Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

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    Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    List your predicted Patriots draft positions in order for the first 3 rounds (regardless of if they move up or down) and your reasoning if desired. I'll compile and see how we all did after the draft.   

    1. DE  - desparately need pass rush. some franchise players available early
    2. OL  - free agency could expose a big crack
    3. OLB - need a consistent impact player and leader here
    4. RB  -  Imagine how more balanced our O would be with an actual legit RB
    5. WR -  Branch is old, Welker is ?? need a fast tall strong deep threat
    6. CB -   need strong bench/replacement for predictable injuries at this position
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    I agree on everything from 1-3.

    On the RB I think BJGE and Woodhead provide a great 1-2 but they still need that shot yard tough back that wears down the D and lets Woodhead run wild later in games. Now that has something to do with the OLine but I just don't feel comfortable with Green running in must need 2 yrd or less situations. Ideally I  wouldn't mind someone like a Kuhn. He a RB/FB combo that can lead the way but will pound the ball for short yards and if the other team is in a dime package can run over the secondary when he gets to the second level. It's just my opinion but I think a bruiser back makes us more balanced by forcing teams to guess whether he's in there to lead block in the I formation, run the ball, or to pass block in a play action. For that you don't need a premier RB just someone who will get you 500+ yrds carrying maybe 300+ in receiving and be able to hold his own in short yrds and blocking.

    With the WR I think Price has a good shot at becoming that deep threat WR. He's shown to have great hands and is really fast. What I think we need is a big possession WR. Someone who won't get bumped off the line and can fight for the ball. Basically another Hernandez or a Mike Williams type in Sea.

    I agree we need more help in the secondary depth in the CB spot would help but I'd go further in saying we need more consistent S's too. Page looked decent and Sanders keeps performing although getting older. Chung is getting ready to take over that leadership role Harrison left but Meriweather still has trouble wrapping up tackles, staying in his position, and just being consistent from play to play never mind game to game. I think they need to look to replace him with someone who might not make a ton of big plays but consistently plays in position, makes the tackles, and doesn't make bad cuts or reads.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    1 DE
    2 OL
    3 OLB
    4 OL
    5 RB
    6 CB

    Of course this is before any FA signings.  If we re-sign either Light or Mankins, the need for OL is much less.  I don't think may will disagree that we need a DE even with Ty coming back.  A RB would be great, but I think it will be easier to fill the short yardage back role via FA than the other team needs.  Pats will definitely take at least 1 RB in the draft though.

    I wouldn't be surprised to see a safety taken in the 2nd round, simply because it doesn't appear we need one (barring a Meriweather trade) and BB loves to make moves no one sees coming.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Here's my early pre-combine/all-star game/pro-day projection.

    17 (Oak)-
      Cameron Jordan (6-4 287) DL Cal or JJ Watt (6-6 300) DL Wisconsin- Both are big tough, strong and disruptive kids that really get after it, are strong at the POA,  can split the double and are scheme diverse which is a huge value.  Both would represent a big upgrade to the NE DL and are potential impact players up front.

    32 (Own)-  Mike Pouncey (6-5 309) C/OG Florida
    - BB continues to convert Foxboro into Gainesville North.  This kid has great size and strength, he’s versatile and can potentially start at all three interior OL positions.  He’s also a smart kid, has a ton of experience, comes with a championship pedigree and is proven against top competition.  Pittsburgh will be hard after this kid too, to pair up with his twin brother Maurkice who they drafted in Rd 1 of  2010 draft.  He’s worked out really well for them. 

    33 (Car)-
    Mark Herzlich (6-4 247) LB BC- I think he’s more valuable to a team like NE that’s generally high on a player’s character.  He was generally regarded as a top 10 type talent before he got and beat cancer and should regain that form as his body continues to heal from treatment.  He’s big, tough, versatile, physical, smart and instinctive; the kind of blue-collar type player that you want on your roster and in your locker room.  I think he’d be great addition to the NE LB corp. 

    64 (Own)-
     Randall Cobb (5-11 186) WR/RB/KR/PR/QB/DB Kentucky- You want versatile?  This kid could be the most versatile player in America.  He has the quickness, agility and suddenness that BB likes in his WR’s, is tough after the catch with big play ability which fits their offense and also gives them value as a RB/KR/PR and emergency CB, heck he had two tackles on D this year and has the SEC pedigree.  He was ultra productive with 144-1661-13 as a receiver, 228-1313-22 on running plays, 2 return TD’s and 5 passing TD’s in his career.  I think his stock will continue to rise, especially with Blackmon, Broyles and Floyd staying in school and you could eventually see him come off the board in the early portion of Rd 2 similar to Dexter McCluster who went 36th overall to KC last year.

