NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

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    NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    This is funny

    Rotoworld ranked Patriots as the #2 O-line in 2012..and this is our single biggest concern today !!!


     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]This is funny Rotoworld ranked Patriots as the #2 O-line in 2012..and this is our single biggest concern today !!! http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40484/179/2012-offensive-line-rankings
    Posted by PatFanInBA2[/QUOTE]

    Monday, May 7th article?
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    With Waters and a healthy Mankins and Vollmer.  Maybe.

    Solder full time at the left tackle position is not a given.  But I think in time,  he will be fine.  Hopefully Brady dosen't get killed in the meantime.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]This is funny Rotoworld ranked Patriots as the #2 O-line in 2012..and this is our single biggest concern today !!! http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/40484/179/2012-offensive-line-rankings
    Posted by PatFanInBA2[/QUOTE]


    based on what? last season's performance? three of five starters -- light, mankins, waters (until he shows up, i consider him out) -- are out. last year's performance barely has any bearing on this year's.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    Just another example of how useless rankings are.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    Being that it was written last May they would probably rank our defense very low. IMO the D will be very good this year. 
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    I have two reasons for saying that the old Rotoworld article isn't that far off.  First, we're not seeing the real offensive line.  Second, preseason is full of outright fraud across the NFL and the Patriots are one of the leaders of the pack.

    Mankins was strictly limited to 12 snaps last night.  Moreover, the real offensive line doesn't have a rusty Logan Mankins.  It has a Mankins working at full speed. 

    The real offensive line has a healthy Sebastian Vollmer.  He's coming along.

    Solder is a second year but he only got half a training camp last year.  His rookie mechanical errors appear to be correctable.  Cannon got even less rookie practice than Solder.  He couldn't practice with the team until after week 6 of the regular season.

    I'm amassing a pretty long agenda of terrible plays committed by the Patriots, and by Tom Brady in particular, in the third game of preseason.  I started to get suspicious when underdogggggg pointed out, don't judge the Colts by their preseason, and he was right.  Then in the third preseason game of 2010 I saw some truly ugly plays by the Pats. 

    "Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing." -  Red Sanders, borrowed by Vince Lombardi.  Preseason victories have almost no influence on regular season games or on playoff runs.  If anything, preseason victories nudge a team in the direction of regular season losses.  So, a good coach loses preseason games, within limits.  I suspect that Bill Belichick stole the idea of losing in preseason from the Colts.  In any case, when the third preseason game of 2011 came around, I expected bad plays.  Sure enough, Brady threw a perfect pick-six interception ball right at the cornerback, and the cornerback dropped it.  The very next play, no messing around here, he threw an interception over the middle.  Best to get these things out of the way early.  I also saw an uncharacteristic fumble by Kevin Faulk in that game.  None of the borderline players messed up.  It was all the veterans. 

    This time I was forecasting a rash of butt-ugly plays on the Pats-Bucs game thread Friday night.  Here's what I wrote.

    "1.  Tom Brady will toss a pass directly to a cornerback on an out pattern for a pick-six, just like last year's third game.  The difference this year is that the turkey will actually catch that ball. 

    2.  We need either Mallett or Hoyer to toss a second int just like last year.  I'd give Mallett the honors.  He's an established guy now. 

    2.  We need a running back to fumble the ball where it might possibly be picked up and returned for a touchdown, just like last year.  The other team fumbled that opportunity too. "

    Except for my numbering typo, reality wasn't far off.  First, I watched the Patriots linemen double-team a fairly lightweight looking defensive end around to the back side of Tom Brady, nice and close.  Then the two of them just let the nice man go free.  He ran forward without much acceleration, stripped the ball, fumble!, and tackled Brady pretty gently because he had been released at just the right spot. 

    Sadly, the Patriots got the ball back.  So, next, Brady dropped back to pass and whipped the ball straight at a defensive lineman's shoulder like a rookie with bad aim.  The nice lineman put his arm high in the air to tip the pass, and the pass bounced off of his upper arm, not off of his fingertips.  Sadly, no Tampa Bay player came down with the ball.  Rats!

    So, the very next play, Brady throws the ball where a defensive backfield player can get his fingertips on it.  The ball tips up in the air and Tampa Bay runs it back for a touchdown.  Callou, callay, o frabjous day!

