Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    IF people want to complain about what the WR corps is, then please show me what you expected out of a couple of rookies, 1 and 2 games into their careers, respectively.

    Did you expect Calvin Johnson? He of a 48 catch rookie season?

    I can only imagine how Bungles fans reacted after AJ Green's 1 catch opening performance.

    Julio Jones, all those picks to move up and get him? 54 catches in his rookie year. 5 in game one, which probably means the rest of the season was a letdown since he averaged less than that per game, over 12. Yes, 12, because he missed 4 in the middle of the season. I know, injuries in the NFL? Who-da-thunk-it!

    People seem to have disturbingly unrealistic expectations, and a sickening level of entitlement.

    This TEAM and this FRANCHISE does not revolve around any single player. I don't care if God himself floats down and dons a Pats jersey. Even he wouldn't have the right to make demands of the coach and team like some around here would like to, and want to see Brady do.

    Once upon a time, this ENTIRE TEAM had to redo the offense to accomodate a backup QB who was young and couldn't do all the things his predecessor could. Worked out ok, no? So maybe, just maybe...we can have some fking patience for these kids too!

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:

    IF people want to complain about what the WR corps is, then please show me what you expected out of a couple of rookies, 1 and 2 games into their careers, respectively.

    Did you expect Calvin Johnson? He of a 48 catch rookie season?

    I can only imagine how Bungles fans reacted after AJ Green's 1 catch opening performance.

    Julio Jones, all those picks to move up and get him? 54 catches in his rookie year. 5 in game one, which probably means the rest of the season was a letdown since he averaged less than that per game, over 12. Yes, 12, because he missed 4 in the middle of the season. I know, injuries in the NFL? Who-da-thunk-it!

    People seem to have disturbingly unrealistic expectations, and a sickening level of entitlement.

    This TEAM and this FRANCHISE does not revolve around any single player. I don't care if God himself floats down and dons a Pats jersey. Even he wouldn't have the right to make demands of the coach and team like some around here would like to, and want to see Brady do.

    Once upon a time, this ENTIRE TEAM had to redo the offense to accomodate a backup QB who was young and couldn't do all the things his predecessor could. Worked out ok, no? So maybe, just maybe...we can have some fking patience for these kids too!




    Exactly, and the last paragraph sums it up.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    You have 100% missed the point.

    The problem isn't Thompkins.  It isn't Boyce.  It isn't Sudfeld.  It isn't Dobson.

    It's the fact that they're all on the team as rookies at the same time.  The only other receivers are an injured TE, an injured WR and a Special Teams guy.

    No one expects any rookie to be a miracle worker.  They should get limited playing time and limited targets while they learn everything.

    The GM has proven, once again, his story is a lot greater than his results.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    You have 100% missed the point.

    The problem isn't Thompkins.  It isn't Boyce.  It isn't Sudfeld.  It isn't Dobson.

    It's the fact that they're all on the team as rookies at the same time.  The only other receivers are an injured TE, an injured WR and a Special Teams guy.

    No one expects any rookie to be a miracle worker.  They should get limited playing time and limited targets while they learn everything.

    The GM has proven, once again, his story is a lot greater than his results.

    What the GM proved is that he believes in his QB, that his QB will guide the offense while the kids learn. 


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    Yeah your right these results suck!

    153-57  .727%

    17-7      .708%

    7 AFCCG's

    5 AFCCT's

    5 SB Appearance's

    3 SB Titles

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatFanInBA2. Show PatFanInBA2's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to kansaspatriot's comment:

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    IF people want to complain about what the WR corps is, then please show me what you expected out of a couple of rookies, 1 and 2 games into their careers, respectively.

    Did you expect Calvin Johnson? He of a 48 catch rookie season?

    I can only imagine how Bungles fans reacted after AJ Green's 1 catch opening performance.

    Julio Jones, all those picks to move up and get him? 54 catches in his rookie year. 5 in game one, which probably means the rest of the season was a letdown since he averaged less than that per game, over 12. Yes, 12, because he missed 4 in the middle of the season. I know, injuries in the NFL? Who-da-thunk-it!

    People seem to have disturbingly unrealistic expectations, and a sickening level of entitlement.