    74 (Min)-
    Robert Sands (6-5 220) S WVU-  Great size/speed combo, good instincts and ball skills, aggressive yet secure tackler, reads, reacts and fills downhill quickly, versatile and can play down in the box or the deep half/third.  He could allow BB to get creative and utilize him in some sort of S/LB hybrid type role and could be the long term compliment to Chung in the NE secondary.

    96 (Own)-
    Thomas Keiser (6-5 250) OLB Stanford- Has the size that BB looks for, new to the position after moving from DE when Stanford moved to the 3-4 but had a solid first year with 5.5 sacks and 9.5 TFL.  Smart kid and brings it on every down.  He does provide some scheme versatility if they run some 4-3 sub-packages as he was a 1stTeam Freshman All-American at DE in 2008 with 6 sacks and 7 TFL and followed that up with 8 sacks and 15 TFL in 2009.  I look forward to researching this kid further to get a better read on his first step and ability to operate in space/coverage.

    -Or-

    Brooks Reed (6-3 255) OLB/DE Arizona- Great first step and quickness off the snap, has the ability to set the edge,  shows the ability to be disruptive and pressure the pocket from the outside, good awareness and ability to re-direct and plays the game like a man on fire.   He should draw comparisons to Clay Mathews in appearance, motor/aggression and Pac 10 pedigree.

     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    MB - I'm surprised you haven't gotten on the Steven Friday band wagon yet. I know he's a bit older and could bulk up a little more but this kid showed a lot of promise starting for Vir Tech this year. Seems like a natural DE -> OLB type of player
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    with the with 4 picks, I can see 3 ol/og/c combo and a DL/LB. I can also see us perhaps going after a lb/dl in fa, whether that's an established guy (i doubt it after the thomas backfire), or more of a sub who had limited exposure in the vrabel type role when he was in pittsburgh. With the 3rd rounders, it'll be best available, or trade for next year.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    MB - I'm surprised you haven't gotten on the Steven Friday band wagon yet. I know he's a bit older and could bulk up a little more but this kid showed a lot of promise starting for Vir Tech this year. Seems like a natural DE - /> OLB type of player
    Posted by PatsEng


    PE,
    I'll have to research the kid further but 6-4 250 or so looks like pretty good size and he did have 8.5 sacks and 14 TFL (2 vs. Anthony Castonzo).  Yeah, he'll be 25 by the start of the 2011 season which is prob a bit older than ideal, but It may not matter if he's a late round pick.  I see him listed as a late round-URFA type on a couple of reputable publications, though it could be that the scouting hasn't caught up to him yet.  The listed 4.6 40 (while not as important as his 10 yard split, 3-cone and short shuttle, IMO) is impressive though.  I hope to see him at the combine.

    I'm not able to find much if any video on him, have you had a chance to see him play?  Provide some feedback from his performance?
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Yeah I actually saw him when they were at BC. That's what caught my eye about him. He didn't seem very comfortable putting is hand down and had trouble using strength to get past blockers. However, when they let him take a couple steps back or move slightly outside he'd constantly get into the backfield. He really just used a couple moves mainly his speed and swim moves to get around the tackles but Vir tech also used his speed in crossing blitzes and the blockers couldn't keep up. He's very quick of the ball and forced runners to go either through the middle or run far outside but got pushed backwards when he was on the line.

    To me he's a situational pass rushing OLB, I'd use him maybe 10-20 times a game but that's all you need if you have 2 solid OLB's to start. I wouldn't try to put him on the line or use him in running situations but you give him some space and he can beat a lot of T's on the outside or can shoot a gap quickly.

    This is the only link I could find. It shows his outside rush speed:
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLBdDz2gbeE">
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLBdDz2gbeE
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

     Mbeaulieu07 - Like your picks...this really helps strengthen the back bone of both the offense and defense. Though, do you really think Randall Cobb will go that high that we need to pick him at 64? And while looking at the FA market I can see the Pats maybe going after one of the higher end OL FA on the market with a draft like you've outlined...but I think the Pats will go with one more OL in the draft than you've picked in the top 3 rounds.