    I'm not an expert on the defense because my rabbit ears TV doesn't show defensive positioning until the receiver catches the ball.  However, I'm willing to speculate that Tampa Bay threw some nice passes because the Patriots defensive backfield left the receivers open early.  The team's goal was to get behind by two touchdowns, so as to not look good.  BB was buddy-buddy with the Bucs' coach, and the Bucs need to put fans in the seats, so why not set up a gentleman's agreement?
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]I have two reasons for saying that the old Rotoworld article isn't that far off.  First, we're not seeing the real offensive line.  Second, preseason is full of outright fraud across the NFL and the Patriots are one of the leaders of the pack. Mankins was strictly limited to 12 snaps last night.  Moreover, the real offensive line doesn't have a rusty Logan Mankins.  It has a Mankins working at full speed.  The real offensive line has a healthy Sebastian Vollmer.  He's coming along. Solder is a second year but he only got half a training camp last year.  His rookie mechanical errors appear to be correctable.  Cannon got even less rookie practice than Solder.  He couldn't practice with the team until after week 6 of the regular season. I'm amassing a pretty long agenda of terrible plays committed by the Patriots, and by Tom Brady in particular, in the third game of preseason.  I started to get suspicious when underdogggggg pointed out, don't judge the Colts by their preseason, and he was right.  Then in the third preseason game of 2010 I saw some truly ugly plays by the Pats.  "Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing." -  Red Sanders, borrowed by Vince Lombardi.  Preseason victories have almost no influence on regular season games or on playoff runs.  If anything, preseason victories nudge a team in the direction of regular season losses.  So, a good coach loses preseason games, within limits.  I suspect that Bill Belichick stole the idea of losing in preseason from the Colts.  In any case, when the third preseason game of 2011 came around, I expected bad plays.  Sure enough, Brady threw a perfect pick-six interception ball right at the cornerback, and the cornerback dropped it.  The very next play, no messing around here, he threw an interception over the middle.  Best to get these things out of the way early.  I also saw an uncharacteristic fumble by Kevin Faulk in that game.  None of the borderline players messed up.  It was all the veterans.  This time I was forecasting a rash of butt-ugly plays on the Pats-Bucs game thread Friday night.  Here's what I wrote. "1.  Tom Brady will toss a pass directly to a cornerback on an out pattern for a pick-six, just like last year's third game.  The difference this year is that the turkey will actually catch that ball.  2.  We need either Mallett or Hoyer to toss a second int just like last year.  I'd give Mallett the honors.  He's an established guy now.  2.  We need a running back to fumble the ball where it might possibly be picked up and returned for a touchdown, just like last year.  The other team fumbled that opportunity too. " Except for my numbering typo, reality wasn't far off.  First, I watched the Patriots linemen double-team a fairly lightweight looking defensive end around to the back side of Tom Brady, nice and close.  Then the two of them just let the nice man go free.  He ran forward without much acceleration, stripped the ball, fumble!, and tackled Brady pretty gently because he had been released at just the right spot.  Sadly, the Patriots got the ball back.  So, next, Brady dropped back to pass and whipped the ball straight at a defensive lineman's shoulder like a rookie with bad aim.  The nice lineman put his arm high in the air to tip the pass, and the pass bounced off of his upper arm, not off of his fingertips.  Sadly, no Tampa Bay player came down with the ball.  Rats! So, the very next play, Brady throws the ball where a defensive backfield player can get his fingertips on it.  The ball tips up in the air and Tampa Bay runs it back for a touchdown.  Callou, callay, o frabjous day! I'm not an expert on the defense because my rabbit ears TV doesn't show defensive positioning until the receiver catches the ball.  However, I'm willing to speculate that Tampa Bay threw some nice passes because the Patriots defensive backfield left the receivers open early.  The team's goal was to get behind by two touchdowns, so as to not look good.  BB was buddy-buddy with the Bucs' coach, and the Bucs need to put fans in the seats, so why not set up a gentleman's agreement?
    Posted by Paul_K[/QUOTE]

    Are you saying that Brady intentionally threw a pick 6 

    And are you suggesting that he got whacked intentionally?

    And these are Brady's master plan or Belichick's or both?

     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    I don't believe New England fans will see Koppen around the team this season. He is to slow and and age has finally caught up with him in an important position. Dan Connolly or Ryan Wendell will likely take his place. I could see Connolly at Center if Brian Waters comes back and plays RG.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    They've looked like a number 2 lately.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld) : Are you saying that Brady intentionally threw a pick 6  And are you suggesting that he got whacked intentionally ? And these are Brady's master plan or Belichick's or both?
    Posted by PatFanInBA2[/QUOTE]
    I'm saying that Brady has been throwing intentional pick sixes for years in preseason games. 

    I normally wouldn't expect Brady to get whacked intentionally, but if he was going to get whacked, that was the best-engineered possible play for him to get whacked softly --  the right double team, the right defensive guy, the right release location for the defensive guy so he couldn't get a running start on the quarterback.  Brady is quite solidly built versus most quarterbacks, versus little Michael Vick for example.  I'll add that it was the perfect spot on the field for a strip and a score, but that part didn't quite work out.  I think that Brady could put up with a humiliating bump, not much of a whack, for the team's preseason statistics.  Finally, the timing, very early in the game, first team against first team, was an optimal impact time for the press and possibly for scouts.  Later in the game Coach Belichick could insert random offensive and defensive players so that his "first string" team wasn't quite up to par, but the first series out was the important series. 

