Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Boy, are you going to get beat up!

    I think it obvious that we are in a rebuilding mode.  With the flush of great veterans on defense last year I think the writing was on the wall.  Then the two WRs didn't pan out and that hurt a bunch.

    You are being overly cynical.  We haven't had the draft yet and yes I'm depending on this draft a bunch.  The Pats can get through this alright if they draft certain spots like DE, OLB, RB and TE with the first 4 picks.  DEs are suppose to be deep so maybe you can grab one up later, maybe a WR instead.

    The Clay Matthews thing bugs me.  I find it very after the fact.  Nobody complained about passing this guy up last year.  The cry was for the passing up of Maualuga. Matthews starts putting it together at the end of the season and here come the whiners.  How many players down the road will we complain about not getting if they turn out well?

    There are some good points in there like about the OL.  I hope there's something good down the line in this years draft like a big center who can take on these 3-4 defenses we're starting to see.

     
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1021us. Show m1021us's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Wow....someone over analyzes things.....BIG TIME!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaBlade. Show DaBlade's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Rebuilding, reloading all the same thing as far as I am concerned because the way the NFL is constructed you can "rebuild" and be competative even challenge for a championship at the same time.  I don't see it as bare as you do...

    The coaching is fine, front office I think is poretty solid Casserio I think will show us Pioli was no genious.  (not saying I disliked Pioli just he isn't the sole reason we won the championships.) 

    Special teams have been an issue on the punting and returning side in my opinion for a couple years and this draft should rectify that with a Top notch punter (3 possibly 4 available) and I still stand by my prediction we get CJ he fills so many needs for us and is a guy that makes our offense unpredictable and dangerous.


       Now as far as the offense goes yeah I am fine with Hoyer as the back up but he isn't the future unless the Patriots don't plan on signing Brady (Kraft says otherwise so I am not worried there). We won't be drafting his replacement for at least 3 years.

       RB is a place where I am not happy but I think this draft takes care of that.

       TE is not vacant far from it Crumpler will be the main stay and teacher for a young group including one that will surely be drafted as TE is a strength in this draft we should be able to get one maybe as late as the 4th that will develop along side Crumpler... and there will be a couple available in the June on free agency period.

        OL... well that is in flux.  I look at it like this if they keep Mankins they have the pieces to build it into a big strength with one more piece added through the draft. Vollmer solidifies one OT spot, Mankins a OG spot and if we need to keep Light for one more year before replacing him the Patriots will be fine like that. As for the other OG and Koppen will be fine for one more year unless we find a replacement in the draft.

    WR is an area I am unsure of... Moss will certainly be playing top of his game this year being a contract year and who knows if he stays after that or not. We have sole solid youththere in Edelman and Tate and Welker will hopefully return and be a help at the position as well. I suspect there will be some additions FA/ or Draft or even both there. 

    Defense needs a DE and OLB but beyond that (both can be had in this deep draft) they are not too bad off. I think it is unbfair to say Warren has pulled a Steven Neal as Warren has been getting doubles on a lot of the plays I have watched due to the pressure decrease from other places along the line.  
     
    I may be wrong here but I think ILB will be a strength with McKenzie... I see big things coming from him, Guyton is a quality backup.

    OLB is an area of need and I think that is a need that will be taken care of at the Draft.     
          
    Secondary is not an issue we need to worry about. While they have spent some bullets in the past there it doesn't really affect any of their potential moves this year and on as the uncapped year kind of solved that problem.
          
    I agree if the Patriots want to be in the mix for another championship this year they need a solid draft and they need to get 4 quality starters from it and a few that can develop as things go.

    They need their young developing players to step up like McKenzie, Chung and Tate... Crable would be a bonus but I am not counting on him. Nothing against his ability to be a solid LB just he had bad luck with injuries.     
         