    Your thoughts?
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    Yeah I actually saw him when they were at BC. That's what caught my eye about him. He didn't seem very comfortable putting is hand down and had trouble using strength to get past blockers. However, when they let him take a couple steps back or move slightly outside he'd constantly get into the backfield. He really just used a couple moves mainly his speed and swim moves to get around the tackles but Vir tech also used his speed in crossing blitzes and the blockers couldn't keep up. He's very quick of the ball and forced runners to go either through the middle or run far outside but got pushed backwards when he was on the line. To me he's a situational pass rushing OLB, I'd use him maybe 10-20 times a game but that's all you need if you have 2 solid OLB's to start. I wouldn't try to put him on the line or use him in running situations but you give him some space and he can beat a lot of T's on the outside or can shoot a gap quickly. This is the only link I could find. It shows his outside rush speed: www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLBdDz2gbeE " /> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLBdDz2gbeE
    Posted by PatsEng


    Good stuff, man, I'll add him to my watch list.

    What round would you project him in?

    Was it you that brought Wilkerson to the draft board?  So many names are brought there I forget who the originator is.  If so, good call as he's probably alongside Watt as best potential DE fit for their scheme and really think he'll get some 1st round consideration once the scouting has caught up with him (as can be the case with off the radar underclassmen that declare early).
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    MB, I'm glad that you think the Pats should look at a BIG Saftey. I used to be a Merriweather supporter, but not so sure anymore. Intimidation is a big factor in the Saftey position, and size is the best way to start. Thanks
    Posted by bobbysu


    bobbysu,
    Ideally I'm looking for a smart safety that can cover, tackle securely, play physical (yet under control) and execute his assignments consistently within the scheme.  It would be a huge bonus if the guy is also 6-5 220 which would certainly bring a certain level of intimidation.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks? : Good stuff, man, I'll add him to my watch list. What round would you project him in? Was it you that brought Wilkerson to the draft board?  So many names are brought there I forget who the originator is.  If so, good call as he's probably alongside Watt as best potential DE fit for their scheme and really think he'll get some 1st round consideration once the scouting has caught up with him (as can be the case with off the radar underclassmen that declare early).
    Posted by mbeaulieu07


    I'm thinking Friday will fall between the mid 5th - 7th area.

    I'm not sure if I was the first to post on Wilkerson but I've mentioned him a number of times as a player we could pick up in the early to mid 2nd if they decided to go OLB, trade back, or OL in the 1st. I'm really coming around on Watt and Jordan seems like an interesting prospect but I'm not sure I'd take him at 17. Wilkerson seemed like a player that had the same talent level just not as highly recognized imo.

    If they don't get Watt at 17 I'd be more then happy for them to trade back then grab Wilkerson at 28 or 33
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    I was thinking with Minn's pick we would go either S or CB. I've been following Jeron Johnson as a Meriweather replacement since his playing style is similar with the exception that he takes much better angles and plays in position but after you mentioned Sands I started looking some stuff up and he looks pretty good. Do you think he'll last to Minn's pick?

    My gut feeling is that we'll end up picking 3 in the first 2 rounds and use Minn's pick. If we pick 3 in the first 2 rounds it should go 1 DE, 1 OLB, 1 OL but then again things change with FA and trades. With any luck KC will tender and trade us Hali after giving them Cassel.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
     Mbeaulieu07 - Like your picks...this really helps strengthen the back bone of both the offense and defense. Though, do you really think Randall Cobb will go that high that we need to pick him at 64? And while looking at the FA market I can see the Pats maybe going after one of the higher end OL FA on the market with a draft like you've outlined...but I think the Pats will go with one more OL in the draft than you've picked in the top 3 rounds. Your thoughts?
    Posted by ejb222


    ejb,
    Yeah, he's a projected Rd 2-3 kid so 64 (well, 58 now) is right in that range.  I'm telling you, this kid (who is quickly becoming one of my favorite prospects in entire class) is an ideal fit for this team as he's one of the most versatile players in the country and has run up some impressive career stats against tough competition and is the epitome of a 4 down player.

    Below is some great info courtesy of nfldraftscout, that shows just how versatile and dominant he's been:

     He was named first-team All-America in 2010 as an all-purpose player by The Associated Press, ESPN.com and SportsIllustrated.com. He was a consensus first-team All-Southeastern Conference selection. In his recently completed junior year, Cobb broke the SEC single-season record for all-purpose yardage with 2,396 yards. He led the SEC in receptions per game by catching 84 passes for 1,017 yards and seven touchdowns but his value far exceeded those contributions. He played quarterback in the "WildCobb" formation and rushed for 424 yards and five touchdowns and threw three TD passes in that role. Cobb's versatility as an all-purpose player is underscored by the fact that he was the only player in the nation who ranked first or second on his team in rushing, passing and receiving in 2010. He put points on the board eight different ways this season - rushing, receiving and passing for touchdowns; returning a punt for a TD; throwing for a TD on a fake field goal; and notching two-point conversions by rushing, passing and receiving. Although not completing his eligibility, Cobb also posted outstanding career numbers during his three seasons with the Wildcats. He broke the UK all-time record for total touchdowns (37) and ranks fourth in career all-purpose yardage (4,674), fourth in career scoring (226 points), fifth in career pass receptions (144) and sixth in career receiving yardage (1,661). - Kentucky football
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

