A breakdown of Pats' free agents:
http://musketfire.com/2011/01/22/patriots-free-agents-whos-staying-and-whos-going/

A great place to look at all of the top free agents in the NFL:
http://www.footballsfuture.com/freeagents.html

These are long lists of names that most of you probably won't want to read through, but it's a good introduction to all of the names you're likely to hear this offseason

Pats' Free Agents that I'd like to see them keep:
Logan Mankins - sets the tone on the offensive line; tough to replace
Gerard Warren - a big run stopper who also had 3.5 sacks
Jarrad Page - a big safety who can also play linebacker in subpackages
Tracy White - led the Patriots in special teams tackles

Pats' Free Agents that I'd like to see back for the right money
Kyle Arrington - quietly a very good #2 corner and could field a nice offer... and with Bodden coming back from injured reserve, would he settle for the slot?
BenJarvis Green-Ellis - a tough straightline runner with minimal pass-catching skills
Kevin Faulk - a veteran and a leader, even if redundant with Woodhead
Matt Light - limited, but a good locker room presence and knows the playoffs; only if no upgrade

Other free agents the Pats should target:
LaMarr Woodley, OLB, PIT - good pass rusher who can also drop back (every down OLB); knows what it takes to be a top defense on a Super Bowl team
Harvey Dahl, G, ATL - apparently plays with a mean streak; Pats probably need to replace Stephen Neal, whose shoulders are gone and who might retire anyway; a mean-streak player would also help replace Mankins' attitude if he leaves
Pierre Thomas, RB, NO - a dual threat who can run between the tackles but also catch passes out of the backfield and make defenders miss in space; was injured & would be more reasonably priced than DeAngelo Williams
Cullen Jenkins, DE, GB - played in a 3-4 and got 8.5 sacks (different system)
Nnamdi Asomugha, CB, OAK - highly unlikely both because of price and because he wants to play with Revis or Woodson, but if Kyle Arrington walks and Leigh Bodden is washed up (30+ and out of football for a year), then he'd look nice in a Pats uniform opposite McCourty and he's a high-character guy who spends his free time tutoring disadvantaged teens and helping Nigerian orphans while driving around in his 1990's Nissan (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=clemmons/081014&sportCat=nfl) - someone forward that article to Myra Kraft!
D'Qwell Jackson, ILB, CLE - a tackling machine on a very bad Cleveland team that played a similar 3-4 defense under Eric Mangini; was injured
Carl Nicks, G, NO - would be pricey, but would help replace Mankins
DeAngelo Williams, RB, CAR - a dual threat who would be expensive
Malcolm Floyd, WR, SD - a big body at 6'5" and a deep threat
Jared Gaither, OT, BAL - a giant man at 6'9"
Champ Bailey, CB, DEN - on the downside of his career, but still a good corner who could also show the young kids the ropes
Ryan Kalil, C, CAR - apparently a good center, but only if better than Koppen
Piso Tinoisamoa, OLB, CHI - a 4-3 LB who stopped Michael Turner dead in his tracks and forced a fumble on the same bone-jarring hit... this image of him is stuck in my head
Ronnie Brown, RB, MIA - a great talent who has had two knee injuries already
Al Harris, CB, MIA - a physical cornerback who had a bad knee injury a year and a half ago; corner in the Ty Law mold if he recovers
Stephen Cooper, ILB, SD - grew up in Wareham, MA
Standford Routt, CB, OAK - a good athlete at corner; not sure if he's panning out or developing, but he'd be just as good of a project as Darius Butler
Manny Lawson, OLB, SF - a draft bust who has speed, could be a project for cheap enough

