Whiner's delight had this happened..........

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to danemcmenamin's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


    Then this happened...


     


     


     


    Jonathan Fanene
    Albert Heynesworth
    Trevor Scott
    Shaun Ellis
    Ron Brace
    Armstead
    Tomy Kelly
    Mike Wright
    Myron Pryor
    Tully Banta Cain
    Adalious Thomas
    Burgess
    Stallworth
    Gaffney
    Gozalez
    Brandon Tate
    Price
    Ocho Cinco
    Lloyd
    Amendola
    Torry Holt
    Joey Galloway
    Jenkins
    Schiancoe
    Fells
    Hernandez
    Leigh Bodden
    Shawn Springs
    Delta O’Neil
    Adrian Wilson
    Tavon Wilson
    Butler
    Wheatley
    Whilite
    Rasi Dowling
    McGowen
    Jon Lynch
    Steven Gregory
    Fred Taylor
    Joseph Addai
    Robert Gallery
    Leon Washington


     


     


     


    Then people had a right to whine. lol!!!


     


    [/QUOTE]

    Please remove Mike Wright, good solid lunch pale kind of guy that lost his career to concussions. It's not his fault his body let him down and what's more it's certainly not BB's fault. The guy was also an UDFA so in terms of money you're not talking much. Other than that I completely agree with the list!


    [/QUOTE]

    Remove most of the list! Half the guys he mentions either produced for a year or two, never made it out of training camp, or were at least average NFL players for the Pats.


    The guy is reaching for anything to make BB and the Pats look bad!

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to rtuinila's comment:
    [QUOTE]



    Remove most of the list! Half the guys he mentions either produced for a year or two, never made it out of training camp, or were at least average NFL players for the Pats.


     


    The guy is reaching for anything to make BB and the Pats look bad!


    [/QUOTE]

    FAIL!!


    You might have an argument for a small handful but come on homer, you can't deny that is a pretty sad list.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from DoNotSleepOnThePats. Show DoNotSleepOnThePats's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    Every NFL team is perfect in the NFL Draft and in free agency except the Patriots.  No team makes mistakes in the draft and the free agency process except the Patriots.  Congrats to the other 31 NFL teams for always being perfect in their drafts and free agent signings.  It's such a shame the Patriots are the only team to have some misses in both the draft and free agency.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from cyncalpatfan. Show cyncalpatfan's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to PatsEng's comment:


     


     


     


     


    To be fair you can't have it both ways. If you are going to criticize fans for nothing picking Brady in the 1st then you really can't give BB credit for stealing him in the 6th. What I mean by that is if he really saw Brady for what he was don't you think he would have taken him much higher? It was a lucky pick but hey luck counts in this game and I'm damn glad we got lucky. I just don't pretend it's going to happen every year in the 6th like some fans, or heck even again in my lifetime.


     





    Actually, I'm not crediting BB with stealing anything. regarding TB.  What I do credit BB with is knowing what kind of player he is looking for...not just in terms of physical skills, but also all those other intangibles that he values so highly.  Sometimes, he hits the jackpot, and other times, maybe not quite so much.  The thing that works to BB's greatest advantage, if you ask me, is that he has a very intimate knowledge of who his coach is and what kinds of players will likely respond best with that coach.  That's a very important element when putting together a team.  Sometimes, that might mean passing on a player, that many people might see as having superior physical talent, to pick another player who has less in terms of pure talent, but more of those other intangibles that he values so highly.  Another important characteristic is his willingness to take chances.  He shows no fear.  Personally, I like that.  It adds a little more excitement to the whole process.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Then this happened...