     We need linemen on both sides of the ball. I could see BB drafting BAT in the first rounds but this will be the year we get a new OL and a replacement for Seymour.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    I was thinking with Minn's pick we would go either S or CB. I've been following Jeron Johnson as a Meriweather replacement since his playing style is similar with the exception that he takes much better angles and plays in position but after you mentioned Sands I started looking some stuff up and he looks pretty good. Do you think he'll last to Minn's pick? My gut feeling is that we'll end up picking 3 in the first 2 rounds and use Minn's pick. If we pick 3 in the first 2 rounds it should go 1 DE, 1 OLB, 1 OL but then again things change with FA and trades. With any luck KC will tender and trade us Hali after giving them Cassel.
    Posted by PatsEng


    I think 74 might be within range for Sands, he's prob a rd 2-3 prospect at this point.

    Hali while prob unrealistic, would be awesome.  He look flat out unblockable against Baltimore in the playoffs from the snaps that I saw and really came on this year with 14.5 sacks operating at OLB in KC's 3-4.
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Yeah I doubt we'd ever get Hali but a guy can dream. Although I'd be willing to give up #33 for him which is more then KC gave up to get Cassel and Vrable so weirder things have happened

    To me if you can pull that trade off and add either Watt or Wilkerson along with adding one of the top T's or Wisniewski then I'd say we'd have a very solid draft.

    I know BB will trade some back and KC isn't going to let Hali go but just imagine Watt/Wilkerson, Hali, Wisniewski/Pouncey, Sands, and Solder/Reynolds/Barksdale with the first 5 picks now that would just be a sick draft
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    PicK 17: j.j.Watt DE 6'6" 292 4.87
    Pick 28: Gabe Carimi OT 6'7" 327 5.14 or Anthony Castonzo OT 6'7" 308 5.06
    Pick 33: Mike Pouncey C/OG 6'4" 310 5.29 or Stefen Wisniewski C/OG 6'3" 306 5.16
    Pick 60: Dontay Moch OLB 6'1" 242 4.38 (has been clocked much faster, after combine may jump out of our range to top 10, no joke)
    Pick 74: Benjamin Ijalana OG 6'4" 320 5.34
    Pick 92: Kenrick Ellis DT/DE 6'5" 340 5.07

    All Ol and DL,and OLB's. Fills all our needs for the big men for years to come. Of course after the combine all the possition ranges will reset and so will the picks. Of note Dontay Moch is my sleeper for the draft, curently rated as 7th OLB and 63rd. overall. This will change at the combine when he showcases his impressive speed.
    http://packerchatters.com/?p=22296
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dontay_Moch
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Hey part-time

    I've heard nothing but bad on Moch. No real knowledge of the game, has no instincts on where to go, or how to really play. He used his speed against college level opponents to great affect but still doesn't have a lot of technics to get to the passer if someone can watch where he's rushing from. He's a concern with the run game as he doesn't read plays well and will over pursue (but his speed to get back into the play can make up for some of this). He's got the speed to drop back into coverage but there is concerns if he'd know what to do in those situations. Don't forget it took 2 years for coaches to teach him how to use his hands to gain leverage in a bull rush. He's a workout warrior and compares most to Gholston from my understanding.

    I'm not saying I wouldn't want someone with his speed on the team but imo he's simply best suited as a situational pass rusher in the league which would be fine if you were spending a late 2nd or early 3rd on him but someone will take him early given his numbers. Now I'm not a scout and could be completely wrong on the guy but just watching him and how he actually plays it reminds me a lot of Gholston. Triangle numbers that make your eyes pop out but when you put him in the Pro's might not be able to translate well
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Mark Herzlich Great Player....and I really like him for the Pats...but do you really think he'll go that high? I think he'll round into a solid NFL guy...but he's definitely a high risk player at this point. He'll probably be around later on in the draft. Then Position for Kuechly in a year or two.
     
