To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dafoe. Show dafoe's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    Wether Jackson is great is debatable. He is definitely good. But good WRs are a dime a dozen. 

    And his baggage is an issue. Just because the Jets were dumb enough to give up two 2nd rounders for one head case, doesn't mean a different team will do the same for another. One DUI could be classified as a mistake. He has two, which means he's a dirtbag and a complete idiot.

    Maybe the Chargers should give the Jets a call.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    Wether Jackson is great is debatable. He is definitely good. But good WRs are a dime a dozen. 

    RESPONSE: Really?? I have to strongly disagree with you here...about good WRs being a dime a dozen. Whether or not Jackson is great is debatable. But there's no debating that he's very good. 

    And his baggage is an issue. Just because the Jets were dumb enough to give up two 2nd rounders for one head case, doesn't mean a different team will do the same for another.
     
    RESPONSE: You mean Miami, who gave up two 2nd rounders for Brandon Marshall. The Jets traded for Santonio Holmes...giving up just a 5th rounder to get him. I can understand why the Steelers traded him at a discount. But they why to an AFC contender, like the Jets? Wouldn't a WR needy NFC team like the Redskins, Seattle, or the Bears have parted with at least as much, or more?

    One DUI could be classified as a mistake. He has two, which means he's a dirtbag and a complete idiot. Maybe the Chargers should give the Jets a call.

    RESPONSE: Yes...the two DUIs are a huge concern. But Jackson is a legitimate deep threat. 

    Posted by dafoe
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from dafoe. Show dafoe's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson :
    Posted by TexasPat3


    Yeah, I meant Miami. Jets, Bills and Dolphins- same difference.

    And the two DUIs? Well, there seem to be teams that don't really care about that sort of thing. But they will use it try to hammer the Chargers when talking trade. If you don't mind a guy like that representing your team, then it probably shouldn't matter in trade discussions. But it does.

    And I'm not sure what you disagree with. Good WRs grow on trees. Every offseason there are at least a half a dozen available. It's July and TO is still unemployed. As far as Jackson being great, I'm not saying he's not. I just haven't heard a lot of people say that. And I don't see him enough to know if he is or isn't. Philip Rivers makes me ill. I try to avoid Chargers' game unless they are playing the Pats or Colts. 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from unclealfie. Show unclealfie's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
         Reports of whether the Chargers are looking to trade disgruntled WR, Vincent Jackson, are getting ridiculous. First, they said that they're were willing to trade him: http://www.nctimes.com/sports/football/professional/nfl/chargers/article_5d1909a1-bfb6-551b-8050-2d14d91a34b9.html , and now thay're saying they are  not willing to trade him: http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/7981/Report--Chargers-not-interested-in-dealing-Vincent-Jackson/Default.aspx        Translation...the Chargers would be happy to unload the talented headache that is Jackson, but only at a premium price. In other words, they want more than the Broncos got for Brandon Marshall (two 2nd round draft choices).      The Jackson matter is similar to the Mankins matter...except that, as a top level WR, Jackson would appear to have more leverage...as great WRs are rare, and thereby are harder to replace than OGs. The Chargers appear to be willing to let Jackson sit and stew...but may only be doing this to in hopes of increasing Jackson's trade value. It remains to be seen: http://www.nctimes.com/sports/football/professional/nfl/chargers/article_8f8a8c34-9e53-5db7-9e0b-75956db48ad5.html    
    Posted by TexasPat3



    He's definately a top 5 receiver in the NFL. I'm sure they'll trade him but NFW will they get 2 #1s. Possibly, if he had been a solid citizen but with his attitude he's a long way from that. Maybe a #2 and a #3 or something along those lines, I'm not sure any NFL team would give up a single #1, for him and the sack of problems that he comes with. He's already suspended for three games next year. 

    If I were BB, I wouldn't give more than a second rounder for him, along with a no-nonsense contract. But he does sound like an ideal guy for the jests (who are quickly becoming the oakland raiders, east). Love to see his shenanigans in NYC.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson : He's definately a top 5 receiver in the NFL. I'm sure they'll trade him but NFW will they get 2 #1s. Possibly, if he had been a solid citizen but with his attitude he's a long way from that. Maybe a #2 and a #3 or something along those lines, I'm not sure any NFL team would give up a single #1, for him and the sack of problems that he comes with. He's already suspended for three games next year.  If I were BB, I wouldn't give more than a second rounder for him, along with a no-nonsense contract. But he does sound like an ideal guy for the jests (who are quickly becoming the oakland raiders, east). Love to see his shenanigans in NYC.
    Posted by unclealfie


    I disagree with Alfie and Tex on this one. No way is Jackson a top 5 wr in the league. Never had over 70 catches. I think the other poster had it right. Lots of talented wrs in the league. Jackson is a "problem guy" He has been in the league for 5 years and just started to perform and I would argue with Gates and LT getting a defense's attention he should have been way more productive then 69 catches in a throw first offense.

    With his baggage he is only worth a 2nd round pick to a team desperate for a wr and with substantial cap room considering he is a hold out and wants Marshall money.

    While he has similar off field issues as Marshall he is not in the same category of elite receiver that Brandon Marshall is. (100 catches each year for the last 3)

    Also I would bet that Malcom Floyd is 90% as productive this year as Jackson was last year. A feeling I think I share with the Chargers front office considering they are willing to play without this headache!!!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from jbolted. Show jbolted's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson : I disagree with Alfie and Tex on this one. No way is Jackson a top 5 wr in the league. Never had over 70 catches. I think the other poster had it right. Lots of talented wrs in the league. Jackson is a "problem guy" He has been in the league for 5 years and just started to perform and I would argue with Gates and LT getting a defense's attention he should have been way more productive then 69 catches in a throw first offense. With his baggage he is only worth a 2nd round pick to a team desperate for a wr and with substantial cap room considering he is a hold out and wants Marshall money. While he has similar off field issues as Marshall he is not in the same category of elite receiver that Brandon Marshall is. (100 catches each year for the last 3) Also I would bet that Malcom Floyd is 90% as productive this year as Jackson was last year. A feeling I think I share with the Chargers front office considering they are willing to play without this headache!!!
    Posted by TrueChamp

    Once again, Jackson averaged 17.2 a catch, Marshall 11.2.
    You're putting Marshall over Jackson? Well I've watched both play twice the past 3 years and Jackson moves the chains and Marshall doesn't.
    Jackson has never been selfish like Marshall either.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson : Once again, Jackson averaged 17.2 a catch, Marshall 11.2. You're putting Marshall over Jackson? Well I've watched both play twice the past 3 years and Jackson moves the chains and Marshall doesn't. Jackson has never been selfish like Marshall either.
    Posted by jbolted

    No offense but you are watching with rose colored glasses.  I don't know that I've ever heard anybody use YPC as a comparison for best WR.  The only thing YPC indicates is that Vincent Jackson is only a deep threat.  There is a stat called first downs and he is not in the top 10, meaning he is not a posession reciever that moves the chains.  The only time VJ has ever broke the top 10 WR list in anything was this year when he was 10th in yards.  He doesn't impress in YAC, he is good but the numbers just confirm what everyone can already see he is in the 10-15 best recievers in the NFL not top 5.  He'll be top 5 when when there aren't 5 of guys who get more yards, catches, TD's, and 1st downs than him.  There's really no great excuse either, he is the primary threat on a pass happy offense so his numbers are as good in SD as they will ever be anywhere else.

    I'm not trying to berrate the guy because I respect how good he is, I'm, just saying you can't put him on top based on some obscure  narrow statistic, he just hasn't earned it.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from LazarusintheSanatorium. Show LazarusintheSanatorium's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    Another "Risk vs Reward" Dealing...

    Anquan Boldin goes from Arizona to Baltimore:  Deal was that Arizona would get a 3rd anda 4th Round Pick, while Baltimore got Boldin and a 5th rd selection from Arizona.

    Brandon Marshall goes from Denver to Miami:  Deal was that Denver would get two 2nd rders from Miami, one in 2010 and one in 2011.

    ~BOTH Boldin & Marshall have better stats than Vincent Jackson (In 3 years: Marshall (6'4 230lbs, 26 y.o.)=307 receptions for @ 3,700 yards; In 3 years: Boldin (6'1 220lbs, 29 y,o.)=244 receptions for @ 2900 yards.

    Now, Onto Vincent Jackson...
    6'5 230lbs, 27 y.o.
    168 receptions for @ 2800 yards


    ~Chargers Asking Price:  Same as it was Pre-Draft- One 1st Rder and One 3rd rder

    ALL 3 wideouts are headaches to team chemistry

    Factors to weigh in:
    ~Vincent Jackson will in all probablity NOT be playing during the first 4 games of the season (on any team) due to violating the substance abuse policy upon getting his 2nd DUI arrest.
    ~Vincent Jackson would STILL need to be signed long-term regardless...And NO doubt that Jackson wants Top 5 WR money
    ~ALL weighed against whether or not they'll be a league lockout in 2011, due to Players vs Owners not seeing eye-to-eye @ the CBA.

    NOW, would I STILL want Vincent Jackson on The Patriots?
    ~Well, given his size, frame young age and skills to be a team's #1 WR, AND factoring in that the 35 y.o. Randy Moss, just might be seeing his final season in NE (due to his contract being up at the end of this year weighed vs Moss's age, and still big Contract Dollar Number, he'll still covet)...  
    ~And given that this IS a pass first league now, and considering that NE was already far too obvious in the receiver game, By having Moss & Welker (then NObody...no TE, no #2 wideout worth their weight in dogs-, AND having a near ZERO breaking RB threat to speak of...
    ~NE Football in 2011 could very well mean having: Taylor Price, Brandon Tate, Sam Aiken, and Julian Edelman as our wideout core...(omg, I just might be sick).
    ~AND finally, ALL this weighed with the final Pro- of getting Jackson=A guy who has all the speed, size, and a good degree of the skill, Who perhaps CAN take over the reigns for #1 wideout, Randy Moss's coming inevitable departure... 

    FINAL-
    ~SO, Would I STILL want Vincent Jackson in a NE uni?
    I just "might" bite on a 2nd Rder and NOTHING else higher...
    OR, perhaps a swapping of a NE player and a 3rd rder to San diego , OR one NE 2nd rder and a 4th rder to San Diego for Jackson and a future 3rd rder

    ...problem is though, That there are still many d^mber Coach's Managers and Owners in this League than our own in NE (guys wh continually throw caution to the wind by OVER-bidding on some guy's services because rating, stadium seats, and merchandise are all down for their franchise...guys trying far more desperately than our front office, to keep their job & paycheck). 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson : Once again, Jackson averaged 17.2 a catch, Marshall 11.2. You're putting Marshall over Jackson? Well I've watched both play twice the past 3 years and Jackson moves the chains and Marshall doesn't. Jackson has never been selfish like Marshall either.
    Posted by jbolted


    Don't you think they're different guys?  Marshall is more of a possession guy, not a speed guy.  He can run well enough, but he's not a field stretcher.  Jackson is a blazer.  A bigger version of Donte Stallworth (with apparently the same bad driving habits).  As far as their football skills, they're both outstanding.  Marshall is a man-child in the red zone.  Jackson is like Moss in that he demands a lot of attention.

    As for their personal failings: In my opinion, Jackson is a choir boy compared to Marshall.  Yes DUIs are serious (there but for the grace of God...), but unless I missed it, he doesn't have the domestic abuse and assorted other crap that Marshall does.  That and the hip surgeries.  I'd give a late first round pick for Jackson, assuming his contract demands were not ridiculous (which they may well be).  I'm not sure I would touch Marshall for anything.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

         Here's Chargers GM, AJ Smith's, take on the Jackson and McNeill holdouts: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ms-trippintuesday070610
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson : No offense but you are watching with rose colored glasses.  I don't know that I've ever heard anybody use YPC as a comparison for best WR.  The only thing YPC indicates is that Vincent Jackson is only a deep threat.  There is a stat called first downs and he is not in the top 10, meaning he is not a posession reciever that moves the chains.  The only time VJ has ever broke the top 10 WR list in anything was this year when he was 10th in yards.  He doesn't impress in YAC, he is good but the numbers just confirm what everyone can already see he is in the 10-15 best recievers in the NFL not top 5.  He'll be top 5 when when there aren't 5 of guys who get more yards, catches, TD's, and 1st downs than him.  There's really no great excuse either, he is the primary threat on a pass happy offense so his numbers are as good in SD as they will ever be anywhere else. I'm not trying to berrate the guy because I respect how good he is, I'm, just saying you can't put him on top based on some obscure  narrow statistic, he just hasn't earned it.
    Posted by shenanigan


    Shenanigans covered my response. I am not jackson bashing either I am just saying no way is this guy a top 5 wr, maybe he will be but given his suspension and weigh in the Goodel factor if he gets in trouble again. I don't think he is worth a high draft pick especially considering his high opinion of himself( as in the money he wants) Good receiver just not great yet.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jbolted. Show jbolted's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson:
    In Response to Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson : No offense but you are watching with rose colored glasses.  I don't know that I've ever heard anybody use YPC as a comparison for best WR.  The only thing YPC indicates is that Vincent Jackson is only a deep threat.  There is a stat called first downs and he is not in the top 10, meaning he is not a posession reciever that moves the chains.  The only time VJ has ever broke the top 10 WR list in anything was this year when he was 10th in yards.  He doesn't impress in YAC, he is good but the numbers just confirm what everyone can already see he is in the 10-15 best recievers in the NFL not top 5.  He'll be top 5 when when there aren't 5 of guys who get more yards, catches, TD's, and 1st downs than him.  There's really no great excuse either, he is the primary threat on a pass happy offense so his numbers are as good in SD as they will ever be anywhere else. I'm not trying to berrate the guy because I respect how good he is, I'm, just saying you can't put him on top based on some obscure  narrow statistic, he just hasn't earned it.
    Posted by shenanigan

    Spoken like a true Welker fan. Any fan with a 100 catch 1000 yard WR on their team feels the same way.  
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsfan1994. Show patsfan1994's posts

    Re: To Trade, Or Not To Trade, Vincent Jackson

    i could go for this. we have 2 first round picks, and i THINK but not sure that we have 3 second round picks. i wouldnt mind giving up two seconds and a low round pick. Face it moss isn't getting any younger and probably gone off this and i'm not sold on holt, edelman, and our rookie price and tate who got hurt last year. Gives tom brady a good young weapon for years to come.
     
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