Patrick Chung

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from pyegian. Show pyegian's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    It's laughable to  draw conclusions from a guy's rookie year in which he is learning a complex defense, where he needs to be able to read and react extremely quickly.  The reason a lot of defenders don't play huge roles in their first year in the NFL, especially in a complex defense, is because their reaction time to plays is slowed because they are THINKING the plays through.  Once the second and third years come, they are just reacting instinctively.  

    Chung played 22% of defensive snaps last year, which means he basically played just over 3 full NFL games of defense.  Meriweather, Sanders, and McGowan played over him because they are veterans who were more ready to play at the time.  It's that simple.  I have no idea how good of a safety Chung will turn into but it's laughable to say he can't cover based on about 150 snaps during his rookie season.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung : Patrick Chung : That's a pretty strong opinion considering the lack of any examples.  For a player that was 'beaten repeadedly' you should be able to site some examples.   RESPONSE: What examples must I give? The fact that the guy wasn't playing much speaks volumes.   

    YOUR RESPONSE: It speaks nothing;

    MY REPLY: LOL!! If the guy was as great as you say, why wasn't he playing more?

    YOUR RESPONSE: the kid was a rookie trying to learn a complex defense. Again, please provide examples of how he was beaten repeatedly? With your argument, any DB that doesn’t immediately come in and play lacks the ability to cover. You also can't discount his pick against Tenn just to suit your argument, production is production.

    MY REPLY: The kid was horrible in coverage. That's why he didn't play. It wasn't because he's "learning a complex defense". He was too slow, and wasn't athletic enough to keep up with NFL WRs. This article belies you're assertion that the defense was too complicated for him: http://www.nesn.com/2010/04/patrick-chung-on-a-mission-in-patriots-secondary.html

    RESPONSE: Surely you jest. That's like saying that a RB who averages 5-plus yards a carry against a prevent defense is equivalent to him doing the same, when playing against a standard set....or a QB who passes for big yardage against the 3rd string defense, as opposed to the first stringers. After all, production is production, right?? Cut it out.


    YOUR RESPONSE: None of this is relevant to VY throwing a pick on his first series with the Titan’s first string skill guys still in the game or were Crumpler, Nate Washington and Chris Johnson not first stringers?   That was VY's 1st series at QB, you're assuming he wasn't trying?
     
    MY REPLY: At the time Young threw that pickto  Chung, the score was 59-0! It was clearly GARBAGE TIME!! 

    YOUR RESPONSE:  Oh no kidding, you know if you look back, Chris Johnson was still carrying the ball after the Chung pick, guess he’s not a first stringer.  The pass he picked off was intended for Alge Crumpler, also a first stringer and later in the 4 th he attempted a pass to Nate Washington who was also a first stringer.   That same hapless Tennessee team went on to win 8 of its final 10 games. Spare me the koolaid BS.....

    MY REPLY: It was garbage time. Are you seriously trying to argue that the  intensity level is the same as when it's a ball-game?

    YOUR RESPONSE: Again, what ever you need to do to make your argument, (outside of an example of Chung’s lack of ability in coverage) you do it.

    MY REPLY: Your argument seems to be that Chung making an interception during garbage time shows that he's a good player. That's absurd.  

    You might as well attempt humor to defer attention away from your lack of an argument or any examples to back it up

    MY REPLY: The guy was awful in coverage...as was the Pats' "D". That's why he didn't play. Don't you think that if he played as well as you imply, that BB would have used him more? 

    Posted by mbeaulieu07
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    Cut Sanders? Are you nuts? The defense came together only after Sanders became the starter. And Mighty I love you bro but seriously you are out of your f*cking mind if you think Meriwhether needs to be cut. He is one of the best guys we have on defense and will be a gamer for years to come. When a guy liek Rodney Harrison has nothing but good things to say about him, and calls him the leader of the defense how can you sh*t on him? I am going to guess that Rodney knows a little more then you or me about playing safety in this league and he loves Meriwhether and his play so what is your problem?
    Posted by MVPKilla2009


    Merriweather can't tackle, blows coverages and gets lots of interceptions.  I'd rather have a guy who will tackle consistently than a ball hawk.  And there were multiple reports of attitude problems.  And everyone is praising him and voting him to the pro bowl, which will get to his head, and he'll be cocky, and only think about getting interceptions for the sake of his next contract. 