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    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    Mark Herzlich Great Player....and I really like him for the Pats...but do you really think he'll go that high? I think he'll round into a solid NFL guy...but he's definitely a high risk player at this point. He'll probably be around later on in the draft. Then Position for Kuechly in a year or two.
    Posted by jgallag1


    If not for cancer he would have been a top 10 player last year. He's rated as one of the top LB's in the draft even given his recovery from cancer. Someone will be more then willing to spend a 2nd maybe even a late 1st on a kid with such a high upside and value. If there is no concern about him fully recoverying from cancer it would be hard to find a single team who wouldn't want to grab a top 10 talent in the 2nd
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Moch, 6'1", 245 pounds, ran a 40-yard dash in 4.2 seconds, which was after he had run a 4.08 and 4.18 for NFL scouts. The scouts purportedly did not believe their stopwatches so they asked Moch to run again and he recorded the 4.2."He has freakish talent," Nevada defensive coordinator Andy Buh said. When he puts his mind to it, he's unstoppable


    We should pick this guy with Oaklands pick just to make Al Davis cry.   lol
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    In Response to Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?:
    Here's my early pre-combine/all-star game/pro-day projection. 17 (Oak)-   Cameron Jordan (6-4 287) DL Cal or JJ Watt (6-6 300) DL Wisconsin - Both are big tough, strong and disruptive kids that really get after it, are strong at the POA,   can split the double and are scheme diverse which is a huge value.   Both would represent a big upgrade to the NE DL and are potential impact players up front. 32 (Own)-   Mike Pouncey (6-5 309) C/OG Florida - BB continues to convert Foxboro into Gainesville North.   This kid has great size and strength, he’s versatile and can potentially start at all three interior OL positions.   He’s also a smart kid, has a ton of experience, comes with a championship pedigree and is proven against top competition.   Pittsburgh will be hard after this kid too, to pair up with his twin brother Maurkice who they drafted in Rd 1 of   2010 draft.   He’s worked out really well for them.   33 (Car )- Mark Herzlich (6-4 247) LB BC - I think he’s more valuable to a team like NE that’s generally high on a player’s character.   He was generally regarded as a top 10 type talent before he got and beat cancer and should regain that form as his body continues to heal from treatment.   He’s big, tough, versatile, physical, smart and instinctive; the kind of blue-collar type player that you want on your roster and in your locker room.   I think he’d be great addition to the NE LB corp.   64 (Own)-   Randall Cobb (5-11 186) WR/RB/KR/PR/QB/DB Kentucky - You want versatile?   This kid could be the most versatile player in America.   He has the quickness, agility and suddenness that BB likes in his WR’s, is tough after the catch with big play ability which fits their offense and also gives them value as a RB/KR/PR and emergency CB, heck he had two tackles on D this year and has the SEC pedigree.   He was ultra productive with 144-1661-13 as a receiver, 228-1313-22 on running plays, 2 return TD’s and 5 passing TD’s in his career.  I think his stock will continue to rise, especially with Blackmon, Broyles and Floyd staying in school and you could eventually see him come off the board in the early portion of Rd 2 similar to Dexter McCluster who went 36th overall to KC last year. 74 (Min)- Robert Sands (6-5 220) S WVU -   Great size/speed combo, good instincts and ball skills, aggressive yet secure tackler, reads, reacts and fills downhill quickly, versatile and can play down in the box or the deep half/third.   He could allow BB to get creative and utilize him in some sort of S/LB hybrid type role and could be the long term compliment to Chung in the NE secondary. 96 (Own)- Thomas Keiser (6-5 250) OLB Stanford - Has the size that BB looks for, new to the position after moving from DE when Stanford moved to the 3-4 but had a solid first year with 5.5 sacks and 9.5 TFL.   Smart kid and brings it on every down.   He does provide some scheme versatility if they run some 4-3 sub-packages as he was a 1 st Team Freshman All-American at DE in 2008 with 6 sacks and 7 TFL and followed that up with 8 sacks and 15 TFL in 2009.   I look forward to researching this kid further to get a better read on his first step and ability to operate in space/coverage. -Or- Brooks Reed (6-3 255) OLB/DE Arizona - Great first step and quickness off the snap, has the ability to set the edge,   shows the ability to be disruptive and pressure the pocket from the outside, good awareness and ability to re-direct and plays the game like a man on fire.    He should draw comparisons to Clay Mathews in appearance, motor/aggression and Pac 10 pedigree.
    Posted by mbeaulieu07
    MB I like the first three choices and I think Cobb could be the steal of the draft at #60 as that's where they will be picking provided they keep their pick,also we might luck into Wiesnewski at #28 and he is the better of the two between he and Pouncey but like I said on other boards it's basically a potatoes,potatas type of thing. I would love to see them draft Herzelich but I won't bet the farm on that happening!
     
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    Re: Positions filled with first 6 Pats Picks?

    Trade both 3s and the Oak pick for top 10 pick.

    1a.)DL
    1b.)OLB
    2a.)OL
    2b.)OL
     
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