Time to commit to a featured running back?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from DStroh1. Show DStroh1's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]The only problem I have with Moss, Welker, and Edleman 3 receiver set is normally you have Faluk on there as well. (He plays 60% of the snaps for the RBs) So you have 3 guys on the field who all excel at the underneath routes and then Moss. The real big play threat downfield. So Moss gets double teamed with Safety over the top and then you have 3 underneath receivers With Ben Watson, maybe, trying to stretch the opposite side of the field taking coverage away from Moss? I think Watson is best at the medium route myself. Anyway, I would think you need another receiver oppostie Moss to stretch field to clear room for Welker and Edleman, otherwise you have a lot of defenders in close to the two of them meaning they have to catch in traffic and less YAC. A lot of people didn't give Donte Stallworth enough credit. I mean he only caught 35-40 balls that year but he could stretch the field. That is what allowed Moss to catch 23 TDs and Welker to catch 115 balls in '07
    Posted by MaritimePatsFan[/QUOTE]

    Good points.  I liked Stallworth too.  Watson would be a great middle medium route receiver, but he just seems to drop too many balls.  He'll make some catches that are just incredible, and then either disappear from the game or drop some no brainers.  Defenses have gotten lulled into thinking Welker and Edelman are just short pass underneath guys.  Why not try sending them upfield once in a while?  Why not have Edelman throw a pass?  I would love to see some new wrinkles to this offense! 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from DStroh1. Show DStroh1's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : Completely agree Steve. Nothing wrong with a rb by committee as long as you get results. So far the results have been mixed but good for the most part. Dillion is really the only back we have had since Curtis who could handle the load. Antione was a big beast and for the most part not appreciated enough to a lot of fans yet he really needed Faulk to handle a good 30-40% of the carries. No need with our offense to commit 40 million dollars to a high rated college rb. However if another Corey Dillion type veteran becomes available(maybe Larry Johnson in a trade next year) then I wouldnt mind seeing BB make another move.
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    I think you just agreed with my initial point "if another Corey Dillon type veteran becomes available like a Larry Johnson I wouldn't mind seeing BB make another move".  If we can land a guy like that again ala Dillon or Smith, we can go back to having a featured running back that can be given the ball 60-70% of the time.  The other 30-40% can be covered by Faulk or whoever (Maroney, BJGE, or Morris).  Again, running back by mostly two guys and a speciality back like Faulk on third downs.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from stringer1776. Show stringer1776's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE] Even when we had dillon it was a time share. I loved Twinblades but they were still a committee  I suppose there is a small possibility but I dont think we will never have a feature back in N.E not while BB is around  BB will always be a committee guy and that makes sense. RBs always get injured. Rbs are always over paid You can find some great value out there like the patriots do year in year out and allot those millions to other areas in need.  Maybe its been a tough start but the pats were still 6th last year......and the philosophy continues to prove the genius
    Posted by steve1581[/QUOTE]

    BB was the guy with (2) 1000 yard backs. - - Cleveland.
    Nope...   no committment to one guy.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from MaritimePatsFan. Show MaritimePatsFan's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    To Champ, I agree we brought in Joey for a reason. I was excited and skeptical about him. I kind of agree about trying to turn him into a possesion type receiver and that ruined it for him. Welker played last week and Joey was a healthy scratch. If the point was to have him strech the field opposite Moss and Welker underneath why didn't he play last week and do that? I think Brady has some issues with Joey. I keep hearing about not being on the same page and blah blah blah. I know Brady had so bad throws the first few weeks, but how many times over the first three weeks did you see Brady hit Joey in the hands and CLANK. Just drops it. Some of the blame goes to Brady yes but it is a lot harder to throw a ball 25 yards downfield into a 3x4 window than it is to catch a ball that hits you in the hands. Thus, in my opinion Joey's lack of production this far is his problem, not Brady throwing some off throws, not Welker getting hurt and Bill using Joey as a "possesion" type receiver.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from DStroh1. Show DStroh1's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : Which is exactly why we brought in Galloway. A burner who stretches the defense and opens things up in the middle, unfortunetly we have tried to make him a possession wr since WW's injury. I hope we give Galloway another shot on Sunday and I think we will
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    By the way, love the Bruschi picture!!  Probably my favorite Patriot player of all time (along with Troy Brown).
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from MaritimePatsFan. Show MaritimePatsFan's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : I think you just agreed with my initial point "if another Corey Dillon type veteran becomes available like a Larry Johnson I wouldn't mind seeing BB make another move".  If we can land a guy like that again ala Dillon or Smith, we can go back to having a featured running back that can be given the ball 60-70% of the time.  The other 30-40% can be covered by Faulk or whoever (Maroney, BJGE, or Morris).  Again, running back by mostly two guys and a speciality back like Faulk on third downs.
    Posted by DStroh1[/QUOTE]

