When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatory pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dmcpatsfan. Show dmcpatsfan's posts

    When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatory pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    Ok now I know many of you are going to flip out about this but I'm just voicing my opinion on the matter...  Is Mankins good...without a doubt.....is Mankins GREAT...I think not....He is NOT the be-all-end-all when it comes to the Patriots offensive line....he plays well durring the regular season but when the playoffs come around he slips into a coma & disappears....the tag hit of 10.5 mill & or the contract that he wants to play guard is way too high for what he brings to the line...last year when Mankins was sitting out the Pats O-line played fine & I noticed very little difference after he stepped in, again though he did disappear in the playoffs....what kind of message does it send to the rest of the players if we pay him way more than what he's worth to play GUARD!!! I say let him walk for the compensatory pick we'll get next year(as i said probably a 3rd) & let Scar do his thing with the guys we got & next year go after O-lineman early & often in the draft to team with Vollmer,Cannon, & Solder as well as whomever steps up this year....Smith, our new TE may even be able to be converted to O-line this year to help out due to his size & athletasism....or pick up a FA....I just see Mankins looking for a pay day & willing to go anywhere just as long as he gets one...let him go..Pats will be just fine without him....I've just never been overly impressed with his abilities, he's adequate but not a John H., Move on Patriots, that's what Mankins wants to do so let him....
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rocky. Show Rocky's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    No for only a 3rd.....I believe he was a restricted FA with the 1st and 3rd round tender.....You have to at least get a 1st round pick....He is worth more than a 3rd
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from dmcpatsfan. Show dmcpatsfan's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    Mankins has the Franchise tag...2-1sts is the copensation....never happen!!!
    I just say let him go....move on......take the compensatory pick next year & play who we've got or pick up a FA out there at 1/4 the cost & that is hungry to play for a winning franchise & perhaps a ring....
    Take what we can get & not overpay for Mankins, he's not worth the tag or the contract he wants...not even close actually....time to turn the page.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    I'm not going to rip you apart DMC but there are a couple of things I'd like to point out as to why it might be a good idea to keep him for at least this season:

    #1 Salary Cap concerns - I've read in multiple articles (referencing Miguel's of course) that even with Mankins large cap hit for the franchise tag that the Pats are sitting around 98 mil. So even if the cap ends up being on the low end of 115 mil his cap hit is minimal and doesn't prevent them from getting a couple of players at WR and OLB, signing the rook's, or adding vet depth.

    #2 Position Depth - Cannon is a rookie who will need time to recover from chemo. Connolly is currently you starting RG. Right now there is zero depth to take the hit from losing Mankins for the season. Agreed a guard shouldn't be paid in the upper echelon of salaries but at the same time if you don't have the proper depth to replace him to begin with sometimes you have to pay more then you should

    #3 Compensation - A 3rd Comp pick is pretty much a early 4th you can't trade. Even if they weren't planning on keeping Mankins, you don't feel they could get even a 3rd for him? A 3rd that is tradable is far superior to a 3rd Comp any day.

    #4 Converting TE's to lineman - Yes you can convert a TE to a T but shifting him all the way into a G spot is suicide for Brady. You most likely will have a rookie starting LT at some point this year, you need to have a vet (preferable one who knows the system) on the inside to minimize the mistakes during the learning curve phase.

    Even if it's just for 1 year that 1 year could mean everything for Cannon's development or to even get a Mankins replacement in next years draft with 1 of those 2 first picks. It doesn't hurt the Pats cap wise and certainly makes them stronger depth wise so why make the team that much weaker when there is no draw back to having him play under the franchise tag?
     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dmcpatsfan. Show dmcpatsfan's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    I guess I need to clarify my comment about a 3rd rounder...I was saying to release him flat out, that would give us our 3rd round compensatory pick & send a STRONG message to the other O-lineman & players looking to make rediculous demands....

    If the Pats get him to sign the Tag & can work out a deal with another team for a higher pick than so be it...I just don't see a team out there willing to give Mankins 8+ million a year as well as give up a high round draft pick & if the Pats can find such a guppy than GREAT, do it!!!!

