The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    find out what you got and what limitations you have RIGHT NOW, so you know what you can do come playoffs.

    you can try doubling the 2nd best wr.

    you can run most of your defense minus the wayne coverage

    you can also run your double wayne and let talib cover the #2.

    be good to know now what you can do teh rest of the year; against the better teams ; when you know you need a win; and in the playoffs.

    play your soft zone form now till teh end and you will never know your options.

    might also mix in more blitzes.

    trying our big safety on tes, etc.

    i think dennard is better at pressing and competing with the wr than zone (much)

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Quagmire3. Show Quagmire3's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    I concur. Dennard and Talib in press man coverage and the will do OK (I think). Hopefully the others wont be exposed!

     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    Wayne is operating very differently this year than he has in the past.  He is in motion on nearly every play.  Pretty difficult to play press when the wide out is off the ball and in motion.  Also difficult to have one person checking him when he's all over the field. 

    I expect the pats to play zone on wayne with extra focus, and while the pats may not so easily be able to play press coverage on him, I do think they will try to chuck him off his route.

    I fully expect the pats to make Luck and the other young receivers to beat them, by doing whatever they can to focus on Wayne.  In fact, I could see the pats playing nickel all game as the colts run game still isn't much of anything. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    Yeah ... just run press man ... every play. Why not? That is football right?

    Talib is going to play his side, in zone, man whatever. 

    UD6 is right. They've been moving Wayne all over the place this season. The Colt's offense is a lot more complex now than it has been for a long time. And a big part of that is getting the WRs clean releases and showing Luck the defense.

    There will be some man, there will be some zone. 

    If the players execute, it won't matter what they call for the most part. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    Yeah ... just run press man ... every play. Why not? That is football right?

    Talib is going to play his side, in zone, man whatever. 

    UD6 is right. They've been moving Wayne all over the place this season. The Colt's offense is a lot more complex now than it has been for a long time. And a big part of that is getting the WRs clean releases and showing Luck the defense.

    There will be some man, there will be some zone. 

    If the players execute, it won't matter what they call for the most part. 



    This is exactly right. The Pats play sides. If Talib is up to speed he will play LCB. I know we all think Dennard will be at RCB, but I would not be surprised to see Arrington out there.

    Wayne lines up all over the field, and motions a lot. I would not expect Talib to spend his first game with the Pats chasing Wayne all over the field.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to UD6's comment:

    Wayne is operating very differently this year than he has in the past.  He is in motion on nearly every play.  Pretty difficult to play press when the wide out is off the ball and in motion.  Also difficult to have one person checking him when he's all over the field. 

    I expect the pats to play zone on wayne with extra focus, and while the pats may not so easily be able to play press coverage on him, I do think they will try to chuck him off his route.

    I fully expect the pats to make Luck and the other young receivers to beat them, by doing whatever they can to focus on Wayne.  In fact, I could see the pats playing nickel all game as the colts run game still isn't much of anything. 



    i agree with what probably will happen. still like them play man and start playing talib tht way instead of playing sides of teh field and zone all teh time

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to zbellino's comment:

    Yeah ... just run press man ... every play. Why not? That is football right?

    Talib is going to play his side, in zone, man whatever. 

    UD6 is right. They've been moving Wayne all over the place this season. The Colt's offense is a lot more complex now than it has been for a long time. And a big part of that is getting the WRs clean releases and showing Luck the defense.

    There will be some man, there will be some zone. 

    If the players execute, it won't matter what they call for the most part. 



    what i expect and what id liek are 2 diff things.

    iincidentally, i dont expect our def backfield be be good or very good all of a sudden

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from dapats1281. Show dapats1281's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    I'd rather them double Wayne and put Talib on their number 2.

     

    Talib probably isn't even in proper game shape yet, and even when he was, he got torched by the GMen in week 2.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Eldunker. Show Eldunker's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    Way overly optimistic expectations.

    I would not immediately throw the man to the lions and potentially damage his confidence which is sooo important for D backs.  I would expect Talib to play adequately, at best, against one of the best recievers in the league, in his first game in over a month, in a brand new system, new environment and new players with whom he has barely practiced with.  

    He should improve week after week and hopefully be effective against quality recievers come playoff crunch time.  Give the guy some time to adjust and learn the system without hurting himself and the team.. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    "This time last year there were many theorizing that Reggie Wayne was a spent force in Indianapolis and not the same without Peyton Manning under center for the Colts. Well, halfway through the 2012 season those theories have been firmly put to bed and once again Wayne was front and center as Andrew Luck’s go-to guy and crucial in terms of getting the offense started.