    I made a comment on another thread titled Maroney Will Step Up, that kinda has something to do with this. Do we really want another vet RB that can go for 2 years maybe? RB is the easiest position to come in from college and make an immediate impact running the ball. Blitz pickup seems to take a little while longer. But if we want a run game shouldn't we try and find a RB in say round 2 or 3 and see what happens. I mean look at Matt Forte and Steve Slaton. Here are two guys that came in as rookies and lit it up on teams that everyone knew were going to run the ball. Defenses put 8 in the box against these teams and these rookies were still able to get it done. It makes more sense to me to get a 23 year old than a 32 year old. You would be able to sign him to a longer contract for probably roughly the same amount of cash as a Larry Johnson and could possibly trade him towards the end of his contract and pick something up for him. Or if he turns out to be good sign him to an extension.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from DStroh1. Show DStroh1's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : I made a comment on another thread titled Maroney Will Step Up, that kinda has something to do with this. Do we really want another vet RB that can go for 2 years maybe? RB is the easiest position to come in from college and make an immediate impact running the ball. Blitz pickup seems to take a little while longer. But if we want a run game shouldn't we try and find a RB in say round 2 or 3 and see what happens. I mean look at Matt Forte and Steve Slaton. Here are two guys that came in as rookies and lit it up on teams that everyone knew were going to run the ball. Defenses put 8 in the box against these teams and these rookies were still able to get it done. It makes more sense to me to get a 23 year old than a 32 year old. You would be able to sign him to a longer contract for probably roughly the same amount of cash as a Larry Johnson and could possibly trade him towards the end of his contract and pick something up for him. Or if he turns out to be good sign him to an extension.
    Posted by MaritimePatsFan[/QUOTE]

    Larry Johnson is only 29 so he might have a little more tread on his tires.  That's assuming we could get him for a reasonable price.  I agree with previous posts that I wouldn't want to break the bank for one guy (which I never implied).  Veterans have shown in the past that they are willing to come to NE for less in search of a ring.  Now if another Slaton or Forte is available in next years draft, hopefully they'll jump on it.  Problem is for every one of these two guys, the NFL is littered with busts who were selected very highly and never panned out.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    Seattlemaslow and ALL:

    I understand not wanting to commit several mil to a back who might get injured, and/or one who might urn out to be a "Biakaba-whatever", BUT so far Seattle has offered the most poignant question on this Thread:  "I think the real question is why the Pats never try to find an RB in rounds 3-6."
     
    Each and every year I follow the NFL Draft for roughly 3/4's of the year, and last year I was intrigued by 2 backs that I believed the Patriots could have swipped with just one of their, what did they have, 11 Picks or so?  The 2 RBs in question were Andre Brown of N.C. State and Rashad Jennings of D-1AA Liberty...  With big backs like Peterson and BOTH the Giant's RBs bruising and blazing their ways to ground games that open up the rest of the team's offense, and with the way bigger backs have flourished in N.E. under BB's tenure like Dillon and A. Smith (with flashes from Sammy Morris as well), I saw ZERO harm in using a mid-rounder (again, one of 11 or 12 Total Picks) On either Brown or Jennings... 

    To this day, I STILL don't know exactly why BB wouldn' take this very calculated "gamble" with our backs who are either very old (in NFL terms-Morris/Faulk), or undrafted very young guy(s) (BJGE), AND our most "feature back", Maroney, getting injured each year, and/or not showing...well, the overall output you'd want and expect from a 1st rder.
     
    BOTH Andre Brown and Rashad Jennings are at least 6 feet tall and roughly around 230 lbs.  BOTH guys had 40 times in the 4.5 something range... Jennings was touted as more of a straight-ahead blazer, who could run to daylight, while Brown was scouted as more of a cut-back, bruising-back that was very good at pass-catching as well...

    I know these guys weren't the highest ranked RBs, and Jennings was a 1AA back.  BUT Do You ALL Want to know where they were Drafted?  Andre Brown was drafted at the very end of the 4th rd by NY, and whom due to the great depth in the Giant's rushing game, hasn't seen much of the field (obviously).  Jennings, was Drafted in the 7th RD by the Jags, and although he too has been used sparingly (but far more so than Brown has), and isn't therefore, a "feature-back" (yet?), DOES have a 4 yard average.

    Look, I too, Obviously Do NOT know more than Belichick, But these 2 guys were scouted as Great "Sleeper/Value" Picks well across Draft-Boards half of the year by NFL analysts, and so idk... I'll just say, I too, Just Can't comprehend taking into account things like Age/Skill-depth/Injuries that plague the Pats at RB over the course of 4-5 years, WHY Belichick wouldn't use 1 mid-7th rd pick! on someone that might help this Offense become more balanced, and help Brady stay off his back by making the Defenses we play against to be more honest vs our potential ground-attack?