    I'll take it one further... If the Patriots want to be in the mix I think they need to make one or two Free agent pick ups in the June on Period that will fill a need like WR or TE.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    Wow....someone over analyzes things.....BIG TIME!
    Posted by m1021us


         OK...tell me what part of my analysis that you disagree with?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from jbolted. Show jbolted's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading? :      OK...tell me what part of my analysis that you disagree with?
    Posted by TexasPat3

    From my point of view:
    RB,ILB,T,QB,S
    The Pats need to forget the old washed up RB's and get a young stud that can fly.
    ILB  beyond Mayo- nothin'
    Vollmer needs to start in place of K as well draft here.
    QB- with Brady gettin older have to get a good young QB to be mentored instead of some ultra project like O'connell
    I dont think DB backfield can stop good teams in the air. Merriweather is overrated, Bodden is too, the others are servicable, but not one in the group that shines IMO.
     
  6. This post has been removed.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    Rebuilding, reloading all the same thing as far as I am concerned because the way the NFL is constructed you can "rebuild" and be competative even challenge for a championship at the same time.  I don't see it as bare as you do...
    The coaching is fine, front office I think is poretty solid Casserio I think will show us Pioli was no genious.  (not saying I disliked Pioli just he isn't the sole reason we won the championships.)
     
    RESPONSE: How can you say that "the coaching is fine", when the Pats lack both an OC and a DC? 

      Special teams have been an issue on the punting and returning side in my opinion for a couple years and this draft should rectify that with a Top notch punter (3 possibly 4 available) and I still stand by my prediction we get CJ he fills so many needs for us and is a guy that makes our offense unpredictable and dangerous.
     
    RESPONSE: So...in what round would you recommend that the Pats take a punter? Remember, they lack their 3rd round and 5th round picks. 

         Who is CJ?

       Now as far as the offense goes yeah I am fine with Hoyer as the back up but he isn't the future unless the Patriots don't plan on signing Brady (Kraft says otherwise so I am not worried there). We won't be drafting his replacement for at least 3 years.
     
    RESPONSE: Are you really saying that the Pats should wait til Brady turns 36, and then seek to find his successor? If the Pats don't think that Hoya is the guy, perhaps they should groom a young QB now. 

       RB is a place where I am not happy but I think this draft takes care of that.
     
    RESPONSE: I don't care who the Pats get to run the ball...unless the OL starts to open holes, Adrian Peterson could get nothing done in Foxborough.

       TE is not vacant far from it Crumpler will be the main stay and teacher for a young group including one that will surely be drafted as TE is a strength in this draft we should be able to get one maybe as late as the 4th that will develop along side Crumpler... and there will be a couple available in the June on free agency period.
     
    RESPONSE: So...you want the Pats to draft both a RB and a TE? With what picks? TE is a must. Who is around for would the 55 year old Crumpler to mentor?

        OL... well that is in flux.  I look at it like this if they keep Mankins they have the pieces to build it into a big strength with one more piece added through the draft. Vollmer solidifies one OT spot, Mankins a OG spot and if we need to keep Light for one more year before replacing him the Patriots will be fine like that. As for the other OG and Koppen will be fine for one more year unless we find a replacement in the draft. WR is an area I am unsure of...
     
    RESPONSE: Saying that the OL is in flux seems to be just another way to admit that it needs to be upgraded. The Pats need to jettison Matt Light, move Nick Kaczur inside, start Vollmer at LT, and draft a RT.

    Moss will certainly be playing top of his game this year being a contract year and who knows if he stays after that or not. We have sole solid youththere in Edelman and Tate and Welker will hopefully return and be a help at the position as well. I suspect there will be some additions FA/ or Draft or even both there.

    RESPONSE: Saying that Moss will step up because it's his contract year implies that he has been laying down. I strongly disagree. Moss has been an asset to the team since day one. But, the Pats still lack a quality WR to play opposite him (I can't take another year of Sam Aiken impersonating an NFL receiver). Furthermore, with Welker likely to miss a large part of 2010, Julian Eddleman will have to play a bigger role. But, no way he fills Welker's shoes.

