Plagarist...liar?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    NAS I will leave you with this as the article is written much better than i could produce. You can do with it what you like and I'm sure you will discount it for whatever reason including the fact the writer may not like Borges but it doesn't change any of the facts or anecdotal information in his piece.

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/why-ron-borges-should-be-fired/5061/




    That is a very interesting article.  It says he should be fired because they don't like how he does his job.  It doesn't pin any lies on him.  People here are calling the guy a liar.  I am trying to figure out why.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

     

    It is your right to discount his history it is my right to take his history and use it as a guide to analyze anything he writes about the Pat's.

     

    You know like the time he picked the Patriots to win the AFCCCG on MSNBC and then wrote the next day in the Globe the Pat's were going to win.

     



    Like the time he picked the Pats to win and then the next day he picked the Pats to win?  Am I reading that correctly?

     

     




     

    Apoligies should have read the Colts in the Globe piece.

    [/QUOTE]


    Assuming no new info was uncovered overnight, that makes him a wishy-washy, poor writer.  It doesn't make him a liar.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

     

    In response to CablesWyndBairn's comment:

     

     

     


    But the point, to me I guess, is that Borges' information and sourcing is poor and not verifiable.  Of course, with his caveats, Borges goes out of his way to say, in effect, "...hey, I'm only telling you what I heard through the grapevine." He's including something in the article that comes from a third party, a guy who is not even the source of the quote, and using it to advance his anti-BB agenda.  Typical Borges. 

    So yeah, BB and Kraft have everything to lose, but the Hernandez associate, the guy who is probably a punk on the street, has nothing to gain?  How about 15 minutes of fame, a quote in Rolling Stone, or being paid for his information?  If this guy exists, and if he's telling the truth, why hide?  

    Again, this is typical Borges.  He lets his hatred overtake his credibility.   

     

     



    Why hide?  Maybe because the info he's giving is about a guy who is suspected of three murders.  15 minutes of fame usually comes with a name attached.  The guy who is quoted isn't garnering any fame.

     

     

    The article clearly states that it's third party info.  It's a "hey, this is what one of his boys said" and it's opened attributed to that.  Love, hate or don't care about Borges, it doesn't make the statement any less true.

     




    We'll agree to disagree. But an anonymous quote from a third party source who is not even the source of the quote means no one is accountable for the information and said information is not even verifiable.  Journalistic integrity at its best, right?  It's a throw away line couched as such so that if confronted Borges can say "...I'm only telling you what some guy said AH told one of his friends."  It's included to serve Borges' purposes. 

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

     

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

     

     

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

     

    It is your right to discount his history it is my right to take his history and use it as a guide to analyze anything he writes about the Pat's.

     

    You know like the time he picked the Patriots to win the AFCCCG on MSNBC and then wrote the next day in the Globe the Pat's were going to win.

     



    Like the time he picked the Pats to win and then the next day he picked the Pats to win?  Am I reading that correctly?

     

     

     




     

     

    Apoligies should have read the Colts in the Globe piece.




    Assuming no new info was uncovered overnight, that makes him a wishy-washy, poor writer.  It doesn't make him a liar.

     

     




    Just one little anecdote of many that points to his credibility or lack thereof.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    Last words I have to say in this topic.  Journalistic integrity aside, people are reading the article and talking about it, which is mission accomplished as far as Rolling Stone or Ron Borges are concerned.  That is the bottom line.  The fact that Jonathan Kraft has to dispute certain points of the article publicly is a home run for RS or RB.  That in itself says a lot. 



     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to CablesWyndBairn's comment:

    In addition to being a plagiarist, Borges is about one of the most negative people you will ever hear speak.  His wanna be tough guy shtick is unbearable.  I'm guessing many of the posters in this thread defending or aligning him do not live in Boston and have not had to be subjected to his painful diatribes about the Patriots over the years on the airwaves.  You may read his stuff, but maybe you don't see him or hear him often enough to realise the depths of his obsession with the Patriots.  With Borges and the Patriots, it's clearly personal.

    Maybe it's just me, but I want my sports scribes, whether beat guy or columnist, to stick to facts and not get into the personal realm.  Borges interjects a lot of his personal hatred into his work, and it shows.  His objectivity is clearly in question. 

    I couldn't care less if Borges and others call BB out for some of his game planning, personnel moves or mistakes in the draft.  That's the business, and that's what football analysts do. These guys are paid to second guess, all with the benefit of hindsight and all while pretending that they have the same football knowledge as the guys they are being critical of.  All fine and good, no problems there.

    We all know that BB is aloof, calculating and can be condescending.  That's no reason to align yourselves with a guy like Borges who will always criticise anything the Patriots or BB accomplish.  That is, unless you have a personal thing against the Pats and like to fan the flames, which clearly some here do.         