    Thoughts ANYONE
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from MaritimePatsFan. Show MaritimePatsFan's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : Larry Johnson is only 29 so he might have a little more tread on his tires.  That's assuming we could get him for a reasonable price.  I agree with previous posts that I wouldn't want to break the bank for one guy (which I never implied).  Veterans have shown in the past that they are willing to come to NE for less in search of a ring.  Now if another Slaton or Forte is available in next years draft, hopefully they'll jump on it.  Problem is for every one of these two guys, the NFL is littered with busts who were selected very highly and never panned out.
    Posted by DStroh1[/QUOTE]

    I agree with the number of busts at RB as well as each position. Also I think BB has taken some heat over the last couple of years for poor drafting. I think almost all his busts seem to come on the offensive side of the ball. Maroney, Chad Jackson, some say Watson, even though I like him as a blocker and his cap friendly contract. Anyway, I think all you can do is draft another back somewhere in round 2-4. Whats the worst that could happen. You waste a pick on a RB instead of a receiver. RB is the easiest skill position I think to come in and make an immediate impact on. I mean Brady puts ball in your stomach, you grab it and run. Blitz pick up is a little trickier I know but still. Anyway I think RB is the next postition after OL that Bill targets to get younger next year and remember we already have Vollmer and Orhnberger waiting in the wings for OL. I could see Maroney, Morris and Taylor all playing elsewhere or not playing at all next year.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    The Patriots don't need a featured back, so going with two good backs with faulk on third down specialty duty, could work well. As someone else said once the snoe season hits, passing gets more difficult-tougher to pass in the snow-more difficult to catch a wet slippery ball. Having a more balanced approach in bad weather not in a dome is paramount.

    Right now, except for Taylor, the Pats don't have a solid back. Morris is fair, Maroney should have been gone or traded if he holds any value long ago. Again as someone mentioned, Maroney looked like he was going to be a featured back coming out of college, but unfortunately it hasn't worked out. Nothing against him, but I say, hopefully trade him for a draft pick if possible and wish him well with his new team.

    Hetchinspete.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from imdealingwithidiots. Show imdealingwithidiots's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    Comity.  Lol.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : I think you just agreed with my initial point "if another Corey Dillon type veteran becomes available like a Larry Johnson I wouldn't mind seeing BB make another move".  If we can land a guy like that again ala Dillon or Smith, we can go back to having a featured running back that can be given the ball 60-70% of the time.  The other 30-40% can be covered by Faulk or whoever (Maroney, BJGE, or Morris).  Again, running back by mostly two guys and a speciality back like Faulk on third downs.
    Posted by DStroh1[/QUOTE]

    I do agree, I think it is important to have depth but just as important to get 1 or 2 guys the bulk of the carries in each game. I think rbs need to get in a rhythm and you cannot do that by getting 6 or 7 carries a game. However I think Clock killin Corey Dillions 2004 year was an anomaly. He broke our franchise record for rushing yards and I think tds in a season. I don't expect that to happen again so the committee is good. I posted this on another thread but the days of 1 back carrying the load are coming to an end. The NFL defensive players are bigger stronger and faster and they dish out more punishment to rbs then in years past. The committee is the future and BB has used a committee for quite some time now.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from mikec645. Show mikec645's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    They are not going to use the Raiders 2011 pick on a running back unless there is a serious cap on rookie salaries.  they're not going to spend big money on a big time RB draft prospect when they don't need to.  They were what, 5th overall in rushing last year with the committee approach?  

    Yea it'd certainly be nicer to have a top notch guy that handles the bulk but it's not what the team needs.  They have some good young WR potential, they should continue to get younger at O-line, and work on the defense.  If they can pick up a young version of sammy morris, it'd be a great fit with law firm being the starter and maroney taking over faulks role.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]To Champ, I agree we brought in Joey for a reason. I was excited and skeptical about him. I kind of agree about trying to turn him into a possesion type receiver and that ruined it for him. Welker played last week and Joey was a healthy scratch. If the point was to have him strech the field opposite Moss and Welker underneath why didn't he play last week and do that? I think Brady has some issues with Joey. I keep hearing about not being on the same page and blah blah blah. I know Brady had so bad throws the first few weeks, but how many times over the first three weeks did you see Brady hit Joey in the hands and CLANK. Just drops it. Some of the blame goes to Brady yes but it is a lot harder to throw a ball 25 yards downfield into a 3x4 window than it is to catch a ball that hits you in the hands. Thus, in my opinion Joey's lack of production this far is his problem, not Brady throwing some off throws, not Welker getting hurt and Bill using Joey as a "possesion" type receiver.
    Posted by MaritimePatsFan[/QUOTE]

    I heard that Galloway was scratched to add another rb to the roster(BJGE) to fit the gameplan against a tough ravens D. Not sure if that is true but I agree the drops and timing issues have been a problem. I just would like to see what we can do with the full offense including galloway running deep routes.
     
