Reusing Old or Used Treads

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    Reusing Old or Used Treads

    How well has it actually worked out for the Patriots?

     
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    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    Worked great in 2001-2004 when we used Joe Andruzzi, Roman Phifer, Rodney Harrison, Ted Washington, Keith Traylor, Anthony Pleasant, Larry Centers, Antowain Smith, Mike Vrabel, Corey Dillon, Christian Fauria, Marc Edwards, Bryan Cox, Otis Smith and Terrell Buckley.

     
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    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    Worked well with Rodney Harrison, but when you think about it Harrison wasn't old and he wasn't some low priced free agent signing. It worked with Ted Washington, but Washington wasn't old and washed up at that point either. It worked well with Carter (for 8 games) and it woked with that guard from KC (I can never remember his name...probably because he was a short term fix that ran home and sulked after the season because he wanted more money).

    It didn't work with Ocho Cinco...that's for damn sure, and it cost us 7 million of our precious cap space that year. Imagine what 7 million can buy you. It didn't work with Shaun Ellis and it cost us four million of cap space. Four million!! We could of used the combined 7 from Ocho and 4 from Ellis and went out and signed something huge and effective with that money, yet we got virtually NOTHING out of that 11 million - that to me is horrendous cap management/team building. It didn't work with Haynesworth, but it "only" cost us two million...keep in mind all three of these signings/trades were in the same season costing us 13 million in wasted cap space and resources. It didn't work so well with Leigh Bodden, we ended up wasting 25 million on him during our quest to replace Asante Samual. It didn't work on last year's free agent bonanza either...Stallworth, Gaffney, Addai, Gallery, Gregory, Gonzalez, Fenene, but at least it didn't cost us 14 million. It did work (somewhat) on Lloyd...although there is a great chance he will be cut in the spring to save us three million.

    So I think used treads work on occasion, but only if they're sprinkled in with young talent in their prime or heading into their prime and that costs money. Instead what we've tried to do is sign old players (that were washed up) and put them out there with young second round picks that weren't very good. The result is a QB that carries the team while your defense crumbles as the washed up guys watch from their homes after they've been cut, but the good news is that they will have company in the form of some second round picks in the near future.

     
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    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    In response to ClarkGriswold's comment:

    Worked great with Lloyd last year, in 2011 Brian Waters, Mark Anderson, Andre Carter, Alge Crumpler (2010) and even throw ins like Shaun Ellis or Gerard Warren.   Heck, the one year deal with Bodden in 2009 was a bargain.  He was rated 14th in the NFL that year, well ahead of Asante Samuel.  Philly never liked what Samuel did and cut him loose.

    BB has been unbelievable in having so much cap space with his base built, that when he fills in the gaps with older players, they're mostly a complement, but sometimes they play well above their salary.  To even have the space to take a flyer on a Haynesworth is something other teams' fanbases would love to have as an option. Without the management and cap space, gambling on those kinds of things with potenial payoff, it wouldn't even be dreamed of by the majority of GMs.

    It's always a great sign when he pretty much has the base under contraact and ready to go and he can let the market come to him. That's the key. He did it brilliantly in 2011 off the lockout, to the point, it put NE in the SB. 

    The list is so long, we'd need to look back at all the great moves.

    Pat Kirwan has recently noted that since the cap doesn't go up until 20145, the next two offseasons will provide a plethora of quality vets who aren't done for those teams who have well managed rosters.

    It should be interesting to see who BB has lined up for options this offseason. Sounds like Freeney wants to play for a dome team or in warm weather, but I wonder what Unmenyura wants.



    I am also interested in this offseason (a bit more than usual...and i'm usually pumped to see what the Pats do). There are a lot of routes BB could take here.

     

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    Worked well with Rodney Harrison, but when you think about it Harrison wasn't old and he wasn't some low priced free agent signing. It worked with Ted Washington, but Washington wasn't old and washed up at that point either. It worked well with Carter (for 8 games) and it woked with that guard from KC (I can never remember his name...probably because he was a short term fix that ran home and sulked after the season because he wanted more money).

    It didn't work with Ocho Cinco...that's for damn sure, and it cost us 7 million of our precious cap space that year. Imagine what 7 million can buy you.




    When we signed Harrison his best years were behind him according to San Diego, Washington was ancient; when we say they are old that means in football terms, a thirty year old is already a grizzled vet, middle to late thirties is ancient.