    Jonathan Fanene
    Albert Heynesworth
    Trevor Scott
    Shaun Ellis
    Ron Brace
    Armstead
    Tomy Kelly
    Mike Wright
    Myron Pryor
    Tully Banta Cain
    Adalious Thomas
    Burgess
    Stallworth
    Gaffney
    Gozalez
    Brandon Tate
    Price
    Ocho Cinco
    Lloyd
    Amendola
    Torry Holt
    Joey Galloway
    Jenkins
    Schiancoe
    Fells
    Hernandez
    Leigh Bodden
    Shawn Springs
    Delta O’Neil
    Adrian Wilson
    Tavon Wilson
    Butler
    Wheatley
    Whilite
    Rasi Dowling
    McGowen
    Jon Lynch
    Steven Gregory
    Fred Taylor
    Joseph Addai
    Robert Gallery
    Leon Washington


     


    Then people had a right to whine. lol!!!


    [/QUOTE]

    Half of the people on this list were camp fodder that cost next to nothing or were low round draft picks.  You could make a list like this for every team in the NFL if the standard is that low.  There are some legit bad picks/signings on this list, but putting someone like Mike Wright a freaking UDFA that was a pretty good player here before concussions ended his career and who was paid peanuts is disingenuous imo.


    Plus I love how you put freaking Armstead on the list as if the verdict is out on him.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    concerning mthurl's list........ I'm still holding out hope for Amendola and Armstead.  And I know Tully Banta Cain wasn't what we hoped he would be, I kept holding out hope he would turn into a really good player.  I liked that dude. 


     


    *******************************


    Be a Fan!  But don't be a Homer Fan!

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to Mike-J-D's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


    Before 2006 no one really had anything to whine about...


     


    [/QUOTE]

    Maybe if you started following the team in 2000.  There was plenty to complain about before 2000.


    [/QUOTE]


    The expectations were so low no one complained.  Heck, hardly anyone even watched.


     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    If nothing else, this list shows why many of take issue with the idea that BB is a personnel genius or legendary GM. I've scoured the online lists and while I find BB on some (if not most) all time great coaches list, he's not on any all time great GM lists. 


     


    I believe he's good but certainly open to question. 


     


    From a draft standpoint, it would be interesting to organize picks by position, because it seems to me BB has particular struggles at certain positions in the draft - cornerback and wide receiver come immediately to mind....



     
     
     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to BostonTrollSpanker's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    If nothing else, this list shows why many of take issue with the idea that BB is a personnel genius or legendary GM. I've scoured the online lists and while I find BB on some (if not most) all time great coaches list, he's not on any all time great GM lists. 


    I believe he's good but certainly open to question. 


    From a draft standpoint, it would be interesting to organize picks by position, because it seems to me BB has particular struggles at certain positions in the draft - cornerback and wide receiver come immediately to mind....


    [/QUOTE]


    There does seem to be an issue there, doesn't there?  I'd actually like to see it organized by position and with a comparative column relative to the rest of the league.  For example, BB hits on (defined however you wish) 1 in 3 CB's selected in rounds 1, 2 & 3 and 1 in 4 WR's selected in rounds 1, 2 and 3.  The league average at each position for those rounds is 1 in 2 and 1 in 3 respectively.


    Not trying to over analyze so much as place it in context.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Then this happened...


     


    Jonathan Fanene
    Albert Heynesworth
    Trevor Scott
    Shaun Ellis
    Ron Brace
    Armstead
    Tomy Kelly
    Mike Wright
    Myron Pryor
    Tully Banta Cain
    Adalious Thomas
    Burgess
    Stallworth
    Gaffney
    Gozalez
    Brandon Tate
    Price
    Ocho Cinco
    Lloyd
    Amendola
    Torry Holt
    Joey Galloway
    Jenkins
    Schiancoe
    Fells
    Hernandez
    Leigh Bodden
    Shawn Springs
    Delta O’Neil
    Adrian Wilson
    Tavon Wilson
    Butler
    Wheatley
    Whilite
    Rasi Dowling
    McGowen
    Jon Lynch
    Steven Gregory
    Fred Taylor
    Joseph Addai
    Robert Gallery
    Leon Washington


     


    Then people had a right to whine. lol!!!


