The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from chrisakawoody. Show chrisakawoody's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    In Response to www.boston.com/community/forums.html?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat%3aSportsForum%3a9690Discussion%3ac6fb1c9f-79b6-408b-8c37-c11c5640174f&plckFindPostKey=Cat:SportsForum:9690Discussion:c6fb1c9f-79b6-408b-8c37-c11c5640174fPost:c6506d43-6b14-4f50-a21c-44c129ff6a27 " /> Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what? : Believe me, I've been a worker my entire life so if I'm on a side it would be theirs but it can't work that way.   If you make an investment through a broker who has a fixed percentage or fixed price per trade and your deal goes through the roof, I mean all the way to the moon does that mean it's Ok for your broker to come back after the risk is over and say he wants more money?  Instead of comparing their pay scale to owners perhaps they should compare what they make to a serviceman risking a lot more physical harm than they do without bitch*ng about it. It makes me sick
    Posted by Sam-Adams


    Sam, you could say the exact thing about the rich team owners. 

    Look at all the stuff they get for free to help operate their businesses - stadiums, transportation and infrastructure upgrades, military fly-overs that probably cost around $100K per game, long-term ( 10 years) local and state business tax exemptions, special financing rates that you and I could never get on a business loan, etc., etc., etc. The owners BEACH about not making enough money all the time, but they are almost always making the most money.  If you don't like richly paid people complaining about not getting enough, you should hate the owners as much as the players.

    As to the dreaded claim of "SOCIALISM!" regarding the proposed 20-year healthcare package, you are thus labeling Mike Ditka a Socialist.  Mike Ditka...the pronounced arch-conservative who has dedicated years to this cause and knows all too well the real physical "risk" of playing pro football. 

    Which brings me to my last point on this board: You love it when Brady throws a 40-yard pass downfield into double-coverage to Moss, who catches it with one outstretched hand, jukes the safety, then runs it another 15 yards for a TD. A thing of beauty. Eleven players contributed to the play, and some will only make a million in their career, a career that may have taken them 15, 16 or 17 years of hard work to build, and will almost certainly leave them physically scarred, maybe brain damaged.  You scream, you celebrate, you yell that you love Brady, or Moss, or Hernandez for throwing a key block...but then you hate them when they get paid.  Why?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    In Response to www.boston.com/community/forums.html?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat%3aSportsForum%3a9690Discussion%3ac6fb1c9f-79b6-408b-8c37-c11c5640174f&plckFindPostKey=Cat:SportsForum:9690Discussion:c6fb1c9f-79b6-408b-8c37-c11c5640174fPost:c6506d43-6b14-4f50-a21c-44c129ff6a27 " /> Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what? : Believe me, I've been a worker my entire life so if I'm on a side it would be theirs but it can't work that way.   If you make an investment through a broker who has a fixed percentage or fixed price per trade and your deal goes through the roof, I mean all the way to the moon does that mean it's Ok for your broker to come back after the risk is over and say he wants more money?  Instead of comparing their pay scale to owners perhaps they should compare what they make to a serviceman risking a lot more physical harm than they do without bitch*ng about it. It makes me sick
    Posted by Sam-Adams

    Sam, 

    I hear what you are saying. And being a part-time union organizer, there is little in common between unions like the NFLPA and SAG etc, and most unions. But Chris is right... people put up with the petulance of the super-workers (millionaire athletes, actors, etc) in those structures because it does help  protect the guys at the bottom.

    But you have the facts here mixed up. The NFLPA isn't striking. In fact, they are likely to decertify soon. 

    It is the owners who have demands after signing an agreement. 

    The better analogy would be if your boss walked up to you and the other workers  under contract and basically said take a 5% pay cut and work two extra hours a day or I'm locking you out.

    Or to use your broker scenario, it would be like the investor going back to the broker after the deal and saying, I don't like the 15 points I promised you, I'm only giving you 13 and if you want it you need to take this extra account at zero points.