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    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back? : By the way, love the Bruschi picture!!  Probably my favorite Patriot player of all time (along with Troy Brown).
    Posted by DStroh1[/QUOTE]


    Thanks DStrohl1 Tedy is the main man and so is Troy!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Paul_K. Show Paul_K's posts

    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    Maroney probably has an injured shoulder and won't dive into the pile much in his lifetime.  I like the ownership of different skills in multiple backs but now we need a new Maroney. We need a guy to run wide with zone blocking, and then the RB makes one cutback into a hole.
     
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    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    I think bellichekup was trying to go to the 2 Back system. Sammy Morris is a stud and 1000 yd a year runner, only problem is he gets way too many boo boo's. So if Baloney would have run like a running back instead of in circles we would have the 2 back system. I think with Fred No Action Jackson til next year being hurt, this kid Ben Green Ellis Jarvis Smith will show just how much stuff hes got. Hes got more guts in his little pinky than Maloney does in his whole family. Now lets play ball.
     
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    Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?

    In Response to Re: Time to commit to a featured running back?:
    [QUOTE]Seattlemaslow and ALL : I understand not wanting to commit several mil to a back who might get injured, and/or one who might urn out to be a " Biakaba -whatever", BUT so far Seattle has offered the most poignant question on this Thread:  " I think the real question is why the Pats never try to find an RB in rounds 3-6 ."   Each and every year I follow the NFL Draft for roughly 3/4's of the year, and last year I was intrigued by 2 backs that I believed the Patriots could have swipped with just one of their, what did they have, 11 Picks or so?  The 2 RBs in question were Andre Brown of N.C. State and Rashad Jennings of D-1AA Liberty ...  With big backs like Peterson and BOTH the Giant's RBs bruising and blazing their ways to ground games that open up the rest of the team's offense, and with the way bigger backs have flourished in N.E. under BB's tenure like Dillon and A. Smith (with flashes from Sammy Morris as well), I saw ZERO harm in using a mid-rounder (again, one of 11 or 12 Total Picks) On either Brown or Jennings...  To this day, I STILL don't know exactly why BB wouldn' take this very calculated "gamble" with our backs who are either very old (in NFL terms- Morris/Faulk ), or undrafted very young guy(s) ( BJGE ), AND our most "feature back", Maroney , getting injured each year, and/or not showing...well, the overall output you'd want and expect from a 1st rder.   BOTH Andre Brown and Rashad Jennings are at least 6 feet tall and roughly around 230 lbs.  BOTH guys had 40 times in the 4.5 something range... Jennings was touted as more of a straight-ahead blazer, who could run to daylight, while Brown was scouted as more of a cut-back, bruising-back that was very good at pass-catching as well... I know these guys weren't the highest ranked RBs, and Jennings was a 1AA back.  BUT Do You ALL  Want to know where they were Drafted?  Andre Brown was drafted at the very end of the 4th rd by NY, and whom due to the great depth in the Giant's rushing game, hasn't seen much of the field (obviously).  Jennings, was Drafted in the 7th RD by the Jags, and although he too has been used sparingly (but far more so than Brown has), and isn't therefore, a "feature-back" (yet?), DOES have a 4 yard average. Look, I too, Obviously Do NOT  know more than Belichick, But these 2 guys were scouted as Great "Sleeper/Value" Picks well across Draft-Boards half of the year by NFL analysts, and so idk... I'll just say, I too, Just Can't comprehend taking into account things like Age/Skill-depth/Injuries that plague the Pats at RB over the course of 4-5 years, WHY Belichick wouldn't use 1 mid-7th rd pick! on someone that might help this Offense become more balanced, and help Brady stay off his back by making the Defenses we play against to be more honest vs our potential ground-attack? Thoughts ANYONE ? 
    Posted by LazarusintheSanatorium[/QUOTE]

    Great post!  Pretty much in-line with what I've been saying.  I agree that they should have committed at least one mid to late round pick on a RB.  Seems like we have been throwing away these picks of late anyway.  I hope we do get a more bruising type of back in the draft next year.  It seems like in todays NFL (and of course with the weather in NE) the bigger backs are thbe way to go.  Don't give up on this BJGE kid though!  He really hasn't had a chance to show off his stuff that much yet (we've had a sample portion).  He could be the Brown or Jennings of this team that you referred to.
     

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