    Wayne was the targeted receiver on Luck’s first five passes and though Wayne dropped two of them (one was off of a tip by Tyson Alualu) it was no secret who the Colts were feeding the ball to in order to build momentum. For the sixth time in nine games Wayne saw double digit targets and six of his eight catches resulted in first downs for the Indianapolis offense. Count in Wayne’s solid contributions as a blocker on the edge and you start to build a picture of the man most important to the success of the Colts’ offense. Can any team take Wayne away from Luck? And, if they do, can Luck get the offense moving without leaning on Wayne? Surely Bill Belichick will cook up a scheme next week that forces Luck to look away from Wayne early and often."

    --https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/09/refo-colts-jaguars-week-10/

    Double team Reggie Wayne on every single play.  Luck is still a rookie quarterback and needs to be made as uncomfortable as possible.  If Reggie Wayne is going to be Luck's first read on every single pass play all day, make sure that Luck continues to hang on to the football. If Talib can bump Wayne pretty hard to disrupt Wayne's timing, so much the better.

    Perhaps some nice fellow named Chandler will push his man into Luck's lap (sort of being in the lap of lucksury).  Luck's stock in trade is getting loose to the left or right and running.  It's important to contain him in the pocket, and the Patriots are pretty good at containment because they outweigh most NFL defensive lines.  Emphasize bull-rushing technique.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from sporter81. Show sporter81's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    Talib has played at a high level in this league for a few years. He's proven that he can cover and make big plays. He's somewhat cocky which is good, he knows that he can get it done. The only problem for now may be a little rust but even then he should be better than anyone  we've had back there so far this season.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to dapats1281's comment:

    I'd rather them double Wayne and put Talib on their number 2.

     

    Talib probably isn't even in proper game shape yet, and even when he was, he got torched by the GMen in week 2.



    wasnt man. was some zone combo variation.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

    "This time last year there were many theorizing that Reggie Wayne was a spent force in Indianapolis and not the same without Peyton Manning under center for the Colts. Well, halfway through the 2012 season those theories have been firmly put to bed and once again Wayne was front and center as Andrew Luck’s go-to guy and crucial in terms of getting the offense started.

    Wayne was the targeted receiver on Luck’s first five passes and though Wayne dropped two of them (one was off of a tip by Tyson Alualu) it was no secret who the Colts were feeding the ball to in order to build momentum. For the sixth time in nine games Wayne saw double digit targets and six of his eight catches resulted in first downs for the Indianapolis offense. Count in Wayne’s solid contributions as a blocker on the edge and you start to build a picture of the man most important to the success of the Colts’ offense. Can any team take Wayne away from Luck? And, if they do, can Luck get the offense moving without leaning on Wayne? Surely Bill Belichick will cook up a scheme next week that forces Luck to look away from Wayne early and often."

    --https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/09/refo-colts-jaguars-week-10/

    Double team Reggie Wayne on every single play.  Luck is still a rookie quarterback and needs to be made as uncomfortable as possible.  If Reggie Wayne is going to be Luck's first read on every single pass play all day, make sure that Luck continues to hang on to the football. If Talib can bump Wayne pretty hard to disrupt Wayne's timing, so much the better.

    Perhaps some nice fellow named Chandler will push his man into Luck's lap (sort of being in the lap of lucksury).  Luck's stock in trade is getting loose to the left or right and running.  It's important to contain him in the pocket, and the Patriots are pretty good at containment because they outweigh most NFL defensive lines.  Emphasize bull-rushing technique.



    Even with the addition of Talib, can the Patriots afford to double anyone on every single play? It would mean play in nickle or essentially playing two DBs against the other WR, RBs and TE (or whatever the combo on the field is).

    Lock may be a rookie, but checking down is something Luck is actually good at.

    With Ninkovich and Jones at the ends, I am not sure who they outweigh. Love and Wilfork are beasts, but rushing the passer is neither of their strength. 

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to Paul_K's comment:

    "This time last year there were many theorizing that Reggie Wayne was a spent force in Indianapolis and not the same without Peyton Manning under center for the Colts. Well, halfway through the 2012 season those theories have been firmly put to bed and once again Wayne was front and center as Andrew Luck’s go-to guy and crucial in terms of getting the offense started.

