The Pats offensive line

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from harleyroadking103. Show harleyroadking103's posts

    The Pats offensive line

    This is the most important group on the team, and for those who have been on here awhile I know I'm repeating myself but to me it all starts with these guys.
    To borrow a popular line on this board "this offensive line is not what we thought it was" The Pats running game is weak at best. There been some good signs but overall the Pats don't run it consistently enough. Some blame can be laid on Maroney but mostly it lies with the line. Ever since the SB loss in the Giants showed the blueprint as to how to get to Brady teams with the right personnel can overwhelm this line and harass/sack/hit Brady. With all this being said here is what I would like to see for Sundays game and for next season. Against the 'fins this the line I would put out there. Vollmer/Mankins/Koppen/Connelly/Light.

    Next season I would draft the best center we can get (WITHOUT TRADING DOWN!!) and look for for some good FAs. Every year for next four drafts the pats should draft the best lineman they can get. 

    Go ahead call me idiot....





     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    In Response to The Pats offensive line:
    [QUOTE]Go ahead call me idiot....
    Posted by harleyroadking103[/QUOTE]

    No need too, Harley. You're absolutely right. I think the Pats run blocking has been weak for years . . . and their pass blocking may look better than it really is because of Brady's ability to make decisions and get rid of the ball so quickly. (Bledsoe always made the line look worse than it really was because he took so long to make decisions).

    The problem with pass blocking really became evident in the Super Bowl against the Giants and was also clear against the Saints last week. Albert Breer posted an article today on the Saints' pass rush. His analysis shows the Saints using a three-man rush in 16 of the Patriots' 36 passing downs and a normal four-man rush 9 times. The Saints blitzed (sent more than four) only 11 times.  What's remarkable about these statistics is that Brady was under pressure on almost every play--despite the Saints sending only three men nearly half the time. That's shocking, really!  By being able to pressure Brady so effectively with just three rushers, the Saints were able to drop eight into coverage. That made it possible to double team Moss, keep a safety over the top to protect against a deep ball to Aiken or Watson and leave a rover in the middle of the field to double up on Welker or Faulk in the short zones. Brady can beat a blitz, when five or six rushers are coming at him, leaving only five or six defenders in coverage.  But with eight in coverage, it's a lot harder to find an open man when the rushers are on your tail.

    Against the Saints, a big part of the problem may have been Vollmer's absence (I was worried about that before the game as he was on the DNP list all week) and Light not yet being 100% (plus Kaczur's usual spottiness against good rushers). Plus Light was rotating with LeVoir during the game, and LeVoir makes Light look like Anthony Munoz.

    Since about 2002, I've been arguing with friends that the Pats needed to draft a good tackle. I think they got one with Vollmer. But I'd like to see them draft another.  I'm not as concerned with center or guard--but a real mauler at right tackle--someone who can rip holes open in the running game and still hold his own against good pass rushers--would really improve this team, especially if Vollmer turns out to be the pro bowler at left tackle I think he might become. 

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from murghkhor. Show murghkhor's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    I'll call you an idiot. 3 of the 5 played the Pro Bowl last year in February. Hello!!!??!?
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    I am pretty happy with Vollmer and Mankins, but it seems that the older OL may be losing a step. Can someone explain why Kaczur got a contract and Mankins didn't ? It seems that BB could draft a RT next year (with the many 2nds) and cut Kaczur. it bothers me when people complain that the 07 Giants somehow wrote the blueprint on beating the Pats O Line and now everyone is copying it. The Giants had the most sacks in all of football that year and Justin Tuck played the best game of his life. The Pats underestimated the Giants defense and failed to make in game adjustments.....time to move on...Alot depends on whether you're talking about power running or finesse running. I think the Pats need a power runner like Jonathan Dwyer....a player who's 6;1 235-245 and can move the pile or play finesse. Wasn't Koppen out for lie 2 games ? The reason I ask is because this OL functions well as a unit and losing the centre is like losing an ILB that calls the plays (see Mayo). All these guys are big and strong, but if there's miscommunication on the blocking schemes, protecting the QB or whatever becomes more difficult...obviously....
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    Actually comparing that game to the Sb was apt, simply because Neal left early in both games.

