Why did Denver persue Welker?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:

    In response to stillgridlocked's comment:

     

    I thought they missed the time deadline to send Dumervil his contract?  

    I know the media reported Welker going to them. He wasn't getting along with BB and BB refused to pay him also reported in the media.  There was some bad blood there between the two of them.

     

     



    No.  Dumervil claimed his fax machine was broken, which is clearly a lie.  He was ticked off he had to take a paycut with his restructure because if gets hurt this year, his restructure would have jeopardized what he was guaranteed originally.

    So, he stuck it to Denver, Baltimore knee jerked signing him, also in a cap hell, but the numbers were almost the same.

    The damage had been done, so Dumervil stuck it to Elway. By waiting on faxing in the signed restructure, Dumervil shopped himself around. He used Denver's price and Baltimore matched it.

    The media likes to protect Elway and Gomer, so the public doesn't get to hear the truth with them and their embarrassing foul ups.

     
    And you know this is a lie because? He did fire his agent over it. 

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrnkBnhm. Show FrnkBnhm's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:

    In response to FrnkBnhm's comment:

     

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to stillgridlocked's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    I thought they missed the time deadline to send Dumervil his contract?  

    I know the media reported Welker going to them. He wasn't getting along with BB and BB refused to pay him also reported in the media.  There was some bad blood there between the two of them.

     

     

     

     



    No.  Dumervil claimed his fax machine was broken, which is clearly a lie. He was ticked off he had to take a paycut with his restructure because if gets hurt this year, his restructure would have jeopardized what he was guaranteed originally.

     

     

    So, he stuck it to Denver, Baltimore knee jerked signing him, also in a cap hell, but the numbers were almost the same.

    The damage had been done, so Dumervil stuck it to Elway. By waiting on faxing in the signed restructure, Dumervil shopped himself around. He used Denver's price and Baltimore matched it.

    The media likes to protect Elway and Gomer, so the public doesn't get to hear the truth with them and their embarrassing foul ups.

     

     

     

     

     
    And you know this is a lie because? He did fire his agent over it. 

     



    Sure. To make it seem like it wasn't on him.  Geno Smith fired his like a crybaby

     

    You do realize the same contract was waiting for Dumervil after Denver released him officially on the old one, right?  He was a FA, completely able to return to Denver. He didn;t.

    By that time, Denver had signed Welkie and couldn't go up a bit to match Baltimore. He left.

    Get it?  He wanted to use other teams to boost his salary back up closer to what it was before his agent and he announced they would restructure under Denver's terms.

    They waited DAYS, DAYS and DAYS to simply sign on the dotted line. They were using those days to call around. Then, once the dealine hit, they waited to see if Pitt, Miami or Balt would pay the highest.  

    Do you read anything before mouthing off? I don't care what Dumervil did.   He clearly was in tune with what he and the agent devised.

    Saving face and scapegoating his agent reflects poorly on Dumervil.  It's why he's completely overrated, too.  

    Not championship material. All he wants is sack totals to make money in FA like a CB with INTs.  Denver had to change from their 3-4 to a 4-3 to accomdate him becaue he was so awful in the 3-4 OLB spot. Not enough sacks for his liking being responsible on the edge or in coverage.

    Heck. Balt has to switch to a 4-3 to accomodate him, too. 7 TDs for Gomer opening night.

     

    Yes. Welkie being signed forced them to lose Dumervil. THe money was close enough, but he took a tad more because that's all he cares about apparently.



    And even if they lost him over Welker, they still have 5 sacks through two game without Von Miller out there either.  Obviously, the Broncos would rather have had Welker without Dumervil than the other way around.

     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

    In response to glenr's comment:

     

     

     

    Why did they persue him? Because he's good?


    Evil's work computer name ( don't tell the boss )

     

     




    Well...they lost Dumerville to get him. I don't think Welker was needed in Denver. I love the guy but he did have at least 3 drops in the game yesterday. Plus he got flattened on one nasty hit. Decker was killer all day. I think Denver would have been better with Dumerville.

     

     

     



    They lost Dumerville because they didn't get the papers signed. They didn't choose one over the other--they planned to sign both, but there was an administrative mix up. Even if Dumerville and his agent sabotaged the deal intentionally, Elway never planned to pick Welker over Dumerville.  He thought he'd have both. 

     

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

     

    In response to glenr's comment:

     

     

     

    Why did they persue him? Because he's good?


