Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    This is a desperation move.

    [/QUOTE]

    Of course it is. Desperate times call for desperate measures. This secondary is a JOKE. A 96 DPR. Horrible. Embarrassing. Worse than last year.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to Neal Page's comment:

    What?  Moss was dealt in Week 4 before Minny;s Bye week, so BB fleeced Minny there. 

    It's rare, but we've seen plenty of players dealt for mid rd picks midway through a season. God forbid BB do things to improve or attempt to improve his team whether it's dealing Moss in 2010/acquiring Branch or this move here.

    Keep in mind, we're still waiting on our offense to be there when the chips are on the table.

     



    No, I meant coming to the Pats mid season. I had forgotten Branch. 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    Funny to see people wringing their hands over a 4th rounder but they are docile as lambs over 7 second round picks that have produced basically nada since 2008.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Quagmire3. Show Quagmire3's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to Mighty2013's comment:

    In response to Quagmire3's comment:

    Prediction: New England leads Green bay in the Super Bowl 34-28 with :41 left. Green Bay is out of timeouts, and is driving. They are at the New England 35 and Aquib Talib picks off Aaron Rodgers to secure the Super Bowl win! TexasPat and all the posters here saying its a desperation move, then start a thread saying "we got to resign this guy!" HAHAHAHA Hey a guy can dream can't he?!



    More like he posts a report card giving everyone B's and C's following the Super Bowl win.




    +1

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    This is a desperation move.



    Of course it is. Desperate times call for desperate measures. This secondary is a JOKE. A 96 DPR. Horrible. Embarrassing. Worse than last year.



    Ras Dowling got hurt, Belichick made a move to replace him with what amounts to a 5-6th round pick because he got a 7th back in exchange.  The defense was improving, we just held the surging Rams to 7 points.  Ras Dowling covered their tightend the whole game and was shutting them down on third downs by the end of the game, he was playing really good.  The defense was going to continue to improve regardless of this move because the pressure up front was better and the defense is learning how to play and play together.  

    Instant satisfaction is typical with spoiled fans of great teams, Brady was dead on.

    The defense is ranked 12th in the NFL in points given up per game, they rank #1 the NFL in takeaways, their "big" corner got hurt and they replaced him.  Both corners are 6'1" 205 pounds, both have a skill set that the other corners in our secondary can't replace.  This is a logical move, a great move; trolls and nervous Nancy's will disagree.

    This from Damian Woody in a recent espn article:

    "Coach [Bill] Belichick always used to say, 'I don't give a s--- about our defense giving up yards; all I care about is scoring defense, turnovers and the red zone,'" Woody said. "That's really the key to football. A lot of coaches pound their chest and say, 'I've got the No. 1 defense.'

    "That number doesn't mean anything."

    Bend don't break.  This defense is 12th best in the NFL, some would argue better because it leads the NFL in turnovers.  It's not bad, you just don't understand it.

     

 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    karp, im more concerned with winning now over not being able to move in next years draft. I mean cmon, thats the whole point. BB has done better with trading pics for Players (Wes,Moss, Talib?) then drafting them.. so who cares about next years draft?



    that wasnt the point I was making. My point is that a 4th is high for a question mark such as Talib, and for 7 games at that, and was some one more stable available for that 4th rd pick.

    Talib is a veteran that upgrades the position. Is he smart enough to stay in the game?

     



    #1 the 4th is a late 4th, so about a 5th. #2 our secondary S@CKS. so adding a real cb coulld help put us over the top. if we win a super bowl it will be a brilliant move. if he is good and stays out of trouble and is extended or stays with pats (even w/o a sb win), that is great.

    if neither of these things happen, some can say it was a stupid move,

    while others can say, at least bb finally did someting to address a problem he has heretofor not even dented. (count me in this latter group).

    talib has been a team guy lately and even moved to tampa at the request of the team, so trouble wouldnt catch up with him back home.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to PatsLifer's comment:

    You got to wonder how the pats lockerroom feels about this? I am sure they will publicly tote the company line, but I got to think guys know he is a knucklehead. 