    Sadly, despite the (false) demonization of unions, that is typically what actually happens in both strikes and lockouts. It is typically owners who demand austerity after the fact, and the rest is organized action against it, or organized action on behalf of the owners.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    I agree...Too much reading on here...Plain and simple: I dont care what goes on behind the scenes, as I am not paid to care. Not my job....I will care however, when I work my A$% off and I want to sit on my couch and watch the game next year, and theres no Football...Not something I want to tolerate...we could go on and on about this all day...I am a Marine, do you think we "get treated right?" are we properly compensated for everything we give up when we serve?? (Thank you's from people walking by every once in a blue moon dont count, as they wont put back on the years of my life stress, and everythings else it has taken off )..do we make millions upon millions and still complain about money and our health?? Lets do a servey....what are there more of in America??: Homeless NFL stars, or Homeless Veterans?? But do Vets STOP SERVING or stop showing up because higher ups make a rule we dont agree with??? lol hahahaha no its simple: SHUT YOUR F&%#ING MOUTH and DO WHAT YOUR TOLD!!
    Posted by reegz04



    Honestly, I feel for those guys. The way some U.S. veterans are treated is appalling. It is a labor nightmare, even during peacetime. I respect what you guys do (even if I don't agree with most wars) and am grateful for it, and wish that the USMC and others had half the labor protection that more humble civil servants like post officers have.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from russgrisworld. Show russgrisworld's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what? : 1) Most people at the top of their professions worked very hard to get there.  The owner's familiy worked hard to get where they are, just as the player did. 2) Agents (after you are established) are luxuries.  Bottom run players do not need publicists, and the team provides trainers. 3) Players are asked to make apperances at charitable events.  They may be encouraged to give (like many are at work), but my guess is optional.  It is not a requirement. 4) The bottom rung doesn't make as much because they are not exceptional.  They may have been exceptional in high school.  They may have been exceptional at college (and received compensation in the form of 100% scholarships).  That doesn't mean they are worthy of exceptional money at the next level. 5) Why are earnings a function of all those years they played pee wee and HS football?  How are they different then doctors, lawyers, businessman who spent years preparing for their career? 6)  There are no sports leagues without owners willing to risk THEIR capital. 7) Injuries are part of the potential high risk/potential spectacular reward equation they willingly accept.  If the NFLPA wants to see a disproportionate amount of money go to unproven "interns", just don't expect the owners to also reward the graybeards.  The pie is finite.
    Posted by Encinitas


    Good Post Encinitas..Don't worry about Woody or Z. They've been communists for quite sometime now and are beyond help. Thankyou for living in the real world.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from fishers5. Show fishers5's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what? : You are all making notable points, but I will now go line-by-line: You know, not that long ago the people of this country had a healthy, reasoned mistrust of the wealthy class, after the years of abuse the wealthy exacted.  Then TV came along with Red Scare propaganda programming that portrayed union laborers as Stalinists, then Dallas, Falcon's Crest, Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous , etc., idolizing the lifestyles of the rich, and gradually the lower 98% fell in love with the elite 2%, all while most of the elite 2% were undermining the lower 98% interests, tilting the game board in their favor through their paid-for special access to our elected pols.  Unless you are in the upper 2%, you should be pretty mad that we have returned to the economics of the robber baron days. If you don't understand that the economy was deliberately sabotaged by these elites to create a vulture market of investment opportunity, you need to start reading some business news and opening your minds. I write this as a guy with a journalism degree, a strong history background, and the experience of working within the field of finance the past 14 years.  Wake up.
    Posted by chrisakawoody

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from fishers5. Show fishers5's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    lets get real.....people who have money earned it by creating a company that makes PROFITS,,,,hires people to work at a salary and creates a life for them....If you dont like the salary  either work harder (except for unions) or leave and find another job....WHY DO you leave out the govt as to whos fault the economy is in.....THEY CREATED AN ATMOSPHERE for lending to dead beats and illegals toi get their form of affordable housing.....
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Funny thing I noticed about ideology. You can never convince the other guy that he's wrong. I wonder why it has to be that way?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ewhite1065. Show ewhite1065's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    lets get real.....people who have money earned it by creating a company that makes PROFITS,,,,hires people to work at a salary and creates a life for them....If you dont like the salary  either work harder (except for unions) or leave and find another job....WHY DO you leave out the govt as to whos fault the economy is in.....THEY CREATED AN ATMOSPHERE for lending to dead beats and illegals toi get their form of affordable housing.....
    Posted by fishers5