      Defense needs a DE and OLB but beyond that (both can be had in this deep draft) they are not too bad off.
     
    RESPONSE: Really? I wish.

    I think it is unbfair to say Warren has pulled a Steven Neal as Warren has been getting doubles on a lot of the plays I have watched due to the pressure decrease from other places along the line.

    RESPONSE: That's what a 3-4 DE must do. Unfair?? The guy hasn't been healthy for the past two years.

         I may be wrong here but I think ILB will be a strength with McKenzie... I see big things coming from him, Guyton is a quality backup. OLB is an area of need and I think that is a need that will be taken care of at the Draft. 

    RESPONSE: Wishful thinking. We just don't know. But, how many guys bounce back 100% in their first year back from a knee injury?

                Secondary is not an issue we need to worry about. While they have spent some bullets in the past there it doesn't really affect any of their potential moves this year and on as the uncapped year kind of solved that problem.        I agree if the Patriots want to be in the mix for another championship this year they need a solid draft and they need to get 4 quality starters from it and a few that can develop as things go.
     
    RESPONSE: Getting four quality starters from one draft is a tall, tall order.

    They need their young developing players to step up like McKenzie, Chung and Tate... Crable would be a bonus but I am not counting on him. Nothing against his ability to be a solid LB just he had bad luck with injuries.            I'll take it one further... If the Patriots want to be in the mix I think they need to make one or two Free agent pick ups in the June on Period that will fill a need like WR or TE.
    Posted by DaBlade


    RESPONSE: Blade...hope you're right...but I don't see things going so perfectly for this team in 2010. There's too many ifs.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rolltide1963. Show rolltide1963's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    . The Clay Matthews thing bugs me.  I find it very after the fact.  Nobody complained about passing this guy up last year.  The cry was for the passing up of Maualuga. Matthews starts putting it together at the end of the season and here come the whiners.  How many players down the road will we complain about not getting if they turn out well? There are some good points in there like about the OL.  I hope there's something good down the line in this years draft like a big center who can take on these 3-4 defenses we're starting to see.  
    Posted by garytx



    Sorry, I was one of those that stated BB had his Jones way to high on Butler and Brace last year.    They could have, with good draft had both Maualuga and Matthews and Should have.   But then again, at this time last year not many people on these type of forums liked my input then.  Matthews at # 23, and Maualuga in the second curtesy of the Cassel/Vrable trade.   But, everyone fell in line with the In Bill we Trust cr@pola.    Bill is has his strengths, and he has some weak points, such as the Draft.


     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    I prefer to call it retooling
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from harleyroadking103. Show harleyroadking103's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Where do you find the time to do all this?
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBRULES23. Show BBRULES23's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    The only teams that rebuild are the ones that can't draft.  The Pats were 5-11 the year before they won their 1st superbowl.  So I don't buy into any of this rebuilding crap.  They got very lucky with Brady in the 6th thanks to the late Dick Rehbein.  No matter which way you cut it, the Pats have drafted poorly the last few seasons.  Their offseason FA moves have been pretty pathetic.  This is why the Pats are in the situation they are in.  Brady can keep them competitive, but only for so long.  If the Pats don't get their s*** together in the personnel and offensive coaching department, then expect a very steady decline.  I'm a Pats fan, but I'm not just going to blindly approve of everything they do as genius or the best move possible.  So far this season is proving to be more of the same, not addressing holes with quality FA, only hasbeens nobody really wants.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Tex, I do think we can wait atleast 2 maybe 3 years before drafting Brady's apprentice.  Barring injuries and adding some OL to prevent that.
    Rolltide, I was a HUGE Rey Maualuga (Sp?) fan and did wish we grabbed him.  On Mathews, no one was too high on him here in the first.  No one hated him either.  Hind sight is 20/20.  Heck I would take Sean Williams CB instead of Brace if I could now, I also liked him allot last year at draft time.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    Tex, I do think we can wait at least 2 maybe 3 years before drafting Brady's apprentice.  Barring injuries and adding some OL to prevent that.
     
