Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    Maybe our GM genius should get a real TE to compliment GRONK so the greatest coach ever, can manage GRONK's playing time better.  No f***ing need for this guy to play 90% of the snaps or Special teams of any kind.  But a great mind should be able to figure this out .....right?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to tcal2-'s comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Maybe our GM genius should get a real TE to compliment GRONK so the greatest coach ever, can manage GRONK's playing time better.  No f***ing need for this guy to play 90% of the snaps or Special teams of any kind.  But a great mind should be able to figure this out .....right?

    [/QUOTE]

    +1

    I've been screaming about this since the draft. Not just to compliment but I don't see how we can count on Gronk staying healthy all year or through the playoffs(Hope I'm Wrong). So if he goes out we have watch the offense spiral around the Toilet bowl again? We didn't draft one and I'm starting to get the feeling they have little interest in Dustin Keller unless he plays for the league minimum. It's going to be tough to watch HooMan sukck for another year. I hope I don't get any death threats for questioning our draft again.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from m. a. pat. Show m. a. pat's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to TFB12's comment:


    In response to Muzwell's comment:


     


     



    Did the Heat have a backup for Lebron?


     


    If Peyton Manning gets hurt, the Broncos season is over, isn't it? Yeah, there's a backup and they'll keep playing they games and say all the right things, but they have zero chance.


     


    If Big Papi got hurt and missed the playoffs last year, do the Red Sox have a prayer of even getting past the Rays with his backup? Who, Carp? 


     


    It's pretty much the same thing with Gronk. Some guys there's no backup that means a damn thing. What's "comical" about that? It's fact. The regular season is for show and for fantasy football and for making money, it means nothing in the end to a team like that Pats (or the Broncos, or the Heat or any serious contender in any sport).


     


     




    Comparing Gronk to Manning, Lebron?? Without them those teams win nothing.  Without Gronk this team still wins. 


     


     


    By your comments how about this... Once the Pats get enough wins to make the playoffs then lets just pull TFB and save him for the playoffs.  Better yet, how about pull the entire 1st teams and save them for the playoffs.  What do you think?  After 10 wins or 11 wins?


     


    Remember last season, everyone was all over Gronk for not coming back sooner. 


     


    Yeah, this team is better off with Gronk in the playoffs but to hold him out like that, come on.  I just don't agree with that at all.


     


    Why not just have a good, legit backup!?!?!?!




    Agree that if Gronk is healthy he needs to be on the field whether it's Game 1, Game 5 or whatever. Football players get paid to play and this would be a disservice to the fans paying hundreds of dollars per game to attend regular season games.


    Do the Pats keep Wilfork, Kelly, Vollmer and Mayo out all season also? It hurts not having Gronk in the post season but Edelman finally played a full season and hopefully the Pats are due for some good luck with their big TE.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

     


     


     I think we build a cryogenic vault for him amd keep him frozen solid until the playoffs.  When we thaw him out, not only will he be undamaged having been unable to move a muscle for four months, he'll be completely aclimatized to the cold weather. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    For the people that are complaing about TE depth....

    The offense isn't going to revolve around the TE spot any more if Gronk is hurt or even if he's healthy. Hooman will be used as a blocker, but I think this season we will see a lot of 3WR 1TE 1RB sets this year. If Gronk is healthy, then that looks great, if not, they can just use Hooman as a blocker and its no big deal. We have a logjam at WR and 4 and 5 WR sets will be used.

    Back in the superbowl days we didn't have a Gronk. Hell Daniel Graham and Fauria weren't anything close to special, I'm not gonna sit here and say Hooman is as good as them, but he's not far off if given the chance. The offense in the Superbowl days used WRs as receiving threats and TEs were big blockers, hence Hooman.

    TE depth doesn't bother me the least. People have become so spoiled with the Gronk-Hern duo. Until 2010, the Pats had TEs that were decent at best and not game changers and the O did just fine.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    For the people that are complaing about TE depth....