    This 

    plus

    I heard Borges on WEEI the other morning.  He was called to account on multiple points most particularly his assertion that BB had publicly positioned the Patriots personnel selection practices as 'holier-than-thou'.  When Minihane called him on that, Borges couldn't back it up.  That's but one example of many - the guy has an agenda and is willing to compromise whatever integrity he once had (if any) to pursue it.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to CablesWyndBairn's comment:

    We'll agree to disagree. But an anonymous quote from a third party source who is not even the source of the quote means no one is accountable for the information and said information is not even verifiable.  Journalistic integrity at its best, right?  It's a throw away line couched as such so that if confronted Borges can say "...I'm only telling you what some guy said AH told one of his friends."  It's included to serve Borges' purposes. 



    It doesn't say that.  "Belichick, per a close Hernandez associate, had told him to lay low, rent a safe house for a while."

    It says "This guy said Belichick said this to Hernandez."  That's different than your statement. 

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    So far, nothing outside of he's a plagarist and unliked has come up to show why the bulk of the story is as bad as everyone makes it out to be.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

     

    In response to UD6's comment:

     

     

    jri - I am not trying to change that.  But again, that doesn't mean that what he has written or contributed to about Hernandez is false.  There have been previous patriot transgressions that could be used to suggest negative things about the patriots, but I've seen such things vigorously defended here.  I am not interested in getting into that but am pointing out that perspective matters.  

     

     




     

     

    here is what it comes down to. Either Borges and the RS writer are taking liberties with the truth or JK and BB are flat out liars.


    When every other team (including the pats) stayed away from Hernandez at the draft who was easily a first round talent, that's telling.  The pats covet value in the draft.  Its been demonstrated again and again.  When they took him in the 4th, his value finally exceeded his known issues. 

     

    Security departments within teams are there, substantially, to dig into their players' and draftees' lives and to know what they are up to even if they don't know their every move.  Maybe its me, maybe this whole idea of security departments within a team is a sham.  Maybe the pats really don't care about how their players conduct themselves, but if that is the case, then the "Patriot Way" has been a sham all along. 

    Or maybe, as I believe, the Pats got put in an incredibly difficult situation by having to decide to extend an incredibly talented player or let him go because he may have become an issue.  Again, I don't begrudge the pats for their decision, but in doing so, they promote the "Patriot Way" on a wing and a prayer, not as a legitimate foundation for the players they employ.  

     

     



    What does your personal feelings on the "Patriot Way" have to do with who is telling the truth?

     

    Your response to my previous post is just you being transparent as to why you post here. Next time just address the question posed your answer was akin to something Russ would do.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    There's no reason for me not to be transparent, but please don't act as if you are some board police who dictates how one posts.  The question about Borges is only a subset of the larger question which is did the pats know that Hernandez was engaged in a kind of bad behavior that may have guided them differently as it related to his contract extension? 

    If you can dismiss Borges completely then you can continue to say the pats knew nothing of Hernandez's bad behavior, if you can't then you have to accept that the pats may have known they were again taking a chance on a guy whose behavior could come back to haunt the team, which it has. 

    I believe the latter.  I don't begrudge the pats for their decision.  Football is a business, and Hernandez was a helluva commodity.  IMO, they rolled the dice and crapped out.  And yes, that raises a larger question about the team mantra, but you don't want to hear anything about that. 

    I get it.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to rtuinila's comment:

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    jri - I am not trying to change that.  But again, that doesn't mean that what he has written or contributed to about Hernandez is false.  There have been previous patriot transgressions that could be used to suggest negative things about the patriots, but I've seen such things vigorously defended here.  I am not interested in getting into that but am pointing out that perspective matters.  

     

     

     




     

     

     

    here is what it comes down to. Either Borges and the RS writer are taking liberties with the truth or JK and BB are flat out liars.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]
    When every other team (including the pats) stayed away from Hernandez at the draft who was easily a first round talent, that's telling.  The pats covet value in the draft.  Its been demonstrated again and again.  When they took him in the 4th, his value finally exceeded his known issues. 

     

     

    Security departments within teams are there, substantially, to dig into their players' and draftees' lives and to know what they are up to even if they don't know their every move.  Maybe its me, maybe this whole idea of security departments within a team is a sham.  Maybe the pats really don't care about how their players conduct themselves, but if that is the case, then the "Patriot Way" has been a sham all along. 

    Or maybe, as I believe, the Pats got put in an incredibly difficult situation by having to decide to extend an incredibly talented player or let him go because he may have become an issue.  Again, I don't begrudge the pats for their decision, but in doing so, they promote the "Patriot Way" on a wing and a prayer, not as a legitimate foundation for the players they employ.  