    RESPONSE: It usually takes about 2 years of clip-board holding for a QB to become NFL ready. For Tom Brady, it only took a year. But he's the exception, not the rule. If the Pats don't draft a QB this year, or next, it must mean that they think Hoyer has the goods to eventually step in for Tom. But, remember the old NFL axiom, that you never stop developing and/or upgrading the QB position.

    Rolltide, I was a HUGE Rey Maualuga (Sp?) fan and did wish we grabbed him.

    RESPONSE: Fellow poster Z-Bellino tipped me off on Maualuga...posting several cites to show that he was a head case off the field at USC. He's already had a brush with the law this off-season...getting a DWI at around two a.m....striking a parked car...with a couple of 18 year old girls with him. The Pats are better off without him.

    On Mathews, no one was too high on him here in the first.  No one hated him either.  Hind sight is 20/20.  Heck I would take Sean Williams CB instead of Brace if I could now, I also liked him allot last year at draft time.

    RESPONSE: True that about the hindsight being 20/20. But, the Patriots have whiffed too many times, from 2006-present. Not only did they pass on Matthews, when their greatest need was a pass-rushing OLB...but the decision also ended up costing the Pats their 3rd and 5th round picks this year, which were spent to bring in the not so productive Derrick Burgess from Oakland. Furthermore, the Pats also passed up OT Michael Oher, who appears to be on his way to becoming a pro-bowler. Just think...the Pats could have had the best young pair of bookend OTs in the league, in Oher and Sebastien Vollmer...instead of Seabass and the aging Matt Light, of the ineffective Nick Kaczur.  

    Posted by MordecaiBloodmoon

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    The only teams that rebuild are the ones that can't draft.  The Pats were 5-11 the year before they won their 1st superbowl.  So I don't buy into any of this rebuilding crap.

    RESPONSE: You're forgetting that the Pats signed numerous "B" type free agents, such as DE Bobby Hamilton, LB Roman Phifer, LB Bryan Cox, RB Antwain Smith, DE Anthony Pleasant, LB Mike Vrabel, Larry Izzo, and CB Otis Smith...to go along with their #1 pick, Richard Seymour, which enabled them to turn things around. But, they've done nothing to improve the 2010 edition thus far, through free agency.

    They got very lucky with Brady in the 6th thanks to the late Dick Rehbein.

    RESPONSE: True that.

    No matter which way you cut it, the Pats have drafted poorly the last few seasons.  Their off-season FA moves have been pretty pathetic.  This is why the Pats are in the situation they are in.

    RESPONSE: Agreed. 

    Brady can keep them competitive, but only for so long.  If the Pats don't get their s*** together in the personnel and offensive coaching department, then expect a very steady decline.

    RESPONSE: They haven't gotten it together, which is why they have declined.

    I'm a Pats fan, but I'm not just going to blindly approve of everything they do as genius or the best move possible.  So far this season is proving to be more of the same, not addressing holes with quality FA, only has-beens nobody really wants.

    RESPONSE: You and I appear to be on the same page, brother. Let's hope we're wrong.

    Posted by BBRULES23
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaBlade. Show DaBlade's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Texaspat3...

    RESPONSE: How can you say that "the coaching is fine", when the Pats lack both an OC and a DC? 

    Why does there have to be a guy with the title? No reason, there will be a person on each side that has the duties, and BB will oversee them.
     
    RESPONSE: So...in what round would you recommend that the Pats take a punter? Remember, they lack their 3rd round and 5th round picks.

    The Punters wont start coming off the board till the 6th at the earliest with the depth elsewhere in this draft so they could wait till the 7th round and still get one of the top 4 (all of whom will be solid NFL punters with differing abilities... ie Zoltan and Dodge Distance-cannon for a leg, Malone and boone distance is solid 44 yards plus average but also has huge directional and inside the 20 numbers which knocked down their overall distance numbers. One if not all four can be had in the 7th.   

