Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

    Some here need to wake up and take a reality pill....seriously....

    What part about Hernandez is involved in a Murder are some not getting?

     

    [QUOTE]

    Ray Lewis was involved in a murder too, under somewhat similar circumstances. He was either directly involved or he was just part of covering it up.  He made a deal. Now he's a role model, pitchman, and pillar of the community.  I don't remember, did he miss a game, a practice?

    My point is is stop all the mouth breathing and wait and see how it plays out. Those who say his career is over or he needs to be cut at this point are the cranky ones.

     

     

     

     

     

    He’s been involved in 2 other documented shootings Muz..one involving shooting a man in the face.

    He is being charged with obstructing justice in a murder investigation….you know why?

    Because he has obstructed justice in a murder investigation.

    I don’t need to wait around until the charges are upgraded to murder.

    He’s disgraced the organization and smeared the Patriot brand. Enough is enough.

    Let the Law take it from here but Hernandez needs to be banished from this organization like the human maggot that his is. There is no reason to allow this to linger or tarnish the organization any further.

    Those who are unable, or unwilling, to realize this….need to take a look at their moral compass and realize there can be only one way to go forward with this situation.

     

     

    [QUOTE]

    What other "documented shootings"? Some guy filed a civil suit against a rich guy claiming he was shot and the guy needs to pay him.  If this is true, why wasn't the rich guy arrested? Generally speaking, if you're shot in the face your first call is to 911, not to some lawyer. Moreover, if you're treated in a hospital for gunshot wounds there usually follows some sort of police investigation. 

    I can file a civil suit tomorrow claiming whatever Dick Cheney shot me in the face during a poker game after I caught him cheating. Doesn't make it a "documented shooting" because I put it on paper and paid a court filing fee. 

    I get that some people have him tried and convicted without knowing really anything at this point. Rush to judgment all you want. Hopefully, the Patriots are a bit more patient.

     



    Or you could just go bird hunting with Cheney and have a real case against him Foot in Mouth

     

    [/QUOTE]

    No thanks. I jumped out of an airplane and ran with the bulls, but I'm not THAT crazy.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    Muzzy is correct, the legal system needs to play out.

    however, the NFL will also take action 

    if it turns out Hern was there, but did nothing other than was a driver or innocent bystander, both the NFL and the Pats will take action if the courts don't...

    Hern could play again in the NFL, if some team will have him (some team would) but I don't think he plays again for the Pats

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

     


    I don't disagree. If (the operative word here) the facts emerge that Hern is responsible for killing the guy in ANY way, he's a menace to society, give him 40 to life and hope we never hear from him again.

     

     

    There are a couple of other possibilities though. It's equally possible that he did not kill the guy but that he helped the killer cover it up after the fact. It's also possible (but admittedly less likely given some of the facts we do know) that he personally had nothing to do with either the crime or the cover up. 

    If he was part of the cover up, but not the murder, he could make a deal and do no time and after a suspension, resume his football career. 

    Let's let it play out is all I'm saying.

     



    To me covering it up, though not as bad, is still a major crime that I wouldn't want associated with the team and he still needs to be a role model in jail for. I mean what happens if he covers it up and the person gets away with it only to kill again? To me that's almost as if you killed that second person yourself because you allowed it to happen by covering up the first one. If he had absolutely nothing to do with it that would be one thing but of all the scenerios right now that's the least likely as we find out more and more. All I'm saying is murder or covering for murder is not acceptable regardless if you are a brick layer or a pro football player. Heck, if my brother commited murder and I knew he did it I'd be driving him down to the cops that day wrapped up in duct tape. I've lost friends for no reason than the wrong place at the wrong time and if Brady himself tried to cover up for their killers I'd want Brady in jail that day.

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     


    I don't disagree. If (the operative word here) the facts emerge that Hern is responsible for killing the guy in ANY way, he's a menace to society, give him 40 to life and hope we never hear from him again.

     

     

    There are a couple of other possibilities though. It's equally possible that he did not kill the guy but that he helped the killer cover it up after the fact. It's also possible (but admittedly less likely given some of the facts we do know) that he personally had nothing to do with either the crime or the cover up. 