Top Draft Targets:
Akeem Ayers, OLB, UCLA, 6-3, 249 - listed weight concerns me, but he's apparently the most developed pass rusher in the draft
Von Miller, OLB, Texas A&M, 6-3, 238 - weight alarms me even more, but he's also apparently a very good pass rusher and Texas A&M (Ty Warren's alma matter) plays a 3-4 defense so he's already familiar
Justin Houston, OLB, Georgia, 6-3, 254
J.J. Watt, DT/DE, Wisconsin, 6-6, 292 - big frame at a position of need; would need to be an every-down lineman or a stalwart with smarts to justify the high pick needed to get him because I don't see what he can do that Gerard Warren, Ron Brace, Mike Wright, and Myron Pryor can't already do opposite Vince Wilfork and Ty Warren...
Marcell Dareus, DT, Alabama, 6-3, 306 - apparently can play 4-3 or 3-4; sounds like he'll be gone before the Pats pick @17
Ryan Kerrigan, DE/OLB, Purdue, 6-4, 263 - size and frame to set the edge and he had 210 tackles last season so he gets around the field
Aldon Smith, DE/OLB, Missouri, 6-5, 260 - tall enough and big enough to set the edge, but can he drop back in coverage?
Mike Pouncey, C/G, Florida - an interior lineman who could help replace Mankins and Neal
Nathan Solder, OT, Colorado, 6-9, 315 - will probably be gone before the Pats pick because he's the top OT
Anthony Castonzo, OT, Boston College, 6-9, 295 - listed as smaller than Solder, but still has a big frame; would replace Light or bump Vollmer to the left and make for a nice pair of bookends on the line with big bodies for the run game, too
Gabe Carimi, OT, Wisconsin, 6-7, 315 - listed as bigger than Castonzo, but "only" 6-7... the big questions with all these giants at tackle are "can they move?" and "are they smart enough for advanced schemes and smart pass rushers?" because otherwise they're not any better than Matt Light, who is smart and experienced

I guess that narrows down the choices! I didn't see Santa Claus showing up on time on that list! Of all the guys on the FA list, the only guys I think the Patriots will seek are Nnamdi,Woodley,Edwards,Hali,and maybe Ricky Williams or Cadillac Williams,Heath Evans,Nicks only if Mankins departs,Gaither only if Light signs elsewheres. On your draft wish list you are just about on target though you can forget Dareus and supplement Clayborn in his place as he's more likely to be available,and I agree that all four of the O-linemen you have on it are viable draft choices and they all should be available unless some team in front of the patriots starts an O-line drafting frenzy! There are a couple of other top tier O-linemen like Moffat from Wisconson,or Smith from USC,and another kid I've been reading about from the SEC Zeimba who will be available in the second round. I would like to include a couple of very talented WR's into the conversation as potential Draft choices Baldwin,Gurley,Tolliver,Pettis and Young add any of these guys to your WR mix and they will make the WR corps a little harder to defend, Otherwise you hit the proverbial nail with your wish lists.

Al Harris?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Cullen Jenkins "got 8.5 sacks, played in a different system"

Can you say "Derrick Burgess"?

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


Stop being a arm chair GM you don't know how he'll play

Sorry couldn't resist after your little rant about fans stop trying to be coaches and GM's and here you are determining that a player doesn't fit our system

BTW KMart is - /> way

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


No, I'm making fun of the morons that theink they ARE GM's. 

YOU don't have a system.  The Pats have a system.  You don't play for the Pats or coach them, you are only a fan.  So don't say "our system", say "their system".

Good grief.

The Pats need to trade up and get Marcell Dareus from 'Bama. 

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:

You're making sweeping generalizations that because they say these things that they are morons. They are either a) fans, or b) feel vested in their team because they watch the game, follow the team, buy the teams merchandise, and most likely have done so for for years.

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


I.  I am a fan, no more and no less.
2.  I am not  a GM or coach, nor do I feel I am.
3.  I watch the games, follow the team, and I even have a Brady jersey.  I had an Eason jersey back in the day.  I've followed the Pats since Babe Parilli was their QB.
4.  I don't have a lawn, I rent a townhome.
5.  I have a doctorate in computational chemistry so I am on the computer/internet ALL THE TIME.  I was on the internet in 1993.  I had one of the first home pages that were ever published.  Were you on the internet in 1993?  At that time, all Pats fans were screaming, "sign Ernest Givens"..

What is the point of playing GM?  It's not like your words are going to be heeded by anyone; it's not like anyone is going to take your work and build on it.  So, in a sense, it IS moronic and those that do it all the time ARE morons.

I say lets give our 2011, 12, 13, 14 first rounders to Colts and get Manning! We need a reliable backup to TB ;-)

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


Thank you for the holier than thou BS.

