maybe some where else for even less. Then get franchised next year which always pizzes off the player.
    My take is the agent is looking for a bigger cut rather than looking out for the player.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    In Response to Re: Mankins Totally Lost?:
    [QUOTE]OlderbutWiser   The phrase " Older but Wiser " is a corruption of a term William Wordsworth used to end his poem, " The Rhime of the Ancient Mariner ," Which HAS been depicted INcorrectly throughout time: The ACTUAL phrase Wordsworth coined was/is " Older AND Wiser ."  Big freakin' deal, right?  Well...actually it is.  Ya see William Wordsworth specifically used the terms "Older AND Wiser" together, on purpose.  By saying "Older BUT Wiser", It presupposes THAT:  O.k., You've gotten older, YET now- You've grown far wiser in the process.  See, there's a "weighing" of the 2 terms when you place the "but" between them... HOWever, IF you happen to say "Older AND Wiser," It sorta leaves an almost hollow, or empty feeling:  There is NO weighing of the terms using the "And" in between the two...It's like saying, "O.k., I HAVE Age & I HAVE Wisdom."  It leaves the reader (or listener) OF that addage, somewhat lacking when all's said and done...  AND guess what?  THIS is PRECISELY what Wordsworth wanted it to do. SEE, William Wordsworth's poem was about a Groom taking a boat ride en route to his Wedding.  The ship's Captain tells the bridegroom a long, tale about how the former ship-hands of the vessel they're on, STILL man their posts and do their duty as ghosts, WHICH they'll do through eternity.  NOW, the actual boring-#ss story that the Captain tells the Groom, Don't mean jack-cr#p...  What DOES matter, IS what the Groom's left with After HEARING the story...  The Groom Is a Older AND Wiser person. Wordsworth was Ultimately 100% ANTI-Morality in this particular case here.  Wordsworth was attempting to have and imbibe in his readers "A Suspension of their Disblief" so that the readers could "Imagine what could be" in the realm "Of the Ideal."  In otherwords, You, I and EVERYone through each of our Individual experiences, takes with us, An ENTIRE set baggage of judgements, presumptions, pretensions, etc., EACH & EVERY time we see, hear or jump into any new experince (including, reading Wordsworth's poem here for the first time)...  William Wordsworth, Ideally wanted each  ALL of Us To leave these things (presumptions & judgements from any & all past experiences)- BY the wayside...To "Suspend our Disbelief" on the journey he was taking us on... Words, Tales, Stories, Phrases- WHATever...ANY things that make us the wonderfully (hopefully) MORAL creatures we are, CAN- also In a sense, DEsensitize us, by bringing all their weight (presumptions, etc.), WHICH can and WILL, kill the air of the imaginative, & the realm of "what could be" rather than the "weight" of what we singularly believe, Actually Is. ~ I, ahh- I just thought you should know this...    
    Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium[/QUOTE]


    Like your flair, but ROTAM is a poem by Samuel Taylor Coleridge, as is the saying "willing suspension of disbelief" from the Biographia Literaria which is less about being didactic and having a cathartic experience and more about sacrificing the desire to ling to a idea of reality in exchange for being entertained. 
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from kildog. Show kildog's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Chiming in late. 
    Bauer is a huge part of this problem.  Turning to the media when he can't get what he expects at the bargaining table.  How much he has been manipulating Mankins and goading him into a really negative attitude is a factor in this process. 
    Once Mankins gets on a track he sticks to it whether its blocking an opponent or dealing with life.  He gets mad and then he commits to the process whatever it is.  Good attributes of an effective lineman; determination, intractability and irascibility. 
    Unfortunately negotiations are not a win/lose situation. 
    This feels like an attempt to overpower managementand have your way with them.  Will miss Mankins presence on the field, but I don't see him settling any time soon.
     
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    To correct this. I am not trying to give the impression that Mankins is a bad guy for trying to parlay his ability and accomplishments into as much cash as he can. Bob Kraft is far less talented and contributes far less to the running value of the team than Mankins, and he has no qualms about trying to nickel and dime everyone else. 

    I just didn't think that Mankins would be the one to hold it up over a small portion of salary. I am incline in this instance to believe ownership purely for the reason that agents are the biggest vampires in these situations and sometimes actually lead their clients into detrimental courses of action for the sake of making a hair more on commission. His agent sounds like another t00l who wants to make money without doing anything, and in the end is more likely to harm Mankins than anything else considering the Pats have all the cards to ensure he never makes it to the open market. 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from p-mike. Show p-mike's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    In Response to Re: Mankins Totally Lost?:
    [QUOTE]OlderbutWiser   The phrase " Older but Wiser " is a corruption of a term William Wordsworth used to end his poem, " The Rhime of the Ancient Mariner ," Which HAS been depicted INcorrectly throughout time: The ACTUAL phrase Wordsworth coined was/is " Older AND Wiser ."  Big freakin' deal, right?  Well...actually it is.  Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium[/QUOTE]

    No, it's not.

    And the Rime of the Ancient Mariner was written by Samuel Taylor Coleridge.

    From a guy who likes to wax poetic as much as you do, Laz, I find this error unacceptable.







     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Mankins Totally Lost?

    Trade him
     
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