    If he was part of the cover up, but not the murder, he could make a deal and do no time and after a suspension, resume his football career. 

    Let's let it play out is all I'm saying.

     

     



    To me covering it up, though not as bad, is still a major crime that I wouldn't want associated with the team and he still needs to be a role model in jail for. I mean what happens if he covers it up and the person gets away with it only to kill again? To me that's almost as if you killed that second person yourself because you allowed it to happen by covering up the first one. If he had absolutely nothing to do with it that would be one thing but of all the scenerios right now that's the least likely as we find out more and more. All I'm saying is murder or covering for murder is not acceptable regardless if you are a brick layer or a pro football player. Heck, if my brother commited murder and I knew he did it I'd be driving him down to the cops that day wrapped up in duct tape. I've lost friends for no reason than the wrong place at the wrong time and if Brady himself tried to cover up for their killers I'd want Brady in jail that day.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Well, yeah Brady's old anyway...

    I agree that we don't want criminals on the Pats and if he's guilty of any offense related to murder (or rape or child molesting or a few other things), good riddance.

    Sports is funny though, fans seem to rationalize behavior if you're important enough to the team, see Roethlisberger, Ben and Lewis, Ray.

    Mike Tyson is dancing at the Tony Awards. 

    Some people will overlook just about anything.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

     


    Well, yeah Brady's old anyway...

     

    I agree that we don't want criminals on the Pats and if he's guilty of any offense related to murder (or rape or child molesting or a few other things), good riddance.

    Sports is funny though, fans seem to rationalize behavior if you're important enough to the team, see Roethlisberger, Ben and Lewis, Ray.

    Mike Tyson is dancing at the Tony Awards. 

    Some people will overlook just about anything.



    Sports is funny, it's also what annoys me most about fans. I understand you need to let the courts take their course but I'm not a court and frankly I've grew up in not so great areas and seen things like this play out when I was younger. Whether or not he was part of it directly that he's still hanging around with his old crowd and was around it when it did is a huge black mark for me. I worked hard to get out of similar situations as him and wouldn't want to drag myself back in the way he has. I've always been told, by people telling to help kids get out of the situation, that you are only as good as the people you surround yourself with. Whether he's guilty of murder I have no clue but I do know for sure he put himself in this situation when he had all the resources in the world trying to get him away from it. Is bad judgement a crime, nope. But at some point when you become a dad and have resources to get out of such a life you need to get out and cut ties otherwise you should be accountable for what happens if you don't. By accountable it doesn't mean jail all the time (of course if he had no part he should get no jail) but he does need to take a public image hit and maybe even lose his job. If someone else wants to hire him that's on them but he put himself in this situation to begin with.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TSWFAN. Show TSWFAN's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    Hope the Pats can get every dime back and AH will go to selling drugs. He had a chance for a great life and he fumbled.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

     

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

     

    Can this board release Eldunker and get relief from these dopey posts?

     
    RESPONSE: Actually, he brings up a good point. Your response is what is dopey. My guess is that Hernandez, and every player, has some sort of conduct clause in his contract...which gives the Pats an out. Seeing how the Pats protected themselves with the rookie deal given Hernandez, I'd be shocked to learn that the Pats didn't protect themselves again, in his new deal: http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2010/06/patriots_play_c.html 

     

    [QUOTE]

    Response

    This statement by the OP is dopey: "At the very least, he will be tied up for many, many, many months in this murder trial and the FLA face shooting, not to mention the RI bar incident. He will be physically unable to fulfill his contractual football duties and mentally he has got to be a complete basketcase and now worthless to the team."

    We have no idea whatsoever whether this case will result in a murder trial or whether Hernandez will miss one day of training camp or whether the RI or FL matters will result in any missed time or anything else. You want to discuss contracts, fine have at it, but save the completely unforunded conclusions for another time, like when we know a whole lot more than we know now.



    RESPONSE: Okay. But don't go tearing the premise of the guy's thread up. After all, his topic dealt with the Pats' contractual obligtions to AH. Hernandez will certainly be charged with obstruction of justice, for destroying evidence. Though at present, there's no hard evidence that he actually shot the decedent, AH may still face murder charges as an accomplice.  

