Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from thejoshuatree28. Show thejoshuatree28's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    [QUOTE]Tamayo - I'm not quite sure how to address that other than to say we had no QB pressure last year and it killed us on D.   The best defenses have marquee pass rushers.    I agree, there are a lot of instances of OLB's picking up sacks when they weren't accounted for in the blocking scheme - therefore almost anybody could theoretically have picked it up.  However, just consider OLB vs. NT.  If our NT's goal is to tie up blockers, along with the defensive ends, somebody has to be aggressively going after the QB.   It might not be as vital in a 4-3 where the linebackers don’t blitz too often but it is essential that we have someone closing in on the pocket from the outside.
    Posted by SonnyCorlione[/QUOTE]

    Now somebody correct me if im wrong, but in the 3-4 one of the OLB always rushes the passer (this was vrabel job), basically acting like a DE, where one stays back and plays the line etc.

    Just to clarify a blitz is where 5+ men rush the passer, the patriots last year struggled getting pressure with just 4 guys, and were unable to send more as much as they would have like because of the secondary's ineptness.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonnyCorlione. Show SonnyCorlione's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    [QUOTE]Now somebody correct me if im wrong, but in the 3-4 one of the OLB always rushes the passer (this was vrabel job), basically acting like a DE, where one stays back and plays the line etc. Just to clarify a blitz is where 5+ men rush the passer, the patriots last year struggled getting pressure with just 4 guys, and were unable to send more as much as they would have like because of the secondary's ineptness.
    Posted by thejoshuatree28[/QUOTE]

    Definitely not 100% of the time if for no other reason than you can’t be that predictable and succeed. Part of the benefit of running that type of defense is that, other than the three down linemen, you’re not certain who will or won’t rush the passer.  You could potentially see the two ILB’s rush, a safety, the three down linemen and the list goes on and on.

     

    Even in a 4-3 there are instances where a defensive end will drop back into coverage.  Jason Taylor would do this quite a bit.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from thejoshuatree28. Show thejoshuatree28's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    [QUOTE]Definitely not 100% of the time if for no other reason than you can’t be that predictable and succeed. Part of the benefit of running that type of defense is that, other than the three down linemen, you’re not certain who will or won’t rush the passer.   You could potentially see the two ILB’s rush, a safety, the three down linemen and the list goes on and on.   Even in a 4-3 there are instances where a defensive end will drop back into coverage.   Jason Taylor would do this quite a bit.
    Posted by SonnyCorlione[/QUOTE]

    Again correct me if im wrong (offense is my thing, even though I love watching the D), but what your describing is a Zone blitzing scheme, like pitt. I agree with you the 4th rusher could come from anywhere, Usually it was vrable being the "rush linebacker." The patriots don't run a Zone Blitzing scheme, and part of their problem in the past couple of years i believe was being unable to hide where pressure would come from, meaning the OL can pick up the rusher.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonnyCorlione. Show SonnyCorlione's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    [QUOTE]Again correct me if im wrong (offense is my thing, even though I love watching the D), but what your describing is a Zone blitzing scheme, like pitt. I agree with you the 4th rusher could come from anywhere, Usually it was vrable being the "rush linebacker." The patriots don't run a Zone Blitzing scheme, and part of their problem in the past couple of years i believe was being unable to hide where pressure would come from, meaning the OL can pick up the rusher.
    Posted by thejoshuatree28[/QUOTE]

    In the case of a defensive end dropping back into coverage it’s more than likely it’s a zone blitz – the defensive end could potentially be one on one with a TE but that’s not typical.  Pitt doesn’t often have their ends drop back because they’re not great athletes but you could see linebackers playing a deep zone or rushing in behind a safety. The thing about defense in general is that it is so variable; beyond what is defined you really only have to put 11 players on the field and figure out what will work best in each situation.  There are limitless possibilities so it’s the threat of either a run or a pass that forces you to play three levels (line, ‘backers and secondary). In the case of Vrabel, he definitely rushes the passer quite a bit but, as you know from his days playing ILB, he could do a lot of things.  I think at the end of the day they felt he was just too good at setting the edge and rushing the passer to be filling in at another spot.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    deadwood wont be starting.if the roster is to remain as it is.tully will be starting,possibly crable if he shows his stuff this off season.and until i can see promise in any of these guys.a nice veteran will be needed.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BellaCheate. Show BellaCheate's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    Burgess is a Pro Bowl star player. You are going to compare a guy who hasn't even played yet to him?????
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ritchie-az. Show Ritchie-az's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    Moss Effect,

    Just opinion, but I believe Woods not only will be the starting OLB opposite Thomas, but he'll be on the field for 60%-65% of the snaps.