    Persoannly I am not worried by him getting into trouble....he is gone...it's the potential negative effect it could have in the lockwroom that concernS me. 

    This moron got into a fistfight with a teamate of his during the rookie thing the nfl does every year for new guys. I just hope if he is feeling frisky he decides to go off on spikes and not a guy like Brady, this guy is a ticking timebomb and although he has talent, he also has the potential to be more trouble than hauls worth and a detriment to the lockwroom....see fat Albert, adelius, etc...




    "Persoannly I am not worried by him getting into trouble....he is gone...it's the potential negative effect it could have in the lockwroom that concernS me. 

    This moron got into a fistfight with a teamate of his during the rookie thing the nfl does every year for new guys. I just hope if he is feeling frisky he decides to go off on spikes and not a guy like Brady, this guy is a ticking timebomb and although he has talent, he also has the potential to be more trouble than hauls worth and a detriment to the lockwroom....see fat Albert, adelius, etc..."

     

    i started a thread about this "no teddy, willie, ted....."

    the stuff you mention here was quite a while ago.

    while he has maturity issues and he behaves in line with how and where he grew up, he hasnt exhibited these outbursts of late ie past year.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    In response to Mighty2013's comment:

    Was suspended for PEDs.  Hopefully the enhancement lasts through February.




    lol



    last I checked Adderall was the most common prescribed drug for ADD or ADHD. The effects are purely mental with regards to concentration (commonly known as the college exam drug) 

    Surely an upgrade physically, but has the rep of a knucklhead. BBmust feel the locker room can handle a knucklehead, or he is desperate.

     



    I'm not saying the guy is a junky, but Adderall is a lot more than just a little mental/concentration drug. For people that take it without actually having ADD it can have a simialr affect to other drugs that increase energy and concentration (see cocaine). There's a reason why people kill for this stuff - it's not because it just makes you concentrate a bit more.



    Adderall is essentially speed. It's just a time release version of amphetamine. 

    The guy could have been taking it recreationally for all we know. 

    Regardless, when he came out I wanted NE to take him in the draft because I thought his skill set matched other corners who played well in the system -- ie., he was a polished zone corner coming out of college who had a knack for making plays on the ball. Kind of like Asante and Law who both worked well with what BB does. 

    A fourth rounder for a "cup of coffee n' see what happens later" with a player like him is a great deal. Worst case scenario, you are out a fourth. Best case scenario, he 'gets it' and he 'gets' what NE does on defense and you have a pretty good corner there for a 4th.



    yup. very simple.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    In response to ipotnyc's comment:

    Talib has definitely had some issues.  I don't think BB would jump the gun and not take that into consideration in making the move for him.  If they get even a season and a half of solid production from him before his next incident, then it's a win deal.

    RESPONSE: Talib has some issues??? This guy has been a walking, talking issue since his college days.

    No guarantee a 4th round pick will be a Aaron Hernandez or - yikes- a Jonathan Wihlite.

    RESPONSE: Remember how BB found himself in a bind in last years' draft, because the Patriots were left with no picks after round 2? Well, the Pats have already thrown away their 5th and 6th rounders in the Ocho and Haynesworth deals...and now their 4th rounder as well. 

    Bedard calls this a "desperation move."  Why?  He's got an abundance of talent and the secondary is sorely lacking.  It's called an UPGRADE.  From Schiano, a coach BB respects.  Desperation moves are picking guys up off the street.