    Wayne was the targeted receiver on Luck’s first five passes and though Wayne dropped two of them (one was off of a tip by Tyson Alualu) it was no secret who the Colts were feeding the ball to in order to build momentum. For the sixth time in nine games Wayne saw double digit targets and six of his eight catches resulted in first downs for the Indianapolis offense. Count in Wayne’s solid contributions as a blocker on the edge and you start to build a picture of the man most important to the success of the Colts’ offense. Can any team take Wayne away from Luck? And, if they do, can Luck get the offense moving without leaning on Wayne? Surely Bill Belichick will cook up a scheme next week that forces Luck to look away from Wayne early and often."

    --https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/09/refo-colts-jaguars-week-10/

    Double team Reggie Wayne on every single play.  Luck is still a rookie quarterback and needs to be made as uncomfortable as possible.  If Reggie Wayne is going to be Luck's first read on every single pass play all day, make sure that Luck continues to hang on to the football. If Talib can bump Wayne pretty hard to disrupt Wayne's timing, so much the better.

    Perhaps some nice fellow named Chandler will push his man into Luck's lap (sort of being in the lap of lucksury).  Luck's stock in trade is getting loose to the left or right and running.  It's important to contain him in the pocket, and the Patriots are pretty good at containment because they outweigh most NFL defensive lines.  Emphasize bull-rushing technique.



    Even with the addition of Talib, can the Patriots afford to double anyone on every single play? It would mean play in nickle or essentially playing two DBs against the other WR, RBs and TE (or whatever the combo on the field is).

    Lock may be a rookie, but checking down is something Luck is actually good at.

    With Ninkovich and Jones at the ends, I am not sure who they outweigh. Love and Wilfork are beasts, but rushing the passer is neither of their strength. 



    bb hasnt doen this in years. but if its me, i put taliib on wayne period. let him work off his rust doing his job. id even tell him if he gets a penalty or 2 for being too aggressive, i dont mind (long as its not in the end zone)

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player. And I'm talking about Talib, not Wayne - Wayne is much more than a solid player (it's why they wanted to draft him years ago and why they tried to sign him this off season).

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.



    i watched him and to my eyes he looked better in press.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.



    i watched him and to my eyes he looked better in press.



    Honestly, I just hope they start playing enough press coverage to really find out...

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.



    i watched him and to my eyes he looked better in press.



    Honestly, I just hope they start playing enough press coverage to really find out...



    that was the reason i stated in doing so in my original post

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.



    i watched him and to my eyes he looked better in press.



    Honestly, I just hope they start playing enough press coverage to really find out...



    that was the reason i stated in doing so in my original post



    I guess I am just more pessimistic about it actually happening... I thought after the St. Louis game we were going to see more blitzing and a more agressive defensive attitude in general, but against Buffalo they went back to soft-zones and no blitzing.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.



    i watched him and to my eyes he looked better in press.



    Honestly, I just hope they start playing enough press coverage to really find out...



    that was the reason i stated in doing so in my original post



    I guess I am just more pessimistic about it actually happening... I thought after the St. Louis game we were going to see more blitzing and a more agressive defensive attitude in general, but against Buffalo they went back to soft-zones and no blitzing.




    actually if i havent communicsted it, i am pessimistic. bb is stubborn as hell. 

    im rooting for it though

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: The Only Way to Find out If it can be effective is to try: Talib 1 on 1 with Wayne

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to bredbru's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    I really don't see Belichick changing his defensive philosophy for a guy that is probably nothing more than a solid player.



    This I agree with. Talib's success or failure will coming from being part of the defense, not having it changed around him.



    yes i agree with both of you with what likely bb will do.

    however i believe the defense would be better playing pres with d and t, and that it is a misuse of dennard and talib to play them in a soft zone from now thru the playoffs



    I think we may see more of it, but I doubt we will see a fundamental change of philosophy. No team really runs one defense or coverage play after play. It become too easy to read. I think Dennard may be good at tighter coverage, but again, is there enough evidence to prove that. The coaching staff has not felt comfortable having him do it more than the other CBs this year.



    i watched him and to my eyes he looked better in press.



    Honestly, I just hope they start playing enough press coverage to really find out...



    that was the reason i stated in doing so in my original post



    I guess I am just more pessimistic about it actually happening... I thought after the St. Louis game we were going to see more blitzing and a more agressive defensive attitude in general, but against Buffalo they went back to soft-zones and no blitzing.




    actually if i havent communicsted it, i am pessimistic. bb is stubborn as hell. 

    im rooting for it though



    Your pessimism has been clearly communicated.

     
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