    The offense isn't going to revolve around the TE spot any more if Gronk is hurt or even if he's healthy. Hooman will be used as a blocker, but I think this season we will see a lot of 3WR 1TE 1RB sets this year. If Gronk is healthy, then that looks great, if not, they can just use Hooman as a blocker and its no big deal. We have a logjam at WR and 4 and 5 WR sets will be used.

    Back in the superbowl days we didn't have a Gronk. Hell Daniel Graham and Fauria weren't anything close to special, I'm not gonna sit here and say Hooman is as good as them, but he's not far off if given the chance. The offense in the Superbowl days used WRs as receiving threats and TEs were big blockers, hence Hooman.

    TE depth doesn't bother me the least. People have become so spoiled with the Gronk-Hern duo. Until 2010, the Pats had TEs that were decent at best and not game changers and the O did just fine.

    [/QUOTE]

    You are missing it Joe.  With a good receiving TE it is a huge weapon for this offense.  Gronk creates mismatches and they exploit the mismatches.  Huge weapon in this offense.  This offense is more lethal with a TE who can get down field and catch the ball.  Sad, there were a handful in the draft this year who would have been impact players for the Pats at the TE position.  Take a look at what the Pats have done with Gronk in there.  Look what Denver does with Thomas, Saints do with Graham, Falcons did with Gonzalas, 49ers with Davis and the list goes on.  With the right TE it's almost like playing 12 on 11.  Amazing so many here discount the position, especially after we have seen what the Pats can do with that position.  mind blowing.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    For the people that are complaing about TE depth....

    The offense isn't going to revolve around the TE spot any more if Gronk is hurt or even if he's healthy. Hooman will be used as a blocker, but I think this season we will see a lot of 3WR 1TE 1RB sets this year. If Gronk is healthy, then that looks great, if not, they can just use Hooman as a blocker and its no big deal. We have a logjam at WR and 4 and 5 WR sets will be used.

    Back in the superbowl days we didn't have a Gronk. Hell Daniel Graham and Fauria weren't anything close to special, I'm not gonna sit here and say Hooman is as good as them, but he's not far off if given the chance. The offense in the Superbowl days used WRs as receiving threats and TEs were big blockers, hence Hooman.

    TE depth doesn't bother me the least. People have become so spoiled with the Gronk-Hern duo. Until 2010, the Pats had TEs that were decent at best and not game changers and the O did just fine.

    [/QUOTE]

    You are missing it Joe.  With a good receiving TE it is a huge weapon for this offense.  Gronk creates mismatches and they exploit the mismatches.  Huge weapon in this offense.  This offense is more lethal with a TE who can get down field and catch the ball.  Sad, there were a handful in the draft this year who would have been impact players for the Pats at the TE position.  Take a look at what the Pats have done with Gronk in there.  Look what Denver does with Thomas, Saints do with Graham, Falcons did with Gonzalas, 49ers with Davis and the list goes on.  With the right TE it's almost like playing 12 on 11.  Amazing so many here discount the position, especially after we have seen what the Pats can do with that position.  mind blowing.

    [/QUOTE]


    True. We could have drafted a few TEs that would have instantly brought production at the spot that Hernandez vacated. One more thing. Every year I keep thinking the Pats  may adopt a different philosophy on offense and every year it stays pretty much the same. Same players and same offense = same results. Maybe the Beef they drafted for the offensive line will help Brady out with protection. We'll see.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You are missing it Joe.  With a good receiving TE it is a huge weapon for this offense.  Gronk creates mismatches and they exploit the mismatches.  Huge weapon in this offense.  This offense is more lethal with a TE who can get down field and catch the ball.  Sad, there were a handful in the draft this year who would have been impact players for the Pats at the TE position.  Take a look at what the Pats have done with Gronk in there.  Look what Denver does with Thomas, Saints do with Graham, Falcons did with Gonzalas, 49ers with Davis and the list goes on.  With the right TE it's almost like playing 12 on 11.  Amazing so many here discount the position, especially after we have seen what the Pats can do with that position.  mind blowing.

    [/QUOTE]

    What have the Patriots done at that position? Put up great stats and have high powered offenses.