    Evil's work computer name ( don't tell the boss )

     

     




    Well...they lost Dumerville to get him. I don't think Welker was needed in Denver. I love the guy but he did have at least 3 drops in the game yesterday. Plus he got flattened on one nasty hit. Decker was killer all day. I think Denver would have been better with Dumerville.

     

     

     



    They lost Dumerville because they didn't get the papers signed. They didn't choose one over the other--they planned to sign both, but there was an administrative mix up. Even if Dumerville and his agent sabotaged the deal intentionally, Elway never planned to pick Welker over Dumerville.  He thought he'd have both. 

     

     



    That''s not true. They signed Welker on March 13th.  They asked him to restucture a mere week prior to that.

     

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/news/20130308/elvis-dumervil-denver-broncos/

    Welker was NEVER in Denver's plans nor budgeted for prior to March 12th.

    On March 12th, the day FA opens:

    "May be cut anyway"

    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/12/elvis-dumervil-willing-to-restructure-but-may-be-cut-anyway/

    Then, THREE DAYS later, on March 15th, after they dropped 6 million, unplanned on Welker, they were forced to cut Dumervil.

    Welker's money confounded the restructure.

    Yes.

    Stop trying to change what happened.

    http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9057191/denver-broncos-release-elvis-dumervil-according-sources

    You revisionist history types are so belligerent. Don't always believe what the media tries to spoonfeed you via damage control from the Broncos front office.

    Totally botched.

     



    They were trying to get Dumerville to restructure because they thought his cap hit was too high and wanted more room in general.  Those negotiations had been in progress for a while, well before they went after Welker.  The restructuring therefore wasn't specifically done to allow them to sign Welker as several posters are implying.

    Welker was a nice addition if you want to ensure quality starters and depth at your receiving positions.  He's already scored three TDs. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from scash2013. Show scash2013's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    They already have Manning. So maybe Elway is trying to build the All Choke Team. They might convince LDT to come out of retirement.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from profootball. Show profootball's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to NoMorePensionLooting's comment:

    I'm watching the Denver/Giants seeing if my bet that the G Men would bring down Denver a bit (don't ask) and I see this guy Decker snagging catches all over the place, a slot guy no less. The chasing of Welker caused Denver to lose Dumerville so with this kid Decker looking pretty stout to me why did they chase Welker? To hurt us?




    Yes, they took out the favorite wide receiver of Tom Brady.  in order to beat the opponent, you need to take out their best weapon out of the game.

     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to skinnyrexraptor's comment:


    Why did they sign Welker?...to watch him drop mucho passes that hit him in the hands!

     




     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:


    Umm, where did I say that the restructure was so they could go after Welker? They weren't implying that either.

     

    They were OVER the cap before Welker hence why they went running to Dumervil.  Dude. Dumervil was about to take a 50% cut, at least in 2013, with the (non guaranteed) rest of the deal pushed out into 2014, 2015 and 2016.

    Baltimore offered a better up front deal with a bit more money.

    He left.

    You could argue that they swapped out Dumervil for Welker because they signed Welker before they were done with Dumervil's final numbers on the restructure. That is the premise based on the timeline and facts.

    The "fax snafu" garbage was a story made up by Denver's FO to deflect from the embarrassment.  Keep in mind, they announced he agreed to restructure before the deal was done.  Whatever number he had in mind was not close to what Denver had in 2013.

    If he wanted to stay, the numbers were close, but the Balt deal was more attractive because it protected him more in 2013 and 2014.

    Ironically, Balt wasn't in position to be bidding with their cap hell. They dealt Boldin because they are in that cap hell. 

    [/QUOTE]

    You didn't, but the OP said this, which implies that going after Welker was what caused the loss of Dumerville:

    "The chasing of Welker caused Denver to lose Dumerville so with this kid Decker looking pretty stout to me why did they chase Welker? "

    I wasn't trying to argue with you, just clarifying that it's wrong to say the Broncos lost Dumerville because of their pursuit of Welker. 

     

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from TFB12. Show TFB12's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    Interesting... a Welker thread I haven't posted on yet.

    Why did the Bronco's persue Welker?  Production, durabilty and to move the chains.  Big addition to the offense.  He has had to learn a new offense himself, yet hasn't slowed him down one bit.

    2 Games, 12 receptions and out of those 12 receptions 8 were for 1st downs and 3 were for TD's.  Production folks!  Just happens to be what the Pats need more of.

    I had a chance to talk with Elway a couple months ago and told him I'm not happy with the Welker to Denver move.  Elway got a big cocky grin on his face and said....... "I am!"  True story!