    Rodney can say whatever he wants but that doesn't help Mary's tackling.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung : Merriweather can't tackle, blows coverages and gets lots of interceptions.  I'd rather have a guy who will tackle consistently than a ball hawk.  And there were multiple reports of attitude problems.  And everyone is praising him and voting him to the pro bowl, which will get to his head, and he'll be cocky, and only think about getting interceptions for the sake of his next contract.  Rodney can say whatever he wants but that doesn't help Mary's tackling.
    Posted by themightypatriotz


         Agree to an extent. His tackling needs to improve. But, if you're trying to imply that Chung is a better player...spare me.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    Tex, I think you are a better player than Merriweather.  Anyone who tries 100% and doesn't dance around on the field right up until the snap and doesn't laugh about losing is a better player than Maryweather.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    Tex, I think you are a better player than Merriweather.  Anyone who tries 100% and doesn't dance around on the field right up until the snap and doesn't laugh about losing is a better player than Maryweather.
    Posted by themightypatriotz


         I don't kknow about that, Mighty One. It's been many moons since I ran my 5.25 fourty...LOL!! 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

         With regaards to Chung, and the Pats' scouting department, this article from a year ago seems right on: http://confessionalpoet.typepad.com/cursed_to_first/2009/06/patrick-chung-and-a-defensive-genius-like-bill-belichick.html
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

         Here's more on Chung: http://network.yardbarker.com/NFL/article_external/Chung_is_hoping_to_take_his_game_to_the_next_level_next_season_for_the_Pats/2430424

         I guess hope springs eternal. This from Jim Donaldson of the Providence Journal, after BB selected Chung with the 34th overall pick:


         "We trust that safety Patrick Chung of Oregon, a heavy lifter in the weight room and a hard hitter on the field, will improve the New England secondary. It may further boost your confidence to know that he is no relation to Eugene Chung, who was taken 13th overall by New England in the first round in 1992 but proved to be nothing more than a journeyman offensive lineman in an undistinguished NFL career."

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from btownteamsrking. Show btownteamsrking's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    i really have no Judgment on Chung. I remember him sacking the QB and intercepting VY in a game that was over from the start. Other than that, I really didnt see him much. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    I personally rarely expect ANY DBs to make a major role for themselves in the 1st year.  Most take 2-3 years to get going and up to speed.  Kind of like WRs.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    TexPats, you're an idiot. I waited to reply until I had read all your posts. 

    I remember bad secondary play-- Meriweather whiffs, Sanders playing like a turtle, Wilhite just being awful, and Springs being old-- but I can't remember Chung ever blowing coverage, but that's mostly because he wasn't asked to cover that much. 

    When is a SS asked to cover a WR? -_-.... NEVER! I don't know what kind of player Chung will be, but I know he showed me enough to say 'hmmm...' last season.  He reminds me of what Polamalu and Rodney's kid would look like if they were cloned. Chung and Meriweather, assuming he can learn how to wrap up the opponent, will be the best safties in the AFC, and even the NFL.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from mbeaulieu07. Show mbeaulieu07's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung :
    Posted by TexasPat3


    Please feel free to provide an example....any example of him getting "beaten repeatedly" in coverage during the regular season. 

    Him not playing a ton as a rookie (or as much as you think the #34 overall pick should have) does nothing to prove that he's "awful" in coverage.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimNotJimmy. Show JimNotJimmy's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    Chung can cover pretty well, atleast what I saw this year (every game). I'm not gonna put him in Canton yet or say he's the next Rodney Harrison but he's shown flashes of becoming a great player! He looks like he'll be a solid tackler and good overall safety with big play capability. BB never likes to throw rookies in there right away so I don't know why people expect the rookies to contribute right away. Seymore didn't start until half way through his rookie season i believe and back then we didn't have much depth at DT which is what he played until we switched to 3-4.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatFanInBA2. Show PatFanInBA2's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung :
    Posted by TexasPat3


    Texas Pat: I am generally a fan of your posts - especially your report cards.

    I am not enough of an expert to challenge you on your characterization of Chung - except your calling him slow. Unless my memory is wrong, one specific example comes to mind - against the Colts - the guy was a missile and sacked Manning. But, the unbiased referees called a 'roughing the passer' penalty on him.. 