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


Actually since I buy the mechanise, watch the games through commercials, and go to the games it's because of fans like me that there is even a team to watch. Maybe you don't understand this but fans are the reason why teams can operate, they aren't a separate entity that would exist without us therefor it is our team, btw Kraft said that it was the fans team too. Yes we have no dicision on plays or what players to get but as fans it is fun to most of us to play these games (meaningless as they are) because it makes us feel closer to the team we support. If you're not that type of fan then not a problem but don't criticize those who are. And yes I get annoyed by all these "we should get these players" threads but I chose to act like an adult and not read them instead of acting like a kid not getting their way and tossing insults around because you feel differently.

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:

1) Glad you made it through since the 60's. I proudly made it through since the 70's.

They won't keep White...(Unless he comes in at about the same $$).  He's a good special teamer, but lot's of guys like that fit the bill as they round out the last 2-3 spots on the roster.  He's not Larry Izzo. 

Page..interesting who is it MCGowan....that got hurt.....they likely will battle.

I think Arrington, BJGE are young enough....but are they talented enough.

I think they should just continue to draft better.  They have an affliction to drafting certain positions like WR and RB.  Pittsburgh on the other hand continues to find guys like Wallace, Ward and Thigpen.  Mendenhall,Parker, etc. BY no means are they perfect either. 

I think they need to bolster both the OL and DL and work outwards from there. 

I think you should also list Mark Ingram on your list of possible draft targets.  As good as BJGE was, you have to figure that they're going to look for more of a true feature back via either the draft or trade. 

ZZZZZ...........Another thread brought down by 66 ! This guy needs to loosen up a bit as he sounds more and more like a closet Jets fan trying to come out of the closet.

Im guessing he is Leon from New Jersey

I'd hate to see your long list!

I'm not as familiar with the linemen in the draft, particularly the top guards (other than Pouncey)

I also didn't list Tamba Hali because I'd bet almost anything that he'll get franchised.  He's good because Crennel would be running very Patriots-like principles.

And I personally don't see what Cullen Jenkins does in Dom Capers' 3-4 that Mike Wright and Myron Pryor couldn't do in our system, but everyone is clamoring for defensive ends - personally, I'd rather just see them re-sign Warren

there are hundreds of free agents and draft prospects.  I've wittled it down to a comperhensive list of maybe 50

It beats starting 15 different discussions for 15 different players... :-/

Ernest Givens

AFK - Some good interior lineman are Wisniewski, Cannon, Boling, Ziemba, Rackley, O'Dowd. They range from the 2-6 round range. I'd bring you there bio's but I'm cooking dinner and don't feel like spending 20mins to type it all out

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:
Yup he was in the 1986 draft class and he was a speed WR out of the University of Louisville I think he played for the Houston Oilers, He was one of those smurf WR's 5'9" and 170 with bricks in his shorts for added weight. He played for 10 seasons and his last season was 1995..Titus Young is a name to add to the growing list of speed receivers to watch as Greg Bedard put in his quick hits article he can fly!

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


Save your breath. Unless you agree with the overabundance of kool-aide drinkers on this board you can't say anything!

Repeat after me: "BB is the best". "The Patriot Way is the ONLY way". "He won't fit because he doesn't play in a 3-4". "He's not a Patriot type player", "Volume and Value is king"..get it? Want to get along on this board, just follow the simple rules!

In Response to Re: the Short List: Free Agent targets and Draft Prospects who fit the Pats:


i'd take moffitt over cannon and ziemba because i want the pats to finaly have a running game.

I'd like to see them bring in a FB who can lay down some devastating blocks for the tailbacks.  Several times in the last few years, we have used OL and DL as short yardage FBs only to have them get hurt (Seymour, Hochstein & Connolly come to mind).  Both Seymour and Connolly were starters injured on FB plays.  There a few real good options as UFAs.  The Pats would I'm sure like Vonte Leach of the Texans who just mauls people and Arian Foster got 1600 yards behind him. 
Or, and I'd love to see it, bring back Heath Evans.  The guy was the perfect Pat, playing special teams, caught, ran, blocked.  Did it all.  And he played angry and mean.  Loved to hit people.  The Saints love him, and so did the Pats.  I thought it was a huge mistake to let him go.