    I can imagine what 7 million can buy me but if there's nobody else available, then you sign the best fit.  Ocho was cut, so it was a one year rental. I agree with you the problem lies in the mix of vets and young talent, that being said the youth is the problem not the vets, the young guys have to learn what it takes to win and have to eat some crow... we don't have enough desire and mental toughness, maybe this year.  Add one tough interior DT like Suh in Detroit who is mean and pisses vinegar and we'll be a lot tougher.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    You hit on some, you miss on others.  That's how it works.

     
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    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    The Seattle Seahawks are young, talented, and under contract. CBS Sports writer Pat Kirwan thinks they are ready to explode, and dominate in 2013. Pete Carroll has put together a very talented group of players led by rookie standout quarterback Russell Wilson. Furthermorer, they have three Pro-Bowl players in the defensive secondary, a power running back that is in his prime, and a out of the box thinking organization that has built the blueprint on how NF teams will look going forward. Kirwan says: ‘The Seahawks won 11 games in 2012, return 20 starters and found their franchise QB in Russell Wilson. They also have close to $18 million in salary cap space. There are 15 significant players with five or less years of experience and they have eight draft picks. Seattle did lose its defensive coordinator to the Jaguars, but Pete Carroll is a defensive-minded coach. This team is in a great situation to start extending solid young players on their roster. 

    Boy this Pat Kirwan is ligit! And his love for Pete Carroll is intoxicating...just like rusty.

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Reusing Old or Used Treads

    In response to ClarkGriswold's comment:

    In response to wozzy's comment:

     

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Worked well with Rodney Harrison, but when you think about it Harrison wasn't old and he wasn't some low priced free agent signing. It worked with Ted Washington, but Washington wasn't old and washed up at that point either. It worked well with Carter (for 8 games) and it woked with that guard from KC (I can never remember his name...probably because he was a short term fix that ran home and sulked after the season because he wanted more money).

    It didn't work with Ocho Cinco...that's for damn sure, and it cost us 7 million of our precious cap space that year. Imagine what 7 million can buy you.

     




     

    When we signed Harrison his best years were behind him according to San Diego, Washington was ancient; when we say they are old that means in football terms, a thirty year old is already a grizzled vet, middle to late thirties is ancient.

    I can imagine what 7 million can buy me but if there's nobody else available, then you sign the best fit.  Ocho was cut, so it was a one year rental. I agree with you the problem lies in the mix of vets and young talent, that being said the youth is the problem not the vets, the young guys have to learn what it takes to win and have to eat some crow... we don't have enough desire and mental toughness, maybe this year.  Add one tough interior DT like Suh in Detroit who is mean and pisses vinegar and we'll be a lot tougher.

     



    Mt Hurl is personally offended that Ochocinco took some of Kraft's money. LOL

     

    Here's a test for the Mt Hurl types which expose their entire premise even more:

    In 2005, BB signed Duane Starks, Monty Beisel, Chad Brown, etc.  Here's the test: Did these guys not working out actually impact how Tom Brady and our offense played in Denver in the postseason that year? I believe it was 10-3 Denver at halftime. 

    Brady went on to throw two INTs, one a pick 6, and 3 fumbles by Brown and Faulk, sealed the deal in Denver.

    http://scores.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=260114007

    Branch actually had 153 yards receiving in that game, which reflects lack of balance on offense in the shotgun spread base which we used that year.    Hmm.

    Did those 3 failed FA signings affect NE's collapses in INdy in 2006, barely scorring any points in the second half?   Answer? No.

    Did they affect 2007's SB run? Answer? No.

    Mt Hurl, acts like a butt hurt little girl because Tom Brady isn't getting another ring, but the irony is, Brady wants to throw from the shotgun.  "I prefer the shotgun." - T. Brady, 2010.

    He doesn't get that BB's strategy is to upp the odds by adding more not only for competiton, but hoping the more players hit.  Mt Hurl's reaction is to focus on one guy who wasn't an All Pro or maybe didn't make the team (Addai), but the crop of players at a position isn't even affected.

    It's like, if BB isn't 100% perfect, which no GM can be, Mt Hurl holds BB's feet to fire to this irrational state. I feel really sorry his kids, if he does have kids. I know I feel sorry for the kids he apparently teaches, too.  The behavior is dangerous around young, impressionable kids.

     



    I'm not sure...are you trying to make me look bad or better?? Duane Starks, Monty (I liked to fall on a pile) Biesel and Chad (I was so washed up that even I couldn't believe I got signed) Brown were our free agent signings on defense. We/they couldn't keep a white water rafting guide (Jake the snake) from scoring ten in the half and many more before the game was over and it's Brady's fault??? Once again your lack of football knowledge is truly breath taking.

     
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