    Belichick is the master planner.  He directs other players to make the same goofs, but Brady especially because Brady gets all the scrutiny.

    Do the Patriots have weaknesses?  Yes, but they're badly overblown.  That's deliberate.  Call it conspiratorial if you wish.  I know that football coaches are hired to misdirect the opponent sometimes, and that BB is proud of his work.

    Would you like to root for the Jets, Bills or Fish instead?  I don't think so.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld) : I'm saying that Brady has been throwing intentional pick sixes for years in preseason games.  I normally wouldn't expect Brady to get whacked intentionally, but if he was going to get whacked, that was the best-engineered possible play for him to get whacked softly --  the right double team, the right defensive guy, the right release location for the defensive guy so he couldn't get a running start on the quarterback.  Brady is quite solidly built versus most quarterbacks, versus little Michael Vick for example.  I'll add that it was the perfect spot on the field for a strip and a score, but that part didn't quite work out.  I think that Brady could put up with a humiliating bump, not much of a whack, for the team's preseason statistics.  Finally, the timing, very early in the game, first team against first team, was an optimal impact time for the press and possibly for scouts.  Later in the game Coach Belichick could insert random offensive and defensive players so that his "first string" team wasn't quite up to par, but the first series out was the important series.  Belichick is the master planner.  He directs other players to make the same goofs, but Brady especially because Brady gets all the scrutiny. Do the Patriots have weaknesses?  Yes, but they're badly overblown.  That's deliberate.  Call it conspiratorial if you wish.  I know that football coaches are hired to misdirect the opponent sometimes, and that BB is proud of his work. Would you like to root for the Jets, Bills or Fish instead?  I don't think so.
    Posted by Paul_K[/QUOTE]

    Sorry Paul - to think that Brady threw a pick 6 and took a sack intentionally as part of a master plan is way too crazy for me..

    We will have to respectfully disagree..

    Root for the Jets (or bills or Fins)? I'd rather go swim in a piranha infested river...and i am not a very good swimmer..



     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]They've looked like a number 2 lately.
    Posted by shenanigan[/QUOTE]
    Surprised Brady was not carrying a toilet paper roll on his belt during games!!!  (-;
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    I am doubtful either Belichick or by extension McDaniels would use their best plays in the pre-season. The pre-season is usually time to experiment and see which plays can be run effectively with certain personel (and evaluating certain personel). Provide constructive criticism and move on. I'd be happier if the defense peaked in mid-December in contrast to holding the Bucs to under 10 points in a pre-season game. BB never struck as the type of coach that tips his hand. Not even at times with his players...the teaching component is always gradual, but when the Pats get inevitably thrown into the fire the players will be prepared to execute the gameplan and make adjustments. A healthy Mankins and Vollmer would be ideal for the O Line.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    I wonder what the majority of this board would have ranked the Pats O-line after game 3 of pre season last year? You know, the one where the Lions kicked the snot out of Brady.

    Try not to lie and tell us what you expected from that line, and what actually happened. In case you forgot they also ended up the 2nd rated O-line for the 2011 season.

    This is a new year and we have a different group of talent, but make no mistake, we do indeed have talent. I can't help but to be confident that this positional group is not a problem. We might want to be concerned with the Vareen injury and only having 1 true power RB with 80 something carries under his belt. In case you missed it, Tom Brady turned 35 last month.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In response to "Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)": [QUOTE]I wonder what the majority of this board would have ranked the Pats O-line after game 3 of pre season last year? You know, the one where the Lions kicked the snot out of Brady. Try not to lie and tell us what you expected from that line, and what actually happened. In case you forgot they also ended up the 2nd rated O-line for the 2011 season. This is a new year and we have a different group of talent, but make no mistake, we do indeed have talent. I can't help but to be confident that this positional group is not a problem. We might want to be concerned with the Vareen injury and only having 1 true power RB with 80 something carries under his belt. In case you missed it, Tom Brady turned 35 last month. Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE] Why do you keep comparing last years line to this one? I don't recall there being a panic about the line last year despite the way they got handled in Detroit last year - we knew we had Light and Mankins. It's a different year. I do think the line will improve, but you can't tell me you're not concerned.
     
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    Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)

    In Response to Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld):
    [QUOTE]In response to "Re: NE Pats O-line ranked #2 in NFL - 2012 (Rotoworld)": Why do you keep comparing last years line to this one? I don't recall there being a panic about the line last year despite the way they got handled in Detroit last year - we knew we had Light and Mankins. It's a different year. I do think the line will improve, but you can't tell me you're not concerned.
    Posted by mthurl[/QUOTE]

    You're kidding me. This board was up in arms. "Matt Light is done", "We had to pick up the Chiefs garbage", "We reached on Solder", "Koppen should be cut", "Volmer is always injured"........"We have no depth"

    We were doomed after the Lions game, and no, I am honestly not concerned with how we looked in this pre-season game at all.
     
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