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Ok, everything you said might hold water except for the FACT Borges was asked about all the stuff he said about the Pats in that article during an interview on a Boston area radio station. He was asked about the "flop house", the missing practices, the telling BB he was in fear for his life. Instead of saying, Yes that is what happened , what he said was "Well, it COULD have happened that way."

     

    Now unless your moral compass is broken you know that passing off a fabrication as actual fact, as Borges did in that RS article, is lying.

    Since all of your accusations and recriminations are based on that lie, if you were really a moral person like you profess to be, you  would man up, admit you were wrong again and apologize to the entire message board for trying to perpetuate the lies and aspersions cast by Borges.

    [/QUOTE]

    My accusations and recriminations (your words) aren't based on that possible lie alone.  There was a great deal more to that article, and if I understand the time frame correctly, the "flophouse" incident occurred after Hernandez had already signed his contract.  So that is, frankly, immaterial to my comments. 

    I stand by what I have said, and I have presented them as my opinion based on the information available. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    Nice post.  Yep, I spelled that word wrong.

    Borges wasn't fired.

    None of what you wrote says he's a liar, however.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to russgriswold's comment:

    WHo are his sources? Do you know who is source really is, if it's even true? A whacked out Aaron Hernandez, you moron!



    I don't know who the source is.  Do you?  If you don't, how do you know what is true and what isn't?

    This thread had 60 posts on the subject.  You're the first one to start controversy about it.  Previously, we were all just discussing it.  Grow up.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to russgriswold's comment:



    Borges was FIRED. FACT

    They suspended him and then he was fired because people were outraged. So, he quietly disappeared after the return his TWO MONTH suspension. He was fired.

    I was actually off a by a year. I thought it was 2008, it was 2007.

    FIRED

    He also freelanced for a while before going to the Herald.  

    You don;t know much do you?

    Globe suspends sports reporter Borges Newspaper editor cites plagiarism

    By Michael Paulson, Globe Staff  |  March 6, 2007

    The Boston Globe yesterday suspended without pay for two months a veteran sports reporter, Ron Borges, after allegations that he had plagiarized a portion of a football column from another sportswriter.




     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    "Borges retires from Globe

    By Globe Staff  |  May 18, 2007

    Ron Borges, an award-winning journalist with the Boston Globe for 24 years, is leaving the paper to pursue new projects in sports journalism, he announced today."

    Everything written says he retired, yet you continue to say he was fired.  That makes sense.

    No one has provided anything that says he's a liar.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to russgriswold's comment:



    So, you think he just retired out the blue after a 2 month suspension? Now, you're just trolling. 

    And, the Gulf of Tonkin incident wasn't staged, too, you moron.  Christ, do you think the inbreeding in your family goes back generations or just one generation where out you came?

    Explains why gave yourself handies in the balcony of the Garden doing a Bruins game.  

    As for him being a liar, YES, he just tried to play off quotes from BB via made up crap via made up sources!

    Yes! That's called lying.

    If you think that is not lying, then that means you think BB is lying, which means you're a raging troll.



    Offer up proof that his source doesn't exist and then offer proof that he was fired.

    If you can't, then shut up.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from soups. Show soups's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    Borges has done a number of different things in his career, from plagiarizing to near libel, that should have left him looking for a new career.  He wasn't just "copying notes", lol.  How Solaratoff (who won the Pulitzer, btw) ended up collaborating with Borges is beyond me; Borges must have something on him.

    I mean, what popular magazine would ever use him as a source?

    Oh, right...

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    You know there is something sinister to a claim when it has to do with the patriots and occurs in Indy. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to soups' comment:

    Borges has done a number of different things in his career, from plagiarizing to near libel, that should have left him looking for a new career.  He wasn't just "copying notes", lol.  How Solaratoff (who won the Pulitzer, btw) ended up collaborating with Borges is beyond me; Borges must have something on him.

    I mean, what popular magazine would ever use him as a source?

    Oh, right...




    Didn't win the Pulitzer, but was nominated twice...which is still pretty darn good.

    The fact that a guy who was nominated twice for the Pulitzer decided to go with Borges should elevate Borges, not bring down the Solotaroff.  Except in Boston it doesn't because the article had a few lines that made Belichick look bad.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    I don't think Borges was ever "fired".  Was he suspended? Yes.  When he returned was he given the option to retire from his position or get fired?  Very possibly.  But he was never fired.

    As a Patriots fan I do not like Ron Borges.  His agenda on the Patriots is sicken.  I'm sure most here have read past garbage he has written and finds him to be an ugly slug.