         Who is CJ? 

    Your kidding right? C.J. ... Spiller the top RB in the Draft who has two behind the scenes ties to Belichick and whom I think the Patriots might be considering drafting.

     
    RESPONSE: Are you really saying that the Pats should wait til Brady turns 36, and then seek to find his successor? If the Pats don't think that Hoya is the guy, perhaps they should groom a young QB now.

    The Patriots have already said Brady will be "Taken Care of" that is from the one who cuts the checks so that tells me he gets a new deal that means at the very least 4 years probably 5. That means Brady is the starting QB at least till 2014. Now is not the time to draft his replacement. 2012 at the earliest is. No more explanation needed. 
     
    RESPONSE: I don't care who the Pats get to run the ball...unless the OL starts to open holes, Adrian Peterson could get nothing done in Foxborough.

    The OLine will produce much better numbers in 2010 with just minor tweaking and a full overhaul after 2011. Vollmer to RT, Light stays at LT, Mankins at LG then you replace either Koppen or the RG spot through a high draft pick. Add Crumpler and a drafted TE to the mix and you have much better running lanes.  
      
    RESPONSE: So...you want the Pats to draft both a RB and a TE? With what picks? TE is a must. Who is around for would the 55 year old Crumpler to mentor? 

    Yes and it can be done... I'll outline how when I am done answering your responses.
         
    RESPONSE: Saying that the OL is in flux seems to be just another way to admit that it needs to be upgraded. The Pats need to jettison Matt Light, move Nick Kaczur inside, start Vollmer at LT, and draft a RT.

    Covered the OL above

    RESPONSE: Saying that Moss will step up because it's his contract year implies that he has been laying down. I strongly disagree. Moss has been an asset to the team since day one. But, the Pats still lack a quality WR to play opposite him (I can't take another year of Sam Aiken impersonating an NFL receiver). Furthermore, with Welker likely to miss a large part of 2010, Julian Eddleman will have to play a bigger role. But, no way he fills Welker's shoes. 

    Not saying Moss is laying down just saying 2010 should be a solid year for him because all players regardless of how "honerable " they are seem to have their best years in contract years. I agree you can't count on Welker and Edleman has to step up but as I outlined in other threads CJ takes a big part of the problems away and I think people are forgetting about Tate... he will suprise from what I hear. As far as other WR's they can take one late and I guarantee some decent Free Agent WR's will be cut loose in June through camp.

    RESPONSE: That's what a 3-4 DE must do. Unfair?? The guy hasn't been healthy for the past two years.

    Concerning Warren he has been hurt some and doubled a lot so with some help on the other side his play will improve.

    RESPONSE: Wishful thinking. We just don't know. But, how many guys bounce back 100% in their first year back from a knee injury?

    I know there is no way to know about McKenzie but I think and it is a gamble but one I would make this year that he will be the difference maker at ILB.
     
    RESPONSE: Getting four quality starters from one draft is a tall, tall order.

    Most years I would agree with that but this year this draft is super deep especially at the positions of need for the Patriots. 50 or so deep in first round tallent... just as a comparison most years it ranges from 12 to 25 players that recieve first round ranks.

    OK as Promised here is how you could get the players you need if your the Patriots (and this is just one of several different possibilities)...

    Patriots draft CJ Spiller at #8 after trading Raiders their own 1st round pick in 2011 draft back and #47.   

    Patriots Draft DE Morgan with Pick #22 or Odrick if Morgan not there.

    Patriots draft OLB Jerry Hughes @ #44 .

    Patriots draft TE Kronkowski @ #53 or TE Moeaki

    Patriots draft OG Petrus (Arkansas) or C Tennant BC @ #119

    Patriots Draft  best available  tallent at a need position at #134 after trading Our 6th and two 7th round picks we can trade.