    I thought signing Banta-Cain was a good move, but I really doubt he will be a starter. Just a hunch, but I believe he'll be a DE in four-man fronts (more of a natural fit for him, I think) and a situational OLB (pass-rushing situations) who can be counted on to play if there are injuries.
    Just guessing, but I think Crable gets about 20% of the snaps.
    Redd gets cut and hopefully clears waivers for the Practice Squad.

    Perhaps the Patriots do bring in a veteran, but I think it is unlikely at this point. If they do, however, I see Banta-Cain getting cut.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from thejoshuatree28. Show thejoshuatree28's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    If they cut anybody my feeling is it would be Banta-Cain, due mostly to his one demensional ability, yea he can play OLB but he isnt that great at it.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from natesubs. Show natesubs's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    burgess is a great player one whom someday crable might be mentioned in the same sentence with when they are announcing the probowl OLB, however until that day i don't think we can say that crable is better. He has alot of potential, and certianly has the coaching staff and mentors to look up to/learn from. We will see if he becomes the stud we are all hoping he does. As for burgess I would love to see him in a pats jersey, but not for the price Crazy Al davis is asking, I will give up a 2nd round pick at the most no way do we give up our future QB, left tackle, and a few other Players.  I say offer him a 2nd take it or leave it.  yes he is a great threat but he was injured last seasonand only has one year remaining on his contract, so essentially we would be leasing him with the option to buy for one season for a 2nd round pick. A second is more than fair.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BellaCheate. Show BellaCheate's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    In Response to Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess:
    [QUOTE]I think the OLB position is a bit overrated. I mean, how many times did that dirt bag Joey Porter get his sacks running untouched and unblocked freely to the QB? It all depends on the play call. Often times, a blitzing player goes unblocked and "unabated" (not sure thats the spelling) to the QB. I think we will be fine. Belichick will exploit his personel's strengths. We just need to blitz a little more and now with out revamped secondary, recievers wont be open so easily, so the pass rush has time to reach the QB.
    Posted by tamayo2431[/QUOTE]
    Yep... we need Wilfork and Seymour to occupy two blockers for these LBs to be effective. However, your comments on the secondary.... these guys have not played together and are a combination of young and unproven with aging free agents not coming off good years. Remember O'Neal last year? I am worried.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    Natesubs, I have to disagree, a 2nd is a very valuable pick.  That is way too much for a 1 season rental.  Even if we kept him that would mean we would lose one of the other valuable pieces that are FAs next year.  Plus they signed Ellis.  Now they have a glut at the position.  I wouldnt offer more than a 3rd and I am not sure that is worth it even.  I am happy with what we have at OLB, not in love with it, but content.  Of course I want a probowler at ever spot, but I know we cant. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheSharkjeff. Show TheSharkjeff's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    The job is Pierre Woods to lose as of right now and honestly I dont think he holds onto it very long.

    Shawn Crable has been here for one year and that one season he had off he spent it all in the weight room getting bigger and watching film on Willie McGinest. With Crable though that was in the preseason and I loved what I saw especially with him dropping back into coverage. Crable is stronger now and can be a very versatile player for the Pats and could be a future starter for years to come if he can keep his priorties in check. 

    Burgess has never played in the 34 D and while the Pats actually go into the 43 look alot I still dont see him playing a bigger role than a situational rusher. 

    My prediction-Woods starts the year but midway through loses his job. Similar to how Eugene Wilson lost his job to James Sanders. The better player gets the job.


     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from thejoshuatree28. Show thejoshuatree28's posts

    Re: Shawn Crable vs. Burgess

    I agree with mordici on the pick thing, yea we have 3 next year but how much do you guys want to bet the BB would rather trade a 1 than a 2 I know i usually would.
    It also seems like a huge vote of no confidence if you go out and trade for a guy this close to the season, if it was earlier than maybe. And to go with what shark said he hasnt really played in a 3-4 he has played a little OLB but not enough for me to be comfertable with.

    Shark the one thing you said i do disagree with was the Wilson sanders thing, wilson was a very good FS but lost his job after his injury because he was just never the same, he was a better player, but injury cut short what could have been a promising career.
     

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