    This TEAM and this FRANCHISE does not revolve around any single player. I don't care if God himself floats down and dons a Pats jersey. Even he wouldn't have the right to make demands of the coach and team like some around here would like to, and want to see Brady do.

    Once upon a time, this ENTIRE TEAM had to redo the offense to accomodate a backup QB who was young and couldn't do all the things his predecessor could. Worked out ok, no? So maybe, just maybe...we can have some fking patience for these kids too!

     




    Exactly, and the last paragraph sums it up.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    you mean the last line :-)

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatFanInBA2. Show PatFanInBA2's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    Yeah your right these results suck!

    153-57  .727%

    17-7      .708%

    7 AFCCG's

    5 AFCCT's

    5 SB Appearance's

    3 SB Titles



    He should be fired... :-)

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Gravelten4. Show Gravelten4's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    You have 100% missed the point.

    The problem isn't Thompkins.  It isn't Boyce.  It isn't Sudfeld.  It isn't Dobson.

    It's the fact that they're all on the team as rookies at the same time.  The only other receivers are an injured TE, an injured WR and a Special Teams guy.

    No one expects any rookie to be a miracle worker.  They should get limited playing time and limited targets while they learn everything.

    The GM has proven, once again, his story is a lot greater than his results.



    As Troy brown would say...bingo.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    His story is greater than his results? Please explain.

    I thought his results are his story, that they're one and the same? You are what your record says you are, right? His record says he's alright.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:

    Yeah your right these results suck!

    153-57  .727%

    17-7      .708%

    7 AFCCG's

    5 AFCCT's

    5 SB Appearance's

    3 SB Titles



    The last Superbowl win was at the beginning of George W. Bush's second term.  If that's good enough for you, hey, congrats.

    It's not good enough for me.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

    His story is greater than his results? Please explain.

    I thought his results are his story, that they're one and the same? You are what your record says you are, right? His record says he's alright.




    Story:  Greatest GM of the cap era.  Greatest GM ever.  Amazing GM.  Blah blah blah

    Results:  No Superbowl wins in almost 10 years.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    You have 100% missed the point.

    The problem isn't Thompkins.  It isn't Boyce.  It isn't Sudfeld.  It isn't Dobson.

    It's the fact that they're all on the team as rookies at the same time.  The only other receivers are an injured TE, an injured WR and a Special Teams guy.

    No one expects any rookie to be a miracle worker.  They should get limited playing time and limited targets while they learn everything.

    The GM has proven, once again, his story is a lot greater than his results.



    Between you and the OP, you have hit the nail on the head.

    I know a lot of folks kept pointing to the fact the Pats have Brady, but, once he releases the ball a play has to be made at the other end and this crop of rookies and UDFAs need time to work things out.  If there is a saving grace, it is the fact Tom Brady is the QB at the helm of this pack of receivers.  This fan base needs to chill and let the team develop just like so many here did when the defense was a young crop of players, too.  The bar and expectations for the Pats in these last few years is so high, as placed by the fans, anything less than stellar performances leads to the types of posts we are seeing.  Given how ugly these two games have been for the offense, to be 2 - 0 is a he*l of a lot better than the alternative.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    Hey Ma6dragon. I don't think anyone here expects the rookies to play out-of-this-world. If they do, they are being unrealistic. 

    I think the debate is clustered around Brady yelling at Edelman (which everyone takes for Dobson) and their reaction to that. 

    And then some others voicing anger at the risking way NE assembled their roster this offseason: letting healthy proven players go, and replacing them with injury prone players, then not picking up veterans to take the heat off the younger players.

    Every time one of those rookies is out there sweating, you need to blame managment for putting them in this situation. 

    When Julio Jones came in he was backed by Roddy White and Atlanta went out and even got a HOF vet TE to take the heat off the kid. He was option #3 or #4 in that passing offense. He wasn't thrust into a spot where he is option #1B or C or D around two other rookies, a backup slot, and a utility TE. 

    NE put all their chips in on Amendola being healthy (he isn't and is likely out 6 weeks out of the gate now) and Gronk being ready in time (he isn't either).

    They'll get a bogey for the Hernandez thing. But even accounting for that ... adding Hernandez wouldn't work a miracle. 