    This guy was incredibly fast - anybody else remember that play? 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from thejoshuatree28. Show thejoshuatree28's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung : Texas Pat: I am generally a fan of your posts - especially your report cards. I am not enough of an expert to challenge you on your characterization of Chung - except your calling him slow. Unless my memory is wrong, one specific example comes to mind - against the Colts - the guy was a missile and sacked Manning. But, the unbiased referees called a 'roughing the passer' penalty on him..  This guy was incredibly fast - anybody else remember that play? 
    Posted by PatFanInBA2


    I remember the play I don't know against who, but it was a BS call, he practically form tackled him
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from NEforever. Show NEforever's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    I remeber seeing that play, nailed manning and it was a 15 yrd penalty.
    Chung can only get better!
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    Texas Pat just likes to bash the Pats and get people riled up so he can write his point-counterpoint diatribes that make him look good to himself. Otherwise he would realize that since he is asking others to accept his opinion as fact he should expect to have to back it up with facts. He obviously is unwilling to do so and as such his opinion is, in reality, moot. He just doesn't know it. 
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pancakespwn. Show Pancakespwn's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    He will probably have a up and down season but the pieces will come together. Hes a talented young man who is a student of the game. This is a guy where football is his life and he loves it he wants to compete. I think Brandon Meriweathers game overall is going to improve alot and hes going to be more consistent on a week to week basis. 

    Chung is going to provide alot for this team. Hes going to be in the box, out in the deep parts of the field covering, the slot, blitzing, and just being overall more vocal. Hes a guy the Pats need to do well this year. 
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung : Texas Pat: I am generally a fan of your posts - especially your report cards. I am not enough of an expert to challenge you on your characterization of Chung - except your calling him slow. Unless my memory is wrong, one specific example comes to mind - against the Colts - the guy was a missile and sacked Manning. But, the unbiased referees called a 'roughing the passer' penalty on him..  This guy was incredibly fast - anybody else remember that play? 
    Posted by PatFanInBA2


         What does this sack play have to do with Chung's ability to cover? I never said that the guy couldn't hit, or couldn't tackle. But, based on what I've seen, he just can't cover NFL caliber receivers.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    I think Chung had a solid 1st year given the amount of playing time. 30 something total tackles, 2 sacks and 1 interception is nothing to sneeze at.
     
    RESPONSE: Well...excuse me while I sneeze. We're talking about a guy selected 34th overall...not a 5th, or later round pick. Thirty tackles in 16 games averages out to about 2 per game. Sorry, but that suuccks. Unfortunately, closer scrutiny of Chung's alleged "fine" stats paints even a darker picture. Chung finished with 37 tackles, of which 25 were solos, and one interception. The pick came when the Pats were "nursing" a 59-0 lead against the then winless Tennessee Titans. Of his tackles, approximately one-third of them (12 tackles, 8 solos) were registered during garbage time in blow-out wins against Tennessee (59-0) and the then winless Tampa Bay Buccaneers (35-7). That means that in the remaining 14 games, Chung registered just 25 tackles, 17 solos, and had no interceptions.    

    I see him making a big leap in year 2, and I think will be a solid contributor on D as well as special teams.

    RESPONSE: Based on Chung's allergy inducing stats, what causes you to have such hopes?

    I would not be surprised if he starts next year..either at the beginning or somewhere close to it.
     
    RESPONSE: If he does, the Pats' "D" is in huge trouble.

    I think he is a good tackler, good at the line and will improve in coverage.
     
    RESPONSE: Yes, he can tackle. But he simply can't cover.

    He has the speed, and instinct, just needs more time in the system.

    RESPONSE: The 34th overall pick should have those tools. But, unfortunately, Chung failed to show them in his rookie year.  

    I think this will be the case for a lot of the year 1/2 guys. 
    Posted by PatsLifer


    RESPONSE: I really want to be wrong here...but, sorry. Based on what I've seen, Chung is a bust.
        