    You sound pretty motivated to vote in November Fish. That's a good thing.Me too!
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from verrildd. Show verrildd's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    In Response to The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what? : Considering that the vast majority of NFL players don't make that much for a career that most launched when they were peewees (with the very  slightest chance of making the NFL),


    So they started playing a game when they were young - what does that have to do with anything? 

    that most will carry disabling injuries for the remainder of their lives,


    Simply not true.  many do, but not 'most'

    that they all have short careers,

     
    Nobody ever said they couldn't get another job once their NFL career was over.  length of career has nothing to do with what they should be paid.

    that they provide the majority of the talent in the operations,


    So do the minions in the company I work for - that's the way it works.  The people who own and run the business get the lion's share of the profits.

    [QUOTE/that their career choice requires them to donate a considerable portion of their income to charity (even after their careers have ended),

     
    WHAT?!?

    that the bottom 70% don't really make all that much when you average their earnings based on ALL the number of years that they have played football to earn that money


    I assume you are talking about the pee wee years here, which is just plain ridiculous.
 
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  • You have chosen to ignore posts from norichcrybabies. Show norichcrybabies's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    ok... how's this, Chrisakawoody...
    sorry it didn't work out for your brothers.  I am.  But I'm a two time world champion, 4 time national champion powerlifter.  And I know I'm going to need knee and hip replacement before all's said and done.  I did it because I wanted to.  

    I did lift every day, like your brothers.  Because I wanted to be the best at what I did.  Like your brothers did.  I didn't get a scholarship (payment).  Much worse, if they got a free $200,000 + education and can't manage because they didn't go pro?  That's on them.  Just like the players on the swim team, cheerleaders, track and field and anyone else who went into it for the love of the game.  

    I'm sorry.  I don't feel bad.  

    All these all-star collegic athletes got their fame and, if you had asked them at the time, would have traded what could potentially happen to their bodies.  Happilly.  Or they could have just simply stopped playing.  Everyone of them knows the odds of actually making money in their sport after collage is like hitting the lottery.  




     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from chrisakawoody. Show chrisakawoody's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Encitas,

    First, congrats on motivating me to make one more post on this subject.

    The problem with your chart is that many wealthy people are incorporated or own corporations.  Their cars, cell phones, etc., etc., etc., etc. are paid for through their corporations.  They have so many deductions in their corporate returns that by the end of it it looks like they lost thousands or even millions that tax year...while they are living quite nicely in $5m homes and driving Maybachs. Your table does not consider this because it covers AIG (ADJUSTED gross income, i.e. taxable income ADJUSTED AFTER DEDUCTIONS).  The wealthiest purposely influence our pols to write all kinds of tax shelters, deductions, etc. into our tax codes. I've seen many returns for people whereby they paid themselves $20K a year but ran multi-million dollar corporations that "lost" money, "wink, wink", while they lived near Sheridan Rd. in Chicago. (Think Bellvue Ave in Newport.)

    But you don't have to be incorporated to hide your wealth. Most of the self-employed clients with which I worked (by most, I mean about 95% of them) that filed schedule C or partnerships paid no income taxes.  In fact, it was surprising to see them show any income and pay any income taxes. A good part of this is that many are paid in cash and hide that cash from the IRS, besides the deductions they take.

    I know about your table. It was created by a conservative tax policy group, the Tax Policy Center, then promoted by the Drudge Report, then spread all over the "liberal" news media. There was no in-depth check on the facts or the context. It was a big, sensational story, "sensational" being the key word.

    Now here is another set of charts that show who pays what on taxes, and yet it still fails to consider the tax deductions in AGI and cash pocketing (pull up the link): http://www.ctj.org/pdf/taxday2010.pdf

    It looks a lot different, right?

