to all the BB GM naysayers

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  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]27 words. And I'm sure there could be more. Cunningham, Price, Brace, Butler, Tate, McKenzie, Wheatley, Crable, O'Connell, Meriweather, Moroney, Jackson, Hobbs, Hill, Johnson, Williams, Davey, Klemm, Redmond, Haynesworth, Ocho, Ellis, Starks, Beisel, Brown, Thomas, Galloway
    Posted by BabeParilli[/QUOTE]

    The BIG problem with this post Babe is that EVERY team has a list of players like this. E-v-e-r-y   s-i-n-g-l-e   t-e-a-m... Moreover, a number of the players you list were worth the shot. And in fact the book is not even closed on all of the above.

    But again, the real point is that every team misses on a lot of players. In fact, while you could make a case that some GMs have done marginally better - the same way people can disagree about who the best QB or WR is, the only GMs who have undoubtedly done better are the ones with hindsight who never had to actually make the calls in real time.

    I do not think he is the very best GM but I think he is a heck of a good one who knows how to build a team that will flourish under him as opposed to a team that will flourish under, say the great Rex Ryan.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from yesyesyall. Show yesyesyall's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    I agree portfolio. The team completely transitioned almost every major position on D in 2010 and went 14-2. That is insane results. Of course TB12 is a major factor as to the teams success but how good would he be if the o-line could not keep him upright? Maybe that is a weak example but look at some of these steals: Aaron Hernandez 4th rd. Hell Gronk in the 2nd!!! Dan Koppen 5th, Julian Edelman 7th, Brandon Spikes may yet prove to have been a first round talent. Every team has misses but they Patriots have been consistently top 1-3 teams in football for a long long time. Ryan Mallet was projected as 1st rd top 10 talent. TB successor already lined up(?)
     
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    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    BB naysayers are not Patriot fans. 
     
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    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]I'm with Babe on this. We've had some nice drafts, yes. But for Defensive Minded Coach, he just hasn't gotten enough playmakers through the Draft on the Defensive side. How many years has he been here? Since Seymour, I can think of one Sammuel. Most of the guys he has gotten that change games has been through Free Agency, not the Draft. He has done great with the cap, and even on the Offensive side. But through the Draft for this long on the Defensive side, not impressed. His forte was Defense, by this time this team should dominant on this side of the ball. You wouldn't have to always rely on Tom Brady, if he has an off day. Im starting to think Parecells was the genius at spotting talent on the Defensive side of the ball, when they were together. Sorry, thats how I feel.
    Posted by bobbysu[/QUOT

    and Mr Wilfork is chopped liver????

    I also think Eugene Wilson and Mayo deserves some mention. there were other very serviceable if not above average D  guys Ty Warren before his injury, Jarvis Green late LSU Pick .As for the recent D  McCourty has to come back to rookie showing, lets see how Ras I pans out , and I think Spikes is a keeper! 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers : The BIG problem with this post Babe is that EVERY team has a list of players like this. E-v-e-r-y   s-i-n-g-l-e   t-e-a-m... Moreover, a number of the players you list were worth the shot. And in fact the book is not even closed on all of the above. But again, the real point is that every team misses on a lot of players. In fact, while you could make a case that some GMs have done marginally better - the same way people can disagree about who the best QB or WR is, the only GMs who have undoubtedly done better are the ones with hindsight who never had to actually make the calls in real time. I do not think he is the very best GM but I think he is a heck of a good one who knows how to build a team that will flourish under him as opposed to a team that will flourish under, say the great Rex Ryan.
    Posted by portfolio1[/QUOTE]

    That's about 20 draft picks in 12 years and all but one are top 3 rounds. So we're talking BUSTS over half of the time on top picks. That's not even to say the other top picks have been necessarily great at all. They just werent flops. And his FA signings have been a very mixed bag as well.

    I doubt like hell e-v-e-r-y  s-i-n-g-l-e  t-e-a-m is doing that badly.

    He's not a "heck of a good GM" at all. He's very average. Being a great coach he gets a lot out of the junk he drafts though. Once they leave they do even less than when he had them if they even manage to stay in the league.

    We won 3 SBs in 4 years with Brady and a core of guys BB inherited. In the 7 years since we have won any. You tell me why.
     
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    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]BB naysayers are not Patriot fans. 
    Posted by sporter81[/QUOTE]

    BB the GM apologists are not Patriots fans.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]I agree portfolio. The team completely transitioned almost every major position on D in 2010 and went 14-2. That is insane results. Of course TB12 is a major factor as to the teams success but how good would he be if the o-line could not keep him upright? Maybe that is a weak example but look at some of these steals: Aaron Hernandez 4th rd. Hell Gronk in the 2nd!!! Dan Koppen 5th, Julian Edelman 7th, Brandon Spikes may yet prove to have been a first round talent. Every team has misses but they Patriots have been consistently top 1-3 teams in football for a long long time. Ryan Mallet was projected as 1st rd top 10 talent. TB successor already lined up(?)
    Posted by yesyesyall[/QUOTE]

    Edelman? EDELMAN?
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from nonola. Show nonola's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In response to a lot of posters, BB is slightly above average at best. The 11-5 year after TBs injury had more to do with the experience that the pats put on the field. His weakness is in drafting and has always been. For every Brady, Wilfork and Gronk there is a....... Oh sorry I've forgotten their names. His GM genius comes from signing a lot of over the hill guys whose teams can no longer afford or think are done. While I do like his corralling draft picks in the future( expect that to happen again this year) I have always wished he would get more help/ advice when real picking time comes. All this said, there is no question he has done a remarkable job but..... It has been/soon to be 8 years since our last super bowl parade. Maybe y'all are satisfied, but with TB as our main man I guess I expected more.
     