     
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from GO47. Show GO47's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

     

    His story is greater than his results? Please explain.

    I thought his results are his story, that they're one and the same? You are what your record says you are, right? His record says he's alright.

     




    Story:  Greatest GM of the cap era.  Greatest GM ever.  Amazing GM.  Blah blah blah

     

    Results:  No Superbowl wins in almost 10 years.




    For starters it's the press and NFL's past and current staff members who make these claims. It's natural for Patriot fans to feel this way since he has provided a competitive team each and every year since 2001 and just happens to have the highest winning percentage since 2001. Complain about him all you want but I would not trade him for anyone. He's smart, surrounds himself with smart football staff members. Yes he makes mistakes but show me a GM/Coach who has not. He obviously knows a lot more about football than anyone here.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    Hey Ma6dragon. I don't think anyone here expects the rookies to play out-of-this-world. If they do, they are being unrealistic. 

    I think the debate is clustered around Brady yelling at Edelman (which everyone takes for Dobson) and their reaction to that. 

    And then some others voicing anger at the risking way NE assembled their roster this offseason: letting healthy proven players go, and replacing them with injury prone players, then not picking up veterans to take the heat off the younger players.

    Every time one of those rookies is out there sweating, you need to blame managment for putting them in this situation. 

    When Julio Jones came in he was backed by Roddy White and Atlanta went out and even got a HOF vet TE to take the heat off the kid. He was option #3 or #4 in that passing offense. He wasn't thrust into a spot where he is option #1B or C or D around two other rookies, a backup slot, and a utility TE. 

    NE put all their chips in on Amendola being healthy (he isn't and is likely out 6 weeks out of the gate now) and Gronk being ready in time (he isn't either).

    They'll get a bogey for the Hernandez thing. But even accounting for that ... adding Hernandez wouldn't work a miracle. 

     



    Z..  when you look at the manners of posts to BDC, seems a lot of folks did do exactly what you said in your first sentence.. they expected the Pats to come out of the gate without skipping a beat from last season, offense wise.

    IMHO..  Brady may have reacted like he did because during the pre-season and even in the first game, the players were getting close to being on the same page.  In the Jets game it all went to h*ll in a hand basket.  We didn't see so many missed routes and dropped passes in the Bills game, did we?  Brady must have thought they were further along than they showed Thursday night.

    As for Amendola .. well, fingers crossed didn't seem to work and it is good they are not bringing Gronk back too fast.  Also, by not bringing in any new WRs to the team may be more of a vote of confidence by BB than anything else.  Imagine what the impact to the rookie psyche if the team immediately started looking at new bodies? 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    Story:  Greatest GM of the cap era.  Greatest GM ever.  Amazing GM.  Blah blah blah

    Results:  No Superbowl wins in almost 10 years.


    2007 16-0 regular season
    Lost super bowl because of a fluke play.

    2008 11-5 regular season
    Team was finding it's identity ready to make some noise in the playoffs. Only second 11-5 team ever to not make the playoffs.

    2009 10-6 regular season
    Too many key injuries. The healthy teams win the super bowls.

    2010 14-2 regular season
    This young team beat all comers, including both super bowl participants. They laid an egg in the playoffs.

    2011 13-3 regular season
    Lost another close game in super bowl.

    2012 12-4 regular season
    Lost to a hot, healthy team in the AFC championship game.

    Sorry but that's pretty darned good. Super bowl wins don't define a good GM. There are many good GMs that haven't won a super bowl. Belichick's way keeps the Pats in super bowl contention most every year. Very few teams can claim that.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to digger0862's comment:

    Sorry but that's pretty darned good. Super bowl wins don't define a good GM. There are many good GMs that haven't won a super bowl. Belichick's way keeps the Pats in super bowl contention most every year. Very few teams can claim that.

    [/QUOTE]

    There is a common theme in why the Pats didn't get the job done since 2006 to win another SB.  They lost to teams who were "hot" at the right time.  Was there ever a time since the 2007 SB in which anyone felt the Pats were the hot and best playing team in the playoffs?  I really do not recall that at all.  Even in SB42, though the Pats were undefeated, they were not the "hot" team and so many folks across the country genuinely felt the Giants were the better team for that game.  Just goes to show it is how well you are playing at the right time which dictates who wins the SB.  Ravens of 2012 is the classic example!