    Look, I don't blame you for being misled.  Shame on Drudge.  Shame on the mainstream news media.  Shame on Rush. But look man, I have actually seen this stuff about which I am talking.  I didn't pull it down from the web or see it on TV or hear it on talk radio or hear it from a megaphone at a rally.  I saw it, lived it, heard it first-hand from the rich themselves. All of your info is third-hand, fourth-hand.  Mine is first-hand.  That's the end of it.

    You wanna' believe that nonsense propaganda?  You want to help the rich make you poorer?  Be my guest, because in the near future I will be one of those one-percenters and I can throw you a thank-you wave for keeping my income taxes ridiculously low (as compared to 90% under Eisenhower and 70% under Nixon).   But you will never convince me I didn't see first-hand what I have been seeing for the past 14 years.
     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from chrisakawoody. Show chrisakawoody's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    One more question, Sam: How many corporate tax returns coupled with the individual tax returns of the corporations' majority owners have you personally reviewed?
     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    ok... how's this, Chrisakawoody... sorry it didn't work out for your brothers.  I am.  But I'm a two time world champion, 4 time national champion powerlifter.  And I know I'm going to need knee and hip replacement before all's said and done.  I did it because I wanted to.   I did lift every day, like your brothers.  Because I wanted to be the best at what I did.  Like your brothers did.  I didn't get a scholarship (payment).  Much worse, if they got a free $200,000 + education and can't manage because they didn't go pro?  That's on them.  Just like the players on the swim team, cheerleaders, track and field and anyone else who went into it for the love of the game.   I'm sorry.  I don't feel bad.   All these all-star collegic athletes got their fame and, if you had asked them at the time, would have traded what could potentially happen to their bodies.  Happilly.  Or they could have just simply stopped playing.  Everyone of them knows the odds of actually making money in their sport after collage is like hitting the lottery.  
    Posted by norichcrybabies


    I get where you are coming from.  My brothers didn't whine about it.

    But let me put it to you this way: If you did get a scholarship and you also made a few or several millions and then you hosted a cable show on lifting and your employer tried to restructure your TV contract and benefits to an inferior arrangement, and then a guy like SamAdams posts that you already don't deserve what you've made and you are not worth it, that you should be happy to take whatever cut pay your employer offers, and that you should be ashamed to use whatever legal means you have to counter your employer's moves (like approaching another network), how would you respond to Sam? 
     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from norichcrybabies. Show norichcrybabies's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Great!  let's outsource the expensive labor to say...  scabs.  we'll still be rooting for the jersey.  When I see Tom Brady we're a shirt with my name on it, I'll think of it as more than entertainment that I'm passionate about.

    And I am familiar with how businesses work and thought processes of business owners, the best example is a retirement plan.  Who is this really for?  THE OWNER OF THE COMPANY!  401(k), maybe with a profit share on top...  maybe a 412(e)(3), too...  Safe harbor?  why?  so the guys at the top can get more money into the plan or at least don't have to take it back out.  why?  for the deduction.  Why?  to attract and retain key employee's.  Money making money... doesn't have to train new guys because the vesting schedual's. Doesn't have to give up a piece of his business when they key employee heads down the street for more money because his pension is tied into time served. Come on... you're killing me with this.  

    Where on your chart does Tom Brady fit in?  OH!  THAT'S RIGHT!  He hires some "amazing acct" that show's him how to not pay his taxes.  Oh well, I accept that he hires the right guy for the job.  And I don't begrudge him that.  He hired the guy and pays him well.  Just like Kraft did.  And as for bad retirements... how long will it take me to make one single million???  call it 20 years.  and I'm expected to fund my own retirement, including health care.

    I don't want to hear pro athletes cry poverty.  They took the job that would satisfy their needs the most.  

    Maybe boxers should sue their promoter's because they got hit in the head too many times and now they need to be fit for a drool cup.  Haha!  Right!
     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Just wanted to chime in that i'm all in favor of a 18 game season! Absolutely...no questions asked. I would even be in favor of a 20 game season. More football is better period...The preseason is garbage! Bring it on...More! More! and more! No sympathy whatsoever for the greedy overpaid players. There also definitely needs to be a rookie wage cap. Rich people should be taxed at 70-80%, a flat rate with absolutely no exemptions whatsoever. Go Pats!!!