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    Granted there are some mistakes on that list, but there are a number guys who were low risk signings who contributed in their short NE tenure or who didn't really break the bank if they failed.  The WR/CB draft misses are notable - an Ochocinco was a bad deal, as was AT even though he showed up in the superbowl.  But really, are you telling me you couldn't run through the rosters and do this for every team?  If you're arguing that a few more hits on this roster of mediocre players means more superbowls, not so sure I agree.  NFL teams have large rosters and lots of turnover.  It's the nature of the league and I think this is an overstated argument.      

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to danemcmenamin's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


    Then this happened...


     


     


     


    Jonathan Fanene
    Albert Heynesworth
    Trevor Scott
    Shaun Ellis
    Ron Brace
    Armstead
    Tomy Kelly
     Kyle Arrington (Mike Wright removed)
    Myron Pryor
    Tully Banta Cain
    Adalious Thomas
    Burgess
    Stallworth
    Gaffney
    Gozalez
    Brandon Tate
    Price
    Ocho Cinco
    Lloyd
    Amendola
    Torry Holt
    Joey Galloway
    Jenkins
    Schiancoe
    Fells
    Hernandez
    Leigh Bodden
    Shawn Springs
    Delta O’Neil
    Adrian Wilson
    Tavon Wilson
    Butler
    Wheatley
    Whilite
    Rasi Dowling
    McGowen
    Jon Lynch
    Steven Gregory
    Fred Taylor
    Joseph Addai
    Robert Gallery
    Leon Washington


     


     


     


    Then people had a right to whine. lol!!!


     


    [/QUOTE]

    Please remove Mike Wright, good solid lunch pale kind of guy that lost his career to concussions. It's not his fault his body let him down and what's more it's certainly not BB's fault. The guy was also an UDFA so in terms of money you're not talking much. Other than that I completely agree with the list!


    [/QUOTE]

    Done, I replaced him with Kyle Arrington...you had a point.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    If you cant (1) come up with a legitimate list that doesn't include guys that were decent considering the cost (for example a 6th rounder or UDFA making the team and even playing some over a couple of years is not measured by the same expectations as a 1st rounder) and (2) a list longer than the list f for every other team then the list is worthless.


    Putting Wright was stupid., It shows you were trying to make  it look bigger. Armstead was a stupid addition. Your latest addition of Arrington is also bad. He has some talent in the slot. You might as well put his name in because he cant play center.


    How long a list do you think the Steelers have? Or Houston? Or the Chargers, or Buffalo, the Jets, Miami, or anyone....


    We have gone from whiners to Cherry pickers. Play fantasy football. It is your sort of game.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    Astonishing that this team wins as many games as it does what with BB so inept and all.  Oh wait, I forgot, it's all Tom Brady.  Silly me.

    C'mon ATJ, there are examples of one great player carrying their team all over the place. Look at what JJ Watt has done for the Texans, Megatron for the Lions and Peterson for the Vikings. Hell, look at what Joe Montana did with his team of misfits. Jerry Rice, Ronnie Lott, overrated.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from danemcmenamin. Show danemcmenamin's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to danemcmenamin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    Then this happened...

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Jonathan Fanene
    Albert Heynesworth
    Trevor Scott
    Shaun Ellis
    Ron Brace
    Armstead
    Tomy Kelly
     Kyle Arrington (Mike Wright removed)
    Myron Pryor
    Tully Banta Cain
    Adalious Thomas
    Burgess
    Stallworth
    Gaffney
    Gozalez
    Brandon Tate
    Price
    Ocho Cinco
    Lloyd
    Amendola
    Torry Holt
    Joey Galloway
    Jenkins
    Schiancoe
    Fells
    Hernandez
    Leigh Bodden
    Shawn Springs
    Delta O’Neil
    Adrian Wilson
    Tavon Wilson
    Butler
    Wheatley
    Whilite
    Rasi Dowling
    McGowen
    Jon Lynch
    Steven Gregory
    Fred Taylor
    Joseph Addai
    Robert Gallery
    Leon Washington

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Then people had a right to whine. lol!!!