    Patriots draft P with 6th round compensatory

    Patriots draft Richardson OG Iowa solid technique and has a nasty streak (he played for Ferentz) Could be a steal with one of the 7th round compensatories. Draft whoever is at top of board regardless of position or go with your gut and grab a guy if you want to at this point. (three 7th round comp. picks in total).

    There is a draft that is filled with potential starters.

    Case closed defense rests your honor thank you I will be here through the draft.


     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SICOFITALL. Show SICOFITALL's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Im going w/ retooling , although there is a strong case to be made that their rebuilding. Good q's.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    Why does there have to be a guy with the title? No reason, there will be a person on each side that has the duties, and BB will oversee them.

    RESPONSE: The Pats lack top quality assistants. They fired their mediocre at best DC, Dean Pees, and replaced him with nothing. Were you pleased with the play calling last year from O'Brien? Were you pleased with  "adjustments", allegedly made in the second half of games last year? I can count at least three games where the Pats blew second half leads, and lost. At Jets, at Denver, and at Indy. Those three losses were the difference between the Pats having home-field advantage throughout the play-offs, and a much easier path to the SB...and what actually happened. BB is a still a great coach...but he seems to have too much on his plate.
     
    The Punters wont start coming off the board till the 6th at the earliest with the depth elsewhere in this draft so they could wait till the 7th round and still get one of the top 4 (all of whom will be solid NFL punters with differing abilities... ie Zoltan and Dodge Distance-cannon for a leg, Malone and boone distance is solid 44 yards plus average but also has huge directional and inside the 20 numbers which knocked down their overall distance numbers. One if not all four can be had in the 7th.
     
    RESPONSE: Says who? Remember, the Pats had to use a 4th round pick to snare PK Stephen Gostkowski. San Diego took their PK, Nate Kaeding, in the 3rd round. The Pats must replace the ineffective Chris Hanson. 

    Who is CJ?  Your kidding right? C.J. ... Spiller the top RB in the Draft who has two behind the scenes ties to Belichick and whom I think the Patriots might be considering drafting.
     
    RESPONSE: With so many other needs, are you seriously suggesting that the Pats waste their 22nd overall pick on Spiller? The Pats should use the pick on an OLB, DE, or an OT. Some mock drafts have the Pats taking the top rated TE in the draft, Jermaine Gresham.  

    The Patriots have already said Brady will be "Taken Care of" that is from the one who cuts the checks so that tells me he gets a new deal that means at the very least 4 years probably 5. That means Brady is the starting QB at least till 2014. Now is not the time to draft his replacement. 2012 at the earliest is. No more explanation needed.
     
    RESPONSE: So...you think that the Pats, who will undoubtedly be drafting in the 20s, can land a franchise QB, who can immediately step in for Brady? How do you know that Tom can stay healthy til 2012? Shouldn't the Pats try to ensure that by upgrading their OL? Are you satisfied with Hoya as the #2 QB?   

    The OLine will produce much better numbers in 2010 with just minor tweaking and a full overhaul after 2011. Vollmer to RT, Light stays at LT, Mankins at LG then you replace either Koppen or the RG spot through a high draft pick. Add Crumpler and a drafted TE to the mix and you have much better running lanes.
     
    RESPONSE: The Pats' OL is vastly overrated. Though Tom Brady didn't get sacked much last year, he was hit far, far too often. He was playing hurt with broken ribs. The OL opened fewer holes up front than than a one-armed ditch digger. 

    Yes and it can be done (Pats draft a RB and TE)... I'll outline how when I am done answering your responses.
     
    RESPONSE: In what rounds? Will either player selected be a significant upgrade over what they had last year?

    Not saying Moss is laying down just saying 2010 should be a solid year for him because all players regardless of how "honorable " they are seem to have their best years in contract years. I agree you can't count on Welker and Edleman has to step up but as I outlined in other threads CJ takes a big part of the problems away and I think people are forgetting about Tate

    RESPONSE: Let's say, for the sake of argument, that Spiller is still around at #22, and the Pats take him. That leaves three 2nd round picks, in which to draft an OLB, TE, and DE (need to find a replacement for Richard Seymour). How many 2nd rounders just step right in and become stars? Which of the Pats 2nd rounders did that last year? Perhaps Vollmer? Didn't the Pats learn anything from selecting Laurence Maroney at #21 in 2006. Was he worth it?  