    NE 33
    Phins 32
     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    Z, I don't side with either of them. I'm a football fan that would hate to see a stoppage. I also freely admit that I'm not the all knowing entity regarding the overall situation with the CBA and potential stoppage. I was merely reacting to a thread posted by Chris that potrayed the players as being "on the short end" using reasoning that doesn't fly. Is there a site I can visit to see what the proposal is and what the two sides issues are? Thanks
    Posted by Sam-Adams

    There isn't a single site, but there are many, many stories. Essentially, there isn't a proposal. There was the old CBA, which the owners decided they didn't like, and the protocol for no CBA, which they like less. Under both it was essentially decided that the owners receive 40% and the players receive 40%, with 20% going to costs.

    The owners said they weren't happy, the players said they wanted to see the books. The owners said they couldn't see the books. 

    The players are fine in the old CBA and the noCBA (no cap) area we are in now. Why they are happy with non-guaranteed contracts I don't understand.  But that is another story.

    The owners locked them out.

    The NFLPA didn't start this at all. It was started by the owners. As these things usually are.They strike a deal and then decide they don't like it. Then we have lockouts or strikes. 

    As far as Chris's point. I don't know how I feel about counting up years before the job as risk. But this much is certain. Every team in the NFL is in the Forbes 50 (50 most lucrative sports franchises in the world). All 32 of them. The NFL is not  financially risky. It  is a slam dunk because of profit sharing and TV deals that net billions. Furthermore, let's evaluate risk. Every time a player steps on the field he risks the one commodity he has for sale in this market. Yet the owners have as a commodity billions of dollars of liquidity, and more in hard assets. Not to mention bankruptcy protection etcetera.

    If you and I are gambling, and you have 5 dollars, and I have 500 dollars, who has more risk when the stakes are 5 dollars? Essentially for anyone working, but in extreme contact sports in particular, it is all in. But for the extremely wealthy, it is not all in. It is very small portion in. 

    I think that (in a nutshell) is what Chris is getting at, albeit in an extremely anecdotal fashion. 

     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    Just wanted to chime in that i'm all in favor of a 18 game season! Absolutely...no questions asked. I would even be in favor of a 20 game season. More football is better period...The preseason is garbage! Bring it on...More! More! and more! No sympathy whatsoever for the greedy overpaid players. There also definitely needs to be a rookie wage cap. Rich people should be taxed at 70-80%, a flat rate with absolutely no exemptions whatsoever. Go Pats!!! NE 33 Phins 32
    Posted by jam757



    why should "rich people" be taxed so much? i mean its not there fault that they worked hard or their parents worked hard for what they have, so why should someone who works hard to get where they are have to pay more than somebody who doesnt? man does jealousy breed hate.
     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from norichcrybabies. Show norichcrybabies's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    A little off topic, but this is the dumbest statement I've ever heard in my life!

    "Rich people should be taxed at 70-80%, a flat rate with absolutely no exemptions whatsoever..."

    Until they take their money and their businesses to somewhere it's cheaper to do business.  ie call centers in india.  ie manufacturing in china.  Go ahead, tax them so much that you no longer have a job because no one has a job because no one has money to spend on goods and services because there's no jobs... ect...  ect...  ect.  (see the steel industry, but I could go on).
     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Holy FRAT thread. 

    Can anyone provide cliff notes?
     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    In Response to www.boston.com/community/forums.html?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat%3aSportsForum%3a9690Discussion%3ac6fb1c9f-79b6-408b-8c37-c11c5640174f&plckFindPostKey=Cat:SportsForum:9690Discussion:c6fb1c9f-79b6-408b-8c37-c11c5640174fPost:c6506d43-6b14-4f50-a21c-44c129ff6a27 " /> Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what? : Believe me, I've been a worker my entire life so if I'm on a side it would be theirs but it can't work that way.   If you make an investment through a broker who has a fixed percentage or fixed price per trade and your deal goes through the roof, I mean all the way to the moon does that mean it's Ok for your broker to come back after the risk is over and say he wants more money?  Instead of comparing their pay scale to owners perhaps they should compare what they make to a serviceman risking a lot more physical harm than they do without bitch*ng about it. It makes me sick
    Posted by Sam-Adams