    Remember, a 3rd rounder is not bad, we got lots of other great talent much later than that before....I just want this distraction & overinflated ego to go away ASAP & if the TE idea bothers anyone(just an option by the way) than we can get a FA that plays guard much cheaper than logan & probably hungry for the oppertunity to make the playoffs or go all the way....
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from dmcpatsfan. Show dmcpatsfan's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    I'm not trying to downplay Logans performances...he has been a solid lineman but nothing more...he was a first round pick & as one expected to play & be a contributor early on....he was compensated very well & was taught by one of the best O-lineman in the league...I'm simply saying he's not worth what he believes he's worth to the team....he isn't even close to a Hannah, he wes feared!!! I think Bill likes & respects Mankins attitude & football knowledge, but respect will only go so far,remember Randy Moss??!!
    I guess I just am not that impressed with Mankins....his making the probowl last year was a joke...right up there with Merriweather....so please don't start spouting about his pro bowl appearences, I believe we all know it's a WAY overblown statistic THESE DAYS, more of a popularity thing....not as impressive as it once was....
    Anyways, thanks for your comments & feedback...no wrong answers here just some good insight(hopefully)....
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    Killa, you coach linemen don't you?  I bet no one else commenting on this thread does that.  For that alone, I defer to your knowledge on this.  But from what I can tell, I agree fully with you. Mankins is an excellent guard, both in the running game and the passing. 

    I hope the Pats work something out with him. Trading him means one more gaping hole that needs to be filled. 
     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jcour382. Show jcour382's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    i think he will be signed...what the numbers end up being will be interesting...
     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    You aren't going to get torn up, but I strongly disagree. He is the best at his position in the league. NE has the money, and they are already getting short handed on OL, with Neal's retirement and lingering questions about Light's contract and the (in)efectivenss of Nick "The Human Turnstyle" Kazcur.
     
    Rookies are rookies. You can't count on them to even be an effective backup untl they have proven it.

    Losing your best, clearly your best, offensive lineman like that could be a disaster. NE is way under the cap. They will get a deal done. IMO, of course.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    We just acquired Vereen and Ridley. Run blocking could be slightly more important than it has been in the past. Mankins is a very good OG. No he's not Hannah (but no one is !), but he is best O Linemen we have and I think keeping him around while Cannon and Solder develop is very good idea. If we lost Mankins and Light to free agency we'd have press for our rookies and young uns to develop at much faster pace. I could see a one year franchise deal for Mankins and a one year deal for Light. This would buy some time for Scarnecchia to coach up Solder and Cannon.
     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonFanInFlorida. Show BostonFanInFlorida's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    I disagee DMC.

    I believe that the Pats offense played much better after Mankins returned. The pro bowl and all pro voting sunstantiated that.

    I would prefer to see a long therm contract for him, something that warrants his ability but doesn't put the team in a bad place. I think that they have been close in the past. I hope it happens.

    With Mankins, we could be set to have an extremely good o-line and with depth.
     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dmcpatsfan. Show dmcpatsfan's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    AGAIN, this is all about opinions & feedback....really no wrong answers, just a good topic to discuss rationally(at least I hope so)....
    some good insight so far...I mean I'm willing to just let him walk & look elsewhere in FA & the upcoming draft....does anybody think that there would be any interest by other teams to trade for him by giving up a high draft pick (2nd or more) & be willing to pay him the 8Mill + a year he wants for over 5 years??!! I just don't see it at all, I'd call his bluff by leaving the original offer the Pats gave him or let him go elsewhere....I honestly believe there is no team out there willing to give up a high pick & a boat load of cash for a guard.....thus the Pats won't be able to trade him for a high pick & will lose him for a 3rd round compensatory pick in 2012....
    It wouldn't even bother me if he went to another AFC east team...
    I'm just tierd of this a#@ clown & his agent....Pats have already offered him a AWESOME deal & he cried like a chick....mankins is delusional about his worth...

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    I have railed on Mankins in the past for his contract demands but I love him as a player. He has a great attitude and an even greater work ethic.