    What exactly has that gotten us? 0 rings.

    2001-2007 the TE was an afterthought in the offensive scheme and we made 4 Super Bowls winning 3. Of course you will bring up how great the defense was in those years, which yes is very true, but the offense was also extremely effective when it had to be.

    The Seahawks offense runs just fine without a legit TE. Green Bay has a fine passing game without Jermichael Finley.

     

    Stop thinking that we NEED a great TE, because we don't. The offense can exploit mismatches just fine without Gronk out there. LaFell could be used as a Flex-TE role if need be since he is a great blocker as well. You're caught up with the position label at TE.

    We just need a player that can create mismatches, not necessarily a TE. And you keep pointing to this draft like a TE would immediately come in and have 800 yards and 8 Tds. That wouldn't happen. If the Pats drafted any of those TEs, at best they would have 400-500 yards 4Tds. The mismatch player could be Dobson on the outside, could be Boyce, could be Edelman and Amendola together or even LaFell. The mix of WRs we have can be successful.

    The Patriots WRs will be fine in creating an efficient offense this season and Ridley and the run game will be used a lot more too. I'm not worried at the TE spot at all. 

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

     

     Graham and Fauria both had long NFL careers with many starts.  They were good blockers who could catch 25 to 35 balls a season if played.  I don't think Hoomanawanui is quite their equal yet.  Granted, he's still relatively young, but so far he's been fairly average as a blocker and receiver.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     Graham and Fauria both had long NFL careers with many starts.  They were good blockers who could catch 25 to 35 balls a season if played.  I don't think Hoomanawanui is quite their equal yet.  Granted, he's still relatively young, but so far he's been fairly average as a blocker and receiver.

    [/QUOTE]

    Exactly, I never said Hooman was on their level I said that he isn't far off. Hooman didn't play a full season as #1 TE option and had 12 grabs for 125 yards. He's also a good blocker imo. He isn't far off from Graham or Fauria and when those two were around the TE was an afterthought and the O was fine

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to ewhite1065's comment:



    True. We could have drafted a few TEs that would have instantly brought production at the spot that Hernandez vacated. One more thing. Every year I keep thinking the Pats  may adopt a different philosophy on offense and every year it stays pretty much the same. Same players and same offense = same results. Maybe the Beef they drafted for the offensive line will help Brady out with protection. We'll see.



    What production would you have expected from a TE drafted in the first 3 rounds?


    Because apparently the offense we have is hard to learn and clicking with Brady can take time, so what, realistically, would a rookie TE do for us?


     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


    Stop thinking that we NEED a great TE, because we don't. The offense can exploit mismatches just fine without Gronk out there. LaFell could be used as a Flex-TE role if need be since he is a great blocker as well. You're caught up with the position label at TE.


     


    We just need a player that can create mismatches, not necessarily a TE. And you keep pointing to this draft like a TE would immediately come in and have 800 yards and 8 Tds. That wouldn't happen. If the Pats drafted any of those TEs, at best they would have 400-500 yards 4Tds. The mismatch player could be Dobson on the outside, could be Boyce, could be Edelman and Amendola together or even LaFell. The mix of WRs we have can be successful.


     


    The Patriots WRs will be fine in creating an efficient offense this season and Ridley and the run game will be used a lot more too. I'm not worried at the TE spot at all. 


     


     


     


     ---------


     


    I basically agree with this, though I'm not quite as confident the receivers will turn out to be the impact players we need them to be if we have one TE and/or if Gronk is out.  Don't forget backs can be used too.  If we end up with Vereen and another good receiving back, we could use more two-back sets.  Three receivers is maybe more likely, but two backs is a possibility, especially if one or both can flex out when desired.


     


     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    Yeah, you can say you need to man up and play all 16, fine. If the regular season is your thing, it's your thing. I'm saying, for me personally, it's not my thing. I'm OK if they make it as a wild card or as the number one seed, it doesn't mean anything.