    NE doesn't have the depth that some brag about there. And even the starters on the right side are average at best.

    Mankins hasn't even played particularly well either, and Koppen is smart, but not elite.

    They could use more punch up there, but it is FAR from the top concern.

    I would put 3rd Wr and Pass rusher at the top of the list this season. Last season it was just about getting DBs to fill spots.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    In Response to Re: The Pats offensive line:
    [QUOTE]Wasn't Koppen out for lie 2 games ? The reason I ask is because this OL functions well as a unit and losing the centre is like losing an ILB that calls the plays (see Mayo). All these guys are big and strong, but if there's miscommunication on the blocking schemes, protecting the QB or whatever becomes more difficult...obviously....
    Posted by JohnHannahrulz[/QUOTE]

    Koppen was injured in the Miami game, but he was playing against the Saints. You're right that the O-Line plays well together--they are smart, well-coached players. And the interior line is pretty talented I think. The tackles are where the problem is.  I like Matt Light a lot--I think he's a smart, hard-working player, but he just isn't athletic enough to be consistently good against the best pass rushers. And Kaczur is only so-so at right tackle (and a liability against good pass rushers). The line does as well as it does because they play smart (and because Brady helps them out with his quick release).  But the tackles aren't as physically talented as you'd like and they struggle mightily against top pass rushers. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from harleyroadking103. Show harleyroadking103's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    In Response to Re: The Pats offensive line:
    [QUOTE]I'll call you an idiot. 3 of the 5 played the Pro Bowl last year in February. Hello!!!??!?
    Posted by murghkhor[/QUOTE]

    Well that may be but I bet dollars to donuts not one will be there this year.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    Well they played awesome in the 2007 regular season.  Man those were the days ...
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    In Response to Re: The Pats offensive line:
    [QUOTE]Actually comparing that game to the Sb was apt, simply because Neal left early in both games. NE doesn't have the depth that some brag about there. And even the starters on the right side are average at best. Mankins hasn't even played particularly well either, and Koppen is smart, but not elite. They could use more punch up there, but it is FAR from the top concern. I would put 3rd Wr and Pass rusher at the top of the list this season. Last season it was just about getting DBs to fill spots.
    Posted by zbellino[/QUOTE]
    Do you think the Patriots would be willing to use a high draft pick on a 3rd reciever?

    From what I've seen, they seem to think of 3rd reciever as a low money position.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from harleyroadking103. Show harleyroadking103's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    So what do you think now after this game? They looked great until the fourth and one and got royally stuffed. Brady had the snot knocked out of him by 3 and 4 man rushes... TOTALY UNACCEPTABLE !!!!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    Just like in the NO game. The 3-man rush is actually killing them. Tragic really, when average defensive fronts can get pressure with three men.

    The bottom line is this:

    Light needs to be replaced.
    Koppen needs to be replaced.
    Neal needs to be replaced.
    KAczur needs to be replaced.

    Mankins is ok, bhut not worth what I am sure his agents will want. Vollmer has looked promising. But essentially, after those two, the rest are backups. Pure and simple. They are not starters in this league.

    At one point they were. But now they are old and broken, and do not get the job done. Three man rush should not = pressure at all.


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from btownteamsrking. Show btownteamsrking's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    harley ive been saying this since the jets loss.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from harleyroadking103. Show harleyroadking103's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    I was saying this last year, especially at draft time. Now Vollmer has shown real promise but this team has to draft high quality linemen with higher draft picks. I'll bet no-one in the organization thought Vollmer would anything more than a backup let alone a starter as a rookie.

    * fu*cking 3 rushers should not even be the same zip code as the QB. Did we pressure Henne when we rushed 3.....NO!
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    In Response to Re: The Pats offensive line:
    [QUOTE] Did we pressure Henne when we rushed 3.....NO!
    Posted by harleyroadking103[/QUOTE]

    Sh*t, we didn't even pressure him when we rushed six! Pretty stark contrast between the opponents' getting pressure with three rushers and the Pats unable to get pressure with five or six. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from K-max. Show K-max's posts

    Re: The Pats offensive line

    Agree, one of our many concerns.  I believe Philli and the Ravens also blew up our line in 07 and Matt was road kill all of 08.
     
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