    ... he will suprise from what I hear.
     
    RESPONSE: Too risky to use the 22nd overall pick on a RB, with so many other needs.

    As far as other WR's they can take one late and I guarantee some decent Free Agent WR's will be cut loose in June through camp.
     
    RESPONSE: I love your enthusiasm, and optimism. But...sorry...I don't see it. The Pats have too many holes, and too many ifs.

    (Ty Warren)...Unfair?? The guy hasn't been healthy for the past two years. Concerning Warren he has been hurt some and doubled a lot so with some help on the other side his play will improve.
     
    RESPONSE: What difference does it make if you're not getting the job done because you lack ability, or because you can't stay on the field? The bottom line remains that the job is not getting done.

    I know there is no way to know about McKenzie but I think and it is a gamble but one I would make this year that he will be the difference maker at ILB.
     
    RESPONSE: Another big "if". 

    Most years I would agree with that but this year this draft is super deep especially at the positions of need for the Patriots. 50 or so deep in first round tallent... just as a comparison most years it ranges from 12 to 25 players that receive first round ranks.
     
    RESPONSE: Perhaps the biggest "if" of all...especially the way the Patriots have drafted the past few years. 

    OK as Promised here is how you could get the players you need if your the Patriots (and this is just one of several different possibilities)... Patriots draft CJ Spiller at #8 after trading Raiders their own 1st round pick in 2011 draft back and #47.

    RESPONSE: To quote John McEnroe..."You cannot be serious"!! You want the Patriots to trade up for a RB, when they can't pressure the opposing QB, can't protect their HOF QB, and badly need to find a replacement for Richard Seymour's vacant DE spot!! And...you want them to trade their 47th pick, and next years' #1 from Oakland?? Why would Oakland do that? Do you realize that the Pats could have had Oakland's #1 in 2010...but  instead insisted on their #1 in 2011, so as not to have to pay big, salary slotted money for a top ten pick.

         Assuming that the Pats' were to trade up in the first round, they would only do so to select a play-making defender (OLB or DE)...likely targeting either Morgan, McCoy, or Suh.   

    Patriots Draft DE Morgan with Pick #22 or Odrick if Morgan not there.

    RESPONSE: No way Morgan is there at #22. Odrick might be. 

    Patriots draft OLB Jerry Hughes @ #44 . Patriots draft TE Kronkowski @ #53 or TE Moeaki Patriots draft OG Petrus (Arkansas) or C Tennant BC @ #119 Patriots Draft  best available  tallent at a need position at #134 after trading Our 6th and two 7th round picks we can trade. Patriots draft P with 6th round compensatory Patriots draft Richardson OG Iowa solid technique and has a nasty streak (he played for Ferentz) Could be a steal with one of the 7th round compensatories. Draft whoever is at top of board regardless of position or go with your gut and grab a guy if you want to at this point. (three 7th round comp. picks in total). There is a draft that is filled with potential starters. Case closed defense rests your honor thank you I will be here through the draft.

    RESPONSE: As stated above, I love your enthusiasm...LOL!! Hope you're right. Nice discussion, my friend. 

    Posted by DaBlade
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Patriots1970. Show Patriots1970's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:

    Who is CJ? 

    Your kidding right? C.J. ... Spiller the top RB in the Draft who has two behind the scenes ties to Belichick and whom I think the Patriots might be considering drafting.

    On this point, maybe the 'who is CJ?' was a twist.