    Now I have been a boxing fan most of my life and I will say that Borges has written many fine boxing pieces and has not been accused of anything negative concerning lying or plagiarism.  He was involved in a funny incident one time with another boxing writer.  I f anyone follows boxing for a long time you probably remember Michael Katz as a big boixing reporter many, many years ago.  You would probably remember Katz as the guy seen ringside or at press conferences always wearing a neck brace.  Well one time during an interview Borges took a swing at Katz and they got into a little fistycuffs of their own. It was freaking hilarious.  Neither one of them would be able to hold their own in a real fight.

    Anyways...  I guess what I am trying to say is I'm not a fan of Borges, he is an ugly dude when it comes to writing about the Patriots,  but I have always enjoyed his boxing writing.  But here is why I am not buying all the negative hate about the Rolling Stone article is because Paul Solotaroff is involved in this story.  He is a great writter, imo, and I am sure he knows Borges from the boxing writers field.  I would assume, and yes I am assuming here,  that as good as Solotaroff is in his field, he would question anything Borges said that sounded iffy.

     

     

      

     

     

    ---------------------------------------------

    "Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anybody else."  Text received by Tom Brady from Kurt Warner after Ravens loss.


    view my Patriots photoshops at patsfanfotoshop.tumblr.com





     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to NYC's comment:

    Borges has left the impression that he has always had an axe to grind against the Patriots.

    Sports writers are a funny breed. They want to be catered to; and if they are not, they can turn against you and seek retribution. Borges strikes me as this kind of narcissistic individual who feels wounded by being ignored and gets pleasure out of striking back to prove his worth.



    Well stated.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    No, of course Borges wasn't fired from the Globe.

    No one has been fired in the USA in over 30 years.

    When profits are down people get downsized.

    When businesses are in trouble employees are right-sized.

    When competition proves too tough jobs get outsourced.

    When you get caught in violation of company rules you resign to pursue other opportunities.

    But fired, no, that never happens anymore.


     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    In response to russgriswold's comment:

    In response to TFB12's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    I don't think Borges was ever "fired".  Was he suspended? Yes.  When he returned was he given the option to retire from his position or get fired?  Very possibly.  But he was never fired.

    As a Patriots fan I do not like Ron Borges.  His agenda on the Patriots is sicken.  I'm sure most here have read past garbage he has written and finds him to be an ugly slug.

    Now I have been a boxing fan most of my life and I will say that Borges has written many fine boxing pieces and has not been accused of anything negative concerning lying or plagiarism.  He was involved in a funny incident one time with another boxing writer.  I f anyone follows boxing for a long time you probably remember Michael Katz as a big boixing reporter many, many years ago.  You would probably remember Katz as the guy seen ringside or at press conferences always wearing a neck brace.  Well one time during an interview Borges took a swing at Katz and they got into a little fistycuffs of their own. It was freaking hilarious.  Neither one of them would be able to hold their own in a real fight.

    Anyways...  I guess what I am trying to say is I'm not a fan of Borges, he is an ugly dude when it comes to writing about the Patriots,  but I have always enjoyed his boxing writing.  But here is why I am not buying all the negative hate about the Rolling Stone article is because Paul Solotaroff is involved in this story.  He is a great writter, imo, and I am sure he knows Borges from the boxing writers field.  I would assume, and yes I am assuming here,  that as good as Solotaroff is in his field, he would question anything Borges said that sounded iffy.

     

     

      

     

     

    ---------------------------------------------

    "Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anybody else."  Text received by Tom Brady from Kurt Warner after Ravens loss.


    view my Patriots photoshops at patsfanfotoshop.tumblr.com





     



    No one cares what you are NAS try to deflect or spin here.

     

    Borges "retired" after his suspension. What on earth do you think that means?   HE WAS FIRED.

    They threw him a bone with the suspension to begin with and another on the way out the door by calling it a "retirement". He didn't get a retirement package either.

    Plagiarism is the cardinal sin for a journalist because it's technically theft. It'd be like a Pepsi stealing Coke's recipe and then acting like they didn't.

    It's beyond obvious, you are some really naive and gullible 20 something, TFB12.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    It's amazing the depths you go to with your silly agenda.  TROLL!

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheTinMan. Show TheTinMan's posts

    Re: Plagarist...liar?

    From the person that pounced on another poster for spelling a word incorrectly:
    "I have no idea what you're casting it off as nothing."  Don't use an interjection if you can't use the right one.
    "Like clockwork. Gutless puuke. GUTLESS"  Don't use a word if you can't spell it correctly
    "Explains why gave yourself handies in the balcony of the Garden doing a Bruins game."  There's a missing subject at the beginning of this sentence.  The final conjugated verb here should really be a preposition.
    "No one cares what you are NAS try to deflect or spin here"  Try a conjunction instead of a verb.

    There's no problem with making mistakes. Happens to us all.

    Take me for example, making a post like this.

     
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