    RESPONSE: This is a desperation move. It really concerns me, because it tells me that BB thinks that his secondary is as bad or worse than we do. BB didn't just trade for a Corey Dillon or a Randy Moss...who were moody guys, rather than thugs. Talib is a mental case: http://www.tampabay.com/sports/football/bucs/gary-shelton-time-for-buccaneers-to-cut-aqib-talib-loose/1256333







    To be fair TP it's a win now mentality at this point. Brady's window is closing and I don't see it as a desperation move so much as a, we have a SB caliber team this year but with a major achiles heel. Yes Talib is a head case but it's not like they are extending him (I hope they don't). Talib is a move where he has to be on his best behavior for the rest of the year or no one will sign him next year. So, maybe BB is just hoping to get the half of year out of him and catch lighting in a bottle. If it works it's well worth a 4th round pick, if it doesn't then it was just as good of a shot to take as drafting a player in the 4th honestly. The Pats have rebuilt everything on the team and have a very young team except in the DB core (rebuilt wise not youth wise). Honestly in the 4th what would the odds of finding a starting caliber CB be? Yes this move carries risks but the pay off could far outweight it in the end, esp since we don't need a ton of picks this up coimng draft given the youth currently on the team



    "Honestly in the 4th what would the odds of finding a starting caliber CB be"

     exactly round 4 pick 30 for instance, is bb going to get a talib (talentwise)? very highly improbable.

    besides, even if we did by miracel, it wont help us win a sb this year

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    Why are people concerned about the 4th round being too high of a pick? How many wasted 2nd round pics have we had in the past 5 years or so?  I hate when I see people go all crazy over a stupid 2nd day pick that probably wont bring anything back over a guy who already has NFL experience and can play. I mean I dont care what pic they would have given up because from rounds 1 -4 we have found a way to draft busts anyway so isnt it a better bet to use the pic on a player who HAS had success in the league. Screw the off field stuff. He was in florida. IN NE he wont get into anything and it didnt keep BB from drafting Meriweather who also shot at someone in college but wasnt worth the pic in hindsight. I liked M.Griffin but anyway....use the pics to make ur team better. Last 4th rounder we traded worked out right?



    my thoughts exactly as well

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    This guy is Asante Samuel with tackling ability. He is a QB reader which NONE of our CBs can do, meaning we wont be screaming at him to turn his head around. He is an off Man to man cover like Asante although he can press better than Asante if need be. HE makes the kinds of plays that Asante made in the Bears game when he is playing his own man and looking in at the QB, he comes off his man and makes an INT on slot player running an inside route. There are only a handful of players Ive seen do this and He has done it twice. So I WILL TAKE THAT! 

     

    Our guys dont even make plays on the guys they ARE covering and this guy can read Qbs and break on balls. Will he give up some buy gambling? maybe, but he will make more plays then he gives up which is much more than we can say for unmm Kyle Arrington was the starter coming in. Guy cant cover his mouth with his hand this year so guys need to chillax and realize its a necessary and smart move that could pay off big in the form of a title..



    :)

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    Why are people concerned about the 4th round being too high of a pick? How many wasted 2nd round pics have we had in the past 5 years or so?  I hate when I see people go all crazy over a stupid 2nd day pick that probably wont bring anything back over a guy who already has NFL experience and can play. I mean I dont care what pic they would have given up because from rounds 1 -4 we have found a way to draft busts anyway so isnt it a better bet to use the pic on a player who HAS had success in the league. Screw the off field stuff. He was in florida. IN NE he wont get into anything and it didnt keep BB from drafting Meriweather who also shot at someone in college but wasnt worth the pic in hindsight. I liked M.Griffin but anyway....use the pics to make ur team better. Last 4th rounder we traded worked out right?



    I could care less about the pick they gave up to get him. I just think people should temper expectations for what he is going to bring to this team. Even at his best, he was never one of the top corners in the league. However, is better than anyone the Patriots had out there this year. 

    It is going to be a couple weeks before we even see him play. It is not like the Bucs were shutting teams down with Talib in the lineup this year. 

    I think the pick is totally worth the any risk involved. The defensive backfield on this team was just plain bad, at least they admitted it and are trying to make it better!



    re: "However, is better than anyone the Patriots had out there this year. "

    exactly!