    I don't care if the guy takes a regular season snap. They have plenty of talent without him, to win the division and win 10+ games. I'm OK with them changing their approach, and resting guys like Wilfork more, absolutely. Why not? What's the downside, a regular season loss that will mean not one single thing in January? Please don't give me bye week, home field advantage and all of that. History has proven that stuff means very little. Health is 1000% more important than where the game is played.

    As far as having a better backup, I'm saying there is no backup for a guy that good. There's just a body that you stick in there to play the position. Yes, he's that good. He's the best non-QB offensive player in the NFL, some kid fresh out of college is going to replace him? Please. If he gets hurt, it changes everything. There's no replacement. Yes, he's that important. You disagree, fine. It's how I see it.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ewhite1065's comment:

    [QUOTE]

    True. We could have drafted a few TEs that would have instantly brought production at the spot that Hernandez vacated. One more thing. Every year I keep thinking the Pats  may adopt a different philosophy on offense and every year it stays pretty much the same. Same players and same offense = same results. Maybe the Beef they drafted for the offensive line will help Brady out with protection. We'll see.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]
    What production would you have expected from a TE drafted in the first 3 rounds?

     

     

    Because apparently the offense we have is hard to learn and clicking with Brady can take time, so what, realistically, would a rookie TE do for us?

    [/QUOTE]


    Realistically, Any of the those guys are instantly better receivers than Hooman or any other TE we have besides Gronk. That means they are a threat in the passing game as would Keller be if we choose to sign him. Hernandez and Gronk instantly came in and made a difference because they have talent and this offense can make TEs shine if they have talent. When Gronk went out last year our offense was pathetic against any decent defense. I don't want to see that again this year. If you're confident the WRs are going to step up and stay healthy I hope you're right. I'd say it's unlikely and I'll pray for Gronk to play 16 games plus playoffs. It sounds like the Pats are too.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to ewhite1065's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Realistically, Any of the those guys are instantly better receivers than Hooman or any other TE we have besides Gronk. That means they are a threat in the passing game as would Keller be if we choose to sign him. Hernandez and Gronk instantly came in and made a difference because they have talent and this offense can make TEs shine if they have talent. When Gronk went out last year our offense was pathetic against any decent defense. I don't want to see that again this year. If you're confident the WRs are going to step up and stay healthy I hope you're right. I'd say it's unlikely and I'll pray for Gronk to play 16 games plus playoffs. It sounds like the Pats are too.

    [/QUOTE]

    Hernandez and Gronk coming out were far better talents than any of the TEs drafted this season.

    I'd say if we drafted a TE that he would give us 300-400 yards tops which isn't much. Hooman gave us 125 last season not being the starter almost half the year. 

    If the reason you wanted to draft a TE was for the future looking towards Gronk then I'd agree, but this season a rookie wouldn't be enough to take over.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:


    In response to ewhite1065's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Realistically, Any of the those guys are instantly better receivers than Hooman or any other TE we have besides Gronk. That means they are a threat in the passing game as would Keller be if we choose to sign him. Hernandez and Gronk instantly came in and made a difference because they have talent and this offense can make TEs shine if they have talent. When Gronk went out last year our offense was pathetic against any decent defense. I don't want to see that again this year. If you're confident the WRs are going to step up and stay healthy I hope you're right. I'd say it's unlikely and I'll pray for Gronk to play 16 games plus playoffs. It sounds like the Pats are too.




    Hernandez and Gronk coming out were far better talents than any of the TEs drafted this season.


    I'd say if we drafted a TE that he would give us 300-400 yards tops which isn't much. Hooman gave us 125 last season not being the starter almost half the year. 


    If the reason you wanted to draft a TE was for the future looking towards Gronk then I'd agree, but this season a rookie wouldn't be enough to take over.


     


    [/QUOTE]


    I disagree but you're entitled to your opinion. BTW..I don't believe anyone can "Take Over for Gronk". I just want Plan B because we sukked last year without him.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You are missing it Joe.  With a good receiving TE it is a huge weapon for this offense.  Gronk creates mismatches and they exploit the mismatches.  Huge weapon in this offense.  This offense is more lethal with a TE who can get down field and catch the ball.  Sad, there were a handful in the draft this year who would have been impact players for the Pats at the TE position.  Take a look at what the Pats have done with Gronk in there.  Look what Denver does with Thomas, Saints do with Graham, Falcons did with Gonzalas, 49ers with Davis and the list goes on.  With the right TE it's almost like playing 12 on 11.  Amazing so many here discount the position, especially after we have seen what the Pats can do with that position.  mind blowing.