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

    Once Hernandez is arrested today the clock starts ticking as to how soon the Patriots release him. It should be immediately. There is no point in dragging it out. He made his choices and now the Law will meter justice.

    The Patriots need to move on and purge this fool from the organization as soon as possible.

     



         There may be reasons for not releasing him immediately...dealing with the recovery of the guaranteed money paid to AH:  http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/06/21/timing-of-hernandez-incident-creates-dilemma-for-nfl-patriots/

     

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from NoMorePensionLooting. Show NoMorePensionLooting's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Once Hernandez is arrested today the clock starts ticking as to how soon the Patriots release him. It should be immediately. There is no point in dragging it out. He made his choices and now the Law will meter justice.

    The Patriots need to move on and purge this fool from the organization as soon as possible.

     



         There may be reasons for not releasing him immediately...dealing with the recovery of the guaranteed money paid to AH.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I doubt the PATS would even waste their time trying to get back the money already paid. They should cut him and never look back.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

     

     

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

     

     

    Once Hernandez is arrested today the clock starts ticking as to how soon the Patriots release him. It should be immediately. There is no point in dragging it out. He made his choices and now the Law will meter justice.

    The Patriots need to move on and purge this fool from the organization as soon as possible.

     

     

     



         There may be reasons for not releasing him immediately...dealing with the recovery of the guaranteed money paid to AH.

     

     

     

     

     




    I doubt the PATS would even waste their time trying to get back the money already paid. They should cut him and never look back.

     



         If I were Kraft, I'd be ripping mad...and would want my money back. Plus, there may be  salary cap implications to consider.

     

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    ESPN reporting that Hern's contract maybe lacked typical language that would have given the Pats  the right not to pay him his guaranteed money for a failure to perform . . .  don't fully trust these reports but it seems relevant to this thread.

     From ESPN:

     In almost all situations, when an NFL player is suspended, he forfeits all of the future guarantees in his contract. Even if a signing bonus or base salary is guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, a "failure to perform" or "failure to practice" clause makes those guarantees null and void.

    In a surprising twist, this appears not to be the case with the five-year, $40-million extension signed byNew England Patriots tight end Aaron Hernandez in August of 2012. Upon close reading of his contract language -- and after confirming the development with an expert -- the "failure to perform" or "failure to practice" clause that appears in similar Patriots extensions is not present. This means Hernandez might be able to keep nearly $2.5 million of the deal, even if legal troubles prevented him from taking the field.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

    ESPN reporting that Hern's contract maybe lacked typical language that would have given the Pats  the right not to pay him his guaranteed money for a failure to perform . . .  don't fully trust these reports but it seems relevant to this thread.

     From ESPN:

     In almost all situations, when an NFL player is suspended, he forfeits all of the future guarantees in his contract. Even if a signing bonus or base salary is guaranteed for skill, injury and salary cap, a "failure to perform" or "failure to practice" clause makes those guarantees null and void.

    In a surprising twist, this appears not to be the case with the five-year, $40-million extension signed byNew England Patriots tight end Aaron Hernandez in August of 2012. Upon close reading of his contract language -- and after confirming the development with an expert -- the "failure to perform" or "failure to practice" clause that appears in similar Patriots extensions is not present. This means Hernandez might be able to keep nearly $2.5 million of the deal, even if legal troubles prevented him from taking the field.



         This is mystifying, if true. The Pats should know better. But, if this is true, the Pats should cut Hernandez loose immediately: http://www.boston.com/blogs/sports/columnists/kaufman/2013/06/aaron_hernandezs_patriots_career_likely_over.html

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: Pats Contractual Obligations to AHern?

    As I read the tea leaves, Hernandez gets to keep $700,000 of his $30 million dollar contract for services rendered during the 2012 season.  All of his bonus and all of his 2013 and beyond salary can in theory be clawed back for disgracing the NFL and the Patriots.  In practice, Hernandez needs to get all available money to a Cayman Islands bank account pronto, because every available dollar is going to be clawed back if possible.  

     
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