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Please remove Mike Wright, good solid lunch pale kind of guy that lost his career to concussions. It's not his fault his body let him down and what's more it's certainly not BB's fault. The guy was also an UDFA so in terms of money you're not talking much. Other than that I completely agree with the list!

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Done, I replaced him with Kyle Arrington...you had a point.

    [/QUOTE]

    You have a point with Arrington...his coverage is nothing short of tragic at times!

    Cue the "great" slot corner remarks ... so good he's essentially been replaced this year but hey he's already been paid so I doubt he cares 

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BostonTrollSpanker's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    If nothing else, this list shows why many of take issue with the idea that BB is a personnel genius or legendary GM. I've scoured the online lists and while I find BB on some (if not most) all time great coaches list, he's not on any all time great GM lists. 

     

    I believe he's good but certainly open to question. 

     

    From a draft standpoint, it would be interesting to organize picks by position, because it seems to me BB has particular struggles at certain positions in the draft - cornerback and wide receiver come immediately to mind....

     

    [/QUOTE]


    There does seem to be an issue there, doesn't there?  I'd actually like to see it organized by position and with a comparative column relative to the rest of the league.  For example, BB hits on (defined however you wish) 1 in 3 CB's selected in rounds 1, 2 & 3 and 1 in 4 WR's selected in rounds 1, 2 and 3.  The league average at each position for those rounds is 1 in 2 and 1 in 3 respectively.

     

    Not trying to over analyze so much as place it in context.

    [/QUOTE]

    I heard on "98.5 the Sports Hub" (I think) that the washout rate for first round WR was 50%. They also said the washout rate for WR taken in the first 15 picks is 50%. The washout rate for DBs was roughly the same. Everybody has problems drafting WR's and DBs.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to digger0862's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    [QUOTE]Astonishing that this team wins as many games as it does what with BB so inept and all.  Oh wait, I forgot, it's all Tom Brady.  Silly me.
    [/QUOTE]
    C'mon ATJ, there are examples of one great player carrying their team all over the place. Look at what JJ Watt has done for the Texans, Megatron for the Lions and Peterson for the Vikings. Hell, look at what Joe Montana did with his team of misfits. Jerry Rice, Ronnie Lott, overrated.

    [/QUOTE]

    *Massive Head Smack* What was I thinking?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazy-world-of-troybrown. Show crazy-world-of-troybrown's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    The thing is about Montana he won a couple of SB's before Rice was Drafted. Clark, Solomon, Taylor, were no slouches. Nevermind Russ Francis. One of the most underated Defenses ever. Always look at the Offense.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to crazy-world-of-troybrown's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The thing is about Montana he won a couple of SB's before Rice was Drafted. Clark, Solomon, Taylor, were no slouches. Nevermind Russ Francis. One of the most underated Defenses ever. Always look at the Offense.

    [/QUOTE]


    Yeah, the offense was pretty good early on before Rice was there, winning SB's with Montana throwing the ball.  They had a rushing attack much like the Pats where they used several different rb's, but most was on the arm of Montana.  You are right, those players you mentioned weren't slouches.  Not super stars but no where near being considered slouches.

    The defenses back with their first SB's were pretty darn good, Lott, Dwight Hicks, Keena Turner, Mean Freddie Dean, Hacksaw Reynold, really good defense.  Underrated if you ask me.  They don't get get nearly the credit the later 49ers defenses get. 

    I see this years Pats team looking more and more like that 1981 49'ers team where there's really no big stars on offense, using multiple RB's, relying on Brady's arm and hopefully now having a really good, top defense thanks to the addition of Browner and Revis with Wilfork, Kelly, Mayo being back. 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to portfolio1's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    If you cant (1) come up with a legitimate list that doesn't include guys that were decent considering the cost (for example a 6th rounder or UDFA making the team and even playing some over a couple of years is not measured by the same expectations as a 1st rounder) and (2) a list longer than the list f for every other team then the list is worthless.

     

    Putting Wright was stupid., It shows you were trying to make  it look bigger. Armstead was a stupid addition. Your latest addition of Arrington is also bad. He has some talent in the slot. You might as well put his name in because he cant play center.