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

    There is a common theme in why the Pats didn't get the job done since 2006 to win another SB.  They lost to teams who were "hot" at the right time.  Was there ever a time since the 2007 SB in which anyone felt the Pats were the hot and best playing team in the playoffs?  I really do not recall that at all.  Even in SB42, though the Pats were undefeated, they were not the "hot" team and so many folks across the country genuinely felt the Giants were the better team for that game.  Just goes to show it is how well you are playing at the right time which dictates who wins the SB.  Ravens of 2012 is the classic example!

    And the Giants in 2011. It's not how you come out of the gate, it's how you finish. If the youngins start to "get it", this could be the year.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    You have 100% missed the point.

    The problem isn't Thompkins.  It isn't Boyce.  It isn't Sudfeld.  It isn't Dobson.

    It's the fact that they're all on the team as rookies at the same time.  The only other receivers are an injured TE, an injured WR and a Special Teams guy.

    No one expects any rookie to be a miracle worker.  They should get limited playing time and limited targets while they learn everything.

    The GM has proven, once again, his story is a lot greater than his results.




    You are exactly right with this post.  100% on the money. 

    I don't understand why people don't get it.  Sure we have one of the greatest QB's and Coaches ever but to think they can bring in so many rookies, some undrafted, as well as  injury prone players and make up a championship team with them all in year 1 is ignorant.  If the Pats would win it all this season it will be the greatest accomplishment I will have ever witnessed in football.  I'm sorry, I just don't see it happening!  And that's the problem.  The window of Brady/Belichick era is closing.  Take advantage of it now. 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Hey Ma6dragon. I don't think anyone here expects the rookies to play out-of-this-world. If they do, they are being unrealistic. 

    I think the debate is clustered around Brady yelling at Edelman (which everyone takes for Dobson) and their reaction to that. 

    And then some others voicing anger at the risking way NE assembled their roster this offseason: letting healthy proven players go, and replacing them with injury prone players, then not picking up veterans to take the heat off the younger players.

    Every time one of those rookies is out there sweating, you need to blame managment for putting them in this situation. 

    When Julio Jones came in he was backed by Roddy White and Atlanta went out and even got a HOF vet TE to take the heat off the kid. He was option #3 or #4 in that passing offense. He wasn't thrust into a spot where he is option #1B or C or D around two other rookies, a backup slot, and a utility TE. 

    NE put all their chips in on Amendola being healthy (he isn't and is likely out 6 weeks out of the gate now) and Gronk being ready in time (he isn't either).

    They'll get a bogey for the Hernandez thing. But even accounting for that ... adding Hernandez wouldn't work a miracle. 

     



    Z..  when you look at the manners of posts to BDC, seems a lot of folks did do exactly what you said in your first sentence.. they expected the Pats to come out of the gate without skipping a beat from last season, offense wise.

     

    IMHO..  Brady may have reacted like he did because during the pre-season and even in the first game, the players were getting close to being on the same page.  In the Jets game it all went to h*ll in a hand basket.  We didn't see so many missed routes and dropped passes in the Bills game, did we?  Brady must have thought they were further along than they showed Thursday night.

    As for Amendola .. well, fingers crossed didn't seem to work and it is good they are not bringing Gronk back too fast.  Also, by not bringing in any new WRs to the team may be more of a vote of confidence by BB than anything else.  Imagine what the impact to the rookie psyche if the team immediately started looking at new bodies? 

    [/QUOTE]

    Hey Agcsbill,


    Really? The vibe I'm getting is that people are blaming Brady. Though not in this thread. I get some people thought they would be fine and are in shock, but most of those people were really just wishfully thinking, and a couple select posters for whom Brady-bashing is their rasion d'etre built up the selections so they could do what they are doing now ... blame Brady when they played like rookies. 

    We didn't see so many in the Bills game because Amendola was there. He cought 11 passes, and was targetted 14 times. Those targets shifted to the rookies. 

    It did get worse, but it's because those kids were hung out to dry. 