    [/QUOTE]

    What have the Patriots done at that position? Put up great stats and have high powered offenses.

    What exactly has that gotten us? 0 rings.

    2001-2007 the TE was an afterthought in the offensive scheme and we made 4 Super Bowls winning 3. Of course you will bring up how great the defense was in those years, which yes is very true, but the offense was also extremely effective when it had to be.

    The Seahawks offense runs just fine without a legit TE. Green Bay has a fine passing game without Jermichael Finley.

     

    Stop thinking that we NEED a great TE, because we don't. The offense can exploit mismatches just fine without Gronk out there. LaFell could be used as a Flex-TE role if need be since he is a great blocker as well. You're caught up with the position label at TE.

    We just need a player that can create mismatches, not necessarily a TE. And you keep pointing to this draft like a TE would immediately come in and have 800 yards and 8 Tds. That wouldn't happen. If the Pats drafted any of those TEs, at best they would have 400-500 yards 4Tds. The mismatch player could be Dobson on the outside, could be Boyce, could be Edelman and Amendola together or even LaFell. The mix of WRs we have can be successful.

    The Patriots WRs will be fine in creating an efficient offense this season and Ridley and the run game will be used a lot more too. I'm not worried at the TE spot at all. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Stop referring to 2001-2007, it is 2014 now!  The game is different now then it was then.  Offenses are totally different.  Defenses are different.  And why are you bringing up the Seahawks offense??  Their offense was below the Patriots in scoring and way, way below the Patriots in passing.  And you are acting like they are going to be this team who wins multiple SB's that everyone needs to use them as a blueprint to win the SB.  The won 1 SB, Joe. 

    The Pats offense with Gronk is a more powerful offense then without him.  With Hooman they might as well not even send him out in passing situations.  He provides zero threat, he isn't that good.   That position in this offense is a mismatch against other teams as long as you have a capable TE.  The Pats added 1 WR over last season, who knows how Lafell is going to be, who knows if Dobson will continue to have foot problems, who knows if Amendola can stay healthy, who knows if Thompkins can put together a good full season.  Again, the TE position is huge in this offense.  I really can't believe you under value the TE position so much on this team.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Hernandez and Gronk coming out were far better talents than any of the TEs drafted this season.

    I'd say if we drafted a TE that he would give us 300-400 yards tops which isn't much. Hooman gave us 125 last season not being the starter almost half the year. 

    If the reason you wanted to draft a TE was for the future looking towards Gronk then I'd agree, but this season a rookie wouldn't be enough to take over.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Are you kidding me?  Come on, now you are being a homer.

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Are you kidding me?  Come on, now you are being a homer.

    [/QUOTE]

    That's not being homer. This TE class was viewed to be very light. We got a Hern and Gronk, both 1st round talents, in the 2nd and 4th due to injuries and off-field issues.

    I would put money down right now that ASJ, Amaro, CJF, or Niklas don't ever touch the versatility of Hernandez or the freakiness of Gronk.

    And yes, coming out Gronk would be viewed better than ASJ or CJF or Niklas and Hern viewed better than Amaro

    That's not being a homer that's fact. Obviously the outside circumstances of off-field issues and injuries would still affect Gronk and Hern's position but talent wise, they were above

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from joepatsfan111111. Show joepatsfan111111's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Stop referring to 2001-2007, it is 2014 now!  The game is different now then it was then.  Offenses are totally different.  Defenses are different.  And why are you bringing up the Seahawks offense??  Their offense was below the Patriots in scoring and way, way below the Patriots in passing.  And you are acting like they are going to be this team who wins multiple SB's that everyone needs to use them as a blueprint to win the SB.  The won 1 SB, Joe. 

