What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    How come no one says the other team?
    Look the other teams the past two games have executed their game plans.
    Some times it's just about execution.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    In Response to Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?:
    I cannot believe the both Belichick (sp) and Brady spoke at the podium and had the audacity to make excuses for their team.  There are problems with the coaches, expecially witht he Defensive Coach, who should be fired.  To me the Belichick (sp) and Brady have not been truthful to we the fans in re to their problems (I say most likely the problems are personal).  I wish Belichick(sp) would wear his old gray sweat shirt and not style his hair.  The biggest problem has to be with the coaches the the whole team.  They do not put their 100 percent plut into the game.  Look how Brady has over thrown the ball; I believe he is more interested in being a model rather than playing football.  Plus I am wondering if he is getting enough nourishment or is he eating like a BIRD! My feeling is that they should not have shown their faces at the podium; a complete insult to their loyal patrons.  I could say more but....
    Posted by codfishcat


    LOL!  another idiot that thinks there is a problem with the Defense and Pees.....You do realize that Pees has led the Pats to a top 10 defense just about every year he has been the DC?

    What we are missing on this team is veteran leadership on the field to get these guys straightened out on the field and help lead the team.....we are missing the "GUY" who makes the big stop when we need it.....
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    In Response to Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?:
    I blame the coaches - O'Brien ____. They never run screens anymore to the HB. They run one yesterday, rip off 15 yds and then never do it again. The O-line stinks. Matt Light is horrible. Nick Kaczur is horrible. Neither can hold an edge. Watch the last play - both failed and Brady was going down. That's why the TE's can never run pass routes, like all the other teams do. We're either 4W and looking for the quick pass or mismatch deep or we're in max protect. YOu can't blame anyone but the coaching and scouting. Games are won in the trenches. Vollmer & Mankins are great. Everyone else... That's why there is no running game. These guys can't run block to save their lives becuase they can't push anyone.  THe D-line is shallow. None of them can penetrate except for big Vince. Now the the big sey is gone, offenses concentrate on Wilfork and Ty Warren and then there is no rush.  Oh, by the way, Dan Pees____too.  
    Posted by fiveangels


    1) do you know who calls the Offensive plays?  Last I checked we didn't have an OC and Belichick was calling the plays....I guess you want Belichick fired?

    2) Pees has led the Defense to top 10 in almost every year he has been a DC.....that would be stupid to get rid of him.....
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from codfishcat. Show codfishcat's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    One more post.  Yes, the Patriots got great talent, but if they do not believe in thereselves then what good is talent.

    I can remember the days when during the first half the Patriots scouted the opponents then won BIG during the second half.  THIS IS TRULY WHAT IS MISSING.  Lately, they score points during first half and then go to sleep during the second half. 

    IT MAKES ONE WONDER WHO DO THE PATRIOTS WANT TO WIN.  Why do they want to lose?

    NOUGH said.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    In Response to Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?:
    Ibn Response to Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching? : Must GO: pees, obrien, special teams coach, kaczur, light, jarvis green. and i mean today, i want these ppl cut from the team. Must play: SHAWN SPRINGS.  he was not nearly as bad as wilhite on the outside. he actually made some nice plays early in the year. Maroney should get the ball 20+ times a game. he is a legit running back and he is running hard.  if we had Weis, Maroney would be looking at being a star. instead, we have moron o brien who runs the ball 7 times a game. Aiken is a solid #3 WR. Edelman is a good #4. no problems there. THROW THE DAMN BALL TO WATSON AND BAKER ONCE IN A WHILE! on defense: ZONE BLITZ. please.  why do we have fast guys out there if we dont let them use their reaction ability to make plays? this team better change a lot this week.
    Posted by btownteamsrking



    Wow, they grow them really dumb in your town.....might as well get rid of Belichick while you are at it....he is the Offensive play caller.....not O'Brien....
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsfaninsatx. Show patsfaninsatx's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    On the offense I blame the Coaching.  They are not playing the same ball as they used to.  They may score early, but once the second half comes around the other team is the one that makes the adjustments and NE doesnt. 

    On defense, I would say its the talent.  Alot of these guys are young, but the pass rush is absolutely horrible.  Obviously this secondary is young and new to the system, but without any pressure on the QB they dont even have a chance.

    What happened to Mayo?  That guy fell off the map.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    In Response to Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?:
    These are questions to which only Belichick has answers.
    Posted by NickC1188


    Good points Nick. Ever since Crennel and Weiss left, it seems like Belichick has been trying to do too much himself. He also seems reluctant to bring in top coaching talent from outside and give them big roles. I wonder about Dom Capers for instance--why wasn't he turned into a true defensive coordinator when he was here? And why didn't he last? Was BB too controlling? Capers is doing a great job as DC in Green Bay this year. I always thought it was curious that he wasn't given the DC role here and that he didn't last more than a season.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsfaninsatx. Show patsfaninsatx's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    IMO, BB has too much pride to bring in any OC or DC that has not been in his system. 