    And sorry, I  think it far, far worse for confidence that you put them into a position to fail as opposed to mixing them in. I agree, don't ... rush ... Gronk. After Brady he is the franchise. But NE has a billion linebackers, three that are just playing ST. They don't have one vet on the roster who would have been brought in for this very likely scenario: Amendola goes out, Gronk's not ready. 

    The final conclusion is that fans have been conditioned over the last five years by this team. They accept less from the defense, and seem to think allowing 24 points is good, and expect more from the offense, scoffing at anything less than 30 regardless of the health of players (as if losing Gronk is irrelevant to the outcomes). 

    The end result? Everyone is angry at Tom, and very little vitriol is headed toward the rookies. It makes me scratch my head about the thread, because  just don't see people saying they are bad. 

    Outside of the select few people BB-haters that make their life here abouou proving BB is terrible ... no one has said the rookies stink or are busts ... most just accept it even if they excpected more. 

    I guess the "show me" thread the forum needs is one that says "show me a QB who would do better with this group" (there isn't one) AND show me a vet who IS actually playing terribly when they need him to play well, and that is Ridley, who unlike Brady, has had only downs so far, and no ups when NE dearly needed him to carry the load. 

    A comment about rookie WR struggles, to me, is irrelevant to what is actually happening on this board. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    So, digger, the $64,000 question is this:  "Why can't the Pats be the HOT team in the playoffs?".  What is the missing link to them being the hot team at the right time?

    I understand the last few seasons the Pats endured injuries to key players at the wrong time, but, was the team playing like the hot team?  As I noted in my response to you, I do not recall that at all.

    AGCSBill, just a fan havin' fun!!

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to digger0862's comment:

    And the Giants in 2011. It's not how you come out of the gate, it's how you finish. If the youngins start to "get it", this could be the year.



    Yes, I agree and that is the big equalizer.

    However, the chances to win it all are much better when you have a team jumping out of the gate and making great strides in improving each week,  instead of one stumbling out of the gate, just barely crossing the finish line.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from magicalhobo. Show magicalhobo's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    Our week 2 was essentially an extended week 1. These guys haven't had a lot of time to digest what they experienced after the Bills game, and that was Dobson's first outing in general. I think we will see some improvement in the Bucs game and even more after that.


    As far as the playoffs are concerned. We were always matched up against team who could get to Brady. We lost Gronk twice, so Brady zeroed in on Welker and teams took note of that. We need a more balanced passing attack, a la 2001-2003.

    What we have now isn't balanced either. Brady didn't even target a TE last week. I'm sure BB the GM didn't anticipate our star TE being a murderer. Gronk will come back and add another element to the offense while Sudfeld heals and learns, the WRs will get better, the running game will then open up, and people will be praising BB.

    __________________________________________________

    Come on if you think you can take us on
    You and whose army?
    You and your cronies.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

    So, digger, the $64,000 question is this:  "Why can't the Pats be the HOT team in the playoffs?".  What is the missing link to them being the hot team at the right time?

    I understand the last few seasons the Pats endured injuries to key players at the wrong time, but, was the team playing like the hot team?  As I noted in my response to you, I do not recall that at all.

    AGCSBill, just a fan havin' fun!!


    I wish I had the answer. Hopefully the Pats brass do. I'll take just being the healthy team!

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Show me rookie WRs who are awesome after 10 days please

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

    So, digger, the $64,000 question is this:  "Why can't the Pats be the HOT team in the playoffs?".  What is the missing link to them being the hot team at the right time?

    I understand the last few seasons the Pats endured injuries to key players at the wrong time, but, was the team playing like the hot team?  As I noted in my response to you, I do not recall that at all.

    AGCSBill, just a fan havin' fun!!




    Yes, that is the question.  Why can't they be?  But why can't 31 other teams also be too?  I think it is safe to say that there are far more Super Bowl wins by teams who were the better team through the season then there are by teams that just got hot for the playoffs.  The underdog story and hopes are nice but you can't count on them working out a high percentage of time.

    So as fans, many of you are turning from fans of a dominating team to fans just hoping to get hot in the playoffs? WOW!!!  How things have changed.

     

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