    The Pats did fine without him last year (6-1) but he does add intangibles as a model and mentor for the younger players as to how it is done in the NFL. When he came back in week 9 he played like he had been there all season.

    It seems like the Patriots want him so "Git R Done!"
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    Killa, I thought about that when I was posting but if his contract gets worked out all will be well!
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from dmcpatsfan. Show dmcpatsfan's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatory pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    I'll be SHOCKED if the Patriots give into his contract demands....
    I could see the patriots keeping him this year only under the franchise tag dollars(because he sat out last year his tag amount dropped from 8 mill to 1.5 mill that the pats had to pay him), so that breaks down to 2 years for approx 6 mill a year....smart math by ownership.....If mankins holds out again like he did last year(very doubtful) he'd only end up costing the pats about 5 mill for 2 years.....
    Mankins agent is a total tool....he's hurt the guy he's suppose to be watching out for pretty badly....IF mankins is as smart as Killa would have us believe I think he would have dumped him & taken his previous deal....

    IF the Pats keep Mankins under the Tag & don't sign an extension they will get a 3rd round compensatory pick for him next year as he won't be able to be tagged a 3rd time(at least I believe the new CBA won't allow it)....

    AGAIN, WHAT TEAMS out there would you believe trade for him giving up a 2nd rounder or higher & pay him the 8+mill a year for 5 years he wants....I don't see ANY willing to do that which leads me to believe he's way overvalued himself for his position & ability to draw any interest....I can't think of 1 team that would make the Pats an offer of a 2nd rounder for mankins knowing how much money they would also have to give him & the cap hit they would take....
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Pancakespwn. Show Pancakespwn's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    In Response to Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatort pick next year, (prob. a 3rd):
    Dear Killa, haha How smart is Mankins, though? The guy has plenty of penalties against him, gets kicked out of playoffs games for punching a guy in the nuts? I mean, I could see if the  Pats offense struggled in the first 7 weeks, but it didn't. Kris Dielman and Harvey Dahl are easily on Mankins's level.  Hutchinson is old and so is Brian Waters, but both have clearly played at Mankins's level this whole time. Regardless, the FA pool is flooded with quality options, which hurts Mankins's leverage. Heck, even Yanda for Baltimore, who can play both inside and Tackle is on Mankins's level. So is Keomatu from Pitt. 
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing

    Dude what is some of this stuff your even posting right now?

    Plenty of peanlties? Thats what happens when a player misses a large chunk of the year. Mentally they won't be as sharp as others.

    Kicked out of playoff games? Your mistaken my friend. That game he got kicked out of was back in 05-06 against the Broncos his rookie year. Stuff happens.

    The Pats O-Line did struggle at times without him. After the Browns game the offensive line rushing wise and pass blocking started to really gel and that was only a short period of time Mankins played back with those guys. He showed up in great shape as well.

    Hes not Hannah and he gets over powered by bums at times due to crappy technique at times but the guy is a great guard in this league and he is our second best linemen. I don't think we can really afford to lose a talented player along the line as whats allowing for this team from not going 10-6 is the fact they are keeping Brady upright and keep it as a very high importance on the list of things to do.

    I hate this Mankins situation and I wish it would just blow over already. I doubt anyone over pays for Mankins either. Well other than the Bears.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatory pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)

    Mankins and Ryan Leaf are poster children for why five- and six-year rookie deals are bad ideas.  Players who over-perform, like Mankins, get screwed and (in my mind justifiably) angry about their situation while those who under-perform get absurdly overpaid for doing pretty much nothing. 

    Rookie contracts should be three or, at most, four years and everyone should get to re-negotiate freely once a player has proven his ability or his lack thereof . . .
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from BERNIENH. Show BERNIENH's posts

    Re: When lock-out ends, remove tag on Mankins & take the compensatory pick next year, (prob. a 3rd)


    The only correct call BostonFanIn Florida. He does not miss practices and does not miss games (except contract dispute). He is mean and Brady needs him.

    In the Top 100 chosen by his peers, how many guards were picked higher than him?

    Pay the Man and move on!!!
     
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