    I believe he has too much pride to bring back Weis and Crennel.

    BTW,  I started reading No Excuses (Charlie Weis) pretty good book so far.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from amalfi. Show amalfi's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    Playing with five new players on defense is a big part of the problem. They miss Bruschi, Harrison, Vrabel, Seymour, etc. These guys were not only great players but were like having extra coaches on the field. I think we were spoiled watching the Patriot's of old, I think that this is a year the Patriots will get into the playoffs and possibly win a game at home, but not on the road.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from deluxbury. Show deluxbury's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    1.  How about a little playaction passing?
    2.  A little less aggressiveness on offense
    3.  A little more aggressiveness on defense

    * What I meant by less aggressiveness on offense I mean kick a farking field goal instead of going for it on 4-1!  If we punt against the colts - maybe we come home with a win that night..  If we kick a field goal yesterday, we defenitely come home with a win.  That's two additional conference wins! 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from emilycuba33. Show emilycuba33's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    In Response to Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?:
    Personally, I think the main problem is a lack of talent, most notably: Lack of an acceptable third wide receiver Unproductive tight ends Poor offensive tackles, especially Kaczur Mediocre DEs Very unproductive OLBs Inexperienced ILBs An unreliable and undisciplined safety (Merriweather) Atrocious corners (other than Bodden, who is an okay second corner) The offensive play calling is poor (too little commitment to the run, too many deep throws to a double-covered Moss, too little involvement of the TEs), but that may be a function of the talent. 
    Posted by prolate0spheroid

    We have almost the very same offense this year as we had in 2007 when all of the records were set.  Still have Brady, Moss, Welker, Faulk and Maroney, still have the very same offensive line, except for the addition of Vollmer who has added to the talent, still have Ben Watson.   Was Jabar Gaffney the secret to our record setting year???  I don't think so.  It appears they aren't mentally ready for games this year and never put a game away.  They haven't played 60 minutes in one game this year.  Brady (who I think is awesome and one of the best) is now making dumb decisions and just firing the ball anywhere hoping someone comes up with it.  He never used to do that!!  Randy Moss is an unbelievable athlete and I love having him, however, he does not go after balls this year like he did in 2007.  Anything that was thrown to him, he fought for.  Not this year!!!!

    How often have they even thrown towards a TE?  Baker made a catch yesterday and that is his first I think since about game 3.  Watson sometimes drops passes, but even he hasn't had the opportunity to drop many this year, they just don't throw to the TE's.

    Everyone trashed the db's last year, anyone would get beat on a regular basis if the front seven never gets pressure on a qb.  Did they address this issue?  Not.  They bring in D. Burgess and let Seymour go.  Don't think that did the trick!!!!  They have got to get a consistent pass rush or they are going to be beat on a regular basis by mediocre teams like Miami.  Chad Henne had pressure in the first quarter, Miami made adjustments and we didn't.  That comes down to the coaching.

    As for the play calling - have you ever seen Brady do a qb sneak and not pick up 3 or 4 yards?  He always gets a good push and picks up that first down.  What do they do yesterday when they only needed 6 inches - hand it off to Morris.  Is Brady hurt and they don't want him doing a qb sneak????  Totally stupid call!!!

    I don't think there is any part of this team I love that doesn't need some fixing!!!
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from chrisakawoody. Show chrisakawoody's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    A lot of good comments about predictable play calling, being too conservative, lack of pass rush from OLBs, waste of tight ends, poor O line play, BB handling too many reins at once.  I agree with all of those. 

    But there are some tiny basic problems with huge consequences, like horrible tackling.  If they fix that one issue alone, this team is a force and maybe loses one game, maybe two.  They just can't seem to tackle on the first contact.  Is that coaching or talent?  I am not sure, but it has been a problem for the past three seasons and the talent has turned over at virtually all LB and DB roster spots over that time.

    You can see a similar problem in Chicago with pass receiving.  No matter the QB or the receiver, they have a perrenial problem with poorly run routes and dropped passes.  When receivers leave the team, they do better (again), like Moose Mohammad.   That is bad receiver's coaching.