    The Pats offense with Gronk is a more powerful offense then without him.  With Hooman they might as well not even send him out in passing situations.  He provides zero threat, he isn't that good.   That position in this offense is a mismatch against other teams as long as you have a capable TE.  The Pats added 1 WR over last season, who knows how Lafell is going to be, who knows if Dobson will continue to have foot problems, who knows if Amendola can stay healthy, who knows if Thompkins can put together a good full season.  Again, the TE position is huge in this offense.  I really can't believe you under value the TE position so much on this team.

    [/QUOTE]

    I cant believe how much you overrate the TE position in this offense. If Gronk didn't fall into our lap on draft night, the Patriots offense would still be fine top 10 in scoring and yards. When we struck gold with Gronk the offense changed to a lot of TE looks, with no gronk they still would have a good scheme to move the ball.

    Like I said, the TE wont be used this year (outside Gronk) and it really doesn't matter. We will see a lot 3-4-5 WR sets this season with the logjam there and we will be just fine.

    Here, I'll pose you this since you think TE is such a big deal... Look at the other teams with big name TE and their back ups....

    49ers - Davis then Vance McDonald and Garret Celek, those guys are nothing better than  Hooman

    Denver - J. Thomas then Dreesen and Tamme which isn't bad so good for them

    Dallas - Witten then Gavin Escobar.... nope

    Miami - Clay then Dion Sims... who is that?

    New Orleans - Graham then Ben Watson who's old and washed up

    Pitt - Health Miller then... David Paulson... not better than Gronk.

     

    Those are the teams with the best TEs and outside of Denver, all of them have backups who are no better than Hooman. If the TE goes down on any of those teams they can use their WIDE RECIEVERS to move the ball. WRs are still alive in the NFL you know and we have a good variety of them from tall, deep threats, explosive and elusive.

    TE is overrated. You are falling in love with the position, like I said, its about mismatches to move the ball. Whether that's Amendola on the ouside, LaFell in the flex spot, or even Boyce or Dobson as weapons.. BB and JMCD will find a way to move the ball in this offense through gameplanning and mismatches

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    In response to joepatsfan111111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TFB12's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Stop referring to 2001-2007, it is 2014 now!  The game is different now then it was then.  Offenses are totally different.  Defenses are different.  And why are you bringing up the Seahawks offense??  Their offense was below the Patriots in scoring and way, way below the Patriots in passing.  And you are acting like they are going to be this team who wins multiple SB's that everyone needs to use them as a blueprint to win the SB.  The won 1 SB, Joe. 

    The Pats offense with Gronk is a more powerful offense then without him.  With Hooman they might as well not even send him out in passing situations.  He provides zero threat, he isn't that good.   That position in this offense is a mismatch against other teams as long as you have a capable TE.  The Pats added 1 WR over last season, who knows how Lafell is going to be, who knows if Dobson will continue to have foot problems, who knows if Amendola can stay healthy, who knows if Thompkins can put together a good full season.  Again, the TE position is huge in this offense.  I really can't believe you under value the TE position so much on this team.

    [/QUOTE]

    I cant believe how much you overrate the TE position in this offense. If Gronk didn't fall into our lap on draft night, the Patriots offense would still be fine top 10 in scoring and yards. When we struck gold with Gronk the offense changed to a lot of TE looks, with no gronk they still would have a good scheme to move the ball.

    Like I said, the TE wont be used this year (outside Gronk) and it really doesn't matter. We will see a lot 3-4-5 WR sets this season with the logjam there and we will be just fine.

    Here, I'll pose you this since you think TE is such a big deal... Look at the other teams with big name TE and their back ups....

    49ers - Davis then Vance McDonald and Garret Celek, those guys are nothing better than  Hooman

    Denver - J. Thomas then Dreesen and Tamme which isn't bad so good for them

    Dallas - Witten then Gavin Escobar.... nope

    Miami - Clay then Dion Sims... who is that?

    New Orleans - Graham then Ben Watson who's old and washed up

    Pitt - Health Miller then... David Paulson... not better than Gronk.