    I hated seeing Welker go, hated even more to see him go to play with Manning.  Pats should have kept him for that reason alone.  Looks like we could have used him.

     

    ---------------------------------------------

    "Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anybody else."  Text received by Tom Brady from Kurt Warner after Ravens loss.


    view my Patriots photoshops at patsfanfotoshop.tumblr.com





     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    For the Broncs, 6 million for Welker was a good deal. 

    The only way it could backfire is if Welker drops a key ball in the postseason as he has done with us. But then Peyton has been known to throw an errant pass in the playoffs also, so why the heck not. 

    Depth at receiver is not a bad thing, as we have learned once again here. 

    That said Welker does look a step slower and truly if Amendola can get on the field and stay on it, it will look savvy on our part. 

    I think it's a misconception to say Welker didn't have an impact on the Giants. It wasn't his best game, but they focused on shutting Welker down as it seemed to make things easy for the other wideouts. 

    Then there is Edelman who is pretty serviceable in the slot. 

    You can criticize our team for a lot of things at the moment, but losing Welker to the Broncs really doesn't look like one of them. 

    Besides, we really won't know the answer to this question until the entire season is completed. 

     

         
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Why did Denver persue Welker?

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:

     

    In response to FrankDooley's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

     

     


    Umm, where did I say that the restructure was so they could go after Welker? They weren't implying that either.

     

    They were OVER the cap before Welker hence why they went running to Dumervil.  Dude. Dumervil was about to take a 50% cut, at least in 2013, with the (non guaranteed) rest of the deal pushed out into 2014, 2015 and 2016.

    Baltimore offered a better up front deal with a bit more money.

    He left.

    You could argue that they swapped out Dumervil for Welker because they signed Welker before they were done with Dumervil's final numbers on the restructure. That is the premise based on the timeline and facts.

    The "fax snafu" garbage was a story made up by Denver's FO to deflect from the embarrassment.  Keep in mind, they announced he agreed to restructure before the deal was done.  Whatever number he had in mind was not close to what Denver had in 2013.

    If he wanted to stay, the numbers were close, but the Balt deal was more attractive because it protected him more in 2013 and 2014.

    Ironically, Balt wasn't in position to be bidding with their cap hell. They dealt Boldin because they are in that cap hell. 

     

     

    You didn't, but the OP said this, which implies that going after Welker was what caused the loss of Dumerville:

    "The chasing of Welker caused Denver to lose Dumerville so with this kid Decker looking pretty stout to me why did they chase Welker? "

    I wasn't trying to argue with you, just clarifying that it's wrong to say the Broncos lost Dumerville because of their pursuit of Welker. 

     



    I don't think that is wrong, though. I think they had a number in place for 2013 and 2014 as part of the restructure without budgeting for Welkie. Then, Welkie gets 6 million because BB walked, with Balt going back to Dumerville, quite possibly with a worse restructure package.

    Why do you think they asked him to restructure?  Just because?  

    They were going over the cap, so they asked him. Again, they were not planning on adding 6 million to their WR budget.  That's the key.    They couldn't even sweeten the fresh deal after his release (after the supposed forced fax machine story), and they weren't far off from Balt's number, so that should tell you something. They wanted to keep him, but Balt's new package was more attractive than his would be restructure in Denver.

    Bottom line is, Denver got distracted with Welkie and then had to go back and run the numbers again for Dumerville.

    So, yes, the signing of Welker is quite possibly the reason MIami and Baltimore were able to up his price after he was released.

    Otherwise, why didn't he just sign the agreed upon restructure? Why did it take a week if each side announced he would accept the restructure?

    The fax snafu thing is a crock.   



    i think they asked him to restructure because they thought his cap cost was too high and wanted room to pursue additional free agents.  Again, this is something they were working on well before Welker came into the picture for them and they would have tried to do even if Welker was unavailable.  I don't think there's any evidence they were asking Dumerville to restructure specifically so they could pursue Welker or that they would not have asked Dumerville to restructure if Welker wasn't available.  So I think it's inaccurate to say the "chasing" of Welker led to the loss of Dumerville.  The "chasing" of cap space may have, but that cap space wasn't being reserved specifically for Welker. 

    As far as the broader question of why Denver pursued Welker -- I think it's pretty obvious that Welker adds another nice receiving option to a team that is depending a lot on an explosive passing offense.  Elway wants quality and depth in his receivers around Manning, and Welker provides both. 

     

     

 
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