    Besides that, BB seems to have lost his patience to win.  They lost yesterday because he decided to gamble again for seven when they had an easy three.  They were not playing some offensive dynamo, like Indy.  Three would have been fine and it turns out that three would have won the game.  I think that might be three losses that can be blamed on high-risk gambles - in this case a high-risk/low-reward gamble. Maybe he is doing it on purpose to help this team find an identity. If so, it has backfired.  This team just doesn't seem to follow him like they once did.  It could be becasue of the purge this summer.  It could be from that 4th and 2 in Indy. Or it could be that they are seeing his falablity and are therefore surrendering to their own falablity.

    Lastly, Brady is good, but underachieving, considering the tools he has with which to work, the trajectroy of his passes, the repetitve red zone INTs.  He seems never to have regained that clutchedness (new word?) he once possessed.  Where is the happy, cocky swagger in the face of adversity?  He now just looks angry and frustrated.  Has he become jaded, with all the media scrutiny, the big losses due to slanted officiating (Denver in '05, Indy in '06, Indy in '09), the repeated loss of trusted receivers over money he thought he left on the table to keep them? I can only guess, but he is not the same.  He did more with less for years, and now that he has more he is doing less.

    Ultimately, I still like the future of this team.  This is a rebuilding team.  It happens.  I did not expect them to win the SB and I have only 50/50 expected them to make the play-offs since the pre-season, and now they - (gasp) - probably won't make the play-offs. 

    I would be intrigued if Weiss comes back, maybe Crennel.  And at first I was agaisnt the idea for both. The biggest asset they each carry is that they could get players to play for them when they were coordinators.  Crennel's players tackled, pass rushed, would lay their bodies down for him.  Weiss has the complete love, trust and respect of Brady, Faulk, Light and a host of other guys. They both need to be coorindators again, and it is unlikely Crennel will be young enough to be offered a HC job ever again, so we could keep him for a while.  Those hires won't solve all problems, but they may be big steps in the right direction, making the remaining issues to tackle that much more surmountable.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ohyes. Show ohyes's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    Not that he is the total problem, But Tom stopped throwing to the open guy in 07. I'm not so sure I'd run my best down after down just to be overlooked. These problems started way before this year they were just well masked. We could not come up with a TD in the red zone last yr. Everyone just blamed Cassel. BB misshandled timeouts at indy last yr too and the challange of 12 men on the field would not have helped anything.  The lack of run commitment in the SB. Anytime you abandon the run your just telling the rushers to pin there ears back. eg. Vrabal's sack total 07. And for god sake pay Vince and Bodden. Ditto for Gostkowski and then use him. 4th and 13 in a low scoring SB. I don't know about BB or you guy's here but when we send in the Gost. I just assume it's 3 going up. When BB finds out that 07 is gone and were not a elite offense we might get over this. We should be with this personal a move the chains,use the TE's and backs kick the FG, keep the D on the bench team. I'm also not so sure that someone coming up through the system can take over and control the image's on this team. Who's big enough to be the one to drill Tom and Randy two HOF's?
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from gfkr2. Show gfkr2's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    A number of poor player personnel decisions which border on reckless:  Derrick Burgess; Shawn Springs; Adalius Thomas; Joey Galloway; David Thomas; Richard Seymour; Mike Vrabel...  the list goes on and on. 

    Belichick is to blame for the current mess!
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsfansyr. Show patsfansyr's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?


    The play calling is brutal.. O'Brien has no creativity..

    3rd and 6 - run a draw - punt
    3rd and 6 - throw a deep seam to Welker - punt

    4th and 1 - run a full back dive with a TB - turn over on downs

    But the execution is worse.. Brady has killed them the last 2 weeks. That INT to Sharper was a momentum swing that they never got back. That INT yesterday in the end zone was a killer.

    All in all the bottom line is this. Past teams did not beat themselves and made plays when they were there to be made. This team makes dumb mistakes (Woods got bailed out on that running into the kicker call - what a bone head!), and leave a lot plays and points on the field.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SportsRush. Show SportsRush's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    There is no one "problem" per se.

    Teams age, coaches age, systems age.

    NE won their first SB in Feb '02, their last SB in Feb '05.

    It is now almost 2010. The dynasty is over.

    They need to rebuild on both sides of the ball.
     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from proftom. Show proftom's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    Good teams play football games week to week. Build on what they did or didn't a do and learned from each week of the season.  Great football teams, like the Patriots were all of this decade win lots of football games strategically and with superior skilled player.  This years team lacks good strategic thinking and superior skilled players. They are a good football team this year, just not a great one. 
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasonh86. Show jasonh86's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    I think the worst thing that happened to this team in the offseason wasn't the loss of any player or a trade that was made to get another player that didn't pan out.  I think it was the loss of Josh McDaniels - he could dial up any set of plays, whether it was Cassel or Brady, and get yards.  He kept the offense rolling in the 2nd half and always kept it on track. 