     

    Those are the teams with the best TEs and outside of Denver, all of them have backups who are no better than Hooman. If the TE goes down on any of those teams they can use their WIDE RECIEVERS to move the ball. WRs are still alive in the NFL you know and we have a good variety of them from tall, deep threats, explosive and elusive.

    TE is overrated. You are falling in love with the position, like I said, its about mismatches to move the ball. Whether that's Amendola on the ouside, LaFell in the flex spot, or even Boyce or Dobson as weapons.. BB and JMCD will find a way to move the ball in this offense through gameplanning and mismatches

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes, I love the TE position and the weapon it provides for this offense.  In the NFL it's all about matchups.  TE's are changing the offenses around the league, Pats have a perfect offense for a capable TE.  And if you have multiple TE's then even better.  Put Lafell to take AHerns spot, then Gronk and a solid backup for him due to his injury history.  I like Mike Smith, coach of the Falcons take on double TE's... Double TE's are the “queens on the chessboard.”  Get the right tight ends and you can have a 60-minute advantage.

     

    All the teams you mentioned with their back ups not being good... the flaw in that Joe is that those TE's don't have a history of missing large chunks of the season like Gronk has done the past couple seasons.  Those teams don't have to rely on their back up TE's like the Pats do. 

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

     

    What they need are quality weapons.  Belichick's genius is designing schemes that utilize the players he has to their maximum effect.  He can do one TE, two TEs, two receivers, three receivers, one back, two backs . . .whatever.  It all depends on who he has. 

     

    That said, he does need at least a few quality players.  If they don't have a quality TE, then they need the quality elsewhere--in their receivers or their backs.  The problem will be if they have no TEs, none of the receivers takes a step up over last year, and the backs are the same.  Then they won't have sufficient quality anywhere and they'll be in tough spot.  

     

    They just need enough quality.  Where that quality is doesn't concern me too much because Belichick is such a master at creating schemes to work with the weapons he has. 

     

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from carawaydj. Show carawaydj's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    I don't think you can "manage" Gronk's playing time any more than you would manage Brady's playing time.  When Gronk is healthy he is a beast.  He's our best weapon.  You want your best weapon on the field and being employed.  Gronk has had some bad luck with injuries for sure.  I'm not willing to say he can't make it through an entire season again.  He might be a victim more to his playing style than he is actually injury prone.  He forgets that he isn't wearing an exoskeleton.  Maybe he was bit by a spider as a kid and believes he's spiderman.  


    Should he injure himself again this year then we probably need to do what Prolate suggests.  Put him on ice until close to the playoffs.



    This is what being level-headed sounds like.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    If BB knew anything about football he would have drafted a sure fire HOF TE in this years draft to back up Gronk. We knew Gronks back issue would lead to his forearm and knee problems, so it was obviously another classic Belichick bust pick.

    I still can't believe we haven't traded for Jimmy Graham and Larry Fitzgerald.  It's so obvious. 
     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Pats & Gronk Want Week 1 Return

    Just some more notes on the passing concerns, still can not see where some think another good TE is not needed for depth, could also use another legit WR, imo.  If I could only chooses one it would probably be adding to the TE position.


    http://www.patriots.com/news/blog/article-1/From-the-Hart-10-mild-takes-from-Patriots-spring-practice/1a88e706-e9cb-4a93-bcfd-e14a52561533


    1 – Passing concerns: It was hard not to notice the lack of weapons in the New England passing game this spring. Rob Gronkowski was with the rehab group. Aaron Dobson was amongst the missing. Brandon LaFell made a minor cameo. Josh Boyce got dinged up late. Maybe the only good sign was the Danny Amendola seemed healed from the groin issues that limited him last fall. Still, the receiver position is a dubious depth chart of injury concerns and uncertain options. The tight end spot as a factor in the passing game is almost solely based on No. 87’s health. The lack of weapons and depth in the passing game was even more evident when Jimmy Garoppolo ran the second unit made up of unknowns, have-nots and some likely never-wills.


     


     


     


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