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    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    Probably the best way to quantify this thread is rate the GMs ( if we know them all)
    since I started this naturally I start with
    1. BB
    2. Vince Lombardi .. I think he did both..  oops sorry we should be doing active guys... plus he did not have salary cap issues
    3. jerry Reece NYG
    4. Ted Thompson GB
    5. Loomis New Orleans  he has his isues now , much worse than Spygate
    6. Ozzie Newsom Balt
    7. Colbert  Pitt ( I had to google this one!)

    feel free to adjust  and fill in the remaining for the top 10

    I was thinking possibly Rick Smith of Houston , but actually most of their studs were Casserly ( Wilberham  HS coach, MA)additions.

    Also no Jerry Jones nominations.. thank goodness we have Mr Kraft.

    8.
    9.
    10.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]In response to a lot of posters, BB is slightly above average at best. The 11-5 year after TBs injury had more to do with the experience that the pats put on the field. His weakness is in drafting and has always been. For every Brady, Wilfork and Gronk there is a....... Oh sorry I've forgotten their names. His GM genius comes from signing a lot of over the hill guys whose teams can no longer afford or think are done. While I do like his corralling draft picks in the future( expect that to happen again this year) I have always wished he would get more help/ advice when real picking time comes. All this said, there is no question he has done a remarkable job but..... It has been/soon to be 8 years since our last super bowl parade. Maybe y'all are satisfied, but with TB as our main man I guess I expected more.
    Posted by nonola[/QUOTE]

    I couldn't agree with you more. What is truly astonishing in all this is the resources he has thrown at DB and come up with so little. Whoever is scouting DBs for him needs to find a real job.

    His value approach to the draft is a good thing. Problem is if you're going to look for talent in the 2nd round you had better actually find some. In that he has not fared too well.

    Yeah, that 11-5 team had a cake schedule and was pretty talented as well.


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers : That's about 20 draft picks in 12 years and all but one are top 3 rounds. So we're talking BUSTS over half of the time on top picks. That's not even to say the other top picks have been necessarily great at all. They just werent flops. And his FA signings have been a very mixed bag as well. I doubt like hell e-v-e-r-y  s-i-n-g-l-e  t-e-a-m is doing that badly. He's not a "heck of a good GM" at all. He's very average. Being a great coach he gets a lot out of the junk he drafts though. Once they leave they do even less than when he had them if they even manage to stay in the league. We won 3 SBs in 4 years with Brady and a core of guys BB inherited. In the 7 years since we have won any. You tell me why.
    Posted by BabeParilli[/QUOTE]
    There's two guys that come to mind when you talk about guys that left and went on to be nothing (Maroney and Merriweather) - yet when they were here people made excuse, after excuse for them. Some people even went so far to call Merriweather one of the best safeties in the AFC. As for Maroney...next year was always the year he was going to put it all together and quiet the naysayers.  
     
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    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers : There's two guys that come to mind when you talk about guys that left and went on to be nothing (Maroney and Merriweather) - yet when they were here people made excuse, after excuse for them. Some people even went so far to call Merriweather one of the best safeties in the AFC. As for Maroney...next year was always the year he was going to put it all together and quiet the naysayers.  
    Posted by mthurl[/QUOTE]


    Rusty was a Meriweather booster as I recall. But then he also admonished me when I said in the pre-season that McCourty "looked good so far". He schooled me that McCourty was a done deal annual pro-bowler. I don't pronounce anybody a done deal after one year.

    The guy bashed Brady mercilessly then would inflate every guy on the D he could.

    Looking at BB's 10 first rounders he has picked, only Seymour, Wilfork, Mankins and Mayo have really brought the goods. (with acknowledgement that Mankins is somewhat debatable for obvious reasons)
     
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    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    In Response to Re: to all the BB GM naysayers:
    [QUOTE]BB naysayers are not Patriot fans. 
    Posted by sporter81[/QUOTE]

    This is the attitude that makes me crazy on these boards and amongst Patriots fans in general. 

    You cannot be a Patriots fan and question decisions by the team? 

    Is being a fan means blindly agreeing with everything a team does, I am not a fan of any team in any sport. Nor, would I want to be.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from mgraham. Show mgraham's posts

    Re: to all the BB GM naysayers

    well with the Jests latest Sanchez contract extension , we can eliminate Tannebaum for any top 10 GM consideration.

    Likewise Jeff Ireland at Miami. He of the inquiring interview question to Dez Bryant " is your mother a prostitute?". One has to wonder if he asked Jim Harbaugh and Jeff Fisher the same question last year whn they turned down big $ to coach the Dolphins
     

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