    Now we've got a guy who hasn't called plays before and expect him to pick up where McDaniels left off.  Maybe Bill will actually allow Weiss to come back - I think it would be the single biggest off-season pickup we could get for the offense.  A balanced, effective playcaller who can keep the offense on track through 4 quarters would do this team a world of good.  It would allow them to get a lead and keep adding to it or actually make a comeback - while keeping the defense off the field and allowing them to play with a bigger lead when they do get back on the field. 

    As for Weiss, he actually would rip into the entire offense on the sidelines when they made stupid mistakes and actually would point at Brady and say (for one example, in a playoff game against Indy) "That means you too!!" to him.  It always seemed to get the guys back on track. 

    So, my vote goes for playcalling.  If the Pats can muster a big lead and keep adding to it, they can allow the guys on defense to play more aggresively.

    If i'm not mistaken, I think the Pats actually were a higher scoring offense last year.  Somebody might need to check that, but I remember they were still very explosive even with Cassel at the wheel.  The key is McDaniels (or a good/competent offensive playcaller).
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Airmanflight23. Show Airmanflight23's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    biggest problem I see is a lack of a pass rush,  Pats are tired with the Rams for  28th in sacks.  Jarvis Green 0 sacks, Ty Warren 1.0, A Thomas 3.0 Burgess 2.0.  Thats not going to get it done.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Buddo. Show Buddo's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?


      All of the above. Talent is there to be developed and in some cases it takes more than one season. Play calling is out of control. I backed the call vs the  Colts, but not in this Game. In the first QTR you take the points. In the fourth QTR you take the sack's and take the points. That is 9 points and we win.
       I am constantly seeing players not finishing their job. A prime example is Moss not attempting to break up the interception in the end zone in the fourth quarter. Maybe Brady should not have thrown the pass, but what happened to " I've got your back?".                                                                             
       The chemistry is probably not the same.  It appears that the Players are not together. I think it is fine to see former friends or congratulate opposing players, but there is nothing funny about losing.
        As for the Coaching, The Patriots have lost more than their shate of Quality Offensive and Defrnsive Coordinators. It is great to be able to bring Assistant Coaches up through the ranks to be Coordinators, but they need time. COOrdinators also need time before they are ready to be sucessful Head Coaches.

     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from BTownExpress. Show BTownExpress's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    Mazz offered some great insights in his recent article.  Here are some bits from his offering:

    1) Simply put, the Patriots have been able to shut down one-dimensional offenses, though they have been able to do it only at home or on neutral territory.

    2) Of the Patriots’ seven victories this season, five have come against teams that rank among the 10 worst teams in the league in passing offense, at least based on quarterback rating, still the best way to measure any sort of passer efficiency.

    3) They used to be a team that could overcome situations and play through things.

    4) Good teams win on the road, especially in the NFL, and there is no better indicator of team’s potential in any sport than an ability to succeed away from home.  Dating back to the middle of last season, the Pats’ last four wins away from Foxborough have come against the Bucs, Bills, Raiders and Seahawks.

    5) In its five true road games this season, the overrated Patriots offense has averaged 19.6 points per game. (The number is 32.5 at home.)

    6) The defense, too, has been nearly twice as effective at home (14.3 ppg) as on the road (26.2 ppg).

    7) As for the Patriots’ victories against the Titans, Bills, Jets and Bucs, those teams currently rank a respective 23rd, 25th, 27th and 28th in passer rating.

    http://www.boston.com/sports/columnists/massarotti/2009/12/a_comprehesive_breakdown_of_th.html?comments=all
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from futbal. Show futbal's posts

    Re: What's the problem? Talent, play calling, or coaching?

    from earlier today on WEEI: “You’re not going replace all those years of experience and winning games with guys that haven’t been in those games," Brady said. "You miss those things and in other ways, with those players that come to the team, they add a different type of quality or asset to the team. There’s only one Rodney Harrison, those guys just aren’t floating around everywhere. It’s not like there’s 32 of those in the league. There’s just one guy and that’s why he was such a talented great player. Ty Law and Willie McGinest and Ted Johnson and Roman Phifer and obviously Richard (Seymour), Vrabel, these guys were incredible players, it’s not like you win Super Bowls without great players, great coaching. And we have great coaching and we have some players now that are really doing . . . a guy like Aiken who’s really starting to make some great plays for us on offense, for a guy that wasn’t even part of the receiver mix early in the year, a guy who wasn’t even playing much. And we started throwing him the ball and good things were happening so those are kind of guys that really step up and become good players for us and we need more of those guys.”

     
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