     

    How long a list do you think the Steelers have? Or Houston? Or the Chargers, or Buffalo, the Jets, Miami, or anyone....

     

    We have gone from whiners to Cherry pickers. Play fantasy football. It is your sort of game.

    [/QUOTE]


    Why don't you go and make a list of every team you mentioned, and if you think I'm going to add, remove, discount, forget 6th rounders and undrafted free agents (who where only here because the guy we signed or drafted higher turned into a bust) you can forget it. It happened, sorry.

    People forget that all these...low risk...high reward!!! Types survive on this roster for small stretches because they are well coached and scheme wise hidden by the best coach in the NFL (Belichick). Having Brady around to bail them out doesn't hurt either. You probably peed your pants when undrafted free agent Justin Francis got a sack two years ago before being cut a year later...never to be seen again.

    The truth is I understand there will be mistakes, I understand the draft is not an exact science, but don't sit here and call me (or others) whiners for complaining about picks my team makes....when it is well documented that they are NOT above criticizing.

    I like rooting for the team...I get into it...but I don't watch games or the draft in my cheer leading outfit while sucking down large quantities of koolaide. I don't wake up every morning, sit on the toilet and squeeze out a giant pink Patriot helmet either. I'm pretty sure Belichick isn't reading these threads getting all sad at home. And for the record Belichick has come out and said no one has made more mistakes than him - now I'm not sure if he was talking about coaching mistakes or what, but by looking at some of the names on that list I'd say he was talking about GM mistakes. The Belichick before 2006 was lights out bringing in players, the one after that is open for criticism. Sorry.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Astonishing that this team wins as many games as it does what with BB so inept and all.  Oh wait, I forgot, it's all Tom Brady.  Silly me.

    [/QUOTE]

    not all ATJ...75-80% sure but not all

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to rtuinila's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ghostofjri37's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to Mike-J-D's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    Before 2006 no one really had anything to whine about...

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Maybe if you started following the team in 2000.  There was plenty to complain about before 2000.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

     

     

     

    Before Kraft bought this franchise it was a joke.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    No, it wasn't a joke. It was too sad to be a joke! But it did teach a bunch of us what real fandom was about! 

    [/QUOTE]


    before Kraft hired Parcells you mean

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Uncle Rico. Show Uncle Rico's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Then this happened...

     

    Jonathan Fanene
    Albert Heynesworth
    Trevor Scott
    Shaun Ellis
    Ron Brace
    Armstead
    Tomy Kelly
    Mike Wright
    Myron Pryor
    Tully Banta Cain
    Adalious Thomas
    Burgess
    Stallworth
    Gaffney
    Gozalez
    Brandon Tate
    Price
    Ocho Cinco
    Lloyd
    Amendola
    Torry Holt
    Joey Galloway
    Jenkins
    Schiancoe
    Fells
    Hernandez
    Leigh Bodden
    Shawn Springs
    Delta O’Neil
    Adrian Wilson
    Tavon Wilson
    Butler
    Wheatley
    Whilite
    Rasi Dowling
    McGowen
    Jon Lynch
    Steven Gregory
    Fred Taylor
    Joseph Addai
    Robert Gallery
    Leon Washington

     

    Then people had a right to whine. lol!!!

    [/QUOTE]


    That is a massive list.

    Amazing so much success with so many mistakes.  How could this be?

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: Whiner's delight had this happened..........

    You seriously put Joeseph Addai and Leon Washington on this list? Just because they brought them in? And this is list suppose to represent what? Prove what?

    Sorry but if you are just going to list names then you prove nothing. Why not list EVERY UDFA from EVERY year? Then you can list all teams' UDFA and what will you see? What will you prove?

    You wanted to "prove" something so you not only cherry pick but you include all sorts of names that prove nothing except that you are being prejudicial/subjective in order to prove your predetermined point.

    I could list a bunch of names (and maybe even include some of the above!) and "prove" the opposite.

    This is your version of mental masturbation.

     

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