Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    A lot of us have been talking about the 2011 draft early this year because of the sheer number of elite picks.  But, look at the job we do with undrafted players.  Obviously not all of these players were originally signed by us but about half were.  You have to give BB and the front office their due for giving these guys a shot.  Several of these guys were only with their original team a few months before getting cut.  Over 25% of our active 45 man game roster are undrafted players.  You might say our work finding undrafted gems is as important as the draft itself.  Here's the list of the most noteworthy undrafted players.

    Wes Welker (SD)
    Dan Connolly (JAC)
    Ben Jarvis Green-Ellis (Pats)
    Danny Woodhead (NYJ)
    Gary Guyton (Pats)
    Kyle Arrington (PHI)
    Ryan Wendell (Pats)
    Mike Wright (Pats)
    Shayne Graham (NO)
    Dane Fletcher (Pats)
    Tracy White (SEA)
    Brian Hoyer (Pats)
    Mark LeVoir (CHI)

    Guys on IR
    Leigh Bodden (CLE)
    Stephen Neal (Pats)

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    It's a plus no doubt but I would rather hit on my draft than on UFA.  You need some luck to hit on those due to the fact they have to over come the trait that didn't get them drafted to begin with.  To hit on guys in the draft with the measurables would seem to be the way to go.  Given that there are so many undrafted on the roster means that the Pats haven't done well drafting.

    I was stunned when Miami gave up Welker. 
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    Great list. I think you can add Sergio Brown also, or was he drafted? Brandon McGowan as well I believe. Anyway, I think at some level Belichick likes those underdog guys. They have a chip on their shoulders and they play hard. Their egos are not a factor. They just do what they're told.

    I think sometimes we get way too caught up in measurables. It's OK to use that to an extent, but it should be about production and attitude foremost. Then use 40 times and whatnot as a differentiating factor.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    Gary,

    As you know, Miami made the stupid mistake of thinking they could sneak Welker through on a 2nd round RFA tender.  The Pats signed him to an offer sheet with a poison pill.  This forced Miami to trade him to us for a 2nd and 7th vs. slugging it out.  We better not make that same mistake with BJGE.

    As for missing on draft picks, there have been some, sure.  We had a couple of rough years '06 and '07; with only 3 players still on the team from those drafts.  Once Pioli left, things actually got better.  Here are a few more tidbits for you.

    -  37 of the 53 were originally drafted by or signed by the Patriots.
    -  7 first round picks and 10 second round picks are on the team.
    -  16 players from rounds 3-6 on the team.
    -  5 players from the 7th round on the team
    -  15 were undrafted, 8 by the Pats, 7 by others.
    -  11 of our 22 starters are either 1st or 2nd round picks (based on today's depth chart)


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from oklahomapatriot. Show oklahomapatriot's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    Great info, hats off to BB
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from RahZid. Show RahZid's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]Given that there are so many undrafted on the roster means that the Pats haven't done well drafting.
    Posted by garytx[/QUOTE]

    I disagree, to an extent.  about half of the players listed were brought in from outside the organization with the expectation that they could perform (Welker, Graham.  Bodden and Neal are still on the team because they have performed well and were signed to lucrative deals (nothing earth shattering, but a fair deal for an NFL starter).  

    Certainly BJGE, Woodhead, Fletcher, White (to a lesser extent), etc. were more or less flyers and speak more to the lack of quality drafting, but do you think all of them are not quality NFL players?  There are certainly some who haven't been impressive (White and Wendell) and others who haven't had much of a chance (LeVoir, Hoyer), but I think overall the volume of undrafted players doesn't speak to poor drafts, it speaks to the crapshoot that is the NFL draft.  It'd be 1 thing if these were all players originally signed by NE as UDFA's, but it's about 50-50.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    I don't think having 15 UDFAs on our roster speaks as much to having poor drafts, although we've certainly had a few, as it does to necessity.  With the draft cut back to 7 rounds in 1994 and with players becoming free agents after 4-6 years, there are far fewer players that can be drafted.  If there were only 7 rounds in 1993, we might never have landed Troy Brown who was selected in the 8th round that year.

    Think about it.  If you draft 7 players each year and they all make the team each year, you'd end up with 28 new players after 4 years and/or 42 players after 6 years.  With the cap, you can't afford to keep all of your stars.  So, you have to make up your roster with other team's throw aways or with undrafted players. 

    The draft is a bit of a crap shoot.  Heck on our team alone we have 20 players taken in the 7th round or undrafted compared to 16 taken in the 4 rounds from round 3, 4, 5, and 6 combined.  I suspect this is why teams are allowed to start their rosters with 80 players (or whatever the # is) to be able to bring in quality players that may have gone undrafted.  Cutting the draft to 7 rounds probably hurts bad teams because an undrafted player is free to sign with any team and I would think they would want to play on a good team.

    Not all college players have reached their full potential by their senior year.  They may have had bad coaching, or a great player ahead of them.  It is good that these kids get a chance.  There have been some great undrafted players through the years.  Besides Welker, BJGE and Woodhead players like Kurt Warner, Preist Holmes, Rod Smith, James Harrison, Wayne Chrebet, Jake Delhomme, Willie Parker, Antonio Gates, Joshua Cribbs, Adam Vinatieri, Jason Peters and Tony Romo were all undrafted.  The fact that we have so many could speak to the strength of our scouting, including scouting of other NFL teams, and the desirability of our organization that these players want to come here.