    Sam, salaries are set by the market. Football players make a lot of money for the same reason movie stars make a lot of money. They have rare skills and people will pay a lot of money to see them do what they do.  The owners can't make a dime without star players. So they need to get good players.  And good players are in short supply (especially, apparently, cornerbacks--at least in New England). Anytime demand is high and supply is short, prices go up.  It's basic market economics. Most employees in most ordinary jobs are easy to replace (lots of supply and only modest demand), which is why the average working guy doesn't get paid much and has to kow-tow to his boss to ensure he can keep his job. But football players, movie stars, and certain other high-talent people are hard to find and therefore have a kind of leverage over their employers us regular schmucks just don't have.  Whether that's good or just, I don't know.  But when you've got a rare skill that's in high demand, the market says you should be paid a lot. And in a market-based society like ours, that's exactly what happens. 




     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Stepping around the political talk...

    A few points I feel I had to make concerning the years of work to get to the pros.

    No 9 year old should be lifting weights at all. To allow it is a certain amount of ignorance on the part of the parents. Only when your body is close to physical maturity should you be doing things like that.

    Guys spend 15/16 years to get through a short pro career where they make only $1,000,000 total. So, let's call that from 13-29. So, poor them, only made about $60,000 a year from before they are old enough to work, until just about 30. Thats a serious hardship right there. So many people make so much MORE than that right out of college! Then they have that free education to fall back on. Wah wah wah. And thats a low level draft pick who doesn't last!

    And, yes, commitiing that much time and effort into something is a choice. People don't get to make that choice and then complain about it. Every football player knows the risks, that's why they hold out for guaranteed money and complain about length of contract.

    I'm tired of athletes complaining that it's so hard and physical (they didn't realize?) when the root of the problem was they went through money like water when they were playing, never saved, and never got a real education when they were handed a free, golden ticket to a top college.

    Now, as for the layer who played before this ecomnic explosion in football, and helped build the league to where it is, fo those guys to be forgotten IS criminal. But it's not up to the owner's to do something, that's fully on the Union. Current PLAYERS should be looking out for the PLAYERS who laid the groundwork for them. But does anyone see Terrell Owens opening up his checkbook for Elroy Hirsch? Not likely to happen any time soon (and I do realize crazy legs has passed, but how often will I ever get to work him into a post?).
     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    Again, for all the rhetoric about what players suffer or don't suffer and whether they're spoiled or not spoiled, pay isn't about what's fair or just or right.  It's about supply and demand.  And, to a large degree, it's about power.  

    If you have a talent for which there is a high demand and that's in low supply, you can demand more money.  All you need to get the money is negotiating power.  The purpose of the union is simply to increase negotiating power.  Similarly, the owners protect their anti-trust exemption to preserve their own negotiating power.  What if the owners were forced to give up some of their anti-competitive advantages such as salary caps and a draft system and allow players and their agents coming out of college to bargain with all teams rather than just the one that drafted them?  What do you think that bidding war would do for star player pay?  How 'bout if we had "employment at will" as in most professions--i.e., free agency all the time, where an employee can leave and get a new job any time he wants?  What if Brady were able to walk anytime he wanted to any other team?  If you don't like collective bargaining, open it up to a true completely free market system and see what happens.  
     
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    Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?

    In Response to Re: The NFL will suffer greatly...and, for what?:
    Just wanted to chime in that i'm all in favor of a 18 game season! Absolutely...no questions asked. I would even be in favor of a 20 game season. More football is better period...The preseason is garbage! Bring it on...More! More! and more! No sympathy whatsoever for the greedy overpaid players. There also definitely needs to be a rookie wage cap. Rich people should be taxed at 70-80%, a flat rate with absolutely no exemptions whatsoever. Go Pats!!! NE 33 Phins 32
    Posted by jam757

    Well, you've clearly thought this through.

    Let's see. You want more games because you enjoy the virtually free entertainment. Yet the players that entertain you and are likely to end up playing less due to injury are greedy and overpaid. 



     
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