    It is going to be a couple weeks before we even see him play. It is not like the Bucs were shutting teams down with Talib in the lineup this year. "

    actually if the bucs played press man he may have. they too run some combination coverage like us.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to anonymis' comment:

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    We traded a 4th round pick for a 1st round talent who is nearing the age where he either grows up or out of the league.  This isn't desperation, this is Ras Dowling our "big" cover corner getting injured and BB replacing him.  

    Anyone who thinks we aren't going to continue to give up yards, like this is some magic solution to a problem is deluding themselves, giving up yards is part of the scheme we run.  

    The defense is getting better anyway with or without Talib, so when you see a marked improvement on defense understand that it's because of improved and increased pressure upfront, not some magic player that is curing all our defensive woes.  This is a low risk high reward move, there is no downside.



    obviously, there were several factors involved in the Patriots two SB losses to the Giants; including bad game plan, bad play calling, turnovers, and anemic offense.  That being said, isn't it the same scheme that contributed with our defensive inability to get off the field during critical times in a game?



    on board with all that.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to tanbass' comment:

    I love all these comments about "The Patriot Way"......who are you kidding? The "Patriot Way" hasn't proved $hit since 2004.

    This isn't rocket science folks. The guy is clearly a head case, that has all the talent to be a pro-bowl corner. I just don't care about his past....what I care about is what he does here and now.

    Is he a punk? Yep....no doubt. Will he act out again? NOBODY really knows that answer. All I know is that we might have just aquired 1st round talent, for a 4th round pick. I could care less what this guy puts into his system as long as he can cover WRs.

    The "Patriot Way" doesn't mean squat anymore.....we have pulled many head cases in here that didn't quite fit the mold. Some have been great additions, and other were sent packing. Only time will tell with this kid.....but IMO, it's a risk well worth taking, "Patriot Way" or not....

     



    "All I know is that we might have just aquired 1st round talent, for a 4th round pick."

    in a nutshell. 

    forgot to add, for about  $7-800, 000

    if he plays like he has, it's a steal.

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from NY-PATS-FAN4. Show NY-PATS-FAN4's posts

    Re: Pats trade for tampa's Talib!!!

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to TexasPat's comment:

    This is a desperation move.



    Of course it is. Desperate times call for desperate measures. This secondary is a JOKE. A 96 DPR. Horrible. Embarrassing. Worse than last year.



    Ras Dowling got hurt, Belichick made a move to replace him with what amounts to a 5-6th round pick because he got a 7th back in exchange.  The defense was improving, we just held the surging Rams to 7 points.  Ras Dowling covered their tightend the whole game and was shutting them down on third downs by the end of the game, he was playing really good.  The defense was going to continue to improve regardless of this move because the pressure up front was better and the defense is learning how to play and play together.  

    Instant satisfaction is typical with spoiled fans of great teams, Brady was dead on.

    The defense is ranked 12th in the NFL in points given up per game, they rank #1 the NFL in takeaways, their "big" corner got hurt and they replaced him.  Both corners are 6'1" 205 pounds, both have a skill set that the other corners in our secondary can't replace.  This is a logical move, a great move; trolls and nervous Nancy's will disagree.

    This from Damian Woody in a recent espn article:

    "Coach [Bill] Belichick always used to say, 'I don't give a s--- about our defense giving up yards; all I care about is scoring defense, turnovers and the red zone,'" Woody said. "That's really the key to football. A lot of coaches pound their chest and say, 'I've got the No. 1 defense.'

    "That number doesn't mean anything."

    Bend don't break.  This defense is 12th best in the NFL, some would argue better because it leads the NFL in turnovers.  It's not bad, you just don't understand it.

     



    Actually, Wozz, Ras-I went on injured reserve two days before the Rams game.


    But I agree with your basic premises, and while I don't see Talib as a model citizen, I think the trade has higher upside potential than downside risk.

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