    But with your earlier commnets on Punter and where to select and then go right into they take CJ - I too have not heard of a punter named CJ.

    but if Cj is there in the 6th, I will take him. But not waste a 1st on him.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from jcour382. Show jcour382's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    we have been rebuilding for two years... we have been restocking the d since the loss in the o7 SB... we have a good mix of veterans but we have been adding younger players each of the last two years...the last year was a good experience year for some of the coaches... refining the system and for the young players...this year should be a good run with a couple of good early picks... cant wait for draft..
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    If it makes you feel any better, the world will end in 2012 anyway.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdoggg. Show underdoggg's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Tex - too much to read, but read a little. 

    1.  Brady is good enough to perform even with just an ok Oline.  I know this because Brady performed well last year and Manning has done it the last 2 years and the colts are still searching for a combination that will really work. 

    2.  I would say that the pats should give up on the vet fa market.  It seems to me that they have not struck gold here in a long long time yet keep pursuing it.  Or maybe this should be rephrased.  It feels like they have gone after more "long in the tooth" vet fa's.  Maybe they should look for marginal young fa's that they think they can mold (ie vrabel). 

    3.  IMO the dominance that the pats demonstrated in the first half of the decade was all about the defense which no longer exists.  No it feels a little like the entire team has lost its way. Still competitive, but they scare no one. 
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaBlade. Show DaBlade's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Actually the 2012 issue is interesting but I am not going to worry about it. If It happens it happens but I am going to go on living life one way or the other. For the most part the movies on the subject are stupid... back to Football.

    I'm thinking this draft can really go two ways and the problem I have is we currently own 4 picks that will be used in the first 53 which is about how many players have first round grades this year. So that is 4 quality picks that if the Pats do their homework and don't make any picks based on future projection (ie) Tebow they can immediately get better on both sides of the ball. there are several ways they could go as far as players and position but if they keep and use their first 4 smartly they get 4 starting quality players.

    Now they could also trade picks to move up including a 2011 first rounder (ours preferably) with a second rounder  or our pick at 22 plus a second rounder but then you just went from 4 to 3 players being drafted with first round level tallent though obviously one of them will be top 11.  

    People say Belichick won't do this or that but honestly I think that is why he is such a good coach and tallent evaluator he does things all the time against type.  So I guess that is why I keep coming back to I think he trades up in this draft.  
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdoggg. Show underdoggg's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    One other note, unless the pats are San Francisco with a Steve Young waiting on the sidelines, they have to wait until 36 for a back up for Brady.  I think replacing a legendary QB is the hardest thing for a franchise to do.  It never goes well.  I wonder how many teams have done it successfully quickly beyond San Francisco, and theirs was a unique situation because of the USFL.  
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    In Response to Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?:
    Tex - too much to read, but read a little.  1.  Brady is good enough to perform even with just an ok Oline.  I know this because Brady performed well last year and Manning has done it the last 2 years and the colts are still searching for a combination that will really work.

    RESPONSE: Spare me...Dog(gg). Manning was hardly touched last season, while Brady got killed.

      2.  I would say that the pats should give up on the vet fa market.  It seems to me that they have not struck gold here in a long long time yet keep pursuing it.

    RESPONSE: Agree that they should give up on signing 36 year old CBs, and 37 year old WRs. But they should not give up on it all together. 

    Or maybe this should be rephrased.  It feels like they have gone after more "long in the tooth" vet fa's.  Maybe they should look for marginal young fa's that they think they can mold (ie vrabel).

    RESPONSE: They should build through the draft...and supplement only with an occasional free agent. 

      3.  IMO the dominance that the pats demonstrated in the first half of the decade was all about the defense which no longer exists.

    RESPONSE: Unlike the Colts, the Pats had balance on both sides of the ball. They were better than the Colts...who were a "soft" dome team. The Indy teams since 2006 are much better defensively...and tougher.

    No it feels a little like the entire team has lost its way. Still competitive, but they scare no one.

    RESPONSE: The team simply got old...as their paying the price for poor drafts in 2006, 2008, and 2009.
     
    Posted by underdoggg

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tcal2. Show Tcal2's posts

    Re: Patriots Should Be Rebuilding, or Reloading?

    Revitalize with youth.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share