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung : RESPONSE: I really want to be wrong here...but, sorry. Based on what I've seen, Chung is a bust.     
    Posted by TexasPat3

    I think you are way premature here.  Chung didn't see alot of playing time last year and that's primarily the reason he doesn't have big stats.  He was fighting for time during his rookie year against a Pro Bowler and two good vets.  I wouldn't expect much more than what I saw.  He came in a few times to get experience , played OK, and learned some things.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    Texas Pat just likes to bash the Pats and get people riled up so he can write his point-counterpoint diatribes that make him look good to himself. Otherwise he would realize that since he is asking others to accept his opinion as fact he should expect to have to back it up with facts. He obviously is unwilling to do so and as such his opinion is, in reality, moot. He just doesn't know it. 
    Posted by rtuinila


         You want facts? Check Chung's feeble stats, which I've posted above.

         You really think that I enjoy bashing the Pats? No one on this forum has defended the Patriots more than I through the spygate BS, against trolls, and against the Ron Borges types. I staunchly defended Laurance Maroney until last season, when he came down with an unforgivable case of fumble-itis. I've vigorously defended Randy Moss...and have supported BB in his controversial personnel moves involving Lawyer Milloy, Ty Law, Deion Branch, Willie McGinest, "Benedict" Adam Vinatieri, Asante Samuel, and Richard Seymour. I've also defended the Patriots' drafts, until the past couple of years.

         I haven't blindly defend the Pats in the above matters. I did so because I honestly believed that they were right. But...I call 'em as I see 'em...and a series of poor drafts has crippled this team. 

         My criticisms allow me to vent!! Furthermore, my hope is that my criticisms might serve to create awareness among fellow Patriot fans...in hopes that a loud enough fan outcry might, albeit in a small way, assist in speeding along necessary changes in the personnel department. 

         If you don't think that the Pats have drafted poorly over the past few years, then please read this: http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_3204_Belichick_umpteen-uples_down_on_DBs_in_the_draft_.html   
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung:
    In Response to Re: Patrick Chung :      What does this sack play have to do with Chung's ability to cover? I never said that the guy couldn't hit, or couldn't tackle. But, based on what I've seen, he just can't cover NFL caliber receivers.
    Posted by TexasPat3


    What SS in the NFL is asked to cover a WR? NONE! Chung will be asked to cover TEs or play zones. His cover skills don't really matter, even though I can't remember cursing Chung last season. And I remember cursing alot of secondary play, especially Wilhite.

    TexasPat, are you sure you don't have Chung confused with Wilhite?


    Chung wears 25, Wilhite wears 24. I can see how you can be confused.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jcour382. Show jcour382's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    you know that dude who posts under "mostfansarestupid" ...hmmmmmnnnnnnnn at first i thought that name was kinda strong...but as time has gone on....

    patriots defense is complex...im not concerned about chung at all... sanders is slow to point of attack, merriweather still makes a lot of mistakes, has hands of stone yet made probowl go figure...mcgowan is an excellent hitter and forced two fumbles early in the season by putting his nose on the ball....i think he didnt know defense well and his time got scaled back later on so theres alot to be said for knowing the defense. i think chung will definately blossom this season  

    but again it brings me back to that guy that posts under "mostfansarestupid"

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Patrick Chung

    TexasPat,

    I don't think many can argue that the Pats could have drafted better the last few years. But, I would not lump Chung in the category of drafted poorly. 

    As a rookie, and given the amount of opportunity he had (when he was on the field), I think his numbers firmly support a pretty successful rookie year. Combine that with 13 special teams tackles and I would say the guy did quite well. To say he had "feeble stats" is not factual. He played roughly 150 snaps. 30 something combined tackles, 2 sacks and an interception...you call this feeble? Your notion of interceptions not counting because it's garbage time is wrong too. If that is the case, lets pull all stats from all players when it is "garbage time" and write these off the books. The kid can't control when he plays, only how he plays. And given his opportunities to play, I woudl say he performed quite well. Stats support it.

    This notion that he is slow and can't cover is nonsense. The kid runs a 4.45 or close to it. Plus, he is not being asked to match up man on man with WR's the same way CB's do. He clearly is better playing on the line or close to it, and I imagine his coverage skills will be much better this year with a year in the system. He has the speed and ability to be a good cover safety as well as one who plays on the line. 

    Ok, what changes in the personnel department are you advocating? Dumping Chung, Maroney, Moss, etc.?


     
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