    Great discussion guys, thanks for your contributions.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]It's a plus no doubt but I would rather hit on my draft than on UFA.  You need some luck to hit on those due to the fact they have to over come the trait that didn't get them drafted to begin with.  To hit on guys in the draft with the measurables would seem to be the way to go.  Given that there are so many undrafted on the roster means that the Pats haven't done well drafting. I was stunned when Miami gave up Welker. 
    Posted by garytx[/QUOTE]When he became a FA the Patriots offered him a poison pill contract and he was going to sign it,but in an effort to keep the move civil the Patriots made it a trade instead and gave the Phins some draft choices,but push comes to shove they had no choice in the matter as the Patriots poison pill was aimed at where the dolphins played their home games,it was something to the effect that if Wes played more than two games in Joe robbie then the patriots or whoever signed him would have to pay some ungodly amount to Wes,checkmate! I didn't read Faucetmans post but it says essentially the same thing as I said. If you look over the entire roster as it is presently constructed IR players not included I think the Patriots have 24 members of the roster who were either UDFA's or 6th/7th round draft choices or in other words over 50% of the active roster on game day!
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from KyleCleric2. Show KyleCleric2's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    Of those players, only Wes Welker, Shayne Graham, Tracy White, and Leigh Bodden were good players before they arrived here. The rest were developed by the Pats. That's impressive. It's remarkable the patience the Pats had with Green-Ellis but he has become a huge part of this team.

    The guy I really would like to see improve is Dane Fletcher. He has the talent and versatility to be a remarkable player in this 3-4.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    About 440 rookies make either a 53-man roster or practice squad each year. About 230 of those are drafted guys and about 210 are undrafted. The drafted players may have longer careers and therefore make up a bigger portion of the NFL over time, but it's not terribly unusual for a squad to include a fairly high number of undrafted guys.  During training camp, teams bring in almost twice as many undrafted players (roughly 480) as drafted (typically 256), so undrafted free agents play a pretty significant role in building teams--and I don't think having 16 of them on our squad reflects poorly on our drafts. To build a great team, you have to get talent from all sources: the draft, the free agent market (rookie or experienced), and trades.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    This is one of the things I love about the Patriot Way, mostly because I know it makes the trolls even more jealous.

    I'd love to see a list of other teams' rosters so we could compare, but that is an impressive list.

    BB channels everyone's skill sets and finds a spot for them on the field.  It's truly an incredible thing to do in a day and age of million dollar salaries and huge egos.

    All this does is fuel the one, big oiled machine concept and keeps the train rolling.




     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Faucetman. Show Faucetman's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]Great list. I think you can add Sergio Brown also, or was he drafted? Brandon McGowan as well I believe. Anyway, I think at some level Belichick likes those underdog guys. They have a chip on their shoulders and they play hard. Their egos are not a factor. They just do what they're told. I think sometimes we get way too caught up in measurables. It's OK to use that to an extent, but it should be about production and attitude foremost. Then use 40 times and whatnot as a differentiating factor.
    Posted by Muzwell[/QUOTE]
    I was only listing the most noteworthy of players. 
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster : I was only listing the most noteworthy of players. 
    Posted by Faucetman[/QUOTE] Your post was good. The amazing part of what BB has done is not just the UDFA's,it's the guys who are drawing unemployment checks that he brings in from parts unknown they get to practice one week and they are contributing,wow! Moore and Cohan are classic examples of this type of player. Doesn't it just make you wonder out loud where he keeps these players names? His rolodex must be chocked full of the unemployed players in case of emergency call this number type of guy. By the way Faucetman most of your posts are spot on,so keep up the quality posts.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]This is one of the things I love about the Patriot Way, mostly because I know it makes the trolls even more jealous. I'd love to see a list of other teams' rosters so we could compare, but that is an impressive list. BB channels everyone's skill sets and finds a spot for them on the field.  It's truly an incredible thing to do in a day and age of million dollar salaries and huge egos. All this does is fuel the one, big oiled machine concept and keeps the train rolling.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]
    Colts have 18 players on their active roster that are undrafted including:

    Gary Brackett
    Kyle Devan
    Eric Foster
    Aaron Francisco
    Javarris James
    Jacob Lacey
    Jeff Linkenbach
    Dan Muir
    Dominic Rhodes
    Gijon Robinson
    Jeff Saturday
    Taj Smith
    Adam Viniateri
    Justin Snow
    Blair White

    They have another 8 on IR including:
    Melvin Bullitt
    Ramon Humber
    Jamie Silva

    Colts have 29 players on their active roster that they drafted. 
    Colts have another 7 players on IR that they drafted.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rocky. Show Rocky's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster : Colts have 18 players on their active roster that are undrafted including: Gary Brackett Kyle Devan Eric Foster Aaron Francisco Javarris James Jacob Lacey Jeff Linkenbach Dan Muir Dominic Rhodes Gijon Robinson Jeff Saturday Taj Smith Adam Viniateri Justin Snow Blair White They have another 8 on IR including: Melvin Bullitt Ramon Humber Jamie Silva Colts have 29 players on their active roster that they drafted.  Colts have another 7 players on IR that they drafted.
    Posted by UD6[/QUOTE]

    UD6 just puts a target on himself...........
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    Why is that Rock?  I am neither making a judgement or giving an opinion.  Rusty wanted a list of other teams undrafted free agents.  I provided it. 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rocky. Show Rocky's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    In Response to Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster:
    [QUOTE]Why is that Rock?  I am neither making a judgement or giving an opinion.  Rusty wanted a list of other teams undrafted free agents.  I provided it. 
    Posted by UD6[/QUOTE]

    I made a mistake by making an assumption....my apologies
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Undrafted Gems on Pats Roster

    You can go down most of the rosters in the NFL and do the same thing.

    about a few weeks ago i was bored and check some teams, besides the Pats, like the colts, steelers, ravens, etc.

    About 40% of all the rosters were UDFA's.

    That my friends is exactly